Author Topic: Why would Love want to come here and why would we want him to?  (Read 8756 times)

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Re: Why would Love want to come here and why would we want him to?
« Reply #30 on: June 18, 2014, 04:49:30 PM »

Offline Lucky17

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This will most likely anger everyone but I do not see the point in trading away all these great potential assets for Kevin Love. Let's go with idea that we get Love and Asik to go with Rondo. Completely doable, correct? That leaves us razor thin on the bench

You lost me here. Why does Ainge stop at adding Asik and Love?

Because he'd have already depleted his store of 'assets' to obtain them, especially Love...

With Rondo, Love and Asik on the roster, what do you think our salary cap position would look like???

See above. This is patently wrong. Ainge will have assets to make further moves, as I pointed out in my response (below).


This will most likely anger everyone but I do not see the point in trading away all these great potential assets for Kevin Love. Let's go with idea that we get Love and Asik to go with Rondo. Completely doable, correct? That leaves us razor thin on the bench

You lost me here. Why does Ainge stop at adding Asik and Love?

Because he'd have already depleted his store of 'assets' to obtain them, especially Love...

With Rondo, Love and Asik on the roster, what do you think our salary cap position would look like???

Who cares about the salary cap?

Bird Rights to Humphries, Bradley, Bayless
untraded draft picks (because contrary to the OP, Ainge cannot trade ALL 10 or so draft picks to get Love)
MLE

Not to mention expiring contracts not used in the above deals.

People keep thinking the cupboard will be bare after the Asik and Love deals. It won't be.
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Re: Why would Love want to come here and why would we want him to?
« Reply #31 on: June 18, 2014, 04:56:54 PM »

Offline Sixth Man

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To answer the second part of your question:

Because he's a good player.

Also, I've got to admit.

These references to "giving up the farm" and "giving up great potential assets" are driving me insane!!!

If I can make a suggestion, let's ignore and forget the term asset and farm:

Let's just stick with this theory and/or breakdown:

We are giving up "playes and picks" for a really good player

Also, you have to deal value to receive value.

It looks like the terms "asset" and "farm" have taken on a life of their own.

Players, picks, cap space, etc. all have value in a relative sense.  All draft picks represent the opportunity to acquire young talent.  Would you trade all nine or ten of our 1st rounders over the next 5 years to acquire Love?  

I didn't think so....

Who said it's going to take 9-10 1st round picks to land Love?

Another strawman.

You guys are killing me.  Surely you're bright enough to understand that the point I was making is that picks have value as assets, not instead suggesting that it would take 10 picks to obtain him.  Simply unbelievable... ::) ::) ::)

It's not unbelievable, when other people keep screaming "THERE WILL BE NOTHING LEFT" after a Love trade.

Why bother pointing out a strawman with a strawman? Are you unfamiliar with the phrase 'rhetorical question'?

More concerning: you're continually misrepresenting his position. I've read enough of your posts to know that  you're not stupid, so the question becomes -- why do you persist?

Whose position am I misrepresenting? The OP's, or Sixth Man's?

I have no problem with people saying there's a limit to the number of picks to give up in a Love deal. Picks are assets, even if they aren't being used to draft players.

My problem is again with the mentality expressed by those against a Love trade (like the OP) because they think it will "exhaust all available assets." It won't, because it can't.

There you go again, moving the goalposts by conflating another's poster's post with mine.
Incredibly, you've done this after now indicating that you agree with the point I was originally trying to make...you may not be a troll, but at the very least, you are an uninhibited contrarian of the lowest order...

Re: Why would Love want to come here and why would we want him to?
« Reply #32 on: June 18, 2014, 05:00:01 PM »

Offline Lucky17

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^Perhaps I don't understand what you mean when you said this.


You lost me here. Why does Ainge stop at adding Asik and Love?

Because he'd have already depleted his store of 'assets' to obtain them, especially Love...


Unless you mean that "depleted" does not mean "exhausted"?
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Re: Why would Love want to come here and why would we want him to?
« Reply #33 on: June 18, 2014, 05:57:29 PM »

Offline aporel#18

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I don't care about what Love likes about the Celtics... the guy screams "Laker" to me (soft, whiny, no defense), so I'm biased against him.

Celtics shouldn't offer any of the Brooklyn 2016 to 2018 draft options (picks or right to swap) for Kevin Love (or Melo). If LaMarcus Aldridge or Marc Gasol were available, on the other hand... but not for K-Love.

