Author Topic: How did Bird not win the MVP in 1979-80?  (Read 12248 times)

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How did Bird not win the MVP in 1979-80?
« on: July 28, 2014, 08:51:32 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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I know that he won Rookie of the Year, but for a team that added only him, with a few minor changes, to the roster that had finished in last place the season before, there is no clearer indication of who the MVP was, imo.  Kareem?  Give me a break.  Larry comes in and set the record for the largest single season turnaround in NBA history that stood for 28 YEARS :o with a 32 game improvement (a year before the arrival of McHale and Parish, no less) that resulted in Boston not only having the best record in the league, but also advancing to the Eastern Conference Finals.  Is that not the definition of an MVP?  Someone's going to have to explain this one to me, just like how Max won the 1981 playoff MVP instead of Bird, smh. 

Re: How did Bird not win the MVP in 1979-80?
« Reply #1 on: July 28, 2014, 09:05:29 PM »

Offline knuckleballer

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Kareem was still at his peak and yes, he deserved it.
I've said it before, but I still find it amazing that Russell and Wilt played at the same time with Kareem just following them.  There has been no one since that has reached their level.  It's not because the game has changed.  I truly believe that it was a unique coincidence that these three were born so close apart. All three would dominate the game today.

Re: How did Bird not win the MVP in 1979-80?
« Reply #2 on: July 28, 2014, 09:12:00 PM »

Offline Surferdad

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Kareem was still at his peak and yes, he deserved it.
I've said it before, but I still find it amazing that Russell and Wilt played at the same time with Kareem just following them.  There has been no one since that has reached their level.  It's not because the game has changed.  I truly believe that it was a unique coincidence that these three were born so close apart. All three would dominate the game today.
So true.  Kareem represented the end of the Era of the Big Man.  There were many other great great big men then like Nate Thurmond, Willis Reed, Wes Unseld (best 6'7" center ever). Much earlier than Russell and Wilt was George Mikan, though I never saw him live).

The game is more wing oriented today.

Re: How did Bird not win the MVP in 1979-80?
« Reply #3 on: July 28, 2014, 09:13:11 PM »

Offline knuckleballer

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Kareem was still at his peak and yes, he deserved it.
I've said it before, but I still find it amazing that Russell and Wilt played at the same time with Kareem just following them.  There has been no one since that has reached their level.  It's not because the game has changed.  I truly believe that it was a unique coincidence that these three were born so close apart. All three would dominate the game today.
So true.  Kareem represented the end of the Era of the Big Man.  There were many other great great big men then like Nate Thurmond, Willis Reed, Wes Unseld (best 6'7" center ever). Much earlier than Russell and Wilt was George Mikan, though I never saw him live).

The game is more wing oriented today.
It is wing oriented because today's 7 footers aren't as talented.

Re: How did Bird not win the MVP in 1979-80?
« Reply #4 on: July 28, 2014, 09:19:12 PM »

Offline Greenbean

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Kareem was still at his peak and yes, he deserved it.
I've said it before, but I still find it amazing that Russell and Wilt played at the same time with Kareem just following them.  There has been no one since that has reached their level.  It's not because the game has changed.  I truly believe that it was a unique coincidence that these three were born so close apart. All three would dominate the game today.
So true.  Kareem represented the end of the Era of the Big Man.  There were many other great great big men then like Nate Thurmond, Willis Reed, Wes Unseld (best 6'7" center ever). Much earlier than Russell and Wilt was George Mikan, though I never saw him live).

The game is more wing oriented today.
It is wing oriented because today's 7 footers aren't as talented.

yup...but Shaq better be in this conversation...Kareem wasnt the last one.

Re: How did Bird not win the MVP in 1979-80?
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2014, 09:26:50 PM »

Offline slamtheking

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Kareem was still at his peak and yes, he deserved it.
I've said it before, but I still find it amazing that Russell and Wilt played at the same time with Kareem just following them.  There has been no one since that has reached their level.  It's not because the game has changed.  I truly believe that it was a unique coincidence that these three were born so close apart. All three would dominate the game today.
So true.  Kareem represented the end of the Era of the Big Man.  There were many other great great big men then like Nate Thurmond, Willis Reed, Wes Unseld (best 6'7" center ever). Much earlier than Russell and Wilt was George Mikan, though I never saw him live).

