Author Topic: The Lin-Asik Gap Year Plan  (Read 15581 times)

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Re: The Lin-Asik Gap Year Plan
« Reply #45 on: April 23, 2014, 09:59:53 AM »

Offline Birdman

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I want no part of Lin
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Re: The Lin-Asik Gap Year Plan
« Reply #46 on: April 23, 2014, 10:27:04 AM »

Offline MBunge

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I also don't get this notion that losing early means you don't know how to win.  Michael Jordan was on teams that won less than 40 games his first two seasons.  Lebron James was on a 35 win team his rookie year.  The Oklahoma City group won 20 games Durant's first season and 23 games Westbrook's first season.  They have been a 50 win team since.  Losing is only a problem if you don't have winners for players.

Look at Cleveland.  Look at Sacramento.  Losing promotes bad habits and bad attitudes.

Mike

Re: The Lin-Asik Gap Year Plan
« Reply #47 on: April 23, 2014, 10:33:22 AM »

Offline cltc5

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I also don't get this notion that losing early means you don't know how to win.  Michael Jordan was on teams that won less than 40 games his first two seasons.  Lebron James was on a 35 win team his rookie year.  The Oklahoma City group won 20 games Durant's first season and 23 games Westbrook's first season.  They have been a 50 win team since.  Losing is only a problem if you don't have winners for players.

Look at Cleveland.  Look at Sacramento.  Losing promotes bad habits and bad attitudes
Mike

kinda like the celtics this year? So were gonna be losers forever and it doesn't matter
the type of players, coaches management you have?  Ok then.

Re: The Lin-Asik Gap Year Plan
« Reply #48 on: April 23, 2014, 10:34:58 AM »

Offline wdleehi

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I also don't get this notion that losing early means you don't know how to win.  Michael Jordan was on teams that won less than 40 games his first two seasons.  Lebron James was on a 35 win team his rookie year.  The Oklahoma City group won 20 games Durant's first season and 23 games Westbrook's first season.  They have been a 50 win team since.  Losing is only a problem if you don't have winners for players.

Look at Cleveland.  Look at Sacramento.  Losing promotes bad habits and bad attitudes.

Mike


Bad management and bad coaching promotes bad habits. 


Good coaching on a growing team with management with a clear plan grow into winners if the talent is there. 

Re: The Lin-Asik Gap Year Plan
« Reply #49 on: April 23, 2014, 10:40:37 AM »

Offline Moranis

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I also don't get this notion that losing early means you don't know how to win.  Michael Jordan was on teams that won less than 40 games his first two seasons.  Lebron James was on a 35 win team his rookie year.  The Oklahoma City group won 20 games Durant's first season and 23 games Westbrook's first season.  They have been a 50 win team since.  Losing is only a problem if you don't have winners for players.

Look at Cleveland.  Look at Sacramento.  Losing promotes bad habits and bad attitudes.

Mike


Bad management and bad coaching promotes bad habits. 


Good coaching on a growing team with management with a clear plan grow into winners if the talent is there.
as does bad players, no matter whether they are young or old.
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Re: The Lin-Asik Gap Year Plan
« Reply #50 on: April 23, 2014, 10:51:01 AM »

Offline cltc5

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I also don't get this notion that losing early means you don't know how to win.  Michael Jordan was on teams that won less than 40 games his first two seasons.  Lebron James was on a 35 win team his rookie year.  The Oklahoma City group won 20 games Durant's first season and 23 games Westbrook's first season.  They have been a 50 win team since.  Losing is only a problem if you don't have winners for players.

Look at Cleveland.  Look at Sacramento.  Losing promotes bad habits and bad attitudes.

Mike


Bad management and bad coaching promotes bad habits. 


Good coaching on a growing team with management with a clear plan grow into winners if the talent is there.

exactly.  Which is why I'm a big proponent of us rebuidling through the draft.  I guarantee well be no closer to winning a world title by bringing in Kevin love, Carmelo, etc then we would with good young well developed players.  People want to hold onto these guys and replicate 2008.  It ain't happening. Popovich didn't go out and get superstars pieces, he got guys that worked in the system and coached them up.  2008 represents an anomoly in that we had 3 great players in a time when it was the first time a trio like that ever came together for a title, and we had a coach who was inept but suitable enough to go out and let the players do what they do.  The cHeat did the same thing.  So unless were getting back those same caliber type players( Love and rondo are not), that banner isn't comin to Boston and and 4-5 years were doin the same crap all over again and praying that that draft is as good as this one.

