Author Topic: This whiny self entitled fan base is starting to tick me off  (Read 21398 times)

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Re: This whiny self entitled fan base is starting to tick me off
« Reply #105 on: July 21, 2014, 08:31:25 PM »

Offline jaketwice

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These self-aggrandizing moonpies talking about how great it will be to be a contender in 5 years are starting to p--- me off. Really? You're looking forward to watching a literally TERRIBLE team for the next five years? Next three years? Maybe we could sign some more guards!

You people won't be happy until our tallest player is 6'3" and shoots free throws like a seven year old. Then we would be REALLY bad!!!!

 ???


I havent been this active on CB in years... How long has it been this trollish? I mean this is a thread obviously about posters complaining ab each other, but every other thread is infected with this childish crap.

I started posting on this site the last time we were rebuilding and it was actually possible to disagree with other posters without painting such broad strokes about a whole fanbase.

I also started posting at that time. But back then, nobody called the police about a vituperative argument. I bet you also think children should wear helmets at the playground, and are glad to take your shoes off at airports, because freedom is a worthy sacrifice for "safety."

I think this time there is even less hope. Despite the cries of "assets!" We literally have nine guards on the roster, a second year back up and VITOR FAVERANI at center, and then a bunch of "forwards" all of whom play somewhere between two positions.

I don't really see a free agent wanting to play here because of the players on the team. And I think we have seen that the only thing players in the NBA care about, besides money - is winning (LeBron could win anywhere). We have no draw, and no forseeable draw. LeBron and Durant will dominate the next five years, and after that we are looking at Parker, Anthony Davis, Wiggins, Blake Griffin and Andre Drummond (and Boogie?). We won't raise up a star from the draft, and surround that star with a competent team literally for years.

What earthly purpose was there for signing Evan Turner? So we could be defenseless at his position for stretches? Why does Phil Pressey have a guaranteed contract? Why? All of the other teams in the league are basically dumping their bad contracts onto our roster.

Watching the Celtics lose is depressing. I watched them lose for a long time. Then they were miraculously so good. And now I am going to watch them lose again. It's a total bummer.

Re: This whiny self entitled fan base is starting to tick me off
« Reply #106 on: July 21, 2014, 08:34:50 PM »

Offline Sketch5

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These self-aggrandizing moonpies talking about how great it will be to be a contender in 5 years are starting to p--- me off. Really? You're looking forward to watching a literally TERRIBLE team for the next five years? Next three years? Maybe we could sign some more guards!

You people won't be happy until our tallest player is 6'3" and shoots free throws like a seven year old. Then we would be REALLY bad!!!!

 ???

I think people are just being realistic that it may take 3 to 5 years before we are contending again. Doesn't mean we wont make the playoffs at any point, but legit ECF and Finals shot.

People also are excited to see some new young blood, watch how they grow. It's all part of the game. While the team may not win many games this year to say it's bad basketball just because how many loses the team could have is ignorance. The team played good stints of basketball last season. They were in most games, but just didn't have the go to guy to finish the tight ones. Thats not bad basketball, just a team lacking in a good player.

I can't wait to see Stevens coach this year, and see where he's gotten better. See how the new rookies can help out, see where Sully and KO are at, and if Rondo is good to go.

Now would I rather have a contender this season and get deep into the playoffs? Well, yeah. But unless an other team wants to play ball with DA we are going threw an other season like last. But I'm prepared for it, and looking forward to finding some bright spots this season.

But I'm a glass half full kind of guy. And just because your a half empty type of person, doesn't mean it should result in calling other people out that are realistic half full kind of people, and name calling. 

Re: This whiny self entitled fan base is starting to tick me off
« Reply #107 on: July 21, 2014, 08:37:01 PM »

Offline Rondo9

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These self-aggrandizing moonpies talking about how great it will be to be a contender in 5 years are starting to p--- me off. Really? You're looking forward to watching a literally TERRIBLE team for the next five years? Next three years? Maybe we could sign some more guards!

