Author Topic: When you get 9 pts from the SG position, guess what? You lose.  (Read 1848 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline ctrey

  • Jaylen Brown
  • Posts: 673
  • Tommy Points: 110

We got 9 points from the three "players" at that position tonight. Courtney Lee had 5, Jordan Crawford (Who was brought in because he was a "scorer") had 4 and Jason Terry (brought in to replace Ray Allen's scoring) had 0.

Our best shooting guard, also sometimes known as a "scoring guard" has averaged 10.3 points a game this year. Jason Terry has by any measure been a failure. Do not give me this nonsense about fitting in or not having the right system. This is a guy who has scored everywhere he has played. This is his lowest scoring average since his rookie year. The sad truth is we gambled on an old player and lost. Terry just got old. It happens.

The other guys are marginal scorers at best. Yes I know that Bradley was supposed to be the SG for us this year and that the Rondo injury stopped that. Still, Bradley is no scoring threat.

We desperately need scoring next season. We lose far too many games because we do not score enough. The last two games are perfect examples of this problem.

This next draft has wing players, particularly shooting guards. The player I am praying declares is Kentavious Caldwell-Pope. He is the SG for the Georgia Bulldogs and he can flat out score. Yes he is streaky but we are picking around 19, not in the top 5. He should be there when we draft. I get to see a fair amount of SEC basketball down here in Houston and the guy has skill. Like I said, I know he is not a top 5 guy but he has an NBA skill, he can score.

The C's do not need more rebounding. I know the pundits harp about it but because of the way we play defense, getting back immediately rather than crashing the offensive glass, makes us look like a weaker rebounding team than we are. On defensive rebounds we are quite solid.

I find myself watching games and not saying "Man we need a board here" but "Can we buy a basket please?" Somehow we need to solve this problem. The free agent crop is weak, (Unless we can manage to score Ainge's Binky, Tyreke Evans) so the draft is where we must look. My view is if we can add one reliable scorer along with some improvement from Fab Melo and Sullinger next season, we are right back in the hunt for a title. That may sound like a stretch but I truly think we are that close.
 
The best teams in this league score. That is the way the game is right now. Our defense is not going to crater, the culture is far too ingrained at this point under Doc. We just need someone to give us what Terry was supposed to give us, real scoring punch off the bench. I do not blame him. Plenty of players go from excellent to mediocre or worse during an offseason as they age. We were just unlucky with Terry. We need to move on with a younger player, not a old re-tread. 

I invite you all to do a little research and then climb aboard the Kentavious Caldwell-Pope band wagon. Plus, just think what fun Tommy will have with the kids name?

Re: When you get 9 pts from the SG position, guess what? You lose.
« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2013, 02:16:39 AM »

Offline Smutzy#9

  • Jaylen Brown
  • Posts: 703
  • Tommy Points: 42
You know why we get killed rebounding. Because we settle for perimeter jump shots, when they dont fall, we dont score. Apart from Jeff green and Rondo we dont exactly get alot of points in the paint. I would love us to get a wing player that can just scrap and get into the paint.

Re: When you get 9 pts from the SG position, guess what? You lose.
« Reply #2 on: March 21, 2013, 02:30:11 AM »

Offline Eigild

  • Xavier Tillman
  • Posts: 27
  • Tommy Points: 2
I'm torn between if our biggest need going forward is an KG replacement, when he retires (that would be a 7 footer, defense anchor, shot blocking ability) or a scoring threat replacing Pierce as number 1 scoring option, preferable a SG (because we have Jeff at SF).  ???

Re: When you get 9 pts from the SG position, guess what? You lose.
« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2013, 03:15:48 AM »

Offline crimson_stallion

  • Rajon Rondo
  • *****
  • Posts: 5964
  • Tommy Points: 875

We got 9 points from the three "players" at that position tonight. Courtney Lee had 5, Jordan Crawford (Who was brought in because he was a "scorer") had 4 and Jason Terry (brought in to replace Ray Allen's scoring) had 0.

Our best shooting guard, also sometimes known as a "scoring guard" has averaged 10.3 points a game this year. Jason Terry has by any measure been a failure. Do not give me this nonsense about fitting in or not having the right system. This is a guy who has scored everywhere he has played. This is his lowest scoring average since his rookie year. The sad truth is we gambled on an old player and lost. Terry just got old. It happens.

You are talking about the point totals of one game. 

