Author Topic: Rondo has to be traded  (Read 12209 times)

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Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #45 on: April 18, 2014, 11:31:56 AM »

Offline CoachBo

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The realistic value of Rajon Rondo on the NBA market is FAR below where the majority of Celtics fans believe it lies. FAR below.
You have just made a speculative devaluation of a player's value based on your supposed and undetermined valuation by the collective fan base. Hmm...

Hardly speculative. How many NBA front office people do you communicate with?

Hate to break it to you, but Rondo's value in the league is quite realistic - and quite out of line with the hero worship and statistical distortion on this blog. I'm still laughing over the ridiculous notion that assist percentages are some sort of accurate measure of ball pounding. In the political world, they call that kind of distortion "spin."

Rondo is known among some front office types as a great talent who can't shoot, pounds the basketball on the offensive end, doesn't work hard on the defensive end and now has a mediocre (to put it charitably) half-season of post-injury basketball on his resume.

He won't draw a top five pick from anyone.

Believe what you want. The return on Rondo won't be much.
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Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #46 on: April 18, 2014, 11:35:33 AM »

Offline gpap

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I think many people are discounting how good of a player Rondo is and basing a lot of their opinions about him during this past season.

There is no way he is just a "Glorified Role Player" as someone pointed out. How quickly do we forget the All-Star Level talent he was for us before the injury. You can talk about the fact that his value has gone down the last year due to the injury alone, I will agree with that but lets not compare him to a guy like Chalmers.

I won't disagree with you that Rondo is a good player.

But, he still has glaring weaknesses which he has yet to improve on, like his shooting.
Stats may show his shooting has improved, but I still wouldn't count on him to take the game winning shot.

True. Along with poor defensive effort, bad ball movement, etc.

The realistic value of Rajon Rondo on the NBA market is FAR below where the majority of Celtics fans believe it lies. FAR below.

I disagree with your opinion and therefore his value is actually FAR above where you believe where it lies. FAR above.

Just to add to this discussion, Danny Ainge was on Felger/Mazz back on February 21st (one day after the trade deadline.) Below is a link which includes an audio clip of the interview

http://www.csnne.com/blog/celtics-talk/ainge-rondo-rockets-was-never-discussed

At around 2:13, Danny talks about how highly the organization thinks of Rondo but also says something along the lines of "20 out of 30 teams in the NBA already have their point guard, and thus would not be interested in trading for Rondo."

That tells me while Rondo's trade value might not necessarily be low, it is also not very high.

I suppose from there, it would be up to the other 10 teams looking for point guards to deem necessary value for Rondo.

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #47 on: April 18, 2014, 11:38:26 AM »

Offline gpap

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The realistic value of Rajon Rondo on the NBA market is FAR below where the majority of Celtics fans believe it lies. FAR below.
You have just made a speculative devaluation of a player's value based on your supposed and undetermined valuation by the collective fan base. Hmm...

See my post above

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #48 on: April 18, 2014, 11:48:16 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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Well good new CoachBo, since Rondo is such a flawed player who can't fetch value losing him in FA isn't a big deal now is it?

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #49 on: April 18, 2014, 11:54:08 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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If anything, I think if Rondo goes to the FA market he may find that it's not as kind as he thinks it is.
Unless he improves substantially from his level of play this coming year certainly, but I think the league and Rondo himself expect him to.

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #50 on: April 18, 2014, 12:27:42 PM »

Offline D.o.s.

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The realistic value of Rajon Rondo on the NBA market is FAR below where the majority of Celtics fans believe it lies. FAR below.
You have just made a speculative devaluation of a player's value based on your supposed and undetermined valuation by the collective fan base. Hmm...

Hardly speculative. How many NBA front office people do you communicate with?


That, of course, implies that you talk to at least one or two.
At least a goldfish with a Lincoln Log on its back goin' across your floor to your sock drawer has a miraculous connotation to it.

