Author Topic: Lucky17's Yahoo! Points Hoops League: 2014 Offseason: Post Lottery  (Read 324062 times)

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Re: Lucky17's Yahoo! Points Hoops League: 2014 Offseason: Post Lottery
« Reply #420 on: May 29, 2015, 01:10:06 AM »

Offline LarBrd33

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Blockbuster deal pending

1st deal of the offseason confirmed:

Toine's Boys trade: James Young and Toine's Boys 2016 1st round pick

Rondo2287's trade: 2015 #6 pick, 2015 #19 pick, and Isaiah Canaan



I'm missing something significant here, right? The #6 overall pick and the #19 overall pick, plus Isaiah Canaan for James Young and an unknown 2016 first?

What exactly do people expect out of James Young next year? I'm thinking of the right guy right? Young fella, super skinny, plays for the Celtics?

Young is prob a bust. No big deal.

I'm not at all ready to say that. Well, actually I'm completely ready to say Young is probably a bust in the same fashion that most raw. talented, athletic, but for some reason very incomplete players are probably a bust, but I don't think he's like..for sure a bust by any means.

And I guess the potential high lottery pick next year helps too. I'm not really sure why the number 19 is in there.

Ultimately though the heart wants what the heart wants. And maybe my criticism of the trade will look very stupid in December. It happens.

Rondo2287 has a buttload of picks.  He agreed to trade one of the weaker ones for TB's 2016 pick months ago, because TB has finished dead last two years in a row. At the time the pick he was trading was projected 10th. Trade was vetoed because we couldn't trade future picks yet, but both teams made it clear they were going to do it as soon as it was legal.  That "#10 pick" has since moved up to #6.  So rondo2287 is trading #6 for a pick projected 1st next year.  That deal has been expected for months.   They have expanded the trade since then (which is nice, because it ends any concerns about them forcing through a previously vetoed trade). Rondo2287 sending 19 and caanon for James young is a new wrinkle.   Seems you are arguing that TB is winning by getting 6 for his pick next year (debatable) and rondo2287 is winning by getting young for 19+caanon (debateable).   Pretty much evens out then.   Both teams are taking gambles.  Nice trade.

Just my impartial perspective on it.  Does that clear up your confusion?
« Last Edit: May 29, 2015, 01:23:07 AM by LarBrd33 »

Re: Lucky17's Yahoo! Points Hoops League: 2014 Offseason: Post Lottery
« Reply #421 on: May 29, 2015, 07:03:28 AM »

Offline Rondo2287

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It's actually interesting how similar James young and Avery Bradley's rookie seasons were.

That said, as LB33 broke it down we had a deal already agreed to  which I am quite happy with. 

Toines boys then approached me about trading for one of my PGs.  I liked James young and pulled the trigger.  Maybe I didn't have to include number 19 but I dunno
« Last Edit: May 29, 2015, 07:16:45 AM by Rondo2287 »
CB Draft LA Lakers: Lamarcus Aldridge, Carmelo Anthony,Jrue Holiday, Wes Matthews  6.11, 7.16, 8.14, 8.15, 9.16, 11.5, 11.16

Re: Lucky17's Yahoo! Points Hoops League: 2014 Offseason: Post Lottery
« Reply #422 on: May 29, 2015, 08:39:47 AM »

Online hpantazo

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Yeah, the breakdown is pretty accurate. The thing is, I like James Young, and would not have moved him for Canaan straight up, or for the #19 straight up. Both for him was about my asking price. People forget that he is still very young and was never expected to do much last year to begin with.