Between them our three guards (Terry, Lee and Jordan) are averaging 25.3 PPG, which is approximately 1/3 of the teams total points scored.

When you consider that our two best scorers (KG and Pierce) average almost 35 PPG between them, 25 PPG from our guards is pretty reasonable considering we don't have any stars at that position. 

As for Terry, how can you say he has been a failure?  When was the last time Boston (in the big 3 era) had two bench players both averaging double figure scoring?

Terry is averaging 27 MPG for us this season - he has averaged 30+ minutes per game ever other season in the league since his rookie and Sophomore seasons. 

Last year in Dallas Terry averaged 17.0 points per 36 minutes, but he was the second scoring option on that Dallas team and the first scoring option off the bench.  This season he's averaging 13.5 per 36 minutes, but he is the forth scoring option (after Pierce, KG, Green) and the secondary scorer off the bench (behind green).  When you factor in his reduced role, his slight drop of 3.5 points per 36 minutes is not only understandable, but expected.

If you look at his percentages, they are right up there with what he has averaged throughout his career.

Stat | This season | Career |
-----|-------------|--------|
FG%  |    44.3%    |  44.8% |
3PT% |    38.1%    |  38.0% |
FT%  |    86.1%    |  84.7% |

Look at his rebounding, assists, steals, blocks, turnovers - all of the are pretty much dead on what he averaged last season on a per minute basis.

Everyone is pointing the blame at Terry, but he has been solid this year and is giving us everything we expected from him. 

You can't expect him to average 15 PPG for us the way he did in Dallas when he's playing 4-5 minutes less per game, and is two men further down in the scoring depth chart.  That's just silly.


The best teams in this league score. That is the way the game is right now. Our defense is not going to crater, the culture is far too ingrained at this point under Doc. We just need someone to give us what Terry was supposed to give us, real scoring punch off the bench. I do not blame him. Plenty of players go from excellent to mediocre or worse during an offseason as they age. We were just unlucky with Terry. We need to move on with a younger player, not a old re-tread. 

Correction - the best teams in this league outscore their opponents. Whether they do this by scoring a lot, or by allowing very little, makes no difference.

This team is a team that has gone for quantity over quality - DA took the approach of getting us a very deep team of solid players rather than a team with a few very good players and no depth. 

This is by design, and if you look at our injury situations this season you could say it's paid off.  We lost two key starters (Rondo and Sully) along with a significant backup (Barbosa) and we are about 3 games out from the 4th seed in the East.  We've achieved this because of the depth that was built in to this team, and that depth has allowed us to whether the storm and keep fighing.  We might not have the pure star power to dominate other teams on a nightly basis, but we have enough quality depth to compete on any night.

Right now we have Terry, Jordan and Green averaging 29 PPG off the bench between them.  That is more scoring depth then a Celtics team has ever had in the big three era.  Today our gus struggled with their shots - Green missed layups he always makes, Bradley missed jumpers he usually makes, Terry missed shots he almost always makes.  We had a bad shooting night, it happens. 

It was also some of the most one-side officiating I've seen this season and while that isn't an excuse, it doesn't help when you are struggling with your shot.

We also got beaten on the boards by almost double.

Somehow despite all of this we lost the game by 1 point.

One game prior to this we came one Lebron prayer away from upsetting the best team in the league and breaking their historical win streak.

We could use another scorer yes, but right now we are desperate for it.  When Pierce and KG retire, then we will be...unless Jeff Green can start producing those big nights on a more consistent basis.   

Re: When you get 9 pts from the SG position, guess what? You lose.
« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2013, 03:20:51 AM »

Offline crimson_stallion

  • Rajon Rondo
  • *****
  • Posts: 5964
  • Tommy Points: 875
I'm torn between if our biggest need going forward is an KG replacement, when he retires (that would be a 7 footer, defense anchor, shot blocking ability) or a scoring threat replacing Pierce as number 1 scoring option, preferable a SG (because we have Jeff at SF).  ???

Right now we don't really have the luxury of choosing, we need both.

Our anchor doesn't need to be a 7 footer though.  We just need a big who is a capable shotblocker (to keep pesky slashers out of the paint), who is capable of defending in the post, and who is agile enough to defend the P&R.  Josh Smith (although he isn't a center) could have been that guy.  He can defend the post well enough, he's athletic enough to defend almost any position, and he's been one of the best shotblockers in the league over his entire career.  As a bonus he's also good for about 15-16 PPG and about 8-9 RPG which conveniently is about the same as we get from KG now.

