Roy H.... your thoughts on Jeff Green now?

[Yogi]

Haha.  I'm not sure these threads are allowed, but I'm happy to share.

I was really impressed with Green in the latter half of the season.  He was extremely inconsistent early, going months without stringing together three good (or bad) games in a row.

Over the last 20 games or so, though, Green was excellent.  As a starter, he averaged 20 ppg, 52% FG%, and 52% 3PT%.  Plus, he showed more aggression, and his defense was very good.  It's hard not to tip your cap to those numbers.

Now, I'm not sure that that level of efficiency is sustainable for Green, and I still don't see him having the superstar potential that others due.  I do think, though, that he out-performed his contract over the last quarter of the season, and I'm hoping that he can keep it up.

2012–13   Oklahoma City   
Games 78
MPG   25.1
FG%   .457
FT%   .611
REB:   6.0
AST:   1.4
STL:   .6
BLK:   1.1
PTS:   4.2

And OKC's end of the deal is living up to(and exceeding) the contract. 

?

Is it not possible to discuss Green without Perk? 

Because, if you'd like to rehash that particular thread for the ten thousandth time, I still wouldn't have made the Perk trade *during the season*.  Danny threw away a shot at a title, for a guy who really didn't contribute much in 2011 or 2012.  Instead of exploring a trade in the off-season, and perhaps landing a guy like David West, we instead wasted two seasons of KG and Pierce.  That trade blew up our chemistry, and blew a gaping hole in our team at center.  That's a void Danny still hasn't filled.

So, in terms of Green's play, I think he played very well during the latter part of this season, and I'm hopeful for him going forward.  Don't confuse that with thinking that Danny's fool-hardy deal to move a starting center with trade value for a backup small forward in the middle of a season where we had legitimate championship hopes was a good trade.  It wasn't, regardless of which player has more current value.

Can we end this ridiculous myth that we would've had a better shot at the title without the trade?  Perk was injured and Green produced more than Perk would've anyway.  No Rondo, No Shaq and No JO was was the reason we lost.  Not because of Perk who is a great 20 min a game role player and great teammate but nothing more.  By the way the back up to old Paul Pierce would've been Sasha Pavlovic.  That was the guy that would've had to cover Lebron, if Paul Pierce needs to conserve himself for offense. 

[CelticConcourse]

Can we end this ridiculous myth that we would've had a better shot at the title without the trade?  Perk was injured and Green produced more than Perk would've anyway.  No Rondo, No Shaq and No JO was was the reason we lost.  Not because of Perk who is a great 20 min a game role player and great teammate but nothing more.  By the way the back up to old Paul Pierce would've been Sasha Pavlovic.  That was the guy that would've had to cover Lebron, if Paul Pierce needs to conserve himself for offense.

Hey, is this an attack on Sasha? Hm? 

[mmmmm]

Green's attitude reminds me of Duncan. Anyone else feel that way?

Tim Duncan? Not remotely ... Tim is highly confident of himself, has some humility, a sense of humor, is relaxed on the court, a team-first guy ... I wouldn't give any of those attributes to Jeff. He's more of an Antione Walker, Gerald Wallace type, (though I think he's improving in most of those areas since being in Boston).

Seriously?  Antoine Walker?

Of all the possible comparisons, you are comparing Green's attitude to Walkers?

As someone who watched Green a lot from his Hoya days 'till now, I could not possibly disagree more vehemently with that.

I'm not going to compare Green with Duncan.  But he is nothing like Antoine.

[vjcsmoke]

Timmy is a legend.  His team is in contention for the NBA title yet again.  Green is not even close.  To me Green is like a younger Rashard Lewis but not as athletic.  He's certainly a good player to have but he's not a championship block.  He's a complementary player. 

The Celtics lack that MJ/Kobe/Lebron level talent to bring them a title.  And unfortunately they are not bad enough to draft that guy unless they get insanely lucky in the draft and say get a John Stockton level guy at #16.

[krook]

Timmy is a legend.  His team is in contention for the NBA title yet again.  Green is not even close.  To me Green is like a younger Rashard Lewis but not as athletic.  He's certainly a good player to have but he's not a championship block.  He's a complementary player. 

The Celtics lack that MJ/Kobe/Lebron level talent to bring them a title.  And unfortunately they are not bad enough to draft that guy unless they get insanely lucky in the draft and say get a John Stockton level guy at #16.

everyone agree with me

jeff green is gerald wallace shawn marion antawn jamison rashad lewis type

[celts55]

Green had an impressive second half of the season, but the play-offs reminded me of why I am unable to completely buy in. He is way too passive and one dimensional. He's a player who doesn't do much outside of scoring and his scoring isn't very consistent. He disappeared for quarters at a time in the Knicks series and did the same all season.

Green has to work on being a presence on the floor through multiple facets of the game, especially rebounding. He also has to do a better job of scoring without the ball in the half-court(he needs more cutting, not just corner threes and Isos). Green is just a few improvements away from being a very nice player and potential building block.

