Poll

Has Lebron ever taken steroids or Growth hormone.

Yes He Has.
30 (81.1%)
No, He has Not.
7 (18.9%)

Total Members Voted: 37

Author Topic: Poll: Has Lebron ever Juiced.  (Read 5060 times)

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Re: Poll: Has Lebron ever Juiced.
« Reply #15 on: November 24, 2014, 09:21:36 AM »

Offline Snakehead

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Carrots are delicious. (I don't own a juicer).

But seriously, here's two players who have been suspended by the NBA for steroids:


I don't think the eye test is a reasonable measurement.

TP
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Re: Poll: Has Lebron ever Juiced.
« Reply #16 on: November 24, 2014, 09:23:07 AM »

Offline Snakehead

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  Hey, does that mean Marc Gasol was juicing too?  He's noticeably slimmer.

Or Carmelo.

But wait we don't hate them.
"I really don't want people to understand me." - Jordan Crawford

Re: Poll: Has Lebron ever Juiced.
« Reply #17 on: November 24, 2014, 09:27:04 AM »

Online Donoghus

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HGH wouldn't surprise me.  Total speculation on my part but I also think a good chunk of professional athletes have done HGH. 


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Re: Poll: Has Lebron ever Juiced.
« Reply #18 on: November 24, 2014, 09:28:23 AM »

Offline Snakehead

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HGH wouldn't surprise me.  Total speculation on my part but I also think a good chunk of professional athletes have done HGH.

I think coming back from injuries in particular you'd be kind of crazy not to do it if you could get away with it (which it seems like you very much can).
"I really don't want people to understand me." - Jordan Crawford

Re: Poll: Has Lebron ever Juiced.
« Reply #19 on: November 24, 2014, 09:58:07 AM »

Online Roy H.

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  Hey, does that mean Marc Gasol was juicing too?  He's noticeably slimmer.

Or Carmelo.

But wait we don't hate them.

We don't hate Carmelo?


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Re: Poll: Has Lebron ever Juiced.
« Reply #20 on: November 24, 2014, 05:22:34 PM »

Offline Onslaught

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  Hey, does that mean Marc Gasol was juicing too?  He's noticeably slimmer.

Or Carmelo.

But wait we don't hate them.

I was about to say. I hate Carmelo more then James. I can't respect James on some levels but not that other idiot.

As for the Juiced question. I don't think he's done anything wrong.
Peace through Tyranny

Re: Poll: Has Lebron ever Juiced.
« Reply #21 on: November 24, 2014, 06:05:58 PM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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Carrots are delicious. (I don't own a juicer).

But seriously, here's two players who have been suspended by the NBA for steroids:





I don't think the eye test is a reasonable measurement.

TP!  Great post.   The eye test will exonerate some who use, and will condemn some who don't.   Wrong thing to do under almost all circumstances to accuse someone of something based solely on physical appearance. 

And I don't think Lebron has lost a step or any skills.  If he has, then perhaps it used to take him a half a step to blow by Rondo rather than the one step he needed when he left him in the dust last week.

Re: Poll: Has Lebron ever Juiced.
« Reply #22 on: November 24, 2014, 06:58:48 PM »

Offline puskas54_10

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For the op?
Has KG ever Juiced? Has Rondo ever Juiced?
What's the point?

[Edited.  Keep it civil, please. -RH]
« Last Edit: November 24, 2014, 07:17:47 PM by Roy H. »

Re: Poll: Has Lebron ever Juiced.
« Reply #23 on: November 24, 2014, 07:26:26 PM »

Offline mgent

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Poll:  Is the sky blue?
Philly:

Anderson Varejao    Tiago Splitter    Matt Bonner
David West    Kenyon Martin    Brad Miller
Andre Iguodala    Josh Childress    Marquis Daniels
Dwyane Wade    Leandro Barbosa
Kirk Hinrich    Toney Douglas   + the legendary Kevin McHale

Re: Poll: Has Lebron ever Juiced.
« Reply #24 on: November 24, 2014, 07:47:03 PM »

Offline mgent

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Carrots are delicious. (I don't own a juicer).

But seriously, here's two players who have been suspended by the NBA for steroids:





I don't think the eye test is a reasonable measurement.

TP!  Great post.   The eye test will exonerate some who use, and will condemn some who don't.   Wrong thing to do under almost all circumstances to accuse someone of something based solely on physical appearance. 

And I don't think Lebron has lost a step or any skills.  If he has, then perhaps it used to take him a half a step to blow by Rondo rather than the one step he needed when he left him in the dust last week.

But if it goes both ways, then how can you guys possibly be trying to use Hedo and Lewis as evidence of anything?

You can't say "not everyone who is huge uses" without applying the same logic to "not everyone who uses is huge."

I mean are we supposed to pretend there aren't other variables?  This isn't a controlled experiment.  Are we supposed to assume Lewis, Hedo, and LeBron all have the same work ethic?  They all spend the same amount of time lifting the same amount of weight?  They all started using at the same age?  Who's to say LeBron didn't start at 14, while they didn't start until they met Dwight?  Their positive tests obviously didn't come with starting dates.

