How many championships would Paul Pierce, Ray Allen, and KG win if..?

[Monkhouse]

1) They were still in their prime? With Kendrick Perkins being healthy, and Rondo the same playoff monster that he is?

2) Lets say Miami Heat Big 3 were also healthy, and younger, who would win? I would say KG> Bosh, Allen = Wade, Lebron> Pierce. But I think in the long run the Big 3 for the Celtics would've gone 4-3 over the Miami Heat 3.

3) Do you think us winning championships would've pushed Pierce's achievement even further? What if Pierce had won 3-4 more rings? Even 5? Do you think he could be top 5 Celtic easily? And what would that say about the legacies of KG/Allen?

[Clench123]

We would win every single time.  Every single time.  There is no doubt about that.  Four to five championships at least

[Roy H.]

Prime KG + Prime Ray + Prime Pierce + Prime Rondo + Prime Perk > Heat

I don't think it's all that close.  The only question would be whether all of those guys would be willing to sacrifice touches for the greater good of the team.  I think they would have.

[Yoki_IsTheName]

We would win until those reach the tailend of their careers.

As dominant as LeBron is, Pierce was one of the guys he really has a hard time playing againts. And that was Paul in his thirties.

Against a Paul in his prime, whose also motivated because KG is with him, sweet Lord that would be a fun match up.

[BigAlTheFuture]

I'll be shocked if the Heat took us to 6 games in a playoff series if we had KG, Paul, and Allen in their primes.

[mmmmm]

Prime KG + Prime Ray + Prime Pierce + Prime Rondo + Prime Perk > Heat

I don't think it's all that close.  The only question would be whether all of those guys would be willing to sacrifice touches for the greater good of the team.  I think they would have.

Yeah.  Man, those guys were freaking _goooood_ in their primes!

That would have been just ridiculous.

[manl_lui]

Prime KG + Prime Ray + Prime Pierce + Prime Rondo + Prime Perk > Heat

I don't think it's all that close.  The only question would be whether all of those guys would be willing to sacrifice touches for the greater good of the team.  I think they would have.

Yeah.  Man, those guys were freaking _goooood_ in their primes!

That would have been just ridiculous.

speaking of fantasies

how about

Prime Rondo + Prime Ray Allen + Prime Pierce + Prime KG + Prime Shaq - now that will be a dynasty

[wiley]

Forget the prime stuff.....even past their primes they lost out on 3 or so championships
due to injuries, most significantly KG's.

[Timdawgg]

Prime KG + Prime Ray + Prime Pierce + Prime Rondo + Prime Perk > Heat

I don't think it's all that close.  The only question would be whether all of those guys would be willing to sacrifice touches for the greater good of the team.  I think they would have.

Yeah.  Man, those guys were freaking _goooood_ in their primes!

That would have been just ridiculous.

speaking of fantasies

how about

Prime Rondo + Prime Ray Allen + Prime Pierce + Prime KG + Prime Shaq - now that will be a dynasty

That team would go 82-0 if healthy. They have the epitome of each position. True PG, True SG, True Slasher/SF, True PF, & True C. Unstoppable.

[Vox_Populi]

We'd comfortably be better but I just wanna know, are you saying prime Allen = prime Wade? As in 05-09 Wade? Because I can't agree with that.

[mmmmm]

We'd comfortably be better but I just wanna know, are you saying prime Allen = prime Wade? As in 05-09 Wade? Because I can't agree with that.

I dunno.   It gets into splitting hairs as to what you value out of a position, but man, 2000-02 Ray Allen was ridiculous.   He shot an absurd 56% eFG% and while he never shot at the volume that Wade did during his prime, he was an extremely efficient scorer so dangerous if he got just a glimmer of a shot that defenses freaked out trying to figure out how to keep the ball out of his hands.    But this - as we also saw even in his later years - meant he was a powerful weapon even if he was moving without the ball.

Wade gave you more in terms of aggressively shooting and also grabbing rebounds, though.   Wade always was more of a 'take over the game' physical type of SG.   Needed the ball more in his hands back then, though.

Very different styles of SGs.   As a complement to a 'Prime Pierce' and a 'Prime KG', at least, I would take Allen.