IMO, Green at best can be the 3rd best player on a championship team but he's not there yet.

I think I have to disagree about Green being one dimensional. He had over 5 rebounds a game in playoffs, which isn't terrible for a 3. He ran the floor well and scored without the ball. And I also was impressed by his defense.
I don't know that he'll be a star but he can very certainly be a second or at least third best player on a championship team, in my opinion.

[Fafnir]

Green had an impressive second half of the season, but the play-offs reminded me of why I am unable to completely buy in. He is way too passive and one dimensional. He's a player who doesn't do much outside of scoring and his scoring isn't very consistent. He disappeared for quarters at a time in the Knicks series and did the same all season.

Green has to work on being a presence on the floor through multiple facets of the game, especially rebounding. He also has to do a better job of scoring without the ball in the half-court(he needs more cutting, not just corner threes and Isos). Green is just a few improvements away from being a very nice player and potential building block.

IMO, Green at best can be the 3rd best player on a championship team but he's not there yet.

I think I have to disagree about Green being one dimensional. He had over 5 rebounds a game in playoffs, which isn't terrible for a 3. He ran the floor well and scored without the ball. And I also was impressed by his defense.
I don't know that he'll be a star but he can very certainly be a second or at least third best player on a championship team, in my opinion.

5 rebounds in 43 MPG isn't good for a 3 either.

A roughly 7.5 RR in the playoffs and 8.3 during the regular season. That's a below average mark for a SF.

[celts55]

Green had an impressive second half of the season, but the play-offs reminded me of why I am unable to completely buy in. He is way too passive and one dimensional. He's a player who doesn't do much outside of scoring and his scoring isn't very consistent. He disappeared for quarters at a time in the Knicks series and did the same all season.

Green has to work on being a presence on the floor through multiple facets of the game, especially rebounding. He also has to do a better job of scoring without the ball in the half-court(he needs more cutting, not just corner threes and Isos). Green is just a few improvements away from being a very nice player and potential building block.

IMO, Green at best can be the 3rd best player on a championship team but he's not there yet.

I think I have to disagree about Green being one dimensional. He had over 5 rebounds a game in playoffs, which isn't terrible for a 3. He ran the floor well and scored without the ball. And I also was impressed by his defense.
I don't know that he'll be a star but he can very certainly be a second or at least third best player on a championship team, in my opinion.

5 rebounds in 43 MPG isn't good for a 3 either.

A roughly 7.5 RR in the playoffs and 8.3 during the regular season. That's a below average mark for a SF.

No it's not that good, but Carmelo averaged right around the same and so did Pierce. Not saying it's that good, said it's not terrible.

Just wondering where you came up with 7.5 and 8.3?

[Fafnir]

Green had an impressive second half of the season, but the play-offs reminded me of why I am unable to completely buy in. He is way too passive and one dimensional. He's a player who doesn't do much outside of scoring and his scoring isn't very consistent. He disappeared for quarters at a time in the Knicks series and did the same all season.

Green has to work on being a presence on the floor through multiple facets of the game, especially rebounding. He also has to do a better job of scoring without the ball in the half-court(he needs more cutting, not just corner threes and Isos). Green is just a few improvements away from being a very nice player and potential building block.

IMO, Green at best can be the 3rd best player on a championship team but he's not there yet.

I think I have to disagree about Green being one dimensional. He had over 5 rebounds a game in playoffs, which isn't terrible for a 3. He ran the floor well and scored without the ball. And I also was impressed by his defense.
I don't know that he'll be a star but he can very certainly be a second or at least third best player on a championship team, in my opinion.

5 rebounds in 43 MPG isn't good for a 3 either.

A roughly 7.5 RR in the playoffs and 8.3 during the regular season. That's a below average mark for a SF.

No it's not that good, but Carmelo averaged right around the same and so did Pierce. Not saying it's that good, said it's not terrible.

Just wondering where you came up with 7.5 and 8.3?

Rebound rates from basketball-reference

[Boris Badenov]

Green had an impressive second half of the season, but the play-offs reminded me of why I am unable to completely buy in. He is way too passive and one dimensional. He's a player who doesn't do much outside of scoring and his scoring isn't very consistent. He disappeared for quarters at a time in the Knicks series and did the same all season.

Green has to work on being a presence on the floor through multiple facets of the game, especially rebounding. He also has to do a better job of scoring without the ball in the half-court(he needs more cutting, not just corner threes and Isos). Green is just a few improvements away from being a very nice player and potential building block.

IMO, Green at best can be the 3rd best player on a championship team but he's not there yet.

I think I have to disagree about Green being one dimensional. He had over 5 rebounds a game in playoffs, which isn't terrible for a 3. He ran the floor well and scored without the ball. And I also was impressed by his defense.
I don't know that he'll be a star but he can very certainly be a second or at least third best player on a championship team, in my opinion.

5 rebounds in 43 MPG isn't good for a 3 either.

A roughly 7.5 RR in the playoffs and 8.3 during the regular season. That's a below average mark for a SF.

