Author Topic: Rondo has to be traded  (Read 12197 times)

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Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #30 on: April 18, 2014, 08:48:25 AM »

Offline slamtheking

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Celts had a worst record with Rondo in lineup this year than without. Pretty simple, Rondo has to go!

It's not simple, though.

In 2008 through 2009, the Celtics went something like 15-2 when Scal started in place of KG.  That 88% winning percentage is a lot better than the percentage of games we won when KG was playing.

Does that mean we were better with Scal instead of KG, or that KG was dragging the team down?  I don't think so.
thank you.  that was the info I was trying to find when I originally posted in this thread.  I knew there was some ridiculous stat when one of the new 'big 3' was out and a much-lesser player started in their place. 

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #31 on: April 18, 2014, 09:11:18 AM »

Offline gpap

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I think Rondo is back next season.

That said (and I know it's been talked about alot on this board) I think a trade with the Lakers for Steve Nash, Nick Young and their 2014 1st round pick makes alot of sense.

You know the Lakers will be looking to become relevant again and I think they would do this in a heartbeat.

For the Celts, if Danny has 2 lottery picks in this year's draft, he can then turn around include them in a package for another all-star (Minny for Love/Rubio.)

Not to mention, he gets 2 more expiring contracts in Nash and Young.

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #32 on: April 18, 2014, 09:19:45 AM »

Offline PhoSita

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Trading Rondo always comes back to the same issue, value.


Because of the rule changes, and a plethora of good (not great) pgs, there is little value in trading Rondo.

Yeah.  So many times I've racked my brain trying to come up with good, realistic Rondo trade ideas.  It's difficult.

Yet, my thinking is that the Celtics may be in a position where they need to trade him in order to get something for him instead of allowing him to walk for nothing.

Better to trade him sooner (i.e. this summer) rather than spend all next season with yet another "will they / won't they" thing with Rondo.  Especially since the potential trade return for Rondo might be at its lowest at the deadline next year if other teams think Rondo's leaving.
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Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #33 on: April 18, 2014, 09:21:26 AM »

Offline ekosins3

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I think many people are discounting how good of a player Rondo is and basing a lot of their opinions about him during this past season.

There is no way he is just a "Glorified Role Player" as someone pointed out. How quickly do we forget the All-Star Level talent he was for us before the injury. You can talk about the fact that his value has gone down the last year due to the injury alone, I will agree with that but lets not compare him to a guy like Chalmers.





Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #34 on: April 18, 2014, 09:39:48 AM »

Offline CoachBo

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Trading Rondo always comes back to the same issue, value.


Because of the rule changes, and a plethora of good (not great) pgs, there is little value in trading Rondo.

Yeah.  So many times I've racked my brain trying to come up with good, realistic Rondo trade ideas.  It's difficult.

Yet, my thinking is that the Celtics may be in a position where they need to trade him in order to get something for him instead of allowing him to walk for nothing.

Better to trade him sooner (i.e. this summer) rather than spend all next season with yet another "will they / won't they" thing with Rondo.  Especially since the potential trade return for Rondo might be at its lowest at the deadline next year if other teams think Rondo's leaving.

I agree - but the reality of the issue is this: The league (no surprise whatsoever) doesn't worship Rondo the way the majority of posters here do.

So consider this: Whatever we would get for Rondo, the players involved are going to be marked for relentless fan bashing - and on this blog - because they had the temerity to be acquired for the greatest point guard in the history of the game, at least in the eyes of Celtic fans who've swapped any semblance of objectivity for green-colored glasses.

It doesn't matter if we get Kevin Love in the deal; Love will be relentlessly attacked by some, as Jeff Green has been - despite the reality that getting Green for the rotting corpse of Kendrick Perkins was a John Dillinger-style heist on Ainge's part.

Would the Celtics be better off moving Rondo? Probably. But the reality is Ainge can't make a Rondo trade that will satisify the fans all wound up in Rondo himself. His market value and his fan value are two radically different things.
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Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #35 on: April 18, 2014, 09:52:17 AM »

Offline gpap

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I think many people are discounting how good of a player Rondo is and basing a lot of their opinions about him during this past season.