You people won't be happy until our tallest player is 6'3" and shoots free throws like a seven year old. Then we would be REALLY bad!!!!

 ???


I havent been this active on CB in years... How long has it been this trollish? I mean this is a thread obviously about posters complaining ab each other, but every other thread is infected with this childish crap.

I started posting on this site the last time we were rebuilding and it was actually possible to disagree with other posters without painting such broad strokes about a whole fanbase.

I also started posting at that time. But back then, nobody called the police about a vituperative argument. I bet you also think children should wear helmets at the playground, and are glad to take your shoes off at airports, because freedom is a worthy sacrifice for "safety."

I think this time there is even less hope. Despite the cries of "assets!" We literally have nine guards on the roster, a second year back up and VITOR FAVERANI at center, and then a bunch of "forwards" all of whom play somewhere between two positions.

I don't really see a free agent wanting to play here because of the players on the team. And I think we have seen that the only thing players in the NBA care about, besides money - is winning (LeBron could win anywhere). We have no draw, and no forseeable draw. LeBron and Durant will dominate the next five years, and after that we are looking at Parker, Anthony Davis, Wiggins, Blake Griffin and Andre Drummond (and Boogie?). We won't raise up a star from the draft, and surround that star with a competent team literally for years.

What earthly purpose was there for signing Evan Turner? So we could be defenseless at his position for stretches? Why does Phil Pressey have a guaranteed contract? Why? All of the other teams in the league are basically dumping their bad contracts onto our roster.

Watching the Celtics lose is depressing. I watched them lose for a long time. Then they were miraculously so good. And now I am going to watch them lose again. It's a total bummer.

You really think that the Celtics will suck for another decade. Management is much better than it was in the nineties and early 2000's. Danny is just collecting assets for that big trade. All you need is patience.

Re: This whiny self entitled fan base is starting to tick me off
« Reply #108 on: July 21, 2014, 08:55:22 PM »

Offline Greenbean

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These self-aggrandizing moonpies talking about how great it will be to be a contender in 5 years are starting to p--- me off. Really? You're looking forward to watching a literally TERRIBLE team for the next five years? Next three years? Maybe we could sign some more guards!

You people won't be happy until our tallest player is 6'3" and shoots free throws like a seven year old. Then we would be REALLY bad!!!!

 ???


I havent been this active on CB in years... How long has it been this trollish? I mean this is a thread obviously about posters complaining ab each other, but every other thread is infected with this childish crap.

I started posting on this site the last time we were rebuilding and it was actually possible to disagree with other posters without painting such broad strokes about a whole fanbase.

I also started posting at that time. But back then, nobody called the police about a vituperative argument. I bet you also think children should wear helmets at the playground, and are glad to take your shoes off at airports, because freedom is a worthy sacrifice for "safety."

I think this time there is even less hope. Despite the cries of "assets!" We literally have nine guards on the roster, a second year back up and VITOR FAVERANI at center, and then a bunch of "forwards" all of whom play somewhere between two positions.

I don't really see a free agent wanting to play here because of the players on the team. And I think we have seen that the only thing players in the NBA care about, besides money - is winning (LeBron could win anywhere). We have no draw, and no forseeable draw. LeBron and Durant will dominate the next five years, and after that we are looking at Parker, Anthony Davis, Wiggins, Blake Griffin and Andre Drummond (and Boogie?). We won't raise up a star from the draft, and surround that star with a competent team literally for years.

What earthly purpose was there for signing Evan Turner? So we could be defenseless at his position for stretches? Why does Phil Pressey have a guaranteed contract? Why? All of the other teams in the league are basically dumping their bad contracts onto our roster.

Watching the Celtics lose is depressing. I watched them lose for a long time. Then they were miraculously so good. And now I am going to watch them lose again. It's a total bummer.

Listen i understand your position on the team i just dont get why you have to throw in personal barbs about posters in the midst of making your arguments?

