Author Topic: DKC League: Open for Bidness  (Read 949405 times)

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Re: DKC League: General Commentary
« Reply #5355 on: July 08, 2013, 02:11:54 PM »

Offline indeedproceed

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more complaining about trades again?  ::)
Trades and FA bidding are the only thing to comment on around.

Not an indictment of you by any means, because not everyone really gives anywhere near enough of a crap to do this, but there is this thread on over here:

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=66197.0

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Re: DKC League: General Commentary
« Reply #5356 on: July 08, 2013, 02:16:00 PM »

Offline Yogi

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IP, I also don't appreciate how you project Harkless' numbers as evidence.  Oladipo, Afflalo and Harris will get most of the minutes at 2 and 3.  Davis, Vucevic and Nicholson playing the bigs.  Harkless will be lucky to see 15 min a game. 

I'm not calling for the reversal of the trade.  I am just trying to protect some of the newer GMs from being taken advantage of.  Clearly the Insider is not helping them out. 
CelticsBlog DKC Pelicans
J. Lin/I. Canaan/N. Wolters
E. Gordon/A. Shved
N. Batum/A. Roberson
A. Davis/K. Olynyk/M. Scott
D. Cousins/A. Baynes/V. Faverani
Rights: A. Abrines, R. Neto, L. Jean-Charles  Coach: M. Williams

Re: DKC League: General Commentary
« Reply #5357 on: July 08, 2013, 02:23:38 PM »

Online Rondo2287

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I would say the deal was "Significantly Unbalanced" based on the consensus view of the players/prospects involved and probably should have gone to the insider.

That said, two issues. 

#1) Washington has been MIA most of the draft so the odds of them seeking out a better deal/acting on the insiders warning would be slim

#2) if the insider was reporting on a deal in which Moe Harkless was the centerpiece of the deal I would reply back with a text picard facepalm.

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Re: DKC League: General Commentary
« Reply #5358 on: July 08, 2013, 02:30:36 PM »

Offline StartOrien

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Here was my idea behind the terminology 'significantly unbalanced'

You know how every year in your Fantasy Football league, a bottom feeder panics and trades away his superstar to a contending team and everyone's immediate reaction is "Welp, hand them the trophy"?

That's 'significantly unbalanced.'

You won't hear me say anything that even hints on that this was a good deal for Washington, but it doesn't really fit the Insider's criteria.
TV Show Draft:
Property Bothers, Kitt form Knight Rider, Caroline Holden (Yasmine Bleeth)
Coach Eric Taylor, Gene Parmesan, Ron Swanson
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Re: DKC League: General Commentary
« Reply #5359 on: July 08, 2013, 02:32:59 PM »

Offline Yogi

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The way I approach this game is:

You win and lose by making FAIR trades while using your research, skill and judgement to get assets you think will be better next year or fit better with your team.  It doesn't matter how fair or unfair the trade is in the future (that is out of our control), it has to be fair in the present. 

It's easy for an experienced negotiator to take advantage of someone who is new, or not as informed or knowledgeable about the NBA.  I go out of my way to recommend to everyone I trade with to check the value of their assets and consider all options before taking any trades with me.  I'm sure those of you who have dealt with me can verify that. 

I do not consider making a clearly unbalanced trade as "being a good GM."  To me a good GM is someone who makes equal trades now, but ones that work out better in the future because they have the research and the instinct.  I feel that unbalanced trade, taking advantage of other people's ignorance is against the spirit of this game. 

I don't stand to gain or lose anything by deals other teams make.  It doesn't affect my enjoyment of my own team.  However if I were getting swindled, I would like the people I am playing a friendly game with to point it out and help me out.  I am only trying to return that same courtesy. 
CelticsBlog DKC Pelicans
J. Lin/I. Canaan/N. Wolters
E. Gordon/A. Shved
N. Batum/A. Roberson
A. Davis/K. Olynyk/M. Scott
D. Cousins/A. Baynes/V. Faverani
Rights: A. Abrines, R. Neto, L. Jean-Charles  Coach: M. Williams

Re: DKC League: General Commentary
« Reply #5360 on: July 08, 2013, 02:36:11 PM »

Offline Yogi

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Here was my idea behind the terminology 'significantly unbalanced'

You know how every year in your Fantasy Football league, a bottom feeder panics and trades away his superstar to a contending team and everyone's immediate reaction is "Welp, hand them the trophy"?