Celtics shouldn't offer more than #6+Sully or Kelly+Clipper's 2015 pick+Bass+Bogans. In that package you have a player who can be a poor man's Love, a pretty decent lottery pick, a quality player in Bass, 5M savings and a wild card pick who could end being pretty good due to Sterling's circus (although it will probably end up in the 20s).

What is Love?  ;D   Kevin Love Is a rich man Avi Lee (no D), a great offensive player but not the kind of star who affects on both sides of the ball. Extension or not, the thought of paying that guy those lots of money makes me sick.

Yes, the Cs would still have some picks, but I'd rather send them for a two-way star who can dominate and help you win big.


Re: Why would Love want to come here and why would we want him to?
« Reply #34 on: June 18, 2014, 06:06:37 PM »

Offline Yoki_IsTheName

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Why would Kevin Love want to come here?

- Not sure if this is his exact position but I believe because...
   
a.) There's a better chance he makes the Playoffs in the East
b.) With the assets Boston has, there's also a chance to build a contending team around him and Rajon Rondo, which could appease him.


Why would we want him to come here?

- I'll answer the question with a question. Is 26 points 12 rebounds, 4 assists, 46% shooting, 37% 3PT Per Game, 26.97 PER, 25 years old, possibly a top 10 player, definitely top 15, a legitimate stretch 4 enough reason why?
2019 CStrong Historical Draft 2000s OKC Thunder.
PG: Jrue Holiday / Isaiah Thomas / Larry Hughes
SG: Paul George / Aaron McKie / Bradley Beal
SF: Paul Pierce / Tayshaun Prince / Brian Scalabrine
PF: LaMarcus Aldridge / Shareef Abdur-Raheem / Ben Simmons
C: Jermaine O'neal / Ben Wallace

Re: Why would Love want to come here and why would we want him to?
« Reply #35 on: June 18, 2014, 06:10:24 PM »

Offline freshinthehouse

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Celtics shouldn't offer any of the Brooklyn 2016 to 2018 draft options (picks or right to swap) for Kevin Love (or Melo). If LaMarcus Aldridge or Marc Gasol were available, on the other hand... but not for K-Love.

TP.  This guy is speaking my language.  In my dream scenario we swap Rondo for an additional top 8 pick, and then throw a max level deal to Marc Gasol during the 2015 off-season. 

Re: Why would Love want to come here and why would we want him to?
« Reply #36 on: June 18, 2014, 06:13:27 PM »

Offline Sixth Man

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^Perhaps I don't understand what you mean when you said this.


You lost me here. Why does Ainge stop at adding Asik and Love?

Because he'd have already depleted his store of 'assets' to obtain them, especially Love...


Unless you mean that "depleted" does not mean "exhausted"?

definition of "depleted" from Merriam-Webster:

1 - to empty of a principal substance
2 - to lessen markedly in quantity, content, power, or value.

definition of "exhaust" from Merriam-Webster:

(1)
a :  to consume entirely :  use up <exhausted our funds in a week>
b :  to tire extremely or completely <exhausted by overwork>
c :  to deprive of a valuable quality or constituent <exhaust a soil of fertility>

(2)
a :  to draw off or let out completely
b :  to empty by drawing off the contents; specifically :  to create a vacuum in

(3)
a :  to consider or discuss (a subject) thoroughly or completely
b :  to try out the whole number of <exhausted all the possibilities

The first definition of 'depleted' conforms with the definitions of 'exhaust' but the second
clearly does not.  Satisfied?  Now, if you're finished trolling me, I've got much better things to
do with my time and energy than to waste them any further on someone of your ilk.

Please have a lousy day... >:(

Re: Why would Love want to come here and why would we want him to?
« Reply #37 on: June 18, 2014, 06:13:46 PM »

Offline Aymanelgowainy

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Celtics shouldn't offer any of the Brooklyn 2016 to 2018 draft options (picks or right to swap) for Kevin Love (or Melo). If LaMarcus Aldridge or Marc Gasol were available, on the other hand... but not for K-Love.

TP.  This guy is speaking my language.  In my dream scenario we swap Rondo for an additional top 8 pick, and then throw a max level deal to Marc Gasol during the 2015 off-season.

What the heck is the point of getting Gasol if ur trading away another superstar??? Point is to gather superstars together not trade one for one... This is the exact same reason Rondo isnt being involved in Love trade talks.. The whole point is to gather superstars together to build ur contender around.. Smh

Re: Why would Love want to come here and why would we want him to?
« Reply #38 on: June 18, 2014, 06:14:39 PM »

Offline Aymanelgowainy

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^Perhaps I don't understand what you mean when you said this.


You lost me here. Why does Ainge stop at adding Asik and Love?