I mean what the heck are you even talking about? Whos "calling the police"? Arent these sports debates? Sports discussions? I can handle disagreements but i have to read this petty back and forth between two groups about who is dumber for feeling a certain way about a basketball team in every thread.

This place kind of sucks now.




 

Re: This whiny self entitled fan base is starting to tick me off
« Reply #109 on: July 21, 2014, 09:16:15 PM »

Offline bballdog384

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I started posting during the last rebuild...

And virtually stopped posting while they were contenders.

And now I'm posting again...


Rebuilds are exciting - the team could go in so many directions. We have so many assets!!

Suck it up and enjoy the ride  ;D
"You can't play like a robot" -Coach Stevens

Re: This whiny self entitled fan base is starting to tick me off
« Reply #110 on: July 21, 2014, 11:39:24 PM »

Offline jaketwice

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These self-aggrandizing moonpies talking about how great it will be to be a contender in 5 years are starting to p--- me off. Really? You're looking forward to watching a literally TERRIBLE team for the next five years? Next three years? Maybe we could sign some more guards!

You people won't be happy until our tallest player is 6'3" and shoots free throws like a seven year old. Then we would be REALLY bad!!!!

 ???

I think people are just being realistic that it may take 3 to 5 years before we are contending again. Doesn't mean we wont make the playoffs at any point, but legit ECF and Finals shot.

People also are excited to see some new young blood, watch how they grow. It's all part of the game. While the team may not win many games this year to say it's bad basketball just because how many loses the team could have is ignorance. The team played good stints of basketball last season. They were in most games, but just didn't have the go to guy to finish the tight ones. Thats not bad basketball, just a team lacking in a good player.

I can't wait to see Stevens coach this year, and see where he's gotten better. See how the new rookies can help out, see where Sully and KO are at, and if Rondo is good to go.

Now would I rather have a contender this season and get deep into the playoffs? Well, yeah. But unless an other team wants to play ball with DA we are going threw an other season like last. But I'm prepared for it, and looking forward to finding some bright spots this season.

But I'm a glass half full kind of guy. And just because your a half empty type of person, doesn't mean it should result in calling other people out that are realistic half full kind of people, and name calling.

While I appreciate what you have to say - the OP is really saying something else: he's saying "I'm a better person than all of these negative nancys out here..." He's puffing himself up as if he is "better" than others...

...it's the same thinking that leads to dictators and political correctness, and all other kinds of loathsome jingoism.  I hate that kind of talk. If you have something substantive to say - then say it - but if he's going to come out bashing everyone who is negative on the team - just because they're negative, he is doing exactly what you are complaining about. Not that I really mind.

Let's be honest - an internet message board is a great place to have (what amounts to) an argument about nothing. Neither the OP nor I will ever win a debate over whether one ought to be pleased or displeased with the management of a team neither of us own (in whose laundry we have only the barest personal investment). What matters is the debate.

To my mind, when you come in blowing smoke with "all you whiny entitled fans..." you ought to get served by the people you're implicitly attacking. And let me say, friend, that one thing I do have is a large vocabulary, and a largely worthless degree in English literature. I'm an internet Zorro, only my sword is a keyboard, and I am a little paunchier than that fabled hero.

In that sense - maybe the OP is right. Being a hater and having little flamewars is totally diverting. Maybe I enjoy the team more now?

Re: This whiny self entitled fan base is starting to tick me off
« Reply #111 on: July 22, 2014, 10:48:35 AM »

Offline DesertDweller

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I haven't been around long but I find it a little discouraging reading that we should tank for the next 3-4 years. I live in L.A. and have DirecTV so for me to follow my Celtics I naturally subscribe to NBA League Pass.
The last thing I am going to do is sit in front of my TV and root for the C's to lose for the next couple years. for one, I am not a fan of tanking because I believe it's counter productive to players developing in this league and also just how do you go about rooting for your team to lose and spend money on top of it???