Re: Lucky17's Yahoo! Points Hoops League: 2014 Offseason: Post Lottery
« Reply #423 on: May 29, 2015, 08:42:39 AM »

Offline Rondo2287

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James Young, Age 19

31 GP
10.7MPG
3.4 ppg
1.4 rpg

Avery Bradley, Age 20
31 GP
5.2 MPG
1.7 ppg
.5 rpg

CB Draft LA Lakers: Lamarcus Aldridge, Carmelo Anthony,Jrue Holiday, Wes Matthews  6.11, 7.16, 8.14, 8.15, 9.16, 11.5, 11.16

Re: Lucky17's Yahoo! Points Hoops League: 2014 Offseason: Post Lottery
« Reply #424 on: May 29, 2015, 09:09:19 AM »

Offline Birdman

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Im thinking of blowing up my team and starting over cause:
1. I been finishing around 5th place the last 5 years and don't see any improvements
2. Im getting bored lol

still have not decided yet but if I see a great offer that I cant pass up and get young players and draft picks then I probably will..or may trade Gasol for some nice young players
C/PF-Horford, Baynes, Noel, Theis, Morris,
SF/SG- Tatum, Brown, Hayward, Smart, Semi, Clark
PG- Irving, Rozier, Larkin

Re: Lucky17's Yahoo! Points Hoops League: 2014 Offseason: Post Lottery
« Reply #425 on: May 29, 2015, 11:39:40 AM »

Offline mkogav

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James Young, Age 19

31 GP
10.7MPG
3.4 ppg
1.4 rpg

Avery Bradley, Age 20
31 GP
5.2 MPG
1.7 ppg
.5 rpg


It seems waaaay too early to make any judgements on James Young. He's so young. Plus, rookie seasons don't mean all that much in the long run, see TJones, Gobert, Schröder, etc... IMO, it's far more important that Young is with a good organization which has a history of developing young players.

That said, like Young Fab Melo had a statistically good rookie season in the D-League, but Danny & Co saw something that they didn't like and quickly jettisoned him. Could it be the same with Young?

If you remember back to the 2013 draft, most of the pre-draft media-thought was that the Cs would take either a PG to develop behind Rondo (Schröder was rumored) or a SF (Giannis was rumored) b/c they went big in the 2012 draft, picking Sully & Melo. However, the Cs went big again with KO & soon after flipped Melo to Washington.

Leading up to the draft, all the sign of this were there, although it wasn't obvious unless u were following closely. If Danny and Co have soured on Young, we *should* know by draft time.

Mk

Sickness, insanity and death were the angels that surrounded my cradle and they have followed me throughout my life - Edvard Munch


DKC Knicks

Re: Lucky17's Yahoo! Points Hoops League: 2014 Offseason: Post Lottery
« Reply #426 on: May 29, 2015, 01:19:35 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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James Young, Age 19

31 GP
10.7MPG
3.4 ppg
1.4 rpg

Avery Bradley, Age 20
31 GP
5.2 MPG
1.7 ppg
.5 rpg


It seems waaaay too early to make any judgements on James Young. He's so young. Plus, rookie seasons don't mean all that much in the long run, see TJones, Gobert, Schröder, etc... IMO, it's far more important that Young is with a good organization which has a history of developing young players.

That said, like Young Fab Melo had a statistically good rookie season in the D-League, but Danny & Co saw something that they didn't like and quickly jettisoned him. Could it be the same with Young?

If you remember back to the 2013 draft, most of the pre-draft media-thought was that the Cs would take either a PG to develop behind Rondo (Schröder was rumored) or a SF (Giannis was rumored) b/c they went big in the 2012 draft, picking Sully & Melo. However, the Cs went big again with KO & soon after flipped Melo to Washington.

Leading up to the draft, all the sign of this were there, although it wasn't obvious unless u were following closely. If Danny and Co have soured on Young, we *should* know by draft time.

Mk
James Young and Tyler Ennis have pretty identical trade value.  Taken one pick away from each other. Some folks thought they'd both be in the lotto.  In-fact, fist pumping bill simmons had a podcast with chad ford prior to the draft where they both speculated that Tyler ennis could be the kind of sleeper talent that we looked back on in several years as the best player in the entire draft.  Neither ennis or young did jack squat their rookie year. Both were great in the d league. 

