ESPN: Is Garnett an All-Time Great?

[Chelm]

IMO, the battle for the title of greatest power forward of all-time is between KG and Duncan. KG in his prime was a monster. 22 points, 13 rebounds, 5 assists, a block, and a steal nightly (combined with game changing defense). IMO, it doesn't matter how you play the game as long as your effective and KG was pretty [dang] effective.

The way Kevin McHale is overlooked around here is something else.  He was a great on both ends of the floor and was regularly abusing people before he lost his lift by playing through ridiculous injuries in the playoffs.  He could D up nearly everyone (not so much Kareems sky hook) and score in the post on anybody.

No one could guard Kareem's sky hook.  Wouldn't really hold that against anyone.  I also wonder at people forgetting Karl Malone.  Yeah, he didn't win a championship, but he got [dang] close, and has the rest of the statistics to at least be in the conversation.  I mean, at KG's age he still averaged 26/10/4.

[Chelm]

My Reply

Name me another player that has 25000 points 10000 rebounds 5000 assists almost 2000 blocks and over 1000 steals......


OH THATS RIGHT... THERE ISNT ANY!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Man is in a league of his own.

Factor in the way he makes those around him play harder, and the way he anchors a defence.

You have an all time great there

Look, I love KG, and he is definitely an all-time great, but if you're judging based on statistics, Malone had more of every stat except for blocks.  Plus, he had 3 years of college taking away from those totals.  I think it's a little disingenuous to say "there isn't any".

[slamtheking]

I saw Stephen A. Smith's face and decided not to click play.

I hate to say this, because Stephen A. Smith is a friend of mine. Stephen A. Smith performed my son's briss. Stephen A. Smith and I own a timeshare together in Ogunquit with side-by-side clawfoot bathtubs overlooking the water.

but Stephen A. Smith is a complete boob and no one should ever take anything he says seriously ever. If I was in a crowded movie theater and Stephen A. Smith yelled "fire," I would sit tight and hope that at least it meant he was leaving.

TP for the laugh.  still smiling over that one.

[BballTim]

Something like 7 years in a row of 20-5-10 per game. HOF Defense. Very good scorer. Elite rebounder. Above average passing for a big man. The question is not HOF worthy, the question is top 30 all-time?20? etc

  You'd be pretty hard pressed to name 30 players better than KG. I'd probably go with top 20.

[rocknrollforyoursoul]

This should not even be in question.

[Celtic]

There really is no debate as to whether KG is an all time great. Before he came to the C's I thought he was the best player in the NBA for many years running and in all honesty in 2008 he was the rightful MVP. I believe that if KG had been drafted to a better team with a better GM he would have easily won multiple championships before Boston. Duncan is usually considered the player (at least the dominant big player) of that generation, I can't help but wonder if that would be true if their situations were reversed.

[CelticsFan9]

Let's look at his resume:

MVP, DPOY, champion, multiple All Stars, multiple All NBAs, multiple All Defenses

Then you look at his stats:

25,000 points, 10,000 rebounds, 5,000 assists, over 2,000 stocks (steals/blocks)

His legendary intensity and focus.  His desire to win while understanding a TEAM wins chips, not one player.  A great teammate, and an even greater player.

KG is the man, and he'll probably go down as my favorite player ever.

[GreenEnvy]

IMO, the battle for the title of greatest power forward of all-time is between KG and Duncan. KG in his prime was a monster. 22 points, 13 rebounds, 5 assists, a block, and a steal nightly (combined with game changing defense). IMO, it doesn't matter how you play the game as long as your effective and KG was pretty [dang] effective.

The way Kevin McHale is overlooked around here is something else.  He was a great on both ends of the floor and was regularly abusing people before he lost his lift by playing through ridiculous injuries in the playoffs.  He could D up nearly everyone (not so much Kareems sky hook) and score in the post on anybody.

No one could guard Kareem's sky hook.  Wouldn't really hold that against anyone.  I also wonder at people forgetting Karl Malone.  Yeah, he didn't win a championship, but he got [dang] close, and has the rest of the statistics to at least be in the conversation.  I mean, at KG's age he still averaged 26/10/4.