The game is more wing oriented today.
It is wing oriented because today's 7 footers aren't as talented.

yup...but Shaq better be in this conversation...Kareem wasnt the last one.
granted Shaq was the dominant center of his time but that was aided by some of the officiating.  he got away with traveling and bulldozing the opposition where in the pre-Jordan NBA he would have been called for that stuff more often. 

to me, the NBA's need to manufacture a marquee player to take Jordan's place in his first retirement artificially elevated Shaq to superstar status and enabling him to get away with Jordan-like officiating leniency, diminished his legacy. 

he was a far less-skilled player than most of the great centers that preceded him. 

Re: How did Bird not win the MVP in 1979-80?
« Reply #6 on: July 28, 2014, 09:28:42 PM »

Offline knuckleballer

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Shaq was great, but he didnt quite reach the level as these three.  Nor did Hakeem.
Wilt is the best comp, but was just as tall, more athletic, and i think even stronger.

Re: How did Bird not win the MVP in 1979-80?
« Reply #7 on: July 28, 2014, 09:34:50 PM »

Offline Greenbean

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Kareem was still at his peak and yes, he deserved it.
I've said it before, but I still find it amazing that Russell and Wilt played at the same time with Kareem just following them.  There has been no one since that has reached their level.  It's not because the game has changed.  I truly believe that it was a unique coincidence that these three were born so close apart. All three would dominate the game today.
So true.  Kareem represented the end of the Era of the Big Man.  There were many other great great big men then like Nate Thurmond, Willis Reed, Wes Unseld (best 6'7" center ever). Much earlier than Russell and Wilt was George Mikan, though I never saw him live).

The game is more wing oriented today.
It is wing oriented because today's 7 footers aren't as talented.

yup...but Shaq better be in this conversation...Kareem wasnt the last one.
granted Shaq was the dominant center of his time but that was aided by some of the officiating.  he got away with traveling and bulldozing the opposition where in the pre-Jordan NBA he would have been called for that stuff more often. 

to me, the NBA's need to manufacture a marquee player to take Jordan's place in his first retirement artificially elevated Shaq to superstar status and enabling him to get away with Jordan-like officiating leniency, diminished his legacy. 

he was a far less-skilled player than most of the great centers that preceded him.

I consider it a skill to be that big and and mobile and agile as he was for so many years.

Shaq was the toughest guy to officiate. He absorbed contact without budging and guys just seemed to bounce off of him with minimal contact. He didnt have to lower his shoulder or "bulldoze" to get to the basket. He was just bigger and stronger and more athletic, Kareem was obviously more skilled but Id put Hakeem and Shaq up there with him in terms of impact on the game.

Im not buying the officials giving him any advantages.


Re: How did Bird not win the MVP in 1979-80?
« Reply #8 on: July 28, 2014, 09:42:21 PM »

Offline knuckleballer

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Kareem was still at his peak and yes, he deserved it.
I've said it before, but I still find it amazing that Russell and Wilt played at the same time with Kareem just following them.  There has been no one since that has reached their level.  It's not because the game has changed.  I truly believe that it was a unique coincidence that these three were born so close apart. All three would dominate the game today.
So true.  Kareem represented the end of the Era of the Big Man.  There were many other great great big men then like Nate Thurmond, Willis Reed, Wes Unseld (best 6'7" center ever). Much earlier than Russell and Wilt was George Mikan, though I never saw him live).

The game is more wing oriented today.
It is wing oriented because today's 7 footers aren't as talented.

yup...but Shaq better be in this conversation...Kareem wasnt the last one.
granted Shaq was the dominant center of his time but that was aided by some of the officiating.  he got away with traveling and bulldozing the opposition where in the pre-Jordan NBA he would have been called for that stuff more often. 

to me, the NBA's need to manufacture a marquee player to take Jordan's place in his first retirement artificially elevated Shaq to superstar status and enabling him to get away with Jordan-like officiating leniency, diminished his legacy. 

he was a far less-skilled player than most of the great centers that preceded him.