Re: The Lin-Asik Gap Year Plan
« Reply #51 on: April 23, 2014, 07:15:58 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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as bball tim says, the peak for that roster, if everything goes well, is still not winning a title so what is the point.


It's all about asset acquisition, and putting those assets in a good position to be developed for future value.

I don't expect that the listed roster would contend for a championship at any time in the future.  It would still be a few moves away, at least.  But our current team is even further away, in my opinion.

The alternative, I guess, instead of trading for Lin / Asik and signing Meeks, would be to just sign and trade Bradley for a couple of players on rookie deals (e.g. send him to OKC for Lamb + Adams), draft a project like Capela, and then watch a bunch of cheap, young players figure out how to play NBA basketball. 

I just think there could be some positive value to having more structure and games to play for.  We've already had a tanking season.  We've got a guaranteed top 8 pick.  Turn Rondo into another top 8 pick, and I think with the Brooklyn picks coming down the line that you can start to focus on creating that "winning environment" that's been discussed a lot this year, instead of just tanking for more picks.
You値l have to excuse my lengthiness葉he reason I dread writing letters is because I am so apt to get to slinging wisdom & forget to let up. Thus much precious time is lost.
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Re: The Lin-Asik Gap Year Plan
« Reply #52 on: April 23, 2014, 07:27:07 PM »

Offline BballTim

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as bball tim says, the peak for that roster, if everything goes well, is still not winning a title so what is the point.


It's all about asset acquisition, and putting those assets in a good position to be developed for future value.

I don't expect that the listed roster would contend for a championship at any time in the future.  It would still be a few moves away, at least.  But our current team is even further away, in my opinion.

The alternative, I guess, instead of trading for Lin / Asik and signing Meeks, would be to just sign and trade Bradley for a couple of players on rookie deals (e.g. send him to OKC for Lamb + Adams), draft a project like Capela, and then watch a bunch of cheap, young players figure out how to play NBA basketball. 

I just think there could be some positive value to having more structure and games to play for.  We've already had a tanking season.  We've got a guaranteed top 8 pick.  Turn Rondo into another top 8 pick, and I think with the Brooklyn picks coming down the line that you can start to focus on creating that "winning environment" that's been discussed a lot this year, instead of just tanking for more picks.

  I don't think the odds are that high that one of those top 8 picks will ever be an all-star, let alone both of them. We've had a tanking season and we're unlikely to get a top player with our own pick. We're doubling down by giving away Rondo for a pick who's average level of play is probably below Jeff Green's.

Re: The Lin-Asik Gap Year Plan
« Reply #53 on: April 23, 2014, 08:46:15 PM »

Offline Moranis

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as bball tim says, the peak for that roster, if everything goes well, is still not winning a title so what is the point.


It's all about asset acquisition, and putting those assets in a good position to be developed for future value.

I don't expect that the listed roster would contend for a championship at any time in the future.  It would still be a few moves away, at least.  But our current team is even further away, in my opinion.

The alternative, I guess, instead of trading for Lin / Asik and signing Meeks, would be to just sign and trade Bradley for a couple of players on rookie deals (e.g. send him to OKC for Lamb + Adams), draft a project like Capela, and then watch a bunch of cheap, young players figure out how to play NBA basketball. 

I just think there could be some positive value to having more structure and games to play for.  We've already had a tanking season.  We've got a guaranteed top 8 pick.  Turn Rondo into another top 8 pick, and I think with the Brooklyn picks coming down the line that you can start to focus on creating that "winning environment" that's been discussed a lot this year, instead of just tanking for more picks.

  I don't think the odds are that high that one of those top 8 picks will ever be an all-star, let alone both of them. We've had a tanking season and we're unlikely to get a top player with our own pick. We're doubling down by giving away Rondo for a pick who's average level of play is probably below Jeff Green's.
and to top it off you bring in veterans that wouldn't make you a contender but would clearly hurt draft position and development of players you might actually want to keep around. 

As everyone on here knows, I am not opposed to trading Rondo, I just don't see the point of trading Rondo and then bringing more talent at other positions.  It just doesn't make sense.  Trade Rondo and truly rebuild or build around Rondo.  Those both make sense.  The status quo does not nor does any other option.
2023 Historical Draft - Brooklyn Nets - 9th pick

Bigs - Pau, Amar'e, Issel, McGinnis, Roundfield
Wings - Dantley, Bowen, J. Jackson
Guards - Cheeks, Petrovic, Buse, Rip

Re: The Lin-Asik Gap Year Plan
« Reply #54 on: April 23, 2014, 09:09:10 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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  I don't think the odds are that high that one of those top 8 picks will ever be an all-star, let alone both of them. We've had a tanking season and we're unlikely to get a top player with our own pick. We're doubling down by giving away Rondo for a pick who's average level of play is probably below Jeff Green's.

