Author Topic: *dusts off idea* Rondo and Green for George and George Hill  (Read 8784 times)

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Re: *dusts off idea* Rondo and Green for George and George Hill
« Reply #15 on: September 02, 2014, 03:43:01 AM »

Offline puskas54_10

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Just stop it... Every week some fool floats this ridiculous trade idea. People who believe in this just embarrass themselves.

Re: *dusts off idea* Rondo and Green for George and George Hill
« Reply #16 on: September 02, 2014, 06:49:30 AM »

Offline Endless Paradise

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Would the perception be that bad in indy? They paid him his big contract. Would trading an injured player who is about to earn 16 million dollars rehabbing a gruesome injury and may never be the same, in exchange for healthy players who could help them get the 2nd seed in the east really going to get the fanbase that riled up?

As a matter of fact, IM not sure I would want to gamble on George at this point.

I'm going to quote what I just said on the main site in response to a George-for-Rondo trade proposal:

Quote from: Endless Paradise
You know what I find really funny about Celtics fans who repeatedly propose the "Rondo for PG" trades? They say this as if Rondo hasn’t suffered his own serious injury and has yet to show he’s come back 100%. It’s as if you think because Rondo’s injury didn’t seem as gruesome as PG's [edit: it must not have been as bad], despite the fact that it’s generally better to injure vascularized bone over avascular connective tissue.

Last season doesn't suddenly get wiped from the books just because people want to believe Rondo is back to being pre-injury Rondo.  He hasn't yet shown he's fully recovered from the injury.  This notion that he's completely healthy isn't actually based on anything we've seen yet other than a leap of faith that because he's Rondo, he'll be fine.

That said, I don't see a Rondo-Green Pacers team being considerably better than Cleveland or Chicago or, quite honestly, even Washington or Toronto, since there still wouldn't be enough scoring.  They already took a huge hit in losing Stephenson, so George going down was just the death blow.  Regardless, I really, REALLY doubt Pacers fans are clamoring about getting the "2nd seed in the east" since ranking high in the conference - and even winning it last year - hasn't resulted in a title.  Their best chances of winning a title are undoubtedly with a healthy George and if that means waiting a year and hoping for the best, I think they're more than willing to do so.  What's the alternative?  Another season that, more than likely, doesn't result in a championship?  Doesn't seem like they have much to lose.

(And just before someone says, "how can you say not to assume that Rondo is fully healthy and then say the Pacers wouldn't be better than the Bulls as though the same thing doesn't apply to Rose?", I'm not assuming that Rose is healthy.  I'm giving the Bulls the nod because they've consistently performed well without Rose and I think adding Pau will do wonders for opening up their offense.  Thibodeau has shown he has the ability to coach around the absence of his best player; Vogel has not inspired any such confidence, unless we really want to argue that Granger was even remotely comparable to Rose, which would be a fair discussion.  If Rose is healthy, Cleveland and Chicago are inarguably better than that proposed Rondo-led Pacers team, in my mind.)
« Last Edit: September 02, 2014, 07:05:41 AM by Endless Paradise »

Re: *dusts off idea* Rondo and Green for George and George Hill
« Reply #17 on: September 02, 2014, 09:53:51 AM »

Offline jambr380

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Just stop it... Every week some fool floats this ridiculous trade idea. People who believe in this just embarrass themselves.

Your addition to CB has provided such thought-provoking commentary. Thank you for your consistently positive contributions to this site.

Re: *dusts off idea* Rondo and Green for George and George Hill
« Reply #18 on: September 02, 2014, 09:58:14 AM »

Offline Clench123

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Just stop it... Every week some fool floats this ridiculous trade idea. People who believe in this just embarrass themselves.

No one is forcing you to click on these threads.

I always said when I left the Celtics, I could not go to heaven, because that would
 be a step down. I am pure 100 percent Celtic. I think if you slashed my wrists, my
 blood would’ve been green.  -  Bill "Greatest of All Time" Russell

Re: *dusts off idea* Rondo and Green for George and George Hill
« Reply #19 on: September 02, 2014, 09:59:08 AM »

Offline CFAN38

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I think Larry would drive to Boston and punch Ainge for thinking he 'd be this stupid.

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Re: *dusts off idea* Rondo and Green for George and George Hill
« Reply #20 on: September 02, 2014, 11:10:41 AM »

Offline Csfan1984

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Rondo looked fine to me last year. He didn't play back to back games or take the best shots because C's were tanking a bit.

Re: *dusts off idea* Rondo and Green for George and George Hill
« Reply #21 on: September 02, 2014, 11:48:34 AM »

Offline Endless Paradise

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I'm not buying that the team was tanking so hard that Rondo bought into it and conscientiously took bad shots and killed his shooting efficiency.

Re: *dusts off idea* Rondo and Green for George and George Hill
« Reply #22 on: September 02, 2014, 01:38:18 PM »

Offline Csfan1984

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True not all the shots were buying in but I remember a lot of bad not like Rondo shots. He was at times looking for shot difficulty allowing a defender to close and then him fade and shoot. Also some end of game stuff that was not typical Rondo. Given his already low shooting and shot amount doing that kind of stuff hurts ya. This year Rondo is playing for Rondo so sure we won't see that kind of shot selection.

