Author Topic: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade  (Read 110868 times)

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Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #195 on: December 18, 2014, 10:15:50 AM »

Offline Endless Paradise

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With the season Green is having, I'd imagine any deal contingent on him picking up his player option is a non-starter.  This is likely his only opportunity to really cash in.

Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #196 on: December 18, 2014, 10:17:33 AM »

Offline Tr1boy

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It appears hard to structure a trade with the Mavs since they seem to be lacking the contracts to send back. The only possibility seems to be centering something around Jason Terry, e.g. Terry, Papanikolaou combination as a starter.

I wonder how hard it would be to pry Montiejunas. I'd even send them a first if it's going to get it done :) But that's probably a pipe dream. I also wouldn't mind taking Beverley instead.

Your wrong.

Mavs can give the celts wright ,one of felton or nelson plus a scrub to get a deal done. Contracts to send back is not the issue. Its probably the 2nd 1st the mavs are reluctant to give up.

Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #197 on: December 18, 2014, 10:19:00 AM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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With the season Green is having, I'd imagine any deal contingent on him picking up his player option is a non-starter.  This is likely his only opportunity to really cash in.

I agree - it'd have to be some goofy "I will throw gobs of money at you when the cap goes up" secret agreement with Cuban, and I don't think he's dumb enough to try that after Minnesota got stomped for it. 

But there's enough smoke to indicate some kind of fire here, even if this is likely a leak from the Mavericks; I'm just trying to figure out some way it'd make sense without a 3rd team involved.  Like, forget what we could actually get, what would Danny even be asking for?  Can't figure it out.

Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #198 on: December 18, 2014, 10:19:30 AM »

Offline rondohondo

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It appears hard to structure a trade with the Mavs since they seem to be lacking the contracts to send back. The only possibility seems to be centering something around Jason Terry, e.g. Terry, Papanikolaou combination as a starter.

I wonder how hard it would be to pry Montiejunas. I'd even send them a first if it's going to get it done :) But that's probably a pipe dream. I also wouldn't mind taking Beverley instead.

Your wrong. Or your assumption is

Mavs can give the celts wright ,one of felton or nelson plus a scrub to get a deal done. Contracts to send back is not the issue. Its probably the 2nd 1st the mavs are reluctant to give up.

you mean they can give us a backup center, scrub 1, scrub 2 , and 1st rd draft picks 25 or lower

AWESOME! Get Rondo out of here right now , we cant do better  ::)

Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #199 on: December 18, 2014, 10:20:41 AM »

Offline kozlodoev

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It appears hard to structure a trade with the Mavs since they seem to be lacking the contracts to send back. The only possibility seems to be centering something around Jason Terry, e.g. Terry, Papanikolaou combination as a starter.

I wonder how hard it would be to pry Montiejunas. I'd even send them a first if it's going to get it done :) But that's probably a pipe dream. I also wouldn't mind taking Beverley instead.

Your wrong.

Mavs can give the celts wright ,one of felton or nelson plus a scrub to get a deal done. Contracts to send back is not the issue. Its probably the 2nd 1st the mavs are reluctant to give up.
I'm obviously wrong, because Terry and Papanikolaou don't play for the Mavs...  ::) But that's a different discussion.

Also, can someone remind me why we need a big that is listed at 6'9/ 210 lbs? Are Sullinger, Bass, and Olynyk somehow not enough to fill the vertically challenged department quota?
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."

Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #200 on: December 18, 2014, 10:23:39 AM »

Offline Endless Paradise

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With the season Green is having, I'd imagine any deal contingent on him picking up his player option is a non-starter.  This is likely his only opportunity to really cash in.

I agree - it'd have to be some goofy "I will throw gobs of money at you when the cap goes up" secret agreement with Cuban, and I don't think he's dumb enough to try that after Minnesota got stomped for it. 

But there's enough smoke to indicate some kind of fire here, even if this is likely a leak from the Mavericks; I'm just trying to figure out some way it'd make sense without a 3rd team involved.  Like, forget what we could actually get, what would Danny even be asking for?  Can't figure it out.