No bs here, I actually think both could end up being really good players. After the bucks trade I went to a bucks forum and actually told them that ennis could be a real surprise for them.  That had nothing to do with fantasy basketball posturing.   As a basketball fan, I found his situation to be really intriguing.  Ennis and MCW went to the same college a year apart from each other and ennis was actually better statistically. Based on their college careers alone, you could argue that ennis was better.   MCW got picked 11th in a garbage draft.  ennis got picked 18 in a loaded draft.   But the roles and situations were dramatically different. MCW goes to a depleted tanking Philly team and given the green light to do whatever he wanted.  Ennis ends up on a borderline playoff team buried behind three borderline star point guards (Bledsoe, dragic and IT).  What would have happened had Ennis ended up in that tanking Philly team and MCW ended up on that Suns team?  Think about it.  So it was fascinating to me to see what might happen if Jason Kidd decided to give Ennis equal opportunity to MCW.  We shall get a better idea next season. Jury is still out.  There was only so much experimentation the bucks could do over the final 25 games as they fought for a playoff spot. They might opt to play them together if middleton leaves. 

If people here think James Young has dramatically higher trade value than Tyler Ennis, it more speaks to our obvious homerism as a group of Celtic fans participating in a fantasy league.  19 and Caanon seems a little low, but since TB is convinced Caanon has a future as a starting PG, it makes perfect sense.  If someone offered me a top 20 pick and someone I saw as a young starting point guard ... I'd have to consider parting with Ennis.

 
« Last Edit: May 29, 2015, 01:27:16 PM by LarBrd33 »

Re: Lucky17's Yahoo! Points Hoops League: 2014 Offseason: Post Lottery
« Reply #427 on: May 29, 2015, 02:05:52 PM »

Offline mkogav

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James Young and Tyler Ennis have pretty identical trade value.  Taken one pick away from each other. Some folks thought they'd both be in the lotto.  In-fact, fist pumping bill simmons had a podcast with chad ford prior to the draft where they both speculated that Tyler ennis could be the kind of sleeper talent that we looked back on in several years as the best player in the entire draft.  Neither ennis or young did jack squat their rookie year. Both were great in the d league. 

I don't mean to burst ur trade-value pumping bubble, but... nope.

1. James Young is a Celtic.

2. Only Even Turner, on an expiring deal, is blocking Young's minutes. 2013/14 ROY MCW is blocking Ennis' minutes.

3. As u mentioned there is this...



4. Then there is this...





No bs here, I actually think both could end up being really good players.

Potentially, but currently Ennis' path has many more obstacles.


If people here think James Young has dramatically higher trade value than Tyler Ennis

Then he does.

it more speaks to our obvious homerism as a group of Celtic fans participating in a fantasy league. 

Sound a little bitter. Is no one biting on your Ennis proposals?


Caanon seems a little low, but since TB is convinced Caanon has a future as a starting PG, it makes perfect sense.  If someone offered me a top 20 pick and someone I saw as a young starting point guard ... I'd have to consider parting with Ennis.

Good luck.

Mk

Sickness, insanity and death were the angels that surrounded my cradle and they have followed me throughout my life - Edvard Munch


DKC Knicks

Re: Lucky17's Yahoo! Points Hoops League: 2014 Offseason: Post Lottery
« Reply #428 on: May 29, 2015, 02:42:45 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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James Young and Tyler Ennis have pretty identical trade value.  Taken one pick away from each other. Some folks thought they'd both be in the lotto.  In-fact, fist pumping bill simmons had a podcast with chad ford prior to the draft where they both speculated that Tyler ennis could be the kind of sleeper talent that we looked back on in several years as the best player in the entire draft.  Neither ennis or young did jack squat their rookie year. Both were great in the d league. 

I don't mean to burst ur trade-value pumping bubble, but... nope.

1. James Young is a Celtic.

2. Only Even Turner, on an expiring deal, is blocking Young's minutes. 2013/14 ROY MCW is blocking Ennis' minutes.

3. As u mentioned there is this...



4. Then there is this...





No bs here, I actually think both could end up being really good players.

Potentially, but currently Ennis' path has many more obstacles.


If people here think James Young has dramatically higher trade value than Tyler Ennis

Then he does.

it more speaks to our obvious homerism as a group of Celtic fans participating in a fantasy league. 

Sound a little bitter. Is no one biting on your Ennis proposals?


Caanon seems a little low, but since TB is convinced Caanon has a future as a starting PG, it makes perfect sense.  If someone offered me a top 20 pick and someone I saw as a young starting point guard ... I'd have to consider parting with Ennis.