Not to mention, anybody who has been to a gym knows that "looks" have largely to do with genetics.  It's completely possible that Hedo or Lewis could lift a lot more than someone who looks smaller or less defined than them.

It's totally possible that Hedo and Lewis have used PEDs just to stay in the league without doing as much work, while others, like LeBron, could have been using in addition to working their butts off.

It's also worth noting (since some people still don't understand this) that steroids don't allow you lift more, they allow you to heal quicker and lift heavy weights more often.  It's completely possible Hedo and Lewis weren't using to get stronger, but to feel less sore between games, or help them with an injury.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2014, 07:52:04 PM by mgent »
Philly:

Anderson Varejao    Tiago Splitter    Matt Bonner
David West    Kenyon Martin    Brad Miller
Andre Iguodala    Josh Childress    Marquis Daniels
Dwyane Wade    Leandro Barbosa
Kirk Hinrich    Toney Douglas   + the legendary Kevin McHale

Re: Poll: Has Lebron ever Juiced.
« Reply #25 on: November 24, 2014, 08:05:50 PM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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It's also worth noting (since some people still don't understand this) that steroids don't allow you lift more, they allow you to heal quicker and lift heavy weights more often.  It's completely possible Hedo and Lewis weren't using to get stronger, but to feel less sore between games, or help them with an injury.

This isn't actually true - a very prominent study on steroid use found that taking steroids and not lifting at all produced the same strength and muscle mass gains as lifting regularly and taking a placebo.  And of course people who both took steroids and lifted gained much more than everyone else, and those who did neither showed no gains at all.  Steroids do help with healing and recovery too, but using absolutely increases muscle mass and maximum lifts, even without exercise.

http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199607043350101#t=articleTop

Re: Poll: Has Lebron ever Juiced.
« Reply #26 on: November 24, 2014, 08:53:12 PM »

Offline mgent

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It's also worth noting (since some people still don't understand this) that steroids don't allow you lift more, they allow you to heal quicker and lift heavy weights more often.  It's completely possible Hedo and Lewis weren't using to get stronger, but to feel less sore between games, or help them with an injury.

This isn't actually true - a very prominent study on steroid use found that taking steroids and not lifting at all produced the same strength and muscle mass gains as lifting regularly and taking a placebo.  And of course people who both took steroids and lifted gained much more than everyone else, and those who did neither showed no gains at all.  Steroids do help with healing and recovery too, but using absolutely increases muscle mass and maximum lifts, even without exercise.

http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199607043350101#t=articleTop

This just proves my point though, steroids+hard work gives you a significant increase over steroids alone.  It's not that farfetched to assume the best player in basketball probably worked a hell of a lot harder than Hedo and Lewis.  I wasn't trying to say that people who use steroids don't get stronger, I was trying to explain why.  The guys who were taking steroids but not lifting were still using their muscles every day, so it obviously makes sense they got stronger.  I'm not saying Hedo and Lewis didn't get stronger, just that they probably weren't using them in the same way that professional bodybuilders do.  If they used but weren't working their butts off, it might send them to the top of a study on average men, but certainly no where near the top of the highest level of basketball (half of which are also using).
Philly:

Anderson Varejao    Tiago Splitter    Matt Bonner
David West    Kenyon Martin    Brad Miller
Andre Iguodala    Josh Childress    Marquis Daniels
Dwyane Wade    Leandro Barbosa
Kirk Hinrich    Toney Douglas   + the legendary Kevin McHale

Re: Poll: Has Lebron ever Juiced.
« Reply #27 on: November 24, 2014, 09:05:18 PM »

Offline hwangjini_1

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On the poll add "unsure since there is no proof."
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Re: Poll: Has Lebron ever Juiced.
« Reply #28 on: November 24, 2014, 09:13:51 PM »

Offline csfansince60s

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For the op?
Has KG ever Juiced? Has Rondo ever Juiced?
What's the point?

[Edited.  Keep it civil, please. -RH]

I think the point is that it is wrong and against the rules and therefore cheating.

Even if Rondo and KG juiced, it's wrong and against the rules and therefore it's cheating. Because people cheat, that makes it OK for everybody else? Why have rules in the first place?

So implicit in your argument, then, it's OK for a pro to cheat if other pros cheat.

How about college athletes? OK for them? How about if some do, which they most assuredly do, then it must be OK, right?

How about High School athletes? I  mean where do college athletes come from? The pressures inherent in getting a Division I or II scholarship are substantial for high school athletes, particularly in poor and lower middle-class families. For many of these kids, getting that scholarship is their only way out. Many of them juice, so if some do, they all should be able to? I really don't think we want to go down that road.

This is a very slippery slope. 

Cheating is cheating. Either change the rules or have rigorous testing in place. None of this morally ambiguous crap. Kids have it tough enough nowadays trying to figure things out.

 
« Last Edit: November 25, 2014, 02:31:30 PM by csfansince60s »