Because he'd have already depleted his store of 'assets' to obtain them, especially Love...


Unless you mean that "depleted" does not mean "exhausted"?

definition of "depleted" from Merriam-Webster:

1 - to empty of a principal substance
2 - to lessen markedly in quantity, content, power, or value.

definition of "exhaust" from Merriam-Webster:

(1)
a :  to consume entirely :  use up <exhausted our funds in a week>
b :  to tire extremely or completely <exhausted by overwork>
c :  to deprive of a valuable quality or constituent <exhaust a soil of fertility>

(2)
a :  to draw off or let out completely
b :  to empty by drawing off the contents; specifically :  to create a vacuum in

(3)
a :  to consider or discuss (a subject) thoroughly or completely
b :  to try out the whole number of <exhausted all the possibilities

The first definition of 'depleted' conforms with the definitions of 'exhaust' but the second
clearly does not.  Satisfied?  Now, if you're finished trolling me, I've got much better things to
do with my time and energy than to waste them any further on someone of your ilk.

Please have a lousy day... >:(

Chill out buddy...

Re: Why would Love want to come here and why would we want him to?
« Reply #39 on: June 18, 2014, 06:18:08 PM »

Offline Lucky17

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^Perhaps I don't understand what you mean when you said this.


You lost me here. Why does Ainge stop at adding Asik and Love?

Because he'd have already depleted his store of 'assets' to obtain them, especially Love...


Unless you mean that "depleted" does not mean "exhausted"?

definition of "depleted" from Merriam-Webster:

1 - to empty of a principal substance
2 - to lessen markedly in quantity, content, power, or value.

definition of "exhaust" from Merriam-Webster:

(1)
a :  to consume entirely :  use up <exhausted our funds in a week>
b :  to tire extremely or completely <exhausted by overwork>
c :  to deprive of a valuable quality or constituent <exhaust a soil of fertility>

(2)
a :  to draw off or let out completely
b :  to empty by drawing off the contents; specifically :  to create a vacuum in

(3)
a :  to consider or discuss (a subject) thoroughly or completely
b :  to try out the whole number of <exhausted all the possibilities

The first definition of 'depleted' conforms with the definitions of 'exhaust' but the second
clearly does not.  Satisfied?   

 

 
« Last Edit: June 18, 2014, 10:36:22 PM by fordescort »
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Re: Why would Love want to come here and why would we want him to?
« Reply #40 on: June 18, 2014, 07:09:45 PM »

Offline JBcat

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Let's say Ainge stops with Asik and Love which is doubtful and the trade is Sully, Bass, Bogans, draft picks TPE to get these 2 guys.  We are still left with:

Asik/KO/Iverson
Love/Humphries(bird rights)
Green/Wallace
Bradley(bird rights), Bayless(bird rights)
Rondo/Pressey

That by itself is very solid team.  Then factor in Ainge will have leftover draft picks and the MLE to play with.

You have to get very lucky in the draft to get a star player of Love's caliber.  Consider the draft slots of 5, 11, and 14.  That's where Green, Bayless, and Humphries were drafted.  Even if we don't make the playoffs over the next couple years it will be hard to draft players better than these guys as it's such a crapshoot. It's also no guarantee we'll have better draft position with the future BKN picks.

It's not like Ainge will be selling off the entire future farm and it's crops.  He will still have some picks to play with.

Re: Why would Love want to come here and why would we want him to?
« Reply #41 on: June 18, 2014, 07:58:35 PM »

Offline gpap

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Let's say Ainge stops with Asik and Love which is doubtful and the trade is Sully, Bass, Bogans, draft picks TPE to get these 2 guys.  We are still left with:

Asik/KO/Iverson
Love/Humphries(bird rights)
Green/Wallace
Bradley(bird rights), Bayless(bird rights)
Rondo/Pressey

That by itself is very solid team.  Then factor in Ainge will have leftover draft picks and the MLE to play with.

You have to get very lucky in the draft to get a star player of Love's caliber.  Consider the draft slots of 5, 11, and 14.  That's where Green, Bayless, and Humphries were drafted.  Even if we don't make the playoffs over the next couple years it will be hard to draft players better than these guys as it's such a crapshoot. It's also no guarantee we'll have better draft position with the future BKN picks.

It's not like Ainge will be selling off the entire future farm and it's crops.  He will still have some picks to play with.

Exactly!

There's either this misconception that landing Love will dry up all of our draft picks and/or we should instead save the draft picks in a trade for another player.