That's 'significantly unbalanced.'

You won't hear me say anything that even hints on that this was a good deal for Washington, but it doesn't really fit the Insider's criteria.

I feel you are underestimating how valuable a top 3 draft pick is as an asset.  To trade that (along with other assets no less!) for an unproductive bench player is outrageously unbalanced. 
CelticsBlog DKC Pelicans
J. Lin/I. Canaan/N. Wolters
E. Gordon/A. Shved
N. Batum/A. Roberson
A. Davis/K. Olynyk/M. Scott
D. Cousins/A. Baynes/V. Faverani
Rights: A. Abrines, R. Neto, L. Jean-Charles  Coach: M. Williams

Re: DKC League: General Commentary
« Reply #5361 on: July 08, 2013, 02:37:49 PM »

Offline StartOrien

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The way I approach this game is:

You win and lose by making FAIR trades while using your research, skill and judgement to get assets you think will be better next year or fit better with your team.  It doesn't matter how fair or unfair the trade is in the future (that is out of our control), it has to be fair in the present. 

It's easy for an experienced negotiator to take advantage of someone who is new, or not as informed or knowledgeable about the NBA.  I go out of my way to recommend to everyone I trade with to check the value of their assets and consider all options before taking any trades with me.  I'm sure those of you who have dealt with me can verify that. 

I do not consider making a clearly unbalanced trade as "being a good GM."  To me a good GM is someone who makes equal trades now, but ones that work out better in the future because they have the research and the instinct.  I feel that unbalanced trade, taking advantage of other people's ignorance is against the spirit of this game. 

I don't stand to gain or lose anything by deals other teams make.  It doesn't affect my enjoyment of my own team.  However if I were getting swindled, I would like the people I am playing a friendly game with to point it out and help me out.  I am only trying to return that same courtesy.

By that logic, Mitch Kupchak - poor gm
TV Show Draft:
Property Bothers, Kitt form Knight Rider, Caroline Holden (Yasmine Bleeth)
Coach Eric Taylor, Gene Parmesan, Ron Swanson
"The Real Deal" Bill McNeil, Golddust

Re: DKC League: General Commentary
« Reply #5362 on: July 08, 2013, 02:38:07 PM »

Offline StartOrien

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Here was my idea behind the terminology 'significantly unbalanced'

You know how every year in your Fantasy Football league, a bottom feeder panics and trades away his superstar to a contending team and everyone's immediate reaction is "Welp, hand them the trophy"?

That's 'significantly unbalanced.'

You won't hear me say anything that even hints on that this was a good deal for Washington, but it doesn't really fit the Insider's criteria.

I feel you are underestimating how valuable a top 3 draft pick is as an asset.  To trade that (along with other assets no less!) for an unproductive bench player is outrageously unbalanced.

noted
TV Show Draft:
Property Bothers, Kitt form Knight Rider, Caroline Holden (Yasmine Bleeth)
Coach Eric Taylor, Gene Parmesan, Ron Swanson
"The Real Deal" Bill McNeil, Golddust

Re: DKC League: General Commentary
« Reply #5363 on: July 08, 2013, 02:39:40 PM »

Offline indeedproceed

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Here was my idea behind the terminology 'significantly unbalanced'

You know how every year in your Fantasy Football league, a bottom feeder panics and trades away his superstar to a contending team and everyone's immediate reaction is "Welp, hand them the trophy"?

That's 'significantly unbalanced.'

You won't hear me say anything that even hints on that this was a good deal for Washington, but it doesn't really fit the Insider's criteria.

I feel you are underestimating how valuable a top 3 draft pick is as an asset.  To trade that (along with other assets no less!) for an unproductive bench player is outrageously unbalanced.

That's not the trade that happened.

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Re: DKC League: General Commentary
« Reply #5364 on: July 08, 2013, 02:42:53 PM »

Offline celticpride07

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i don't have a problem with the trade, what if Alex Len is a bust?
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Re: DKC League: General Commentary
« Reply #5365 on: July 08, 2013, 02:44:42 PM »

Offline indeedproceed

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i don't have a problem with the trade, what if Alex Len is a bust?