There is no way he is just a "Glorified Role Player" as someone pointed out. How quickly do we forget the All-Star Level talent he was for us before the injury. You can talk about the fact that his value has gone down the last year due to the injury alone, I will agree with that but lets not compare him to a guy like Chalmers.

I won't disagree with you that Rondo is a good player.

But, he still has glaring weaknesses which he has yet to improve on, like his shooting.
Stats may show his shooting has improved, but I still wouldn't count on him to take the game winning shot.

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #36 on: April 18, 2014, 10:00:35 AM »

Offline CoachBo

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I think many people are discounting how good of a player Rondo is and basing a lot of their opinions about him during this past season.

There is no way he is just a "Glorified Role Player" as someone pointed out. How quickly do we forget the All-Star Level talent he was for us before the injury. You can talk about the fact that his value has gone down the last year due to the injury alone, I will agree with that but lets not compare him to a guy like Chalmers.

I won't disagree with you that Rondo is a good player.

But, he still has glaring weaknesses which he has yet to improve on, like his shooting.
Stats may show his shooting has improved, but I still wouldn't count on him to take the game winning shot.

True. Along with poor defensive effort, bad ball movement, etc.

The realistic value of Rajon Rondo on the NBA market is FAR below where the majority of Celtics fans believe it lies. FAR below.
Coined the CelticsBlog term, "Euromistake."

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #37 on: April 18, 2014, 10:22:36 AM »

Offline pokeKingCurtis

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I think many people are discounting how good of a player Rondo is and basing a lot of their opinions about him during this past season.

There is no way he is just a "Glorified Role Player" as someone pointed out. How quickly do we forget the All-Star Level talent he was for us before the injury. You can talk about the fact that his value has gone down the last year due to the injury alone, I will agree with that but lets not compare him to a guy like Chalmers.

I won't disagree with you that Rondo is a good player.

But, he still has glaring weaknesses which he has yet to improve on, like his shooting.
Stats may show his shooting has improved, but I still wouldn't count on him to take the game winning shot.

True. Along with poor defensive effort, bad ball movement, etc.

The realistic value of Rajon Rondo on the NBA market is FAR below where the majority of Celtics fans believe it lies. FAR below.

I disagree with your opinion and therefore his value is actually FAR above where you believe where it lies. FAR above.

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #38 on: April 18, 2014, 10:27:48 AM »

Offline Vox_Populi

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The realistic value of Rajon Rondo on the NBA market is FAR below where the majority of Celtics fans believe it lies. FAR below.
You have just made a speculative devaluation of a player's value based on your supposed and undetermined valuation by the collective fan base. Hmm...

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #39 on: April 18, 2014, 10:29:15 AM »

Offline PhoSita

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Trading Rondo always comes back to the same issue, value.


Because of the rule changes, and a plethora of good (not great) pgs, there is little value in trading Rondo.

Yeah.  So many times I've racked my brain trying to come up with good, realistic Rondo trade ideas.  It's difficult.

Yet, my thinking is that the Celtics may be in a position where they need to trade him in order to get something for him instead of allowing him to walk for nothing.

Better to trade him sooner (i.e. this summer) rather than spend all next season with yet another "will they / won't they" thing with Rondo.  Especially since the potential trade return for Rondo might be at its lowest at the deadline next year if other teams think Rondo's leaving.

I agree - but the reality of the issue is this: The league (no surprise whatsoever) doesn't worship Rondo the way the majority of posters here do.

So consider this: Whatever we would get for Rondo, the players involved are going to be marked for relentless fan bashing - and on this blog - because they had the temerity to be acquired for the greatest point guard in the history of the game, at least in the eyes of Celtic fans who've swapped any semblance of objectivity for green-colored glasses.

It doesn't matter if we get Kevin Love in the deal; Love will be relentlessly attacked by some, as Jeff Green has been - despite the reality that getting Green for the rotting corpse of Kendrick Perkins was a John Dillinger-style heist on Ainge's part.

Would the Celtics be better off moving Rondo? Probably. But the reality is Ainge can't make a Rondo trade that will satisify the fans all wound up in Rondo himself. His market value and his fan value are two radically different things.

