Author Topic: Good time for Rondo for Irving trade  (Read 10139 times)

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Re: Good time for Rondo for Irving trade
« Reply #30 on: November 22, 2014, 05:21:55 PM »

Offline cb8883

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Irving is a star and Rondo is a role player. It would probably take all of Boston's picks plus Rondo to make the deal work. Then you have to realize that Kyrie isn't going to be happy and then Boston will have to trade Irving. No one wants to play in Boston if they can help it.
Any other all stars in the league that are role players?

Last I checked Rondo hasn't been an all star in a couple of years. Vin Baker was an all star once too what's your point?

Re: Good time for Rondo for Irving trade
« Reply #31 on: November 22, 2014, 05:27:36 PM »

Offline Snakehead

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People need to relax, as some previous posters said.  Cavs will be fine.  It's a long season.

The only sudden move they could make is for Waiters.  I think he could move this year possibly.  But I think Irving is there to stay.  He is too young.  He will need time to figure out how to play with LeBron but I don't see why he can't be effective off the ball more.

Waiters has talent but the team has other needs besides scoring.  He doesn't necessarily need to go but they could use other things besides more scoring.

I bet he stays there this year though and they become a better team by the end of the year.
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Re: Good time for Rondo for Irving trade
« Reply #32 on: November 22, 2014, 05:33:10 PM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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No .....Cavs are the ones up the creek , under the LeBron pressure cooker of fixing their team.....not the Celtics .

It's the other way around......Danny is in the drivers seat ....they need what we got .......I think the Best Cavs could get would be a swap......we don't need to deal

I'm sure LEBRon will approve most any straight up deal to get rid of Irving ...who is their problem , and get the a True point guard  Rondo.

It will cost the Cavs dearly to get Rondo......even if Irving is younger and better in some regards.

They


The Cavs and LeBron have to decide what they want Irving or a title.......pressure is all on them. ;D

Re: Good time for Rondo for Irving trade
« Reply #33 on: November 22, 2014, 05:34:13 PM »

Offline Nerf DPOY

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Irving is a star and Rondo is a role player. It would probably take all of Boston's picks plus Rondo to make the deal work. Then you have to realize that Kyrie isn't going to be happy and then Boston will have to trade Irving. No one wants to play in Boston if they can help it.
Any other all stars in the league that are role players?

Last I checked Rondo hasn't been an all star in a couple of years. Vin Baker was an all star once too what's your point?

Yes, Rondo and Vin Baker are both black guys who have played for the Celtics.

Re: Good time for Rondo for Irving trade
« Reply #34 on: November 22, 2014, 05:51:49 PM »

Offline Tr1boy

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First of all, Irving is way better then rondo because he is younger,signed long term and has a better health history. i would do rondo and a celtics 1st round 2016 pick for kyrie irving. Another idea would be rondo and bradley for kyrie irving and waiters

2nd of all, the celtics don't need scoring. we actually have a lack of defense. once we have kyrie irving we should trade him for a big defensive center. that is our biggest hole. then we need a strong young sf which we should use our 2015 draft pick on. then we come out 2015 with a great young team

Don't let the 3 quarters of good offensive output this team has been showing fool you into thinking we don't need scoring.  We need scoring in the 4th quarter, especially with less than 5 min left. How many times have we been up 15 , only to lose by 10 when the game is over?

Yes we need defensive help, but for me the issue has to do more with the 4th quarter issues offensively that hurts the mentality of the team on the defensive end late in the game.   

 
« Last Edit: November 22, 2014, 06:15:48 PM by triboy16f »

Re: Good time for Rondo for Irving trade
« Reply #35 on: November 22, 2014, 06:02:01 PM »

Offline Surferdad

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No .....Cavs are the ones up the creek , under the LeBron pressure cooker of fixing their team.....not the Celtics .

It's the other way around......Danny is in the drivers seat ....they need what we got .......I think the Best Cavs could get would be a swap......we don't need to deal

I'm sure LEBRon will approve most any straight up deal to get rid of Irving ...who is their problem , and get the a True point guard  Rondo.

It will cost the Cavs dearly to get Rondo......even if Irving is younger and better in some regards.

They


The Cavs and LeBron have to decide what they want Irving or a title.......pressure is all on them. ;D
Why is exactly why the Celtics shouldn't even consider it. This is such perfect trade for the Cavs that Ainge would practically be handing them the EC. 