What if Moe Harkless averages 15 points and 6 boards a game, and gets his 3pt % around 35-37%?

And he still gets paid 1.8 million dollars a year this year and next.

And I look like a complete idiot.

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Questions about the DKC? Ask here: LINK
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Re: DKC League: General Commentary
« Reply #5366 on: July 08, 2013, 02:45:45 PM »

Online KCattheStripe

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Guys, can we go bacteria to talking about how I got the number one pick in the daft at the tenth pick?

Re: DKC League: General Commentary
« Reply #5367 on: July 08, 2013, 02:46:10 PM »

Offline Yogi

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The way I approach this game is:

You win and lose by making FAIR trades while using your research, skill and judgement to get assets you think will be better next year or fit better with your team.  It doesn't matter how fair or unfair the trade is in the future (that is out of our control), it has to be fair in the present. 

It's easy for an experienced negotiator to take advantage of someone who is new, or not as informed or knowledgeable about the NBA.  I go out of my way to recommend to everyone I trade with to check the value of their assets and consider all options before taking any trades with me.  I'm sure those of you who have dealt with me can verify that. 

I do not consider making a clearly unbalanced trade as "being a good GM."  To me a good GM is someone who makes equal trades now, but ones that work out better in the future because they have the research and the instinct.  I feel that unbalanced trade, taking advantage of other people's ignorance is against the spirit of this game. 

I don't stand to gain or lose anything by deals other teams make.  It doesn't affect my enjoyment of my own team.  However if I were getting swindled, I would like the people I am playing a friendly game with to point it out and help me out.  I am only trying to return that same courtesy.

By that logic, Mitch Kupchak - poor gm
Oh in the real NBA, that type of attitude is ridiculous.  I would fire any GM who wasn't ruthless and manipulative.  That's why I love Danny Ainge!  I just did not think that was what we were going for in this game.

By the way, I love IP.  I really think he's a good guy and very fair.  He's a tough negotiator though.  I made my first trade with him.  I feel I escaped with the clothes on my back, but I shop my players a lot and do a ton of research.  I am just looking out for guys like the Washington GM who may not be as involved and might impulsively make trades without being fully aware of their options. 
CelticsBlog DKC Pelicans
J. Lin/I. Canaan/N. Wolters
E. Gordon/A. Shved
N. Batum/A. Roberson
A. Davis/K. Olynyk/M. Scott
D. Cousins/A. Baynes/V. Faverani
Rights: A. Abrines, R. Neto, L. Jean-Charles  Coach: M. Williams

Re: DKC League: General Commentary
« Reply #5368 on: July 08, 2013, 02:47:41 PM »

Offline StartOrien

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Guys, can we go bacteria to talking about how I got the number one pick in the daft at the tenth pick?

Real Pistons add Josh Smith
DKC Pistons add Grevis Vasquez

KC (1) - Joe Dumars (0)
TV Show Draft:
Property Bothers, Kitt form Knight Rider, Caroline Holden (Yasmine Bleeth)
Coach Eric Taylor, Gene Parmesan, Ron Swanson
"The Real Deal" Bill McNeil, Golddust

Re: DKC League: General Commentary
« Reply #5369 on: July 08, 2013, 02:47:42 PM »

Online Roy H.

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Good to see I'm not going crazy.  When I saw that trade, I was surprised how horrifically bad it was for Washington.  Others seem to share that view.

Cleaning up "Insider" should be one of the top priorities for next year.  Maybe there should be a pool, on whether people favor more use of Insider, or less.  I've always been in favor of a very restrictive use of Commissioner intervention with trades.  However, for the good of the league, perhaps it's a good thing to not let people get swindled, blowing up not only their 2013 draft but their 2014 draft as well.

At some point, with various franchises left decimated by their bad trades, and the discontent that is left behind by that, it will kill the league.  I'm sure many of us have seen this happen in keeper leagues, and maybe it makes sense to either plan for that inevitability, or to allow more liberal use of Insider to prevent it.


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