As far as scorers go, a guy like Rudy Gay would have filled that hole nicely.  Somebody who can score in multiple ways (outside shot, good slasher, post up game, gets to the line, etc).

We don't need a Durant-sque 30 PPG guy, we just need somebody who is consistent and versatile enough to be a go-go guy on offense. 

Re: When you get 9 pts from the SG position, guess what? You lose.
« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2013, 07:53:36 AM »

Offline clover

  • Front Page Moderator
  • Paul Silas
  • ******
  • Posts: 6130
  • Tommy Points: 315
Bradley is still only 22, ended up shooting very well for them last year, is coming off close to a full year layoff, is either learning or filling in at a new position, is their leader on defense by playing an exhausting style, and by all accounts shoots very well in practice without it right now translating into games--something they saw early last year as well.

I'd say the 4 and 5 positions going forward are bigger questions than the 2.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2013, 08:45:30 AM by clover »

Re: When you get 9 pts from the SG position, guess what? You lose.
« Reply #6 on: March 21, 2013, 08:11:03 AM »

Offline pearljammer10

  • K.C. Jones
  • *************
  • Posts: 13129
  • Tommy Points: 885
Dont buy it. We lose (and lost) because no current Celtic can box out.

Re: When you get 9 pts from the SG position, guess what? You lose.
« Reply #7 on: March 21, 2013, 08:18:53 AM »

Offline kozlodoev

  • NCE
  • Kevin Garnett
  • *****************
  • Posts: 17914
  • Tommy Points: 1294
Dont buy it. We lose (and lost) because no current Celtic can box out.
We lost in particular because Garnett didn't box out on the last Hornets possession of the game. I understand he was trying to help on the penetration and everything, but come on...
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."

Re: When you get 9 pts from the SG position, guess what? You lose.
« Reply #8 on: March 21, 2013, 08:27:55 AM »

Offline pearljammer10

  • K.C. Jones
  • *************
  • Posts: 13129
  • Tommy Points: 885
Dont buy it. We lose (and lost) because no current Celtic can box out.
We lost in particular because Garnett didn't box out on the last Hornets possession of the game. I understand he was trying to help on the penetration and everything, but come on...

My point exactly. Just ball watching.

Re: When you get 9 pts from the SG position, guess what? You lose.
« Reply #9 on: March 21, 2013, 08:30:21 AM »

Offline kozlodoev

  • NCE
  • Kevin Garnett
  • *****************
  • Posts: 17914
  • Tommy Points: 1294
Dont buy it. We lose (and lost) because no current Celtic can box out.
We lost in particular because Garnett didn't box out on the last Hornets possession of the game. I understand he was trying to help on the penetration and everything, but come on...

My point exactly. Just ball watching.
I feel for Doc. After handing so many free wins to teams like the Hornets and the Bobcats, one would think our guys will learn that this are not the 2008 Celtics, and other teams won't just fold the moment they step on the floor. The inability to play hard in those games makes the team very hard to watch.
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."

Re: When you get 9 pts from the SG position, guess what? You lose.
« Reply #10 on: March 21, 2013, 10:07:14 AM »

Offline jgod213

  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2258
  • Tommy Points: 300
Our best shooting guard, also sometimes known as a "scoring guard" has averaged 10.3 points a game this year. Jason Terry has by any measure been a failure. Do not give me this nonsense about fitting in or not having the right system. This is a guy who has scored everywhere he has played. This is his lowest scoring average since his rookie year. The sad truth is we gambled on an old player and lost. Terry just got old. It happens.

Yep. Another sub-par game for JET, who is starting to become the focus of my blame-game party these days.

4 turnovers and 5 fouls against the heat, and no points mixed with 3 fouls and 2 turnovers against the Hornets last night.

I would LOVE to see JG start over Bass, but this is why Jeff Green needs to keep playing with the second unit.  Bradley and Terry have been poor in terms of playmaking (Terry w/ careless passes, Bradley not making the right decisions when driving).  Those two are at their best on the fast break/spotting up.  I'm quickly losing faith in Terry as a facilitator/playmaker.

DKC Utah Jazz
http://tinyurl.com/kqjb3cv

Starters:   Bledsoe-Gordon-Hayward-Patterson-Favors  | 6th-Kanter
Reserves: Warren-Hardaway-Plumlee-Larkin-Evans-Mbakwe-Huestis-Hummel-Calathes