Author Topic: Who's left in the Kevin Love sweepstakes?  (Read 9960 times)

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Re: Who's left in the Kevin Love sweepstakes?
« Reply #15 on: July 14, 2014, 03:32:42 AM »

Offline Rondo9

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I think that's pretty grossly overvaluing Waiters and especially Bennett. Bennett hasn't really shown anything.
Bennett looks fantastic in summer league.  He's in far better shape and showing real skill.

Summer League? Really?! Well then I guess Kelly Olynyk would suffice as a great trading piece then.......
Bennett has a higher ceiling. Not sure if he'll get there, but the kid has tools to be an all-star some day.  I think Kelly is what he is.

Kelly can still improve on his game, he put in the work during the summer and it showed. Bennett on the other hand, I don't see all star potential I think he can be a high level role player at best.
Ok. 

Cavs have played two summer league games.  Wiggins looks solid, but the story has been Bennett.  We'll see what happens.  I watched him a bit last season as well and he looked pretty intriguing. 

Watch this video from February:  http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=10417145

He was taken #1 for a reason.  His rookie season was awful... but he's starting to show why he was taken #1.

I want to see him play in an NBA game. He looks good, but many players looked good before flaming out of the league.

Re: Who's left in the Kevin Love sweepstakes?
« Reply #16 on: July 14, 2014, 03:35:17 AM »

Offline LarBrd33

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I think that's pretty grossly overvaluing Waiters and especially Bennett. Bennett hasn't really shown anything.
Bennett looks fantastic in summer league.  He's in far better shape and showing real skill.

Summer League? Really?! Well then I guess Kelly Olynyk would suffice as a great trading piece then.......
Bennett has a higher ceiling. Not sure if he'll get there, but the kid has tools to be an all-star some day.  I think Kelly is what he is.

Kelly can still improve on his game, he put in the work during the summer and it showed. Bennett on the other hand, I don't see all star potential I think he can be a high level role player at best.
Ok. 

Cavs have played two summer league games.  Wiggins looks solid, but the story has been Bennett.  We'll see what happens.  I watched him a bit last season as well and he looked pretty intriguing. 

Watch this video from February:  http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=10417145

He was taken #1 for a reason.  His rookie season was awful... but he's starting to show why he was taken #1.

I want to see him play in an NBA game. He looks good, but many players looked good before flaming out of the league.
A few days after that David Thorpe video, I tuned in to watch Bennett to see if Thrope was out of his freakin mind.  I happened to watch this game:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDiLD-ozUG0  ...  Kid is raw, but he's got a big body that seems to move really well, great shooting mechanics... and he was a lot more slim than I thought he'd be.   Basically everything Thrope said in that video he was showing in that game.  Just one game, but still... he showed his potential.

That was February... He's gotten in better shape since then.  Add intriguing athleticism and aggressiveness to the list of tools: 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLd8n4_dRH4

I think people have trouble understanding that Bennett was taken knowing full-well he was a raw prospect who had boom/bust potential.   He was never going to be someone who could come in and immediately contribute.  The Cavs sized up that draft and determined that it was full of mediocre crap and if they needed to swing for a home run.  Bennett was a the guy everyone pegged as having the highest ceiling.    Same rationalization behind the Magic taking Aaron Gordon this year... nobody expects him to contribute in year 1.

Re: Who's left in the Kevin Love sweepstakes?
« Reply #17 on: July 14, 2014, 03:39:06 AM »

Offline adam.jones614

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I think the thing separating the Cleveland (without Wiggins) trade and a potential Celtics deal is still the picks though. Especially if we start tossing the Brooklyn picks around, which most sane people believe should be lottery picks by 2016.  This paired with our stable of assets and expiring deals trumps any package Cleveland can roll out besides Wiggins in my opinion. Just my opinion though of course.

Re: Who's left in the Kevin Love sweepstakes?
« Reply #18 on: July 14, 2014, 03:54:00 AM »

Offline Rondo9

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I think that's pretty grossly overvaluing Waiters and especially Bennett. Bennett hasn't really shown anything.
Bennett looks fantastic in summer league.  He's in far better shape and showing real skill.