Re: *dusts off idea* Rondo and Green for George and George Hill
« Reply #23 on: September 02, 2014, 01:44:52 PM »

Offline Csfan1984

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My opinion on Pacers is they should stay as is let Hibbert build himself back up as a lead player. Maybe miss playoffs and get a good pick that they can flip for a #3 option for 2015 to go with George and Hibbert. Trading for Rondo or anyone for that matter will cost them too much right now.

Re: *dusts off idea* Rondo and Green for George and George Hill
« Reply #24 on: September 02, 2014, 03:16:13 PM »

Offline Endless Paradise

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Rondo has traditionally been a 50%+ shooter right at the rim.  If you check out his shot chart for last season, you'll see he dipped to 45.6% -- the only time in his career he's ever shot below 50%.  You'll also note that he shot more three point attempts than he ever has in his career, despite playing his fewest games ever in a season (only 30 games). 

Rondo's shooting efficiency didn't drop merely because he was taking bad shots without much regard or concern; it dropped because he was still working his way back from injury and because he was relying more on his long-range jumper.  A drop in shooting efficacy around the rim and increased reliance on jump shots are both indicative of someone rehabbing an injury: if you're coming back from injury, you obviously don't want to get re-injured, so you tend to play in a more conservative manner, which means you shy away from contact.  What's more likely to result in injury: driving to the rim and taking on the opposing big(s) or taking a jump shot?
« Last Edit: September 02, 2014, 03:25:18 PM by Endless Paradise »

Re: *dusts off idea* Rondo and Green for George and George Hill
« Reply #25 on: September 02, 2014, 05:08:14 PM »

Offline Csfan1984

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Rondo has traditionally been a 50%+ shooter right at the rim.  If you check out his shot chart for last season, you'll see he dipped to 45.6% -- the only time in his career he's ever shot below 50%.  You'll also note that he shot more three point attempts than he ever has in his career, despite playing his fewest games ever in a season (only 30 games). 

Rondo's shooting efficiency didn't drop merely because he was taking bad shots without much regard or concern; it dropped because he was still working his way back from injury and because he was relying more on his long-range jumper.  A drop in shooting efficacy around the rim and increased reliance on jump shots are both indicative of someone rehabbing an injury: if you're coming back from injury, you obviously don't want to get re-injured, so you tend to play in a more conservative manner, which means you shy away from contact.  What's more likely to result in injury: driving to the rim and taking on the opposing big(s) or taking a jump shot?

I think it is silly for either one of us to use #s towards why he isn't shooting well debate because we could both be right if we just went by that. I say he taking bad shots cause they tanking, you say it because he is hurt.

Look at the game play did he look like he was hurt or worried, No he didn't. Did he look like he was having fun throwing up threes, Yes he did.

Re: *dusts off idea* Rondo and Green for George and George Hill
« Reply #26 on: September 02, 2014, 05:09:01 PM »

Offline D.o.s.

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Look at the game play did he look like he was hurt or worried, No he didn't. Did he look like he was having fun throwing up threes, Yes he did.
What is 'confirmation bias', Trebek?
At least a goldfish with a Lincoln Log on its back goin' across your floor to your sock drawer has a miraculous connotation to it.

Re: *dusts off idea* Rondo and Green for George and George Hill
« Reply #27 on: September 02, 2014, 06:18:03 PM »

Offline Csfan1984

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Look at the game play did he look like he was hurt or worried, No he didn't. Did he look like he was having fun throwing up threes, Yes he did.
What is 'confirmation bias', Trebek?

When you smile after taking a bad shot I don't think that is being upset, hurt or worried. I call smiling having fun but sure maybe that is biased because maybe some one said something nice to him and that is why he smiled. Smh

Re: *dusts off idea* Rondo and Green for George and George Hill
« Reply #28 on: September 02, 2014, 06:33:08 PM »

Offline Endless Paradise

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It makes literally no business sense whatsoever for Rondo to help the team tank.  Not only does it hurt his own stock ahead of his upcoming free agency, but if he did actually help them tank, he also helped them draft his likely replacement.  Well played, Rondo.  You might have cost yourself big money on your next contract by helping a team tank so they could draft your replacement and be free to trade you.  Genius move.

And it's "silly" to point to statistical abnormalities in Rondo's shooting to suggest that he was playing his way back into shape, yet it's not silly to tell me that I should look for supposed signs of "tanking" in Rondo's facial expressions?  lol, k

Re: *dusts off idea* Rondo and Green for George and George Hill
« Reply #29 on: September 02, 2014, 06:38:28 PM »

Offline Csfan1984

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It makes literally no business sense whatsoever for Rondo to help the team tank.  Not only does it hurt his own stock ahead of his upcoming free agency, but if he did actually help them tank, he also helped them draft his likely replacement.  Well played, Rondo.  You might have cost yourself big money on your next contract by helping a team tank so that draft your replacement and be free to trade you.  Genius move.

And it's "silly" to point to statistical abnormalities in Rondo's shooting to suggest that he was playing his way back into shape, yet it's not silly to tell me that I should look for supposed signs of "tanking" in Rondo's facial expressions?  lol, k

So Pierce and all the others who helped teams tank were dumb? It's called helping the team. And it's not like it was his contract year.