Idea: Kris Humphries for Andris Biedrins

[LooseCannon]

I've mentioned this idea in replies to threads, but I don't think I've actually started a thread on it.

The Jazz have Enes Kanter, 7'2" rookie Rudy Gobert, and Derrick Favors in the big man rotation.  That's three guys who can play center.  Favors is the power forward.  The back-up behind him is combo forward Marvin Williams, who seems like more of a small forward.  The Jazz also have Andris Biedrins from Golden State.  It would make sense for the Jazz to swap Biedrins for a back-up power forward.

The Celtics have extra power forwards.

Both Kris Humphries and Andris Biedrins are expiring contracts who are not in their teams' long-term future plans.  Humphries is set to make $12 million.  Biedrins is set to make $9 million.  Coincidentally, teams are allowed to send out up to $3.2 million (total for the year) as part of trades.  Unfortunately, teams are also capped in how much cash they can receive in a year (the same amount) and the Jazz already received cash considerations from Golden State.  Otherwise, Humphries and cash for Biedrins makes a ton of sense for both teams, although Utah should try to get something else like a draft pick out of it.

Still, Humphries for Biedrins works under salary cap rules.  Additionally, the Jazz have a little bit of cap space they are trying to auction off.  Humphries, Crawford, and a first (likely Brooklyn's 2014 pick) would seem to amount to the Celtics selling a first for $6-8 million ($5 million in salary savings plus an addition $1-3m in luxury tax savings).  If the Celtics explored the deal, Ainge should try to get one of those second round picks coughed up by Golden State.

I'm not sold on the idea of using a first-round pick to get under the luxury tax (or, at least, I'm not sold on doing it right now when there is a decent chance the Celtics can wait until the trade deadline and find a deal to get under the tax threshold), but I think Humphries for Biedrins is an idea that should have both teams being willing to negotiate.

[rondoallaturca]

It's late so I'm sorry if I'm sounding stupid, but are you suggesting we package a first round pick in addition with Humphries?

[tarheelsxxiii]

I appreciate the time and willingness to share this info. It's cool that it could work, but from a broader perspective, how does it benefit us? Essentially trading one salary dump (superior one) for another, unless I'm missing something...

[LooseCannon]

It's late so I'm sorry if I'm sounding stupid, but are you suggesting we package a first round pick in addition with Humphries?

I'm suggesting the Jazz might ask for a first.  If the Celtics can also dump Jordan Crawford's salary and get a second round pick in return, it's the equivalent of trading a first for a second and maybe $7 million. 

I could see negotiations going along the lines of:

Boston: Humphries plus whatever cash you are allowed to accept for Biedrins
Utah: If you throw in a first, we would be willing to take Jordan Crawford off your hands, too.
Boston: Can we do something involving Courtney Lee or Gerald Wallace?
Utah: No, we want to keep our cap space clear for next summer.

At that point, Ainge deliberates between another counter-offer, either one without a first involved or one with the Celtics getting back enough to make giving up a first a good idea, or walking away with the option to revisit the deal later.

If the Celtics could get two second-round picks, with one of them being Utah's 2014 pick, along with Biedrins in exchange for Humphries, Crawford, and a likely late first then I would lean towards a deal.

[rondoallaturca]

I appreciate the time and willingness to share this info. It's cool that it could work, but from a broader perspective, how does it benefit us? Essentially trading one salary dump (superior one) for another, unless I'm missing something...

The C's have a superfluous amount of PFs and no legitimate Cs. This trade helps balance out the roster.

[LooseCannon]

I appreciate the time and willingness to share this info. It's cool that it could work, but from a broader perspective, how does it benefit us? Essentially trading one salary dump (superior one) for another, unless I'm missing something...

The Celtics are currently above the luxury tax line.  It is a really good idea for the team to get below the line, so they can improve the team next year without paying the repeater tax.  Additionally, the more salary the Celtics can dump, the more valuable that trade exception from the Nets becomes.

It basically clears the logjam at PF, makes the center position firmer in theory (but perhaps not, since Biedrins has issues), and gives the team more flexibility for future deals.

[tarheelsxxiii]

I appreciate the time and willingness to share this info. It's cool that it could work, but from a broader perspective, how does it benefit us? Essentially trading one salary dump (superior one) for another, unless I'm missing something...

The C's have a superfluous amount of PFs and no legitimate Cs. This trade helps balance out the roster.

But given our goals for the year, the trade seems unnecessary; keeping Kris would shed us 3 million more than Biedrins. I guess the question is whether or not you think Biedrins could/should be a part of our future.