Luckily, I don't think our GM particularly cares about how attached the fans are to certain players, or what the backlash of a trade will be.  I think Wyc cares, but Danny -- not so much.  The Pierce / KG trade and the Perkins trade are great examples of that.
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Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #40 on: April 18, 2014, 10:32:25 AM »

Offline pokeKingCurtis

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The realistic value of Rajon Rondo on the NBA market is FAR below where the majority of Celtics fans believe it lies. FAR below.
You have just made a speculative devaluation of a player's value based on your supposed and undetermined valuation by the collective fan base. Hmm...

Business as usual.

Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #41 on: April 18, 2014, 10:32:30 AM »

Offline ekosins3

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I think many people are discounting how good of a player Rondo is and basing a lot of their opinions about him during this past season.

There is no way he is just a "Glorified Role Player" as someone pointed out. How quickly do we forget the All-Star Level talent he was for us before the injury. You can talk about the fact that his value has gone down the last year due to the injury alone, I will agree with that but lets not compare him to a guy like Chalmers.

I won't disagree with you that Rondo is a good player.

But, he still has glaring weaknesses which he has yet to improve on, like his shooting.
Stats may show his shooting has improved, but I still wouldn't count on him to take the game winning shot.

True. Along with poor defensive effort, bad ball movement, etc.

The realistic value of Rajon Rondo on the NBA market is FAR below where the majority of Celtics fans believe it lies. FAR below.

I have come to the conclusion a long time ago that Rondo's jump shot will never improve to the likes many of us want. That doesn't make him any less valuable as this has been clear for years around celtics nation and around the NBA.

As far as for the defensive effort, I feel as though its always been there. It amazes me how in control of the game Rondo looks when he's out there. I know he has taken nights or possessions off but his awareness, control, and instincts is what makes him a great player on offense and defense. He has showed up for the big games which is most important.


Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #42 on: April 18, 2014, 11:03:00 AM »

Offline Celtics18

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If Rondo feels like Danny and ownership are moving in a direction where they can put a contending team together within the next couple of years, signing the extension this summer gives him the security and piece of mind to just go out and play basketball and not have to worry about a lot of extraneous drama.  He's certainly not the type who I can see relishing a whole lot of extra media attention and scrutiny.

I feel like that might be a tempting situation for Rondo, particularly if he can get a no-trade clause thrown into the deal. 

Anyway, that's my ideal scenario.  It may be complete wishful thinking, but it does seem like there are elements that both parties could consider appealing.
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Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #43 on: April 18, 2014, 11:12:04 AM »

Offline CFAN38

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The Cs keep Rondo if they feel they can add Vets who will join Rondo and Green to form a championship level team (Love, Asik and Afflalo type)

If this doesn't happen they have a tough decision to make.

A couple hypothetical situations.

Cs land top pick draft Embiid, he need 2-3 years to grow and develop. Kings really want Rondo and offer their 1st plus additional compensation (Mclemore?) for Rondo. If DA can add a young PG with the kings pick (Smart or Ennis) do you make the trade with the hopes of the team growing together OKC style? The #18 becomes a bonus pick where DA can shoot for a high potential/high risk player like Grant or Capela. 

or

Cs land #4 pick draft Exum or #4 and Smart. If he really looks to be more PG then SG do the Cs try to make him fit with Rondo? Or do they move Rondo maybe to Kings, Pistons for pick and young SG (Mclemore or Caldwell-Pope) then resign AB and have a dynamic young 3 guard rotation. With the added lottery pick maybe grab Saric to eventually take Greens spot at SF.

Both of those hypothetical situations leave the Cs in a similar position to this years Jazz. Alot of potential but not alot of winning. As fans we would have to suffer through another losing season but the player growth may be worth the weight.
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Re: Rondo has to be traded
« Reply #44 on: April 18, 2014, 11:31:09 AM »

Offline Jon

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I really think the chances of Rondo leaving as a free agent after next year are greatly exaggerated.  That's not to say it's impossible, but it's really going to have to be a perfect storm for it to happen.  The fact of the matter is that there aren't going to be a lot of teams out there who a) need a PG, b) have cap space, and c) are willing to give Rondo more than Ainge would be willing to beat. 

If anything, I think if Rondo goes to the FA market he may find that it's not as kind as he thinks it is.