Karl Malone was a great player for a long time, but along with never winning, he was the only one of the all-time great PF's to play alongside a PG of Stockton's stature.


I'd go with Duncan/KG as the two best. McHale 3rd. Barkley/Malone round out the top 5.


KG is, IMHO, one of the three greatest defensive players ever (EVER). His career statistics are already one-of-a-kind (25K points, 15K rebounds, 5K assists, 1.5K steals, 1.5K blocks). His versatility makes him a very unique player.

[Yoki_IsTheName]

I don't know. I'm reading in to what Skip said I think he agrees that KG is an all time great, he just thinks he could've been great-er if he played like a big and scored down low.

The issue with that is that's just not KG.  What KG is though is probably the most complete big man ever.  He can shoot, pass, block shots, rebound, attack the rim.... and is very smart and a great leader.  I know he doesn't have the post game of some others but he is a truly remarkable player.  To me he is a modern Russell in how he just fits into his team and makes his whole team better, with how his game adapts and how he brings leadership and fire.

I wouldn't take any PF over him.

Stephen A. actually said the same thing, and I think that is Skip's point. He has the tools, the skills and the craftiness to be a low post scoring threat as well in addition to everything KG had. "He could have been greater is what Skip said. I don't think he's trying to imply that KG is not all time great, but he could be greater.

That is what I am agreeing on. I don't think Skip would say KG is not an All Time great, he would be ultra crazy for him not to say that. Although, I think he's saying KG could have at least jumped jumped up a few levels on the great scale if only he scored down low like a big man instead of floating around and shooting jumpers (which is not bad, don't get me wrong).

[Roy H.]

That's what you get for watching First Take.  From my experience, this is the level of "analysis" they show there daily.

Unless you define "all-time great" as being among the top 5 or 6 players ever, then of course KG is a historically great player.  He is a clear-cut top-five PF of all-time, and some would say the best PF ever (although I would disagree).

[celtics2]

The fact that Bayless starts out by focusing on KG's offensive abilities proves his ignorance.

KG has a legitimate place in discussions about who is the greatest defensive player in NBA history. I'm not saying I think he is the best, but he is up there. I think his ability to elevate the abilities of those around him on defense is the best in NBA history. (Though, I never saw Russell play.)

Add that to his terrific scoring, rebounding and passing skills, along with his commitment to winning and team play, and you have one of the most complete players on both ends of the floor the league has ever seen.

Silly.

Another Great. Yes the League is pouring them out lately. I saw Russell play. I think KG may be coming off the bench back then. But today, hey he's up there, close enough by today's standards.

[KGs Knee]

How is the the greatest PF of all-time not an all-time great?

Does their stupidity know no bounds?  Do thse guys even believe the words that come out of their own mouths, or do they just spew hyperbole, for the sake of being hyperbolic?

[CelticConcourse]

How is the the greatest PF of all-time not an all-time great?

Does their stupidity know no bounds?  Do thse guys even believe the words that come out of their own mouths, or do they just spew hyperbole, for the sake of being hyperbolic?

He's an all-time great 2.

[Yoki_IsTheName]

How is the the greatest PF of all-time not an all-time great?

Does their stupidity know no bounds?  Do thse guys even believe the words that come out of their own mouths, or do they just spew hyperbole, for the sake of being hyperbolic?

No one from First Take said KG is not an All Time great. Skip just blabbed and said "he could have been great-er" but I've not heard any of the two said he's no All Time Great.

[Brendan]

Duncan has been playing Center for a long time, KG has been mostly a PF. I think KG is the better PF on peak value and volume, but Duncan the better player, because being the primary offensive guy is the hardest part of the game, and KG didn't want that, and maybe couldn't be that.

McHale gets a serious discount in my opinion for his short peak and shorter career. I don't consider Barkley a great two way player, Dirk either. Pretty sure Malone was using steroids, so he's out, plus no ring.

It's too hard for me to say anything about the old(er) school guys.