Re: This whiny self entitled fan base is starting to tick me off
« Reply #112 on: July 22, 2014, 10:50:19 AM »

Offline Cman

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I haven't been around long but I find it a little discouraging reading that we should tank for the next 3-4 years. I live in L.A. and have DirecTV so for me to follow my Celtics I naturally subscribe to NBA League Pass.
The last thing I am going to do is sit in front of my TV and root for the C's to lose for the next couple years.

Instead think of it this way -- you get to watch the young players develop. It is quite fun, actually.
Celtics fan for life.

Re: This whiny self entitled fan base is starting to tick me off
« Reply #113 on: July 22, 2014, 10:52:19 AM »

Offline PaulAllen

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I haven't been around long but I find it a little discouraging reading that we should tank for the next 3-4 years. I live in L.A. and have DirecTV so for me to follow my Celtics I naturally subscribe to NBA League Pass.
The last thing I am going to do is sit in front of my TV and root for the C's to lose for the next couple years.

Instead think of it this way -- you get to watch the young players develop. It is quite fun, actually.

I love watching young players develop but losing gets old quick..

Re: This whiny self entitled fan base is starting to tick me off
« Reply #114 on: July 22, 2014, 11:01:25 AM »

Offline gpap

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This thread really needs to be put to pasture and should NEVER have been started to begin with.

It would be like me starting a thread saying "people who don't mind seeing the Celtics suck for the next 5 years have no clue what they are talking about!!"

Imagine how well that would go over.

Like a lead balloon.

Re: This whiny self entitled fan base is starting to tick me off
« Reply #115 on: July 22, 2014, 11:10:55 AM »

Offline D.o.s.

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I don't think anyone actively enjoys watching the Celtics lose. People just rationalize it in different ways.
At least a goldfish with a Lincoln Log on its back goin' across your floor to your sock drawer has a miraculous connotation to it.

Re: This whiny self entitled fan base is starting to tick me off
« Reply #116 on: July 24, 2014, 08:14:10 AM »

Offline LB3533

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He had Joe Johnson, too, who played quite effectively when given consistent playing time.  That was the duo, Johnson and Pierce, not Walker and Pierce.

Johnson played 48 games and lost his starting job to Kedrick "bleeping" Brown, whom the front office, including Jim O'Brien preferred to keep over Joe Johnson, despite Phoenix wanting Kedrick more.

Joe eventually turned into a stud, but not a Paul Pierce.

May I ask how he lost his starting job to Brown?  I've checked the game logs, and Joe played pretty well, and really well in games against the Wizards, Pacers, and Bucks, and then all of a sudden, like a week or two before he was traded, he's only playing 12-15 minutes a night off of the bench.



Hey Beat LA, I don't know how Joe lost his starting job to Kedrick. My estimation is Jim O'Brien & the front office were not patient enough, and again, I'm guesstimating the coaching staff, particularly Obie viewed Kedrick's athletic prowess to be greater than Joe's (back then) skinny physique. This viewpoint possibly gave Obie & the coaching staff a greater positive hope for being the better defensive type of player.

I don't know what exactly was going through their minds/thought process.

When Joe was traded for RRogers+TDelk.....I was furious! I didn't want them them to give up a shot at getting/developing another young Antoine or young Pierce.

But, now I know, years later, that I was reacting and thinking/feeling like a fan, not a front office personnel or a head coach/coaching staff member.

Re: This whiny self entitled fan base is starting to tick me off
« Reply #117 on: July 24, 2014, 10:38:43 AM »

Offline LB3533

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I went to look at the game logs, briefly longer than estimated.

Joe's last Game Started for the Celtics, back in time, was 1-18-2002. Joe was scoreless (0-4) in 18 min played. These stats don't say anything important.

In those last bunch of games (11) (Joe started) before he lost his Starting Gig to Kedrick (1st Start on 1-19-2001), the Celtics were 5 Wins - 6 Losses. (2 W - 1 L) afterwards when Kedrick started. Don't mean jack, too small sample size).