I've hardly seem him play, but given his limited time over the years and age, I'd presume he wouldn't be. I could see us benefiting from having a Center who can log significant minutes, however, as it would give us an opportunity to develop Sully, and probably KO, in their natural (and most likely, best) positions. Is that what you're thinking?

[LooseCannon]

But given our goals for the year, the trade seems unnecessary; keeping Kris would shed us 3 million more than Biedrins. I guess the question is whether or not you think Biedrins could/should be a part of our future.

You could ask the question: who is more likely to be a part of our future.  Humphries seems blocked by Sullinger and Olynyk at power forward.  Even if those two young players have disappointing seasons, you wouldn't be looking to bring Humphries back.  I am pessimistic about Biedrins, but I can at least see the possibility that a change in scenery could help him rehabilitate him image enough so that he is a respectable option as a cheap back-up center who is preferable to Fab Melo in that role.

[tarheelsxxiii]

But given our goals for the year, the trade seems unnecessary; keeping Kris would shed us 3 million more than Biedrins. I guess the question is whether or not you think Biedrins could/should be a part of our future.

You could ask the question: who is more likely to be a part of our future.  Humphries seems blocked by Sullinger and Olynyk at power forward.  Even if those two young players have disappointing seasons, you wouldn't be looking to bring Humphries back.  I am pessimistic about Biedrins, but I can at least see the possibility that a change in scenery could help him rehabilitate him image enough so that he is a respectable option as a cheap back-up center who is preferable to Fab Melo in that role.

I think that's fair. To me, Humphries would seem to be more of a threat to block Sullinger and Olynyk. But either way, no doubt there exists a logjam. I'd prefer Kris play Center so Sully and KO can develop at PF.

In that regard, I agree Biedrins would be a more natural/convenient option to play at the C and, in keeping with our priorities, allow Sully and KO to develop at PF. Perhaps he could split time with Faverani (if he pans out). Though, again, I think Humphries probably could play some minutes at C as well. Obviously that wouldn't be optimal, but...  I'd argue he's significantly better than Biedrins, a superior example on the court (hard working, gritty - does all the little things Sully and KO would greatly benefit from learning/developing), allows us to shed more salary at the end of the season and, if we can trade him, would likely bring back more in a deal at the trade deadline.

[action781]

WitH 4 PFs on the roster and humphries being my 4th favorite, id presently trade him for almost anyone that is not a PF or SG and not under contract past this season. Anyone.

[syfy9]

Biedrins may very well be one of the worst players in the NBA right now.

Even if it is a salary dump, there is no way I would want him on our team, even if we are tanking. He has a "I don't want to score because I might get fouled and go to the free throw line" mentality, and that's just ewww.


There's a better salary dump option than Biedrins out there.

[LooseCannon]

There's a better salary dump option than Biedrins out there.

From a math perspective, I think the only smaller expiring contracts that can be traded straight up for Humphries are Charlie Villanueva, Rodney Stuckey, and Caron Butler.  So, as a pure salary dump, Biedrins can be said to be the fourth-best salary dump option.

[crimson_stallion]

I really don't get why we'd do this.

Biedrins is terrible at this point in his career.  I'd honestly be much happier starting Hump at center, then allowing his $12M to expire next season.

Also don't get why we'd send out valuable picks just to get rid of Crawford's relatively tiny contract.  The only way I'm giving away draft picks is if we can get rid of one of our significant contracts (Bass, Lee, Wallace, Bogans) or get back a valuable player to our rotation.   This trade achieves neither.

If we really wanted to clear cap space for next season that badly, couldn't we just trade our $10M exception to the Jazz for Biedrins?  Then we'd have $12M from humphries and $9M from Biedrins all expiring next season to leave us with $21M less on the books.

[LooseCannon]

If we really wanted to clear cap space for next season that badly, couldn't we just trade our $10M exception to the Jazz for Biedrins?  Then we'd have $12M from humphries and $9M from Biedrins all expiring next season to leave us with $21M less on the books.

The point is to clear payroll for this season so that the Celtics do not pay any luxury tax this season and do not get charged the repeater rate the following season.

You don't necessarily have to give away a draft pick to do so, but you can say that a draft pick is worth x dollars and figure out whether or not doing a deal will save the team more than x as a way of determining whether or not a trade makes sense.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Nope, not a good trade. Seems to be a convoluted scenario, that not only reduces our talent level, it diminishes our trading power and value to accomplish something that should be quite simpler through other alternatives.