Re: Good time for Rondo for Irving trade
« Reply #36 on: November 22, 2014, 06:20:28 PM »

Offline Eja117

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Irving is a star and Rondo is a role player. It would probably take all of Boston's picks plus Rondo to make the deal work. Then you have to realize that Kyrie isn't going to be happy and then Boston will have to trade Irving. No one wants to play in Boston if they can help it.
Any other all stars in the league that are role players?

Last I checked Rondo hasn't been an all star in a couple of years. Vin Baker was an all star once too what's your point?
When Vin Baker was getting his 4 all star berths and his all nba 2nd and 3rd team honors would you say he was a role player at that time? Is there reason to think Rondo is likely to fall off a cliff soon ala Baker?

Re: Good time for Rondo for Irving trade
« Reply #37 on: November 22, 2014, 06:25:08 PM »

Offline Celtics18

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First of all, Irving is way better then rondo because he is younger,signed long term and has a better health history. i would do rondo and a celtics 1st round 2016 pick for kyrie irving. Another idea would be rondo and bradley for kyrie irving and waiters

2nd of all, the celtics don't need scoring. we actually have a lack of defense. once we have kyrie irving we should trade him for a big defensive center. that is our biggest hole. then we need a strong young sf which we should use our 2015 draft pick on. then we come out 2015 with a great young team

Don't let the 3 quarters of good offensive output this team has been showing fool you into thinking we don't need scoring.  We need scoring in the 4th quarter, especially with less than 5 min left. How many times have we been up 15 , only to lose by 10 when the game is over?

Yes we need defensive help, but for me the issue has to do more with the 4th quarter issues offensively that hurts the mentality of the team on the defensive end late in the game.   

 

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PG: G. Hill/D. Schroder
SG: C. Lee/B. Hield/T. Luwawu
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PF:  E. Ilyasova/J. Jerebko/R. Christmas
C:    N. Vucevic/K. Olynyk/E. Davis/C. Jefferson

Re: Good time for Rondo for Irving trade
« Reply #38 on: November 22, 2014, 06:29:39 PM »

Offline footey

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Cavs are not going to trade Irving. I think Waiters could be had for a decent price. Not sure, maybe Bass and a protected first round pick.  I'd rather have Bass, frankly.

Re: Good time for Rondo for Irving trade
« Reply #39 on: November 22, 2014, 06:47:47 PM »

Offline bballdog384

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Cavs are not going to trade Irving. I think Waiters could be had for a decent price. Not sure, maybe Bass and a protected first round pick.  I'd rather have Bass, frankly.

What about a Waiters for Bradley swap?
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Re: Good time for Rondo for Irving trade
« Reply #40 on: November 22, 2014, 06:58:35 PM »

Offline Tr1boy

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If not Irving what about for another similar type of pg but not as talented player

To Hornets: Rondo, Bass
To Celtics: Kemba Walker, Biyombo, Marvin Williams  (waive or trade)

BS knows walker very well.

Starting lineup

Biyombo/Zeller
KO/Sully
Green/Thornton
Smart/AB
Walker/Turner


Re: Good time for Rondo for Irving trade
« Reply #41 on: November 22, 2014, 07:01:38 PM »

Offline csfansince60s

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I guess it all depends on what the de facto GM (the guy who refers to himself as "the king")
decides is best for him the team.

At first blush, you would think that He would want Rondo, the pass-first pg, for both Him and Love to be set up wherever they like. But I'm not so sure. Despite some of the rumblings out of Cleveland about " healthy discussions" between James and Irving, I have to believe that Irving's presence was a huge factor in James coming back to Cleveland.

In fact, the James/Irving relationship is a longstanding one, with James often acting as Irving's mentor.

Quote
LeBron James has known Kyrie Irving for years. He's been a mentor for the young Cleveland Cavaliers point guard since he was a freshman at Duke. Irving has spoken of seeking out James for advice on his adjustment to the NBA both on and off the court


 http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/24786601/report-lebron-irving-exchanged-words-in-healthy-argument

While James has spoken of "bad habits" that have been ingrained in Cleveland the past couple of years, aside from indirectly referring to Irving, he was also probably referring to Waiters and Tristan Thompson.

I see them more likely as heading out of town to get the Cavs help rather than Irving.

For that matter, as unlikely as this is, I see Love being moved before Irving.

The Cavs need veteran leadership and bench help. Their bench sucks. Marion and Miller are cooked and they got nothing else.

I think a Green/Bradley/Olynyk/Bass for Love and Waiters deal would improve the Cavs. I don't think that what they have now is going to work, and I don't think that the argument that "it took a while in Miami to come together " argument means that it will work in Cleveland.