Joe AVG 18.9 MPG (208 min / 11 games). Joe AVG 5.2 PPG (57 points / 11g) on FG% 34.3% (24/70).

Joe's 2 previous monthly splits:

November (10 out 11 Games Started) 28.4 MPG: FG% .468   TS% .528    PPG - 9.5    RPG - 4.4    APG - 2.6

December (15 /16 GS) 23.1 MPG: FG% .451    TS% .493     PPG - 7.1     RPG - 3.4     APG - 1.7

January SPLITS (8 / 14 GS) 17MPG: FG% .359     TS% .435     PPG - 4.1      RPG - 2.1      APG - 0.9     


So before AVG - 17 MPG in Jan. Joe was averaging 25.26 MPG in (Nov. + Dec.) In these two months he started 25 out of 27 games or 92% of the games played. In January, Joe started only 8 / 14 games or 57.14%. In the 10 games after Joe lost his Starters job & before he was traded to PHO, he was averaging 7.8 MPG (78 / 10) as a reserve off the bench.

My last comment on Joe's starting job loss: Joe did't lose his starters gig to Kedrick. It wasn't like Kedrick lit the league on fire. Kedrick didn't "win" the starter's job, he was given the job by coaching just as a "test run" because Joe was struggling in his 14 games of January.

In Joe's 1st game started for the PHO Suns (after 1 game off the bench) Joe's game line - 23/11/6 on (11/18) .611 shooting (1-3 on 3's) with zero FTs & FTAs.

Joe struggled in his next 7 games as a Sun Starter. 6 ppg/5 rpg/4 apg on shooting (17/63) or 27 FG%. (25.6 MPG)

But the Suns didn't quit with Joe, they continued to play AND START him.

After those struggling 7 games, Joe went on to average 9.67 PPG to finish the season for the Suns. And a 10.9 PPG in the last month of April. Both numbers higher than any month for the Celtics. He shot 45.5 FG% (117/257). 844 total mins over 27 games or 31.26 MPG.

My key points out of all this:

  • Don't quit on your young guys. If you're going to stink up the joint, why not just let the youngsters learn from the experience & have them learn how to work out of that "smelly" joint.
  • The MO of Obie's staff was to make the playoffs, build upon their previous year's 24-24 finish after Rick Pitino quit.
  • Now, our current MO, & there is no doubt Danny & Stevens are on the same page, their MO is to develope, hone, improve the young roster for the future. This may entail that Danny will trade these improved youngsters for proven star veteran type players. We've seen this happen before.



Re: This whiny self entitled fan base is starting to tick me off
« Reply #118 on: July 24, 2014, 10:41:50 AM »

Offline crimson_stallion

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Losing more games would have been a big deal.  Being tied with Utah led to losing the coin toss and picking 6 instead of 5.  Calling someone out for that makes a lot of sense.

Also, Smart has definite bust/disappointment potential, was a pick at a position of (current) non-need, and was taken ahead of Randle.  Any of those reasons would make it perfectly reasonable for people not to be happy with the Smart pick.

Losing one more game would have given us the 5th pick instead of 6th, in which case Danny would have most likely taken Dante Exum.  So far in summer league Exum has stunk.  He may well one day be great, but 'may' is the operative word here.  Right now, Smart is the better player.

Losing a few more games might have gotten us to 4rd pick above Orlando, who ended up taking Aaron Gordon.  So far he has probably stunk even more than Exum - which I had long predicted.  There is a pretty minor chance that he will ever develop into even a 'usable' offensive player...much less an above average one.  He may contend for the title of "worst free throw shooting perimeter player in history" once his career is finalised.

3rd Pick would have gotten us Embiid - a guy with very high potential, but who was basically one level down from being red flagged for his injuries.  Could easily become a superstar, could just as easilly be the next Greg Oden...very high risk. 

2nd pick was never realistically achievable given that Cleveland took #1, and so #2 went to the worst team in the league...Boston could not have topped that bad a win record regardless. 