Summer League? Really?! Well then I guess Kelly Olynyk would suffice as a great trading piece then.......
Bennett has a higher ceiling. Not sure if he'll get there, but the kid has tools to be an all-star some day.  I think Kelly is what he is.

Kelly can still improve on his game, he put in the work during the summer and it showed. Bennett on the other hand, I don't see all star potential I think he can be a high level role player at best.
Ok. 

Cavs have played two summer league games.  Wiggins looks solid, but the story has been Bennett.  We'll see what happens.  I watched him a bit last season as well and he looked pretty intriguing. 

Watch this video from February:  http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=10417145

He was taken #1 for a reason.  His rookie season was awful... but he's starting to show why he was taken #1.

I want to see him play in an NBA game. He looks good, but many players looked good before flaming out of the league.
A few days after that David Thorpe video, I tuned in to watch Bennett to see if Thrope was out of his freakin mind.  I happened to watch this game:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDiLD-ozUG0  ...  Kid is raw, but he's got a big body that seems to move really well, great shooting mechanics... and he was a lot more slim than I thought he'd be.   Basically everything Thrope said in that video he was showing in that game.  Just one game, but still... he showed his potential.

That was February... He's gotten in better shape since then.  Add intriguing athleticism and aggressiveness to the list of tools: 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLd8n4_dRH4

I think people have trouble understanding that Bennett was taken knowing full-well he was a raw prospect who had boom/bust potential.   He was never going to be someone who could come in and immediately contribute.  The Cavs sized up that draft and determined that it was full of mediocre crap and if they needed to swing for a home run.  Bennett was a the guy everyone pegged as having the highest ceiling.    Same rationalization behind the Magic taking Aaron Gordon this year... nobody expects him to contribute in year 1.

Nobody thought he would have that bad of a rookie season. Again I'd wait until the season begins.

Re: Who's left in the Kevin Love sweepstakes?
« Reply #19 on: July 14, 2014, 04:16:32 AM »

Offline nostar

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Honestly, if the Cavs offered Dion Waiters, Anthony Bennett, and Tristan Thompson, the Wolves would be foolish not to accept.  There is no reason why the Cavs should have to give up Wiggins.

This is sort of how I feel except that I don't think Bennett or Thompson are any better than our bigs. I'd argue Thompson isn't much better than Sully and Bennett has shown to be a bust so far. Smart has far more upside than Waiters and they are actually almost exactly the same size. Their players might be better by a hair but ours are younger and cheaper. That has to come in to play for a rebuilding team. When Flips gets over his denial that he is rebuilding I think he'll consider these deals.

Sully, KO and Smart vs Thompson, Waiters, Bennett is just too close in my opinion.

The difference is we have a mass of future picks that the Cavs can't match. If we truly decided to outbid Cleveland the only way they could compete with us is by trading Wiggins and I can't think of a single reason they should do that. Love is an UFA next season and Cleveland will have a fair amount of cap space at that point. Assume the cap is ~$65M in 2015. The Cav's only have $50M in committed salary and that includes team options. Add in Wiggins $5M and you're looking at $10M worth of cap room. That isn't max money but it could be very easily. Moving Waiters and Bennett this season and taking back expirings would open up a max contract slot of the 2015 off season. That would not be hard at all. Cleveland giving up Wiggins to get Love one year earlier would be outlandishly dumb.

I think the C's only chance to snag Love is to make a deadline deal with Minnesota. I'm not wild about overpaying for him but the close the the deadline it gets the less leverage Minnesota has. Love would likely choose Cleveland, Houston or LA over Boston as an unrestricted FA. The first two because they are title contenders Love would push to the top and LA because they it's his home. Maybe Golden State but they won't have cap space to offer a max without a lot of work.

Golden State could have him right now and to be honest they should make that deal. They should trade Klay/Lee/1st for Love and walk away happy. Thompson is set to be overpaid next season and they can get wing scoring and defense in a cheaper package. They have Iggy who can defend 3 positions and handle the ball. Trade for Love now, get Afflalo in 2015 and laugh all the way to the WCF at a minimum. This season start Curry, Iggy, Barnes, Love, Bogut with Livingston and Green off the bench. They'd need to fill in backup spots but that is a young athletic scoring machine. I can't believe they didn't jump on that deal. Then again they fired a perfectly good coach too.