Waiters will be addition by subtraction for them. Green is the perfect "third wheel" to James and Irving as he was to Durant and Westbrook. Bardley brings some D that they desperately need. Olynyk would be the perfect passing/stretch  PF/C for them, and Bass brings them legitimate depth as a bench player on a contender.

Yah, I know, I know, Cleveland never does this, but it does make some sense. I think that it makes them better, despite the prevailing 3-star theory adhered to in the NBA.

Re: Good time for Rondo for Irving trade
« Reply #42 on: November 22, 2014, 07:35:23 PM »

Offline Eddie20

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I don't think that Rondo would be a great fit next to Lebron, who wants / needs the ball in his hands.  Rondo is borderline useless offensively off the ball.

Lebron has never played with a pass pg before.   These days if you see him play he does not want to bring up the ball unless he feels like he has to take over the game.  Just like how Pierce was before demanding the ball at any point of the game, i don't think Rondo will have a problem giving up the ball to Lebron anytime he wants it , especially in the 4th quarter

Right now the issue with the cavs is that Irving brings up the ball but alot of times does not know "naturally" what to do with it.  In the 4th quarter he wants to score but this is also where guys like Lebron and Love want to shine. There is a struggle

Irving on the Celtics team can rely on guys like Green, Sully, KO , Smart's passing to get the offense working and also jack up 20-22 shots without worry and get the team the points it needs. Most importantly score those less than 5 min points to close out the game

How much better do you think the Celtics would be right now if they exchanged Rondo for Irving?

Better. The team will have a chance to win more close score games. Backcourt defense will be better

I seriously doubt that's true.  Irving is a worse defender than Rondo.

There are some things Rondo is better at the defensive end, but Irving is younger and is a better 1 on 1 defender right now. Anyways it's not defensive needs that we would be getting Irving. It's his ability to score, maximize the passing abilities from guys like KO, Sully, Green and have him be the "finisher" for the team.

I disagree.  I don't think Irving would make the team better offensively.  As a matter of fact, I believe he would hamper the play of Olynyk, Sully, and Green, as opposed to maximizing their abilities.  The fact that those guys play with a pass first PG is good for them as scorers. 

If you think just giving the ball to Irving and asking him to take all the shots would improve the team's chemistry or offensive production, I think you are mistaken.

On the flipside, having a player that can create his own looks, will cause double teams, and subsequently open looks for teammates.

On the double flip side, Rondo almost always draws multiple defenders when he gets into the lane, thus creating open looks for teammates.

yes for some parts of the game but in the 4th quarter or against smart teams, they won't be dumb to double Rondo.  You dare Rondo to shoot and stay with your man or play zone defense. Thats how you can beat us and how we have lost so many games late now

The pace also slows to many halfcourt sets. We definitely need player like Irving that can get those tough baskets in crucial situations.

Re: Good time for Rondo for Irving trade
« Reply #43 on: November 22, 2014, 07:45:36 PM »

Offline 2short

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Irving is a star and Rondo is a role player. It would probably take all of Boston's picks plus Rondo to make the deal work. Then you have to realize that Kyrie isn't going to be happy and then Boston will have to trade Irving. No one wants to play in Boston if they can help it.
:-\.  Really

Pick on free throws, acl, something.....but rondo is a ROLE player.  This is the guy nearly averaging a triple double this season coming back from knee surgery AND returning from a broken bone in hand.   Oh wait I forgot he pads his stats  ::)

Re: Good time for Rondo for Irving trade
« Reply #44 on: November 22, 2014, 07:47:40 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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In terms of the Cavs being mediocre, remember that Lebron's first Heat squad started 9-8.  It's probably lucky that they didn't blow it up after 11 games.

Different situation.

I don't think anybody ever questioned whether or not Wade would be able to subdue his game for the betterment of the team. Wade had already proven himself to be a leader and was far more mature at that stage of his career.

Kyrie on the other hand still seems to be very immature and out to 'get his'. I question if he is ready to do what it takes to be a team player. He has a lot to prove in this area. This isn't uncommon for players as young as Kyrie.

I disagree.  That first season, I think it was very much in doubt whether Wade and Lebron would fit together, both due to their skill sets and because both were alpha dogs.  It was only in Year 2 -- when Lebron got more assertive -- that the Heat truly clicked; before that, they got by on talent alone.

It's going to be an adjustment process in Cleveland.  There are a bunch of guys who have never played together, along with a rookie head coach who has made plenty of mistakes.  Yes, Kyrie at times dribbles too much looking for a driving lane, but he's been the Cavs' most consistent player this year.

Once Love and Lebron start playing like they're capable of, the team will look a lot better.  We've seen signs of it, but the players have shown a tendency to default into iso ball.


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