Marc Stein "Boston exploring Josh Smith options"

[crimson_stallion]

Don't like his game.

Don't think his overall defense is game changing like KG or Bradley.

Don't think he can shoot better than Green or Bass.

Don't think he can contain LeBron significantly better than Green could.

He's made exactly the same number of All-Star games as Green and Bass.

Will almost assuredly get overpaid in July, just hope it isn't us.

In today's day and age of overvalued big men, Josh Smith is a genuine max contract guy.

Stop and have a think about what Perkins is making, what Omer Asik is making, and what Roy Hibbert is making in relation to their production.

Josh Smith is a guy that averages over 17 points, 8.5 rebounds, 4 assists, 1 steal and 2 blocks per game. He's the only guy in the NBA right now putting up those numbers across those 5 statistical areas, and he's been putting up those type of numbers for pretty much his entire career (his career stats are not far below).

His current field goal percentage (46%) and three point percentage (35%) are both actually slightly higher than what Jeff Green is putting up for us this season, and he's actually shooting 53% from the field and 47% from three over his last 10 games.

Yes Green is better from midrange, where he shoots 36% (versus 30% for Smith).  Josh Smith however is better inside, where he shoots 71% inside the restricted area (62% for Green) and 33% outside the restricted area (26% for Green).

Smith is also a stronger finisher, as he has only 29 Blocks-Against versus 37 for Green (despite Smith playing more minutes). 

Basically what it comes down to offensively is that Green is a better outside scorer, while Smith is a more effective scorer inside the paint.  Personally I think we could use more interior scoring, so I'd welcome Smith's skill with the higher percentage shots. 

Both guys get to the free throw line well.

Outside of Outside shooting and turnovers, Smith > Green in every statistical area including rebounding and shotblocking - two areas where we could really use a boost.

I love Green right now with the way he's been playing, but it's hard to see Smith as anything but an upgrade.  Not a massive upgrade, but a significant one.   

[Celtics4ever]

This guy is better than Green, I think he has posted all star numbers but he has that Antione Walker inefficiency granted.  He is a better rebounder and scorer.  Neither are knockout shooters and both are good shot blockers but one has to give the nod to Smith on BPG.  Smith is a better passer than peeps realize, think of Antione Walker with jumping ability.  He is a mediocre albeit streaky shooter and TO prone.



    Ranks #26 in the NBA in Points Per Game (17.4)
    Ranks #22 in the NBA in Rebounds Per Game (8.6)
    Ranks #39 in the NBA in Assists Per Game (4.1)
    Ranks #40 in the NBA in Steals Per Game (1.23)
    Ranks #7 in the NBA in Blocks Per Game (2.15)
    Ranks #27 in the NBA in Minutes Per Game (35.7)
    Ranks #40 in the NBA in Minutes Played (1714)
    Ranks #18 in the NBA in Field Goals Made (348)
    Ranks #24 in the NBA in Field Goal Attempts (756)
    Ranks #38 in the NBA in Free Throw Attempts (194)
    Ranks #24 in the NBA in Defensive Rebounds (321)
    Ranks #15 in the NBA in Defensive Rebounds Per Game (6.7)
    Ranks #23 in the NBA in Total Rebounds (414)
    Ranks #49 in the NBA in Assists (195)
    Ranks #48 in the NBA in Steals (59)

[crimson_stallion]

Plus, I'd kinda like a guy who can do stuff like this on a consistent basis:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2zqhvBc_NO4

We really haven't had that type of shotblocking presence since we had KG and Perk together, and we could use a guy who can energise the crowd the way J-Smooth can with some of those kinda of plays and putbacks.

If we had any chance at all of getting him without giving up Rondo, Bradley, Pierce or KG then I think adding him to that group gives us one of the most dominant starting lineups in the league until after KG and Pierce retire, at which point their payroll comes off the books and we can use that $20M or so to sign a max contract guy to pair with Rondo, Bradley and Smith.

I really feel like we need a young energy guy to allow us to run other teams into the ground, and even this year a lineup of AB, Lee, T-Wil, Smith and Wilcox could be one of the most athletic lineups in the league. 

Plus unlike any of our current small bigs, Josh Smith could probably actually play center pretty decently if we ever go small.  His good touch around the basket, nice hands, good passing ability, solid rebounding and excellent shotblocking means he could probably go small with Smith at the 5 (as Doc loves to do). 

In a small ball lineup I don't think Smith would have any trouble at all defending smaller fives like Bosh.  He has the length and muscle to bother Bosh in the post, yet he has the speed and quickness to get out and challenge his jumpers. 

A frontline of KG and Josh Smith could be one of the best defensive and passing frontlines in the NBA, and it'd be a pretty good rebounding one too (~ 15 RPG between them).  Not likely to be many easy baskets with those guys protecting the rim.

The sad part for us is that a lineup of Green/Smith/Garnett is actually probably stronger for us than Pierce/Smith/Garnett.

A lineup of Bradley, Lee, Green, Smith and Garnett would make out defense absolutely suffocating, and it would be probably one of the best lineups in the league when it comes to the ability to defend the pick and roll (all those guys can defend multiple positions) and the ability to get out to shooters (all of those guys are quick and athletic for their position). 

We would lack a little in the way of scoring without Pierce (plus it would kill me to see him go) but on a per36 minute basis that starting lineup is still good for about 75 points per game going off their current averages.

It makes out bench a little thin though, and we'd need Terry and T-Will to play 6MOTY type basketball.   

[SHAQATