Author Topic: A core of Rondo-Bradley-Green-Sully-Center will win a title  (Read 22182 times)

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Re: A core of Rondo-Bradley-Green-Sully-Center will win a title
« Reply #120 on: May 27, 2013, 04:25:54 PM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Every one in the world knew Fab was a multi-year project when drafted, and I am excited to see him in Summer League.  He's only 23. 

I could see him gone to get us a second round pick. He is also horrible.

Re: A core of Rondo-Bradley-Green-Sully-Center will win a title
« Reply #121 on: May 27, 2013, 04:26:42 PM »

Offline CelticConcourse

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are you kidding me?

Roy Hibbert wanted a max contract and everyone was extremely confused. Everyone laughed at him. Everyone said he wasn't worth it. Everyone said he wasn't good. In 2012 HE WAS AN AVERAGE TO SLIGHT LY ABOVE AVG CENTER!!
Jesus Christ, you do realize Roy Hibbert made the All-Star team in 2012, right? My god.
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Re: A core of Rondo-Bradley-Green-Sully-Center will win a title
« Reply #122 on: May 27, 2013, 04:50:10 PM »

Offline Yogi

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Every one in the world knew Fab was a multi-year project when drafted, and I am excited to see him in Summer League.  He's only 23. 

I could see him gone to get us a second round pick. He is also horrible.

You are certainly welcome to an opinion. An opinion that is not based on any facts or insufficient data is not really worth anything.  He has shown great improvement in conditioning and motor.  He has shown flashes of dominance in the D-League.  He has played far too little in the NBA to form any worthwhile opinion of what he can be in the NBA.  He is still a prospect that is improving everyday.  He is hardly any worse of a prospect than Jeff Withey or Dieng who are the same age and are projected as first rounders. 
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Re: A core of Rondo-Bradley-Green-Sully-Center will win a title
« Reply #123 on: May 27, 2013, 04:53:54 PM »

Offline D.o.s.

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Unless you are a fortune teller you don't know their potential.  Age, work ethic, character, talent, good coaching, good player development, HOF role models are all in these kids' favor.  It would be unreasonable to expect this group not to go far.  Add to that a GM who knows what it takes to win a championship, and owners who are willing to pay.  They have as good a shot at a championship as any core. 


No. Telling the people who don't agree with you that they aren't allowed to forecast a future in which our roster post KG and Pierce isn't a championship squad precludes you from making assertions that they are.

We can either sit around like fortune tellers, or we can sit around and look at the facts. But one viewpoint isn't disallowed from prediction just because you don't agree with it.

Some facts that damper my enthusiasm: Rondo, Sully, Avery, and Jeff Green have all had season ending injuries. Avery hasn't looked the same all year (especially in his shooting), there's no telling what Sully and Rondo will look like next year, and Jeff Green will continue to be Jeff Green.

Another fact: Rondo hasn't played close to a full season in four years. Bradley has never played anything close to a full season as a starter, and it remains to see if his great stretch last year was the exception to his game, or the rule.

Some speculation on my part: Jeff Green will continue to be Jeff Green. He is who he is at this point. So, most likely, is Rondo. Bradley and Sullinger are really the only wild-cards left as far as development goes.
At least a goldfish with a Lincoln Log on its back goin' across your floor to your sock drawer has a miraculous connotation to it.

Re: A core of Rondo-Bradley-Green-Sully-Center will win a title
« Reply #124 on: May 27, 2013, 04:57:01 PM »

Offline KCattheStripe

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*sigh*
are you kidding me?

Roy Hibbert wanted a max contract and everyone was extremely confused. Everyone laughed at him. Everyone said he wasn't worth it. Everyone said he wasn't good. In 2012 HE WAS AN AVERAGE TO SLIGHT LY ABOVE AVG CENTER!!
Jesus Christ, you do realize Roy Hibbert made the All-Star team in 2012, right? My god.

So did Jamal Magliore.

Re: A core of Rondo-Bradley-Green-Sully-Center will win a title
« Reply #125 on: May 27, 2013, 05:13:17 PM »

Offline CelticConcourse

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are you kidding me?

Roy Hibbert wanted a max contract and everyone was extremely confused. Everyone laughed at him. Everyone said he wasn't worth it. Everyone said he wasn't good. In 2012 HE WAS AN AVERAGE TO SLIGHT LY ABOVE AVG CENTER!!
Jesus Christ, you do realize Roy Hibbert made the All-Star team in 2012, right? My god.

So did Jamal Magliore.

I don't know who that is, but if you're an All-Star, you're not "an average to slight ly [sic] above avg center". Hibbert is a surefire top 5 center in the league... top 3.
Jeff Green - Top 5 SF

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Re: A core of Rondo-Bradley-Green-Sully-Center will win a title
« Reply #126 on: May 27, 2013, 05:25:13 PM »

Offline KCattheStripe

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*sigh*
are you kidding me?

Roy Hibbert wanted a max contract and everyone was extremely confused. Everyone laughed at him. Everyone said he wasn't worth it. Everyone said he wasn't good. In 2012 HE WAS AN AVERAGE TO SLIGHT LY ABOVE AVG CENTER!!
Jesus Christ, you do realize Roy Hibbert made the All-Star team in 2012, right? My god.

So did Jamal Magliore.

I don't know who that is, but if you're an All-Star, you're not "an average to slight ly [sic] above avg center". Hibbert is a surefire top 5 center in the league... top 3.


Jamal Magliore was an all star and decidedly average.

Re: A core of Rondo-Bradley-Green-Sully-Center will win a title
« Reply #127 on: May 27, 2013, 05:30:05 PM »

Offline CelticConcourse

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are you kidding me?

Roy Hibbert wanted a max contract and everyone was extremely confused. Everyone laughed at him. Everyone said he wasn't worth it. Everyone said he wasn't good. In 2012 HE WAS AN AVERAGE TO SLIGHT LY ABOVE AVG CENTER!!
Jesus Christ, you do realize Roy Hibbert made the All-Star team in 2012, right? My god.

So did Jamal Magliore.

I don't know who that is, but if you're an All-Star, you're not "an average to slight ly [sic] above avg center". Hibbert is a surefire top 5 center in the league... top 3.


Jamal Magliore was an all star and decidedly average.

Aye, I can't counter that, but Hibbert is decidedly above average by quite a bit.

Here's what they said when I called him overpaid.
Jeff Green - Top 5 SF

[Kevin Garnett]
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Re: A core of Rondo-Bradley-Green-Sully-Center will win a title
« Reply #128 on: May 27, 2013, 05:39:24 PM »

Offline CelticsFan9

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I think the only real thing Rondo can develop at this point in his career is the jump shot.  The problem is, we've been wanting him to improve it the past three or four years.  That worries me.

Bradley is hard to read.  He's yet to play a full season as a starter, but from what I've seen, he seems like more of a high-level backup rather than a starter.  He's got too many limitations to his game to start him.

Green's stats have shown that he produces at a very consistent rate throughout his entire entire career.  I don't think it's fair to say that just because he played one really good half of a season, he's turned the corner.  I need to see a little bit more.

Sullinger, like Bradley, has lots of limitations, but his game can be both polished and rugged, so I think he's best as a team's third big guy.

Melo is a project.  That's all we can really call him.

Do any of those players sound like components of a championship contender?  Other than Melo, totally.  I think the other four could be key pieces to a title run, but unfortunately I don't see any of them as that requisite superstar that a team needs to win the chip.

That's an issue.

Re: A core of Rondo-Bradley-Green-Sully-Center will win a title
« Reply #129 on: May 27, 2013, 05:48:03 PM »

Offline Fan from VT

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Unfortunately by the logic of this thread, 80% of the league has a core just as ypung and judt as potential filled as ours, or even moreso, so apparently there are 25 teams that are likely to win a title in the next ten years.

Re: A core of Rondo-Bradley-Green-Sully-Center will win a title
« Reply #130 on: May 27, 2013, 05:59:06 PM »

Offline BballTim

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*sigh*
are you kidding me?

Roy Hibbert wanted a max contract and everyone was extremely confused. Everyone laughed at him. Everyone said he wasn't worth it. Everyone said he wasn't good. In 2012 HE WAS AN AVERAGE TO SLIGHT LY ABOVE AVG CENTER!!
Jesus Christ, you do realize Roy Hibbert made the All-Star team in 2012, right? My god.

So did Jamal Magliore.

I don't know who that is, but if you're an All-Star, you're not "an average to slight ly [sic] above avg center". Hibbert is a surefire top 5 center in the league... top 3.

  Magloire isn't a star but he's still in the league and has been for the last 12 years. Just curious, but when did you start following the nba?

Re: A core of Rondo-Bradley-Green-Sully-Center will win a title
« Reply #131 on: May 27, 2013, 07:55:36 PM »

Offline Yogi

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Unless you are a fortune teller you don't know their potential.  Age, work ethic, character, talent, good coaching, good player development, HOF role models are all in these kids' favor.  It would be unreasonable to expect this group not to go far.  Add to that a GM who knows what it takes to win a championship, and owners who are willing to pay.  They have as good a shot at a championship as any core. 


No. Telling the people who don't agree with you that they aren't allowed to forecast a future in which our roster post KG and Pierce isn't a championship squad precludes you from making assertions that they are.

We can either sit around like fortune tellers, or we can sit around and look at the facts. But one viewpoint isn't disallowed from prediction just because you don't agree with it.

Some facts that damper my enthusiasm: Rondo, Sully, Avery, and Jeff Green have all had season ending injuries. Avery hasn't looked the same all year (especially in his shooting), there's no telling what Sully and Rondo will look like next year, and Jeff Green will continue to be Jeff Green.

Another fact: Rondo hasn't played close to a full season in four years. Bradley has never played anything close to a full season as a starter, and it remains to see if his great stretch last year was the exception to his game, or the rule.

Some speculation on my part: Jeff Green will continue to be Jeff Green. He is who he is at this point. So, most likely, is Rondo. Bradley and Sullinger are really the only wild-cards left as far as development goes.

1.  Who said anyone is not allowed to forecast?  That is called a straw man argument.  A logical fallacy that is unfortunately common in this forum.

2.  I never made any assertions that post KG and Pierce Celtics are a championship squad.  I do stand by my point that they have every chance of becoming one because they have the talent, the work ethic, the coaching, the leadership, the organization to put the right pieces around them, and time because of their youth.

3.  Rondo has played 88% of all possible games in his NBA career.  That is including DNPs, Suspensions and personal/rest days. 

4.  Avery and Sully are 21 and 22 and their surgeries are supposed to fix their problems not create new ones.  Avery hasn't missed any time since and played as hard as he did before the surgery.  Of course his shot suffered.  He wasn't able to shoot for months and he was immediately thrust into 40 min a game at a different position because of the Rondo and Barbosa injuries.  He also lost a ton of muscle in his upper body due to an inability to lift weights.  He should be back better and more confident than ever. 

5.  You are allowed to speculate whatever you want, but there is plenty of reason to expect improvement from Jeff Green.
a.  He is coming off a year of not playing.  He had to shake off rust.  Every reason to believe a full season and off season would help him improve. 
b.  He is 26, and sat out a full season.  Every reason to believe he is still learning and improving naturally. 
c.  He is learning from Paul Pierce and Kevin Garnett.  Top 5 in history to play their respective position, both of which he plays. 
d.  The addition of Rondo will lighten his ball handling responsibilities and allow him focus more on scoring and rebounding.  He will also get easier buckets in transition with Rondo. 
e.  He just completed his first full year with the Celtics system.  No reason he won't come in next year much more comfortable and confident. 
f.  Finally even if none of the above are true, and Jeff Green remains what he was post all star break, you still have an efficient 20ppg scorer who gives you 5+ rebounds and 3 assists to go with some blocks and steals. 
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Re: A core of Rondo-Bradley-Green-Sully-Center will win a title
« Reply #132 on: May 27, 2013, 08:03:30 PM »

Offline CelticConcourse

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are you kidding me?

Roy Hibbert wanted a max contract and everyone was extremely confused. Everyone laughed at him. Everyone said he wasn't worth it. Everyone said he wasn't good. In 2012 HE WAS AN AVERAGE TO SLIGHT LY ABOVE AVG CENTER!!
Jesus Christ, you do realize Roy Hibbert made the All-Star team in 2012, right? My god.

So did Jamal Magliore.

I don't know who that is, but if you're an All-Star, you're not "an average to slight ly [sic] above avg center". Hibbert is a surefire top 5 center in the league... top 3.

  Magloire isn't a star but he's still in the league and has been for the last 12 years. Just curious, but when did you start following the nba?
I wasn't referring to Magloire (also, he didn't play for any team in 2012-13).
Jeff Green - Top 5 SF

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Re: A core of Rondo-Bradley-Green-Sully-Center will win a title
« Reply #133 on: May 27, 2013, 08:11:33 PM »

Offline syfy9

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I think the only real thing Rondo can develop at this point in his career is the jump shot.  The problem is, we've been wanting him to improve it the past three or four years.  That worries me.

Rondo's jump shot looked really good early this season. He was hitting his mid range shots at a % higher than Kevin Durant.
I like Marcus Smart

Re: A core of Rondo-Bradley-Green-Sully-Center will win a title
« Reply #134 on: May 27, 2013, 08:55:03 PM »

Offline More Banners

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Well, anyway, it seems that at the moment it's a 3-star minimum league.  I don't think those 4 guys add up to 3 stars, and if the missing center is a star, then any squad could possibly be a contender with the right guy.

Rondo and Green are the best and most seasoned of the four.  They have star/allstar play for quite a few years in them.  Just need the #1 option next to them.

Sully might have the Jeff Green problem of being a great #2 or 3 guy, which might also be Rondo's problem in our rebuild scenarios.

Bradley/Sully/1st/salary match for the star we need? 

If that isn't enough to land a star, we're in trouble.

Rondo/Green/Star plus those great role players and coaching would be a contender.

Sully...Antoinesque skills, but hopoefully more disciplined.