Good luck.

Mk
I'm not disputing that James Young has more trade value in this fantasy league.   Jared Sullinger probably has more trade value in this fantasy league than Terrence Jones.   Kelly Olynyk probably has more trade value in this league than Shabazz Muhammad.... that doesn't mean that they have more trade value in the real world, though.   We have an obvious bias, because we're Celtic fans.  If anyone is cringing at James Young for #19 + Caanon, it speaks more to our homerism.  If you asked a non-Celtic fan, they'd probably shrug that off. Luckily Celtic fandom doesn't impact fantasy production.

And no, Young doesn't have less obstacles.   Post All-star break he played 14 games and 12mpg while shooting 31%.  Ennis played 25 games and averaged 14mpg while shooting 35%.  Ennis is already getting more minutes on a better team. 

Post All-Star Stats:

Ennis:  4 points, 2.4 assists, 1 rebound 35%/27%/60%   
Young: 3.6 points, 0.3 assists, 1.4 rebounds, 32%/26%/58%

D-League Stats:

Ennis:   18.4 points, 4.3 rebounds, 5.3 assists, 1.8 steals, 48%/33%/81%
Young:  21.4 points, 4.8 rebounds, 2 assists, 1.4 steals, 46%/44%/77%

My point is... you know how you're shrugging off Ennis right now?  That's how everyone outside of Boston feels about James Young. 

Neither is good right now.  Their paths towards minutes are comparable.  Middleton is more likely to leave the Bucks than Evan Turner leaving the Celtics.  If anything, Ennis has a more clear path towards minutes next season as he and MCW could end up being the starting back court by default if the Bucks opt to pass on matching Middleton.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2015, 03:00:23 PM by LarBrd33 »

Re: Lucky17's Yahoo! Points Hoops League: 2014 Offseason: Post Lottery
« Reply #429 on: May 29, 2015, 02:49:40 PM »

Offline Birdman

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First of all, I like to thank everyone who has send me messages about my players..Im going thru everyone messages and responding to them as im looking for the best deals..right now, Dragic and Gasol are on the block so keep them coming
C/PF-Horford, Baynes, Noel, Theis, Morris,
SF/SG- Tatum, Brown, Hayward, Smart, Semi, Clark
PG- Irving, Rozier, Larkin

Re: Lucky17's Yahoo! Points Hoops League: 2014 Offseason: Post Lottery
« Reply #430 on: May 29, 2015, 04:46:47 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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RUMOR:   Bellevue nearing a deal that will involve several draft picks and prospects. 

Re: Lucky17's Yahoo! Points Hoops League: 2014 Offseason: Post Lottery
« Reply #431 on: May 29, 2015, 05:34:04 PM »

Offline barefacedmonk

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TP for Birdman! Class act!
"An ounce of practice is worth more than tons of preaching." - M.K. Gandhi


Re: Lucky17's Yahoo! Points Hoops League: 2014 Offseason: Post Lottery
« Reply #432 on: May 29, 2015, 05:37:35 PM »

Offline barefacedmonk

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TP, Mk. Can't say more than that.


My picks are available for someone better than waiver wire pick-ups. Get in touch!
"An ounce of practice is worth more than tons of preaching." - M.K. Gandhi


Re: Lucky17's Yahoo! Points Hoops League: 2014 Offseason: Post Lottery
« Reply #433 on: May 29, 2015, 06:19:17 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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RUMOR:   Bellevue nearing a deal that will involve several draft picks and prospects.

Chaz Buick:  "I'm told that there's a 4-team trade brewing that has a very real possibility of happening in the next 24 hours."

Re: Lucky17's Yahoo! Points Hoops League: 2014 Offseason: Post Lottery
« Reply #434 on: May 29, 2015, 06:53:00 PM »

Offline Rondo2287

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Hearing a trade for an allstar big man is close
CB Draft LA Lakers: Lamarcus Aldridge, Carmelo Anthony,Jrue Holiday, Wes Matthews  6.11, 7.16, 8.14, 8.15, 9.16, 11.5, 11.16