I consider it a skill to be that big and and mobile and agile as he was for so many years.

Shaq was the toughest guy to officiate. He absorbed contact without budging and guys just seemed to bounce off of him with minimal contact. He didnt have to lower his shoulder or "bulldoze" to get to the basket. He was just bigger and stronger and more athletic, Kareem was obviously more skilled but Id put Hakeem and Shaq up there with him in terms of impact on the game.

Im not buying the officials giving him any advantages.

I agree with a lot of what you said, but Shaq and Hakeem were not equal to Kareem.  Kareem could have shot over both and contended their shots.  Those two in my eyes are a clear step below Wilt, Russell, and Kareem.

Re: How did Bird not win the MVP in 1979-80?
« Reply #9 on: July 28, 2014, 09:59:11 PM »

Offline 86MaxwellSmart

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Bird should have at least 1 more season MVP trophy....but that was an AMAZING decade---talent-wise....Kareem...Magic...Jordan...Moses...Bird...Barkley...Isiah...McHale...Dominique....etc.
Larry Bird was Greater than you think.

Re: How did Bird not win the MVP in 1979-80?
« Reply #10 on: July 28, 2014, 10:06:07 PM »

Offline knuckleballer

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Moses and Dr J did steal a few MVP awards that should have gone to Larry or Magic

Re: How did Bird not win the MVP in 1979-80?
« Reply #11 on: July 28, 2014, 10:27:21 PM »

Online jambr380

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Russell, Wilt, and Kareem were amazing for their time, but the 90s certainly rejuvenated the big man dominance. Hakeem, Shaq, Ewing, Robinson, and even Mourning and Mutombo were the faces of the NBA outside of Jordan (and Malone). I get it, the other three are in the best ever category, but I loved the 90s era of big men and there hasn't been anything even close to that since.

As for Bird, I totally agree. His presence brought upon one of the greatest turn-arounds in the history of sports. That is the definition of Most Valuable Player.

Re: How did Bird not win the MVP in 1979-80?
« Reply #12 on: July 28, 2014, 10:29:12 PM »

Offline bdm860

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The voting, for those interested:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/awards/awards_1980.html#mvp

Bird finished 4th that year behind Kareem, Erving, and Gervin.  While not the 32 game improvement the C's had, both Lakers and Sixers had 13 and 12 game improvements, and from a pure stats perspective, Kareem and Erving both had better stats than Bird too.

I mean there's definitely an argument there for Bird, but it looks like the voters made the right call to me.

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Re: How did Bird not win the MVP in 1979-80?
« Reply #13 on: July 28, 2014, 10:31:38 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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Kareem was still at his peak and yes, he deserved it.
I've said it before, but I still find it amazing that Russell and Wilt played at the same time with Kareem just following them.  There has been no one since that has reached their level.  It's not because the game has changed.  I truly believe that it was a unique coincidence that these three were born so close apart. All three would dominate the game today.

Sorry, but I'm afraid that I'll have to disagree.  The year before, with virtually the same roster, the Lakers sucked.  It was Magic who made that team function as well as it did. 

Re: How did Bird not win the MVP in 1979-80?
« Reply #14 on: July 28, 2014, 10:34:57 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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Bird should have at least 1 more season MVP trophy....but that was an AMAZING decade---talent-wise....Kareem...Magic...Jordan...Moses...Bird...Barkley...Isiah...McHale...Dominique....etc.

I know that Isiah rubbed a lot of people the wrong way with his comments about Bird in 87, but he should have won it in 88-89, imo.  He was the best player on the best team that year.  How did Jordan win in 87-88?  Yeah, his stats were great, but Chicago wasn't even in the top 2, record-wise.  What a joke.  There's no way that he should have won it that year, imo.  It should have been Magic.