How bad is josh smiths contract?

[Celticjay]

Throw in the good Larry Sanders and you have a TOP defensive team that would be UBER Athletic and could run teams out of the gym.  We'd hold teams to 90.  Why not buy low on these two fellas?  Would be exciting..  If the Bull can with 40 + with that squad they had last year we certainly can..

Rondo
Bradley
Green
Smith
Sanders

Bench
Smart, Young, Olnyk

We'd be below average offensively though.  So We'd need to pick up some shooters..

[LooseCannon]

Why not buy low on these two fellas?

Probably because those teams don't seem to be interested in selling low.  Are you willing to part with Sullinger, both Brooklyn picks, and more to get those guys?

[Celticjay]

Why not buy low on these two fellas?

Probably because those teams don't seem to be interested in selling low.  Are you willing to part with Sullinger, both Brooklyn picks, and more to get those guys?

I'm cool with Sullinger going and it wouldn't take both Brooklyn picks.  We have the clippers and cleveland firsts which I'd be totally fine with giving up if it even cost that much..

[PickNRoll]

Josh Smith will never get it.  56% of his attempts were jumpers, on which he had an EFG of 38.9%.    Basically as good a shooter as Ricky Rubio.  If he could embrace his identity as a rebounding, shot-blocking, fast-break menace, he could be great.  But he can't.  Keep him away from Boston at all costs.

[csfansince60s]

There is no way that Detroit keeps both Josh Smith and Greg Monroe. With Monroe on the verge of getting a big payday, that would be WAY too much $$$ to tie up in one position. It's clear from last year that Drummond/Monroe/Smith doesn't work.

I'd take either, but prefer Smith.

Getting Smith would mean that we would be committed to adding and building with Rondo, and I prefer that. And, I believe that we could get Smith for cheap, given his contract and his bad fit. Wallace, Bogans and the Clips first and Philly's 1st/2 2nds would work and give us the rim protector that we need in Smith. Detroit saves a boatload of $$$ (about $20 mil on the difference in Wallace's and Smith's contracts alone, nevermind the Bogans $$$) and gives them a 1st and likely two seconds for their trouble, in addition to getting a 3 that they need in Wallace.

Getting Monroe would give us more flexibility to either build around Rondo or go young, and move Rondo.

If we got Smith, I could live with:

Rondo/Smart/Pressey
Bradley/Thornton/Smart/CJ
Green/Young/Babb
JSmith/KO
Zeller/Fav/?

We could then use Sully and picks to get a serviceable center.

[clover]

I don't think his contract is justified given his net production (#'s - boneheaded plays), and I don't want him signed or paid here as some prospective one of whatever next "Big Three". The C's will finally have real room under the salary cap next summer if they don't clog it up with so-so players.

If they're keeping Rondo, they'll have some room, probably around $12 million depending where the salary cap winds up, and where they select in the draft.  That's decent money, but it's not going to get the superstar you're probably hoping for.  Also, this is assuming that Jeff Green opts out and the C's let him walk, and they don't keep any of their currently non-guaranteed contracts (Pressey, Bogans, Johnson, Babb, Faverani), but do pick up the options of all their guys on rookie deals (Sullinger, Olynyk, Zeller).

Not trying to comment on the viability of Smith or not -- just trying to get out ahead of the Celticsblog urban legend that we will have superstar cap room without making some sort of significant move (namely moving Wallace for no 2015 salary.)

Thanks for pointing this out. For some reason a bunch of media outlets discuss the "money coming off the books" and people start to equate that with the amount of cap room that we have to sign FAs.

Reality is we won't be able to make a run at a big name FA next summer. I'm fine with that -- players seem to prefer warm places with no taxes.... it highlights the need for DA to use some of that "money coming off of the books" in a mid-season trade.

I don't believe a team that pays its big money to Rondo and Smith, among its top players, can win.

As to cap room:

http://espn.go.com/boston/nba/story/_/id/11207676/the-boston-celtics-best-bet-wait-next-summer-make-blockbuster-move

[Cman]

I don't think his contract is justified given his net production (#'s - boneheaded plays), and I don't want him signed or paid here as some prospective one of whatever next "Big Three". The C's will finally have real room under the salary cap next summer if they don't clog it up with so-so players.

If they're keeping Rondo, they'll have some room, probably around $12 million depending where the salary cap winds up, and where they select in the draft.  That's decent money, but it's not going to get the superstar you're probably hoping for.  Also, this is assuming that Jeff Green opts out and the C's let him walk, and they don't keep any of their currently non-guaranteed contracts (Pressey, Bogans, Johnson, Babb, Faverani), but do pick up the options of all their guys on rookie deals (Sullinger, Olynyk, Zeller).

Not trying to comment on the viability of Smith or not -- just trying to get out ahead of the Celticsblog urban legend that we will have superstar cap room without making some sort of significant move (namely moving Wallace for no 2015 salary.)

