Author Topic: Al Horford  (Read 9342 times)

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Re: Al Horford
« Reply #30 on: April 16, 2014, 01:58:39 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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I want to see the answer to this comment

Quote
I believe there is enough evidence to support my claim.


If you are going to throw it out there, back it up with real facts.
I thought the effect that steroids has on tendon ruptures and muscle tear was fairly well documented in the medical world. One pectoral tear. No biggie. Two though? To a different side?

And there won't be overt speculation by news reporting agencies as doing that could cause defamation lawsuits, regardless of whether Horford taking steroids was true or not.

PED use in the NBA is a very hush hush subject that is not taken seriously by the front office. The World Anti Doping Agency has called out the NBA on their very lax drug testing policies.

Evidence does not have to be direct. It can be circumstantial.

Re: Al Horford
« Reply #31 on: April 16, 2014, 02:01:02 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Lets see the evidence. 


Real evidence. 


Otherwise, it is a statement with out facts that could easily be fit into the the description of ignorance.
Nice. Mods following up an insult with more insulting type language.

Re: Al Horford
« Reply #32 on: April 16, 2014, 02:15:16 PM »

Offline CapnDunks

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PED's can significantly affect athletes earning power. If they're in a league where they can get away with it, I don't really see why they wouldn't do it. Fairness? I don't consider it a serious accusation or anything to speculate that a player is using. If I was making millions of dollars and had a chance to compete at a higher level/heal faster and not get caught I would be on whatever worked.

Re: Al Horford
« Reply #33 on: April 16, 2014, 02:28:52 PM »

Offline Endless Paradise

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Calling someone ignorant isn't any more offensive or insulting than calling someone a hypocrite. "Ignorant" =/= "stupid" or "dumb."

Re: Al Horford
« Reply #34 on: April 16, 2014, 03:18:44 PM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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Calling someone ignorant isn't any more offensive or insulting than calling someone a hypocrite. "Ignorant" =/= "stupid" or "dumb."

I'd say calling a specific opinion ignorant is more acceptable than calling a person ignorant.  But it's something that's likely to be taken personally either way.

For the record I have the same suspicions Nick does.  Those types of injuries are associated with PED use, but that's of course not the same as saying they prove PED use.  But honestly, if I was a GM, I'd be more comfortable pursuing Horford if the injuries were due to PEDs than if he's just naturally prone to severe injuries.  It's a lot easier to stop taking PEDs than to stop having a body with major muscles that are naturally inclined to tear.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2014, 04:05:47 PM by foulweatherfan »

Re: Al Horford
« Reply #35 on: April 16, 2014, 03:57:29 PM »

Offline wdleehi

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I want to see the answer to this comment

Quote
I believe there is enough evidence to support my claim.


If you are going to throw it out there, back it up with real facts.
I thought the effect that steroids has on tendon ruptures and muscle tear was fairly well documented in the medical world. One pectoral tear. No biggie. Two though? To a different side?

And there won't be overt speculation by news reporting agencies as doing that could cause defamation lawsuits, regardless of whether Horford taking steroids was true or not.

PED use in the NBA is a very hush hush subject that is not taken seriously by the front office. The World Anti Doping Agency has called out the NBA on their very lax drug testing policies.

Evidence does not have to be direct. It can be circumstantial.


So there is no real evidence.  Just your opinion base on a professional athlete who gets injured. 

Re: Al Horford
« Reply #36 on: April 16, 2014, 03:59:51 PM »

Offline wdleehi

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Lets see the evidence. 


Real evidence. 


Otherwise, it is a statement with out facts that could easily be fit into the the description of ignorance.
Nice. Mods following up an insult with more insulting type language.



I missed both the insult and the follow up. 


Re: Al Horford
« Reply #37 on: April 16, 2014, 05:23:07 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Lets see the evidence. 


Real evidence. 


Otherwise, it is a statement with out facts that could easily be fit into the the description of ignorance.
Nice. Mods following up an insult with more insulting type language.



I missed both the insult and the follow up.
Yeah, you would.

Re: Al Horford
« Reply #38 on: April 16, 2014, 05:51:56 PM »

Offline greg683x

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since when can't you call someones statement ignorant on an internet message board??

even on this board with stricter rules, i see posts all the time with trade proposals getting laughed at and called stupid.  We all need to grow some thicker skin.

While I do think condemning Horford as a PED user with such flimsy evidence is a bit much, throwing up some before and after pictures doesnt 100% clear it up either.  I'd imagine Raphael Palmeiros before and after pictures dont even whisper steroids, yet he's a pretty well documented career user.  Peoples muscles grow in different ways and different drugs do different things.