Yeah, I fundamentally disagree with that statement.  I think a top 8 pick in this draft has a very good chance of being a more valuable player than Jeff Green.
You値l have to excuse my lengthiness葉he reason I dread writing letters is because I am so apt to get to slinging wisdom & forget to let up. Thus much precious time is lost.
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Re: The Lin-Asik Gap Year Plan
« Reply #55 on: April 23, 2014, 09:15:35 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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As everyone on here knows, I am not opposed to trading Rondo, I just don't see the point of trading Rondo and then bringing more talent at other positions.  It just doesn't make sense.  Trade Rondo and truly rebuild or build around Rondo.  Those both make sense.  The status quo does not nor does any other option.


I guess I just think there's a middle ground between "racing toward the bottom" and "having in place a championship core."  Rebuilding, after all, implies that at some point you have to start building something. 

I agree that it's possible for young players to develop even as the team is still figuring things out and losing games.  But that doesn't mean I believe that players that are drafted are guaranteed to reach their potential regardless of the situation they enter when they first come into the league.  So I think part of the rebuilding plan has to be concerned with not just acquiring players / picks, but also maximizing the value of those assets over time.
You値l have to excuse my lengthiness葉he reason I dread writing letters is because I am so apt to get to slinging wisdom & forget to let up. Thus much precious time is lost.
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Re: The Lin-Asik Gap Year Plan
« Reply #56 on: April 23, 2014, 09:15:44 PM »

Offline Rondo9

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  I don't think the odds are that high that one of those top 8 picks will ever be an all-star, let alone both of them. We've had a tanking season and we're unlikely to get a top player with our own pick. We're doubling down by giving away Rondo for a pick who's average level of play is probably below Jeff Green's.

Yeah, I fundamentally disagree with that statement.  I think a top 8 pick in this draft has a very good chance of being a more valuable player than Jeff Green.

I doubt it, he'll probably be just on Green's level.

Re: The Lin-Asik Gap Year Plan
« Reply #57 on: April 23, 2014, 09:36:34 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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  I don't think the odds are that high that one of those top 8 picks will ever be an all-star, let alone both of them. We've had a tanking season and we're unlikely to get a top player with our own pick. We're doubling down by giving away Rondo for a pick who's average level of play is probably below Jeff Green's.

Yeah, I fundamentally disagree with that statement.  I think a top 8 pick in this draft has a very good chance of being a more valuable player than Jeff Green.

I doubt it, he'll probably be just on Green's level.

I think Gordon and Smart have a decent chance of being above average starters.   So I disagree.
You値l have to excuse my lengthiness葉he reason I dread writing letters is because I am so apt to get to slinging wisdom & forget to let up. Thus much precious time is lost.
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Re: The Lin-Asik Gap Year Plan
« Reply #58 on: April 23, 2014, 09:46:20 PM »

Offline Rondo9

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  I don't think the odds are that high that one of those top 8 picks will ever be an all-star, let alone both of them. We've had a tanking season and we're unlikely to get a top player with our own pick. We're doubling down by giving away Rondo for a pick who's average level of play is probably below Jeff Green's.

Yeah, I fundamentally disagree with that statement.  I think a top 8 pick in this draft has a very good chance of being a more valuable player than Jeff Green.

I doubt it, he'll probably be just on Green's level.

I think Gordon and Smart have a decent chance of being above average starters.   So I disagree.

Just on Green's level, and I really like both of them.

Re: The Lin-Asik Gap Year Plan
« Reply #59 on: April 23, 2014, 09:59:35 PM »

Offline Smitty77

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I really do NOT understand almost EVERYONE acting like RR is OVER the hill and will be old and have NOTHING left in a couple of years.  He has ONLY averaged 33 minutes per game in his career and has only played 505 regular season games in 8 total years, averaging ONLY 63 games per year.

I think this means that he is YOUNGER than his 28 years on this earth.  He has the basketball minutes of about a 25-26 year old IMHO!!!

Build around Rajon!!!!!!!!!!

Smitty77