Thanks for pointing this out. For some reason a bunch of media outlets discuss the "money coming off the books" and people start to equate that with the amount of cap room that we have to sign FAs.

Reality is we won't be able to make a run at a big name FA next summer. I'm fine with that -- players seem to prefer warm places with no taxes.... it highlights the need for DA to use some of that "money coming off of the books" in a mid-season trade.

I don't believe a team that pays its big money to Rondo and Smith, among its top players, can win.

As to cap room:

http://espn.go.com/boston/nba/story/_/id/11207676/the-boston-celtics-best-bet-wait-next-summer-make-blockbuster-move

$13.5/yr isn't really top money anymore. In any case, adding Smith would help this team win more games, but yes I agree it wouldnt make them contenders.

EDIT: and i'm fine with that. Baby steps....

[hondobird33]

Smith is probably overrated but most fans and some front office personnel believes he is still at star level.  What about a creative move as follows:

Detroit gets Sullinger, Wallace, Bogans waivable contract and two 1st Round Picks
Minny gets Smith (PF to replace Love, Green (upgrade their SF), & two first round picks. 

Bos Gets Love and gives Minny option to dump bad contracts (either SF Budinger or Brewer) and option to trade KMart for Bradley (30 after Bradley signed) 

To help either team we can offer waivable contracts for salary relief in Johnson/Babb and use our TPE's.  And include Bass expiring and playoff level experience to either team.

We then use our MLE to sign Evan Turner at SF and still have cap room and picks to go for star   free agent in 2015.

Rondo/Smart
KMart or Bradley/Thorton
Turner/Young
Love/Olynyk
Zeller/Faverani 
 
Minny

[gpap]

I still take my chances with Josh Smith.

Yes, he is a flawed player but I still view him an upgarde at PF over what we have now.

Come to think of it, we don't really have a quality starting power forward.

Plus, I think if Rondo is part of the long-term future of the Celts then Smoove compliments RR really well.

[2short]

If Josh stops shooting 3's he's a good player..

the antoine walker syndrome….
josh is very good defender, passer and running pf
BUT his shot selection and apparent bb iq are off the charts but in the wrong way
he is an upgrade over sully, bass and ko yes
would he play within himself 
if we could do the trade for bass and filler (bogans etc) than I'm fine with it…maybe sully as bass is a good pf off the bench
sully's off season is upsetting me, he has upside but so does kelly (and he's taller with a true low post game)

[2short]

Josh Smith will never get it.  56% of his attempts were jumpers, on which he had an EFG of 38.9%.    Basically as good a shooter as Ricky Rubio.  If he could embrace his identity as a rebounding, shot-blocking, fast-break menace, he could be great.  But he can't.  Keep him away from Boston at all costs.

tp
but if he could change i'd welcome him to boston…at a cost

[LooseCannon]

Why not buy low on these two fellas?

Probably because those teams don't seem to be interested in selling low.  Are you willing to part with Sullinger, both Brooklyn picks, and more to get those guys?

I'm cool with Sullinger going and it wouldn't take both Brooklyn picks.  We have the clippers and cleveland firsts which I'd be totally fine with giving up if it even cost that much..

I think you're underestimating how much it might cost.

[jaketwice]

I'm not against a trade for Josh Smith. He is clearly not someone that will put us into contention, but is perhaps someone who helps us get closer to where we need to be. Think "a stepping stone". I do like that he and Rondo are friends.

However, I imagine Detroit would want Jeff Green back in return for Josh Smith (but maybe they have less of a need for JG now that they've signed C. Butler). I'm not sure that swapping Green for Smith is all that useful for the Cs..

My thought was Wallace, sully filler for smith.
Rondo
Bradley
Green
Smith
Zeller
With smart, young, Oly off bench

Smiths main + is athletic D to pair with less athletic 5's Zeller and Oly

Yes, I see your point. It really only makes sense for Boston if Sully is included in such a trade. Would Detroit be interested in Sully? Not clear. But, the lineup above would help insure that Smith doesn't take many threes (that would be for Green).

EDIT: would certainly be a fun team to watch, and could make the playoffs as #7 or #8, and maybe make things difficult on defense for whoever they're paired with - probably still an early round exit, but interesting nevertheless.

I too - very pessimistic on next year - think that if Josh Smith could come in and play at a high level (not like he did last year - "Atlanta Smith") then this might be the only way to grab an 8 seed. I like it!

[Mazingerz]

Very bad; He can't be moved unless a team really desires him; His contributions are not worthy of the money plunked into his contract;

[arctic 3.0]

With the ET signing I renounce my smith trade. I just don't think the combo would be good for the c's mental state.
I now fully endorse prying Greg Monroe from the pistons if they fail to move smith.
.
Green or sully and filler for Monroe.
Assuming its green who goes ( works better for det)
Rondo smart
Bradley smart young
Turner Wallace young
Monroe Oly
Zeller Oly

I think young is going to be a PLAYER long athletic sweet stroke
I think Wallace will rebound after his surgery.
Young will step in to play the wing in a few years.