I agree that there's definitely some credence to the rumors and that this doesn't really make sense without another team getting involved.  I just don't think the Mavs are eyeing a shake-up of their core, especially given Rondo's impending free agency.  Swapping Parsons and Green just doesn't make much sense to me, given the established chemistry that would be disturbed.

I suspect that if and when Rondo and Green are traded, it'll either be in separate transactions or all at once, but with the two going to different teams.

Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #201 on: December 18, 2014, 10:23:44 AM »

Offline Dino Pitino

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Wouldn't it be more correct to assume that Wright's extraordinary PER is an outlier, considering the metric was created to put Jordan at the top?

He's a good player, for sure (and a definite upgrade), but he's really an example of the limitations of PER, rather than it's poster boy.

I do not trust PER, either. But it suffices as shorthand.

Wright's PER with Dallas the last four years has been 22.6, over 198 games, in about 3500 minutes. If that's who he truly is as a player now, where that would put him on the all-time and active PER leaderboard...it'd place him in the company of absolutely no one who even vaguely sucks, not even close to any average players. He'd have to be one of the most singular outliers in sports history.

By the way, to address a point someone else made: Wright is almost a year and a half younger than Rondo, he's entering rather than about to leave his late 20's which is a crucial juncture, and he has logged far fewer total minutes in his career, and his performance is only improving year by year, not declining like Rondo's. And, look, I love Rondo. But sometimes players just turn, like dairy products. I hope Rondo has another 5-10 good years, but the trend he's establishing now doesn't bode well. Wright's trend is good.

As for Wright also expiring, sure, but he's also not going to ask for max or near-max money, and we will have his Bird Rights and be able to comfortably outbid any other team. As opposed to uncomfortably re-signing Rondo to a cap-choking mega-deal that begins as he's hitting 30 years old. And the odds in Vegas on Rondo re-signing must be awful vs. Wright wanting to stay.
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Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #202 on: December 18, 2014, 10:24:15 AM »

Offline aingeforthree

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It appears hard to structure a trade with the Mavs since they seem to be lacking the contracts to send back. The only possibility seems to be centering something around Jason Terry, e.g. Terry, Papanikolaou combination as a starter.

I wonder how hard it would be to pry Montiejunas. I'd even send them a first if it's going to get it done :) But that's probably a pipe dream. I also wouldn't mind taking Beverley instead.

Your wrong.

Mavs can give the celts wright ,one of felton or nelson plus a scrub to get a deal done. Contracts to send back is not the issue. Its probably the 2nd 1st the mavs are reluctant to give up.

Sure, they could give up a guy like Harris. But would Ainge do that ? I think other teams would have to be involved.

Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #203 on: December 18, 2014, 10:26:40 AM »

Offline Fan from VT

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It appears hard to structure a trade with the Mavs since they seem to be lacking the contracts to send back. The only possibility seems to be centering something around Jason Terry, e.g. Terry, Papanikolaou combination as a starter.

I wonder how hard it would be to pry Montiejunas. I'd even send them a first if it's going to get it done :) But that's probably a pipe dream. I also wouldn't mind taking Beverley instead.

Your wrong.

Mavs can give the celts wright ,one of felton or nelson plus a scrub to get a deal done. Contracts to send back is not the issue. Its probably the 2nd 1st the mavs are reluctant to give up.
I'm obviously wrong, because Terry and Papanikolaou don't play for the Mavs...  ::)

Also, can someone remind me why we need a big that is listed at 6'9/ 210 lbs? Are Sullinger, Bass, and Olynyk somehow not enough to fill the vertically challenged department quota?

I think wright is a better rim protector and is. Probably heavier now than listed; he was a beanpole when he entered the nba.

Clearly you were looking at houston's roster before, and i agree, they are hard to match up with. They have the 8.4 Lin exception but thats not big enough for rondo and it cant be combined with other pieces. So really wed either need  to take ariza and his contract back, find a third team that wants ariza, or take a lot of small pieces back.

Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #204 on: December 18, 2014, 10:27:24 AM »

Offline kozlodoev

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I do not trust PER, either. But it suffices as shorthand.
Except one of the known flaws of the PER shorthand is that it is not reliable in short minutes. Wright has never played more  than 19 mpg so evaluating him based on his PER is kind of worthless.

The bottom line is that he's already 27, he's more undersized than any of our other undersized bigs, and will  generally be redundant on our roster.
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Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #205 on: December 18, 2014, 10:28:22 AM »

Offline jay

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I think it would have to be Green/Rondo for Felton/Parsons and a 2018 or 2019 pick.


Yes Parsons and Green are similar, but at least Parsons is locked up and he is 2 years younger.  If we have to sign Green to an extension for near max money its going to take him into his mid thirties.  Hopefully the pick will be good if Dirk is gone and Green/Rondo are on the decline.

I dont think Dallas goes for it. I also dont think Rondo will get two firsts.  Our best bet is to package them and get a lottery pick.  Either get the Pelicans pick from Houston or get Indiana's pick along with some scrubs.

Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #206 on: December 18, 2014, 10:29:16 AM »

Offline Donoghus

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Are people really going to try & talk themselves into Brandan Wright?

This trade is the quintessential "cents on the dollar" trade that many people have been talking about on here for months.  Pretty awful.


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Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #207 on: December 18, 2014, 10:29:21 AM »

Offline Tr1boy

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It appears hard to structure a trade with the Mavs since they seem to be lacking the contracts to send back. The only possibility seems to be centering something around Jason Terry, e.g. Terry, Papanikolaou combination as a starter.

I wonder how hard it would be to pry Montiejunas. I'd even send them a first if it's going to get it done :) But that's probably a pipe dream. I also wouldn't mind taking Beverley instead.

Your wrong.

Mavs can give the celts wright ,one of felton or nelson plus a scrub to get a deal done. Contracts to send back is not the issue. Its probably the 2nd 1st the mavs are reluctant to give up.
I'm obviously wrong, because Terry and Papanikolaou don't play for the Mavs...  ::)

Also, can someone remind me why we need a big that is listed at 6'9/ 210 lbs? Are Sullinger, Bass, and Olynyk somehow not enough to fill the vertically challenged department quota?

I think wright is a better rim protector and is. Probably heavier now than listed; he was a beanpole when he entered the nba.

Clearly you were looking at houston's roster before, and i agree, they are hard to match up with. They have the 8.4 Lin exception but thats not big enough for rondo and it cant be combined with other pieces. So really wed either need  to take ariza and his contract back, find a third team that wants ariza, or take a lot of small pieces back.

Wright would be a very good fit with the running celts team.

He is closer to 240 vs 210. No way he is still that thin.

Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #208 on: December 18, 2014, 10:30:04 AM »

Offline Tr1boy

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Are people really going to try & talk themselves into Brandan Wright?

This trade is the quintessential "cents on the dollar" trade that many people have been talking about on here for months.  Pretty awful.

But he is a blossoming center

Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #209 on: December 18, 2014, 10:31:01 AM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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Wouldn't it be more correct to assume that Wright's extraordinary PER is an outlier, considering the metric was created to put Jordan at the top?

He's a good player, for sure (and a definite upgrade), but he's really an example of the limitations of PER, rather than it's poster boy.

I do not trust PER, either. But it suffices as shorthand.

Wright's PER with Dallas the last four years has been 22.6, over 198 games, in about 3500 minutes. If that's who he truly is as a player now, where that would put him on the all-time and active PER leaderboard...it'd place him in the company of absolutely no one who even vaguely sucks, not even close to any average players. He'd have to be one of the most singular outliers in sports history.


It's not just PER that makes Wright look good, he's third in Win Shares/48, 1st in TS%, his value over replacement is high, etc, etc.  He plays a very, very efficient game, so advanced stats adore him. 

He's obviously not as good as his ranks would indicate, but he's equally clearly a substantial plus to his team.  Unfortunately that also means he's very likely to get some strong contract offers this offseason.