[mgent]

We'd comfortably be better but I just wanna know, are you saying prime Allen = prime Wade? As in 05-09 Wade? Because I can't agree with that.

Obviously not, but are you saying there's a significant difference?  I can't agree with that.

Then you've got to consider that prime Wade's biggest strengths (creating offense for others and efficiently taking 30 FGA/10 FTA a game) are basically completely negated by LeBron having the ball and running the offense.  Whereas Ray's (and Pierce/KG's) biggest strengths are stack-able because they translate even when they're playing off the ball.  Also keep in mind this is a testament to how Dwyane Wade is not aging well compared to 3 of the all time best aging players, playing in a game of who can win the most championships (longest dynasty).

Then you've got to consider that if you were going with a younger Wade you also have to take a younger LeBron.  He's simply a whole different offensive force now; LeBron from 05-09 could be stopped with an elite team defense that loaded the paint, especially in the playoffs.  You've got a top player either way but you're trading .565 FG% and .41 3PT% for .48 FG% and .32 3PT%.  Bosh is also not nearly the same floor spacer and likely not strong enough to handle Center.  Simply put, our big 3's primes line up much more evenly than theirs.

Giving these guys a prime Rondo just doesn't seem fair.

[Vox_Populi]

We'd comfortably be better but I just wanna know, are you saying prime Allen = prime Wade? As in 05-09 Wade? Because I can't agree with that.

I dunno.   It gets into splitting hairs as to what you value out of a position, but man, 2000-02 Ray Allen was ridiculous.   He shot an absurd 56% eFG% and while he never shot at the volume that Wade did during his prime, he was an extremely efficient scorer so dangerous if he got just a glimmer of a shot that defenses freaked out trying to figure out how to keep the ball out of his hands.    But this - as we also saw even in his later years - meant he was a powerful weapon even if he was moving without the ball.

Wade gave you more in terms of aggressively shooting and also grabbing rebounds, though.   Wade always was more of a 'take over the game' physical type of SG.   Needed the ball more in his hands back then, though.

Very different styles of SGs.   As a complement to a 'Prime Pierce' and a 'Prime KG', at least, I would take Allen.

I'm not trying to undermine how dangerous Ray was when he was younger, and as a compliment to PP and KG, I'd rather have Ray too. But I'm just saying, if we're talking individual ability, Wade's better. Different kinds of players though, as you said. Wade's streaky jumpshot and over reliance on his waning athleticism means he probably won't be a reliable 3rd or 4th option (like Allen is now) at 35+.

[Vox_Populi]

We'd comfortably be better but I just wanna know, are you saying prime Allen = prime Wade? As in 05-09 Wade? Because I can't agree with that.

Obviously not, but are you saying there's a significant difference?  I can't agree with that.

Then you've got to consider that prime Wade's biggest strengths (creating offense for others and efficiently taking 30 FGA/10 FTA a game) are basically completely negated by LeBron having the ball and running the offense.  Whereas Ray's (and Pierce/KG's) biggest strengths are stack-able because they translate even when they're playing off the ball.  Also keep in mind this is a testament to how Dwyane Wade is not aging well compared to 3 of the all time best aging players, playing in a game of who can win the most championships (longest dynasty).

Then you've got to consider that if you were going with a younger Wade you also have to take a younger LeBron.  He's simply a whole different offensive force now; LeBron from 05-09 could be stopped with an elite team defense that loaded the paint, especially in the playoffs.  You've got a top player either way but you're trading .565 FG% and .41 3PT% for .48 FG% and .32 3PT%.  Bosh is also not nearly the same floor spacer and likely not strong enough to handle Center.  Simply put, our big 3's primes line up much more evenly than theirs.

Giving these guys a prime Rondo just doesn't seem fair.

I said we'd comfortably be better.....I'm not entirely sure what your two paragraphs have to do with an individual evaluation of Ray vs. Wade. My point wasn't to argue how good each team would be within the confines of the age and earlier talents of the two. I'm sure we'd beat them, I'm just saying prime Wade was a better player than prime Allen.

[Fafnir]

Pierce is the comparison to Wade, KG to LBJ, and Allen to Bosh.