No it's not that good, but Carmelo averaged right around the same and so did Pierce. Not saying it's that good, said it's not terrible.

Just wondering where you came up with 7.5 and 8.3?

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/statistics/_/sort/reboundRate/page/2/seasontype/3

I see Carmelo with 9.9 here.

The playoffs are a small sample, of course, but when the people just ahead of you on the list are JR Smith, Andre Miller, Mike Conley, MAtt Bonner etc. you are not exactly in elite company as far as rebounders.

[Roy H.]

Green had an impressive second half of the season, but the play-offs reminded me of why I am unable to completely buy in. He is way too passive and one dimensional. He's a player who doesn't do much outside of scoring and his scoring isn't very consistent. He disappeared for quarters at a time in the Knicks series and did the same all season.

Green has to work on being a presence on the floor through multiple facets of the game, especially rebounding. He also has to do a better job of scoring without the ball in the half-court(he needs more cutting, not just corner threes and Isos). Green is just a few improvements away from being a very nice player and potential building block.

IMO, Green at best can be the 3rd best player on a championship team but he's not there yet.

I think I have to disagree about Green being one dimensional. He had over 5 rebounds a game in playoffs, which isn't terrible for a 3. He ran the floor well and scored without the ball. And I also was impressed by his defense.
I don't know that he'll be a star but he can very certainly be a second or at least third best player on a championship team, in my opinion.

5 rebounds in 43 MPG isn't good for a 3 either.

A roughly 7.5 RR in the playoffs and 8.3 during the regular season. That's a below average mark for a SF.

No it's not that good, but Carmelo averaged right around the same and so did Pierce. Not saying it's that good, said it's not terrible.

Just wondering where you came up with 7.5 and 8.3?

Those are Green's total rebounding percentage, meaning the percentage of all available boards he grabbed while he was on the floor.  Here are the statistics for the Celtics this season:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/BOS/2013.html

Scroll down to "advanced".  You'll see that Green ranked 13th on the Celtics in total rebounding percentage.  Most of the guys ahead of him were big men and part-time players.  However, you'll see that Pierce was at 11.2%, and even Rondo trumped Green at 8.8%.

In the playoffs, Pierce's rebounding percentage dipped substantially, but he was still ahead of Green.

[Fafnir]

Paul was rebounding in place of PF for much of this season, it really inflated his totals.

I feel weird saying that, because he stepped up when the team needed him to grab those boards. Not every player can do that (Jeff Green for example certainly can't).

[celts55]

Green had an impressive second half of the season, but the play-offs reminded me of why I am unable to completely buy in. He is way too passive and one dimensional. He's a player who doesn't do much outside of scoring and his scoring isn't very consistent. He disappeared for quarters at a time in the Knicks series and did the same all season.

Green has to work on being a presence on the floor through multiple facets of the game, especially rebounding. He also has to do a better job of scoring without the ball in the half-court(he needs more cutting, not just corner threes and Isos). Green is just a few improvements away from being a very nice player and potential building block.

IMO, Green at best can be the 3rd best player on a championship team but he's not there yet.

I think I have to disagree about Green being one dimensional. He had over 5 rebounds a game in playoffs, which isn't terrible for a 3. He ran the floor well and scored without the ball. And I also was impressed by his defense.
I don't know that he'll be a star but he can very certainly be a second or at least third best player on a championship team, in my opinion.

5 rebounds in 43 MPG isn't good for a 3 either.

A roughly 7.5 RR in the playoffs and 8.3 during the regular season. That's a below average mark for a SF.

No it's not that good, but Carmelo averaged right around the same and so did Pierce. Not saying it's that good, said it's not terrible.

Just wondering where you came up with 7.5 and 8.3?

Those are Green's total rebounding percentage, meaning the percentage of all available boards he grabbed while he was on the floor.  Here are the statistics for the Celtics this season:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/BOS/2013.html

Scroll down to "advanced".  You'll see that Green ranked 13th on the Celtics in total rebounding percentage.  Most of the guys ahead of him were big men and part-time players.  However, you'll see that Pierce was at 11.2%, and even Rondo trumped Green at 8.8%.

In the playoffs, Pierce's rebounding percentage dipped substantially, but he was still ahead of Green.

Okay. Thanks. I stand corrected.

[AB_Celtic]

Paul was rebounding in place of PF for much of this season, it really inflated his totals.

I feel weird saying that, because he stepped up when the team needed him to grab those boards. Not every player can do that (Jeff Green for example certainly can't).

I think he can (as in he has the physical tools to make him a good rebounder), he just doesn't want to.

[Bingbangbarros]

I honestly still believe it was a good trade. Perk was injured and not the same Perk and I don't believe he ever regained his form that season or even to this day. Ainge saw this coming. His replacements didn't and haven't panned out since but I would argue that neiher has Perk. 

They had a chance to get something for him before they lost him to free agency. Now OKC is stuck with his contract. Ainge envisioned this and was able to get Jeff Green. A healthy Jeff Green could have made a huge difference last year when we were forced to play Pavolic and others big minutes and in crucial situations.