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #51 on: April 18, 2014, 12:29:39 PM »

Offline Fafnir

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The realistic value of Rajon Rondo on the NBA market is FAR below where the majority of Celtics fans believe it lies. FAR below.
You have just made a speculative devaluation of a player's value based on your supposed and undetermined valuation by the collective fan base. Hmm...

Hardly speculative. How many NBA front office people do you communicate with?


That, of course, implies that you talk to at least one or two.
If Danny responds to my e-mails, letters, and youtube soliloquies with a restraining order does that count as communication?

I'm asking for a friend.....

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #52 on: April 18, 2014, 12:44:21 PM »

Offline Gari

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To begin with, Danny never sell low in his players. Rondo's value is at all time low as he's still recovering from his injury and his stats may look awful to many. Danny won't trade rondo simply for the sake of trading him. If he intends to trade rondo, it will likely be next year's midseason trade deadline, when rondo can play more like his old self and regain his star value throughout the season, like how jordan crawford's value was boosted before getting traded this year.

Besides, trading rondo isn't as easy as you think. Remember when the Kings discussed with Ainge about a trade for rondo using Ben Mclemore, a first round pick plus a filler? Danny was a bit interested in the deal and asked rondo if he would sign with them after his contract expires. Rondo said no and then trade talk stopped since then. Teams won't sacrifice their future for a one year rental. This reflects that rondo has some control in where he'll be traded, while he's likely only willing to be traded to playoff-bound teams, whose first round picks won't be in the lottery and immensely help with our rebuild.

In my opinion, the reason why rondo seems to be playing with so little effort this year is because he has to cautiously deal with his injury. He wouldn't want to turn out to become another rose or westbrook who gets hampered by injuries again when they return. It's of good condition now that rondo is gradually getting back to his old self without risking any injury.  And more importantly, I think he's in the tank with Danny.( I know many may argue with this) Rondo, being recognized as one of the highest BBIQ players in the league, how would he not know how to adapt to Brad Steven's ball sharing system. He's still pounding the ball over and over again despite criticisms, and this style of play has no doubt accounted for some of our losses this year. Pressey has excelled by pushing the ball as fast as he can and the team benefited from it. Rondo should know this pretty well but for some reason he decides to do the opposite. These signs showed me that rondo was probably in the tank and trying to help the celts net a higher draft pick this year, which will do good to celtics' future. After naming rondo the captain at the start of the season, i think danny has absolute confidence in Rondo to lead our future and rondo may be very well aware of that , thus don't mind buying into the tank talk.

Yet, my above speculation may just be pure imagination and rondo may have regressed after the ACL injury or simply is not the man we are looking for. I believe Danny will make the right decision in deciding rondo's future in boston, he knows a lot more about rondo than us fans anyway.

According to Ainge, he's gonna enter his first year of prime next year. I don't think it would be wise to let go of a player like that, as he can be a good starting point of a championship team if things go along the 2007 way.

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #53 on: April 18, 2014, 12:47:27 PM »

Offline D.o.s.

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The realistic value of Rajon Rondo on the NBA market is FAR below where the majority of Celtics fans believe it lies. FAR below.
You have just made a speculative devaluation of a player's value based on your supposed and undetermined valuation by the collective fan base. Hmm...

Hardly speculative. How many NBA front office people do you communicate with?


That, of course, implies that you talk to at least one or two.
If Danny responds to my e-mails, letters, and youtube soliloquies with a restraining order does that count as communication?

I'm asking for a friend.....



I'm just saying, if we just the Pierce Trade Exception on Asik...
At least a goldfish with a Lincoln Log on its back goin' across your floor to your sock drawer has a miraculous connotation to it.

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #54 on: April 18, 2014, 01:36:08 PM »

Offline Jon

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If anything, I think if Rondo goes to the FA market he may find that it's not as kind as he thinks it is.
Unless he improves substantially from his level of play this coming year certainly, but I think the league and Rondo himself expect him to.