Re: Who's left in the Kevin Love sweepstakes?
« Reply #20 on: July 14, 2014, 04:50:34 AM »

Offline j804

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^they would give up Wiggins and pay to get him early so he doesn't go elsewhere, like to a team like us at the trade deadline. cleveland management might want to hold onto him but if LeBron wants Love and to be an elite contending team right away best believe it'll get done
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Re: Who's left in the Kevin Love sweepstakes?
« Reply #21 on: July 14, 2014, 06:05:46 AM »

Offline JOMVP

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I think the Nets draft picks are what sets our offer apart. Eventually they look too good to pass up. Except this is Flip Saunders were talking about here...

I also find it interesting that the Celtics still haven't officially announced anything regarding the Avery Bradley contract (unless I missed it) maybe working out S&T scenarios for AB to be included in the Love deal?

Re: Who's left in the Kevin Love sweepstakes?
« Reply #22 on: July 14, 2014, 06:11:03 AM »

Offline Greenbean

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I think that's pretty grossly overvaluing Waiters and especially Bennett. Bennett hasn't really shown anything.
Bennett looks fantastic in summer league.  He's in far better shape and showing real skill.

Summer League? Really?! Well then I guess Kelly Olynyk would suffice as a great trading piece then.......
Bennett has a higher ceiling. Not sure if he'll get there, but the kid has tools to be an all-star some day.  I think Kelly is what he is.

Kelly can still improve on his game, he put in the work during the summer and it showed. Bennett on the other hand, I don't see all star potential I think he can be a high level role player at best.
Ok. 

Cavs have played two summer league games.  Wiggins looks solid, but the story has been Bennett.  We'll see what happens.  I watched him a bit last season as well and he looked pretty intriguing. 

Watch this video from February:  http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=10417145

He was taken #1 for a reason.  His rookie season was awful... but he's starting to show why he was taken #1.

I want to see him play in an NBA game. He looks good, but many players looked good before flaming out of the league.
A few days after that David Thorpe video, I tuned in to watch Bennett to see if Thrope was out of his freakin mind.  I happened to watch this game:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDiLD-ozUG0  ...  Kid is raw, but he's got a big body that seems to move really well, great shooting mechanics... and he was a lot more slim than I thought he'd be.   Basically everything Thrope said in that video he was showing in that game.  Just one game, but still... he showed his potential.

That was February... He's gotten in better shape since then.  Add intriguing athleticism and aggressiveness to the list of tools: 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLd8n4_dRH4

I think people have trouble understanding that Bennett was taken knowing full-well he was a raw prospect who had boom/bust potential.   He was never going to be someone who could come in and immediately contribute.  The Cavs sized up that draft and determined that it was full of mediocre crap and if they needed to swing for a home run.  Bennett was a the guy everyone pegged as having the highest ceiling.    Same rationalization behind the Magic taking Aaron Gordon this year... nobody expects him to contribute in year 1.

While Bennet might turn into a good or all star caliber player, its tough to make the argument that he has the same or more value than KO in a trade. To say KO is at his ceiling and Bennet is at his floor is exaggerating  a bit i think. If both players reach their potential, they would roughly have the same value in my opinion and KO is much closer than Bennet.

If you were a Cavs fan who just watched summer league and his last two gmes from last year maybe youd have the opposite take.

Re: Who's left in the Kevin Love sweepstakes?
« Reply #23 on: July 14, 2014, 07:35:07 AM »

Offline MBunge

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The Cavaliers have told Andrew Wiggins that he isn't going to be in any trade for Kevin Love,  the only teams would be the Celtics and possibly the Warriors if they end up deciding to give up Klay Thompson which is very unlikely.

Any team could make a trade for Kevin Love so everyone is in the race.