Basically what it comes down to is that the wost Boston could have realistically achieved would have been to rank 4th or 5th in the draft, and as it turns out so far the guys taken at those positions don't look even nearly as good as Smart has.

As for Randle...he looks terribly mediocre, as I had predicted.  He'll probably be a solid player, maybe a decent starter.  I don't think his ceiling is any higher than Smart's at all...and he also has a terribly selfish and arrogant attitude (while Smart is humble and team oriented). 

To be hoenst, even Parker and Wiggins could bust just as easilly as Smart could.  They haven't really looked much better than he has so far in Summer League play.

In fact, out of the top 8 draft picks, right now, Smart has probably been the second most effective after Parker.

I am of the opinion that Danny has done incredibly well in this year's draft, regardless of where he fell in the draft.  I that Smart has just as much chance of becoming a star in this league as any other player in the top 8.  Whether he will...that's something we will find out at a later time.

But yes, ultimately all the negativity is incredibly frustrating.  People talk about signing Love as if tht would be the one move that would transform the Celtics into a contender.  No way.  Love is nowhere near good enough to transform a bottom 6 team in to a contender on his own.  Just take a look at Minnesota for the last 6 years and you'll see.  I wouldn't be surprised at all if one of the guys we have right now (other than Rondo) ends up contributing more to this team's win record than Love would have.  Maybe not this season coming, but in the next 2-3 seasons. 

Re: This whiny self entitled fan base is starting to tick me off
« Reply #119 on: July 24, 2014, 10:56:09 AM »

Offline crimson_stallion

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These self-aggrandizing moonpies talking about how great it will be to be a contender in 5 years are starting to p--- me off. Really? You're looking forward to watching a literally TERRIBLE team for the next five years? Next three years? Maybe we could sign some more guards!

You people won't be happy until our tallest player is 6'3" and shoots free throws like a seven year old. Then we would be REALLY bad!!!!

 ???

I hope you aren't one of those guys who was begging for Ainge to draft Aaron Gordon, because when it comes to undersized guys who can't shoot free throws...

I think it's blatantly obvious what Ainge is doing.  He's not drafting for position, he's drafting to get the best player available.  He's doing the same with free agency - he's not going for needs as a top priority, he's going for assets.  Guys who he is hoping he can buy cheap, develop for a season, then sell for a premium price.

Tyler Zeller - a guy who has the potentially to possibly be a starting calibre center after a bit more experience.  Danny got him for essentially nothing.  Can't possibly sell him for less than nothing.  If Danny can develop Zeller in to even a reasonably productive center, then he should be able to get more return on him than he invested (the basketball equivalent of making a profit). 

Evan Turner was a $10M guy if he stayed in Philly, as he was at one point in the season averaging around 20 PPG there.  He moved to Indy, didn't fit, his value went down.  Danny grabbed him for maybe $3M.  That is a rediculous bargain for a player who is good enough to start at small forward, and who can potentially give you 16-18 points per night as a starter.  The aim?  To have Turner prove to the world that he can still play...then you can increase interest throughout the league, and hopefully trade him out for a player that better suits the team needs.

Smart?  The safest choice out of all the players available when Danny chose at #6. He's NBA ready enough to contribute right away, yet has the potential to get much better in a few years.  Low risk, high payoff.

Same with Young.

Same with Thornton.  The guy can score in bunches, but if worst comes to worst and he proves that he is useless...then he is still an asset as an expiring contract.

There is nobody available in this year's free agency who Boston had a realistic shot at signing, and who would have made the team a contender.  So better to stockpile assets, so that way you have huge 'transactional' flexibility.  This way when a team comes to Boston mid year about a trade, danny will almost certainly have something suitable to offer. 

Danny is doing what he's supposed to do.  He's being a GM, instead of a fan. If he can't make the big move now, then he'll try to get as many assets as possible so he can hopefully make an offer to one later.  Simple.  If one of those assets happens to get lucky for him and grow into a star player...even better.