Perhaps.  But even if Rondo had never torn his ACL, would any team have offered him a max contract (or close to that) given his limitations as a shooter?  And if not, won't Ainge match any offer that is somewhere in the ballpark of what he makes now?

So again, I'm not saying it's impossible for Rondo to leave, I just feel like there are so many "ifs" to him leaving it makes it unlikely.  IF a team needs a PG; IF a team is willing to pay him big bucks; IF the team is actually more appealing than the Celtics. 

Maybe if the Knicks get their act together, they could be that team.  But I don't see multiple teams getting into an absurd bidding war to get Rondo and I say that as a pretty big Rondo fan. 

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #55 on: April 18, 2014, 01:56:07 PM »

Offline Vox_Populi

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The realistic value of Rajon Rondo on the NBA market is FAR below where the majority of Celtics fans believe it lies. FAR below.
You have just made a speculative devaluation of a player's value based on your supposed and undetermined valuation by the collective fan base. Hmm...

Hardly speculative. How many NBA front office people do you communicate with?

Hate to break it to you, but Rondo's value in the league is quite realistic - and quite out of line with the hero worship and statistical distortion on this blog.

Believe what you want. The return on Rondo won't be much.
Well, none, that's why I'm not making any abstract claims about his value. That's why I said they're speculative. I'm not sure why you think you know what his value is around the league anymore than anyone else.

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #56 on: April 18, 2014, 02:51:00 PM »

Offline LooseCannon

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Even if most teams out there undervalue Rondo as a player, it only takes one bad GM to overpay.

I think the team is well-positioned to make some smaller moves this off-season that set up some bigger moves for the summer of 2015.  Trading Rondo now greatly diminishes the team's chances to win soon, so trading him makes the most sense if Ainge is committed to this team possibly being worse next season and unlikely to try to acquire a star in the summer of 2015.  There is so much uncertainty that I don't think it makes any sense to chart a risk-averse path and make a trade to ensure that you get something, even pennies on the dollar, rather than risk the possibility that he leaves for nothing.
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Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #57 on: April 18, 2014, 02:59:48 PM »

Offline tstorey_97

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It's all about the money, gentlemen.

The kid is up for a contract. "Max" or otherwise. Does Rondo's cap hit fit with Ainge's restructuring? I don't know. I remain in the "Ainge does not value the point guard in the max range..." group. I make this speculation based on Ainge's general mimicry of one Red Auerbach. "Team must be built around top big" is what Ainge says to himself...Ainge gets Garnett.

I would be saddened if Rondo was traded for anything less that a "top flight NBA player." I don't see Ainge giving him up for a draft pick. Trade a starting/proven/top draw NBA point guard for 20 year old "might be good" player? That is not good business and if Ainge does it? It would suggest he has failed to "get his price" and Ainge rarely misses on this point.

Back to the money. As Ainge "might not" be intending to pay Rondo "the money," he will be under pressure to make the move this summer as "the leverage" changes with the start of the season.

That's all. Good player, popular for good reason who happens to be smack dab in the middle of a roster blow up. Life is always about timing.

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #58 on: April 18, 2014, 03:15:34 PM »

Offline HomerSapien

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One idea that came to me was what about a three way trade that nets the C's Reggie Jackson from OKC plus a '15 pick, sends Rondo to 3rd team, and "win now" assets to OKC?

Reggie strikes me as a Bledsoe-type situation. A backup who can start for a lot of teams at PG but I wonder if he can be had for the right price.

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #59 on: April 18, 2014, 05:29:53 PM »

Offline BballTim

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The realistic value of Rajon Rondo on the NBA market is FAR below where the majority of Celtics fans believe it lies. FAR below.
You have just made a speculative devaluation of a player's value based on your supposed and undetermined valuation by the collective fan base. Hmm...

Hardly speculative. How many NBA front office people do you communicate with?


   I'm sure half the gms in the league confide in you with their player evaluations, or at least people who *could* be GMs talk about players when they're in line next to you at the deli.