We have enough "assets" for more than one trade and who's the other player currently available that you're going to trade for? (crickets)

Re: Why would Love want to come here and why would we want him to?
« Reply #42 on: June 18, 2014, 08:00:15 PM »

Offline D.o.s.

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Let's say Ainge stops with Asik and Love which is doubtful and the trade is Sully, Bass, Bogans, draft picks TPE to get these 2 guys.  We are still left with:

Asik/KO/Iverson
Love/Humphries(bird rights)
Green/Wallace
Bradley(bird rights), Bayless(bird rights)
Rondo/Pressey

That by itself is very solid team.  Then factor in Ainge will have leftover draft picks and the MLE to play with.

You have to get very lucky in the draft to get a star player of Love's caliber.  Consider the draft slots of 5, 11, and 14.  That's where Green, Bayless, and Humphries were drafted.  Even if we don't make the playoffs over the next couple years it will be hard to draft players better than these guys as it's such a crapshoot. It's also no guarantee we'll have better draft position with the future BKN picks.

It's not like Ainge will be selling off the entire future farm and it's crops.  He will still have some picks to play with.

Exactly!

There's either this misconception that landing Love will dry up all of our draft picks and/or we should instead save the draft picks in a trade for another player.

We have enough "assets" for more than one trade and who's the other player currently available that you're going to trade for? (crickets)

Asik is bandied about a lot. Larry Sanders is another one. Some people like Eric Gordon if you can move Wallace's contract at the same time. There are many other players, players that would be good to put around Rondo and Love, but will be unattainable if we send too many draft picks and things out to get Love in the first place.

We don't want to end up like the Knicks.




This, by the way, is you shifting the framework of the discussion: I thought you'd already said you weren't going to support the phrases "assets" or "farms". That post has both.  ;)


final edit: that team assembled above absolutely is not a championship contender. Even if it was, though, I'd like to see real, actually feasible trade packages assembled that

-land Asik and Love
-Send out Sully, Bass, Bogans, and "draft picks"
-Somehow uses the TPE in the middle of all that
-and leaves us with leftover assets.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2014, 08:05:40 PM by D.o.s. »
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Re: Why would Love want to come here and why would we want him to?
« Reply #43 on: June 18, 2014, 08:04:50 PM »

Offline loco_91

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The huge piece of information that we are all missing is this: how likely is Love to stay? Danny and co need to be very careful. Without the right complementary pieces we could be TWolves 2.0 next year, a middle-of-the-pack team in a cold clime.

We lose in the first round, and ring ring. "Kevin, it's Lebron." Miami's big 3 opted in, DWade's precipitous decline continued, and LeBron is looking for a new sidekick. "Your prime is now, and Boston could be good-but-not-great for years. Want rings? Take your talents to South Beach."

If you think it hurt losing Ray...

Re: Why would Love want to come here and why would we want him to?
« Reply #44 on: June 18, 2014, 08:05:27 PM »

Offline gpap

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Let's say Ainge stops with Asik and Love which is doubtful and the trade is Sully, Bass, Bogans, draft picks TPE to get these 2 guys.  We are still left with:

Asik/KO/Iverson
Love/Humphries(bird rights)
Green/Wallace
Bradley(bird rights), Bayless(bird rights)
Rondo/Pressey

That by itself is very solid team.  Then factor in Ainge will have leftover draft picks and the MLE to play with.

You have to get very lucky in the draft to get a star player of Love's caliber.  Consider the draft slots of 5, 11, and 14.  That's where Green, Bayless, and Humphries were drafted.  Even if we don't make the playoffs over the next couple years it will be hard to draft players better than these guys as it's such a crapshoot. It's also no guarantee we'll have better draft position with the future BKN picks.

It's not like Ainge will be selling off the entire future farm and it's crops.  He will still have some picks to play with.

Exactly!

There's either this misconception that landing Love will dry up all of our draft picks and/or we should instead save the draft picks in a trade for another player.

We have enough "assets" for more than one trade and who's the other player currently available that you're going to trade for? (crickets)

Asik is bandied about a lot. Larry Sanders is another one. Some people like Eric Gordon if you can move Wallace's contract at the same time.


This, by the way, is you shifting the framework of the discussion: I thought you'd already said you weren't going to use the phrase assets.  ;)

Lol?.see the quotation marks.

And to your response, like I was saying, the Celts have enough chips to land both Love and a decent rim-protecting big like Asik or Sanders.

As for Eric Gordon, he's too injury prone. No interest him.

If there's anyone thinking we should maybe save some of the picks for someone else like Aldridge or M. Gasol, there's no indication either one of those guys will be available.