All that being said, roids or not, Injuries are enough reason to stay away from Horford unless hes the final piece.
Greg

Re: Al Horford
« Reply #39 on: April 16, 2014, 05:54:23 PM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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Yeah, here's one of the very few NBA guys to actually test positive for steroids:


Re: Al Horford
« Reply #40 on: April 16, 2014, 06:33:46 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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since when can't you call someones statement ignorant on an internet message board??

Mostly because its against the rules.

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Respect each other at all times. Personal attacks are not permitted under any circumstances.  There is no need for name-calling or harassment of any poster. This includes behavior in all areas of Celticsblog, including forum posts, blog comments and personal messages. While we encourage lively debate there is no reason for anyone to disrespect a fellow poster's ideas.


So, IMHO saying something like " I think you opinion is based on facts not in evidence and might be from misinformation" to me is within the rules.

Saying "your opinion is based on ignorance" to me breaks this rule. And, it just so happens to be the first rule listed in the rules, which to me means its a pretty important one.

Really disappointed that a mod can't see the difference and then continues such behavior. Really disappointed.

Re: Al Horford
« Reply #41 on: April 16, 2014, 06:41:16 PM »

Offline Eddie20

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since when can't you call someones statement ignorant on an internet message board??


So, IMHO saying something like " I think you opinion is based on facts not in evidence and might be from misinformation" to me is within the rules.

Saying "your opinion is based on ignorance" to me breaks this rule. And, it just so happens to be the first rule listed in the rules, which to me means its a pretty important one.

The two examples you provided are synonymous.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ignorant?show=0&t=1397687771

Quote
ig·no·rant adjective \ˈig-n(ə-)rənt\
: lacking knowledge or information

: resulting from or showing a lack of knowledge

You seem to making this a major issue, when it shouldn't be. If you feel slighted I do apologize.

Re: Al Horford
« Reply #42 on: April 16, 2014, 07:05:13 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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since when can't you call someones statement ignorant on an internet message board??


So, IMHO saying something like " I think you opinion is based on facts not in evidence and might be from misinformation" to me is within the rules.

Saying "your opinion is based on ignorance" to me breaks this rule. And, it just so happens to be the first rule listed in the rules, which to me means its a pretty important one.

The two examples you provided are synonymous.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ignorant?show=0&t=1397687771

Quote
ig·no·rant adjective \ˈig-n(ə-)rənt\
: lacking knowledge or information

: resulting from or showing a lack of knowledge

You seem to making this a major issue, when it shouldn't be. If you feel slighted I do apologize.
I accepted your apology though just to counter what you are saying, I can take just about any word that is used in an insulting manner and bring out a dictionary and with the dictionary description of the word, make the word appear innocuous.That doesn't make the word or its use not insulting.

My continuing of the topic has more to do with a mod continuing such behavior and in an indirect manner endorsing such behavior and not you Eddie.

Re: Al Horford
« Reply #43 on: April 16, 2014, 07:12:01 PM »

Offline hwangjini_1

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a small addition to the posts located immediately located above mine. cb is strictly regulated in terms of limits put upon civility. personally, and i mean by that "for me", i am glad, happy, and agree. jeff and his posse of moderators do a fantastic job of keeping our board civil.

if you want rough and tumble, go to sosh. i post there on occasion and see the engagements taking place. for example, when one poster disagreed with another, he posted "with all due respect, that maybe the stupidest Edited.  Profanity and masked profanity are against forum rules and may result in discipline.ing post i have ever seen. why dont you take your crayons, go home, and spare us all your stupidity." slights, slams, attacks, and ad hominem comments are the norm. such posts quickly detract from the very high quality of analysis that takes place there. reading sosh is like reading high level math and brilliant baseball insights being discussed by emotional 10 year olds.

again, this is me speaking for me. i like the civility of cb and jeff's refusal to compromise on this point. i work upper admin in a major univeristy (though will be moving soon!) and i cannot tell you how draining it is to deal with snide, cutting, nasty comments by faculty.

life is short. cb is fun.
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Re: Al Horford
« Reply #44 on: April 16, 2014, 07:43:09 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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I locked the thread, because it became more a discussion of semantics / our rules / steroids than it did anything about Al Horford.

As far as the word "ignorant", it generally has a negative connotation when used in casual speech.  It's one of those words where it's just better to stay away from, unless the context makes it clear you're using the dictionary definition (i.e., "ignorant of the facts" might be okay, whereas "you're ignorant" would most likely not be).  I accept that it wasn't meant as a personal attack here, but I also understand why it got under nick's skin.

In general, if there's a nicer way to say something, it's best to use that option.


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