Honestly, if the Cavs offered Dion Waiters, Anthony Bennett, and Tristan Thompson, the Wolves would be foolish not to accept.  There is no reason why the Cavs should have to give up Wiggins.

Two starters off a team that won 33 games in an awful conference and a #1 pick who had one of the worst rookie seasons in league history?

Mike

Re: Who's left in the Kevin Love sweepstakes?
« Reply #24 on: July 14, 2014, 07:47:43 AM »

Offline Sketch5

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I think Cleveland was interested in Love when they were trying to get Lebron. But I think Lebron had stated he need more than just a couple guys to win like the Spurs. Bringing in Love would just make them the new Miami Heat. At least contract wise. Maybe thats why they wont include Wiggins, because Lebron may have said he'd rather have two max guys (Him and Irving) and reasonable contract guys supporting them.

Bennett looked good so far in SL. I dont' see why he couldn't be a Kevin Love type player, so Why pay 15 to 20 mill on a guy you have on a rookie contract? Some CBers have been making that same case with Sully and KO, so it could be said in Clevelands case. Having Irving,Lebron,Love all at 20 Mill would kill their cap space just like Miami and it would be the same old song. This way when Wiggins and Bennett are ready for their next contracts, Lebron could take less, and would be the support player if Wiggins and/or Bennett reach their potential.

But off course there's always a chance Lebron didn't learn and wants the best players possible around him to make it easier.

Re: Who's left in the Kevin Love sweepstakes?
« Reply #25 on: July 14, 2014, 08:10:58 AM »

Offline cman88

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considering WHY lebron left Miami, that the 3 max contracts(which they took discounts on) is what limited them in putting a solid bench behind Lebron to compete with the spurs. I have a hard time seeing the cavs then go and trade away half of their young guys to get Kevin Love, another guy who will most likely make more than Bosh/Wade did last year. when Lebron/Irving are already on max contracts.


Re: Who's left in the Kevin Love sweepstakes?
« Reply #26 on: July 14, 2014, 09:06:13 AM »

Offline GreenWarrior

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if anyone thinks Love is going anywhere but Cleveland now is fooling themselves. Lebron signing for 2 yrs.(which is actually 1 yr.) means the cavs need to win now, not in yrs. to come. Lebron can sit here and tell everyone he wants to mentor wiggins and throw all the fluff at everyone so he continues to look like the hero he's supposed to be but his contract is what everyone should be listening to.

the Cavs have no choice but to give in. Wiggins for Love is a formality.

Re: Who's left in the Kevin Love sweepstakes?
« Reply #27 on: July 14, 2014, 09:10:07 AM »

Offline TwinTower14

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if anyone thinks Love is going anywhere but Cleveland now is fooling themselves. Lebron signing for 2 yrs.(which is actually 1 yr.) means the cavs need to win now, not in yrs. to come. Lebron can sit here and tell everyone he wants to mentor wiggins and throw all the fluff at everyone so he continues to look like the hero he's supposed to be but his contract is what everyone should be listening to.

the Cavs have no choice but to give in. Wiggins for Love is a formality.

He signed that deal because of the TV contract - he can opt out and redo a max deal once the new TV deal is established.  It's a good deal for him.  He is pretty tone deaf but for him to write that letter and then leave after one year is crazy....

Re: Who's left in the Kevin Love sweepstakes?
« Reply #28 on: July 14, 2014, 09:20:30 AM »

Offline nacceltic

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Just started a new Houston/Rondo thread with this tweet, but figured it also fits in here...

@ESPNSteinLine  1m
Look for Rockets to re-enter trade game for longtime Houston target Rajon Rondo as well as try to work their way into mix for Kevin Love

Re: Who's left in the Kevin Love sweepstakes?
« Reply #29 on: July 14, 2014, 09:33:42 AM »

Offline Smitty77

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Just started a new Houston/Rondo thread with this tweet, but figured it also fits in here...

@ESPNSteinLine  1m
Look for Rockets to re-enter trade game for longtime Houston target Rajon Rondo as well as try to work their way into mix for Kevin Love

Help me understand what salaries Houston has to make a trade for Rondo please!!!!!

I don't see how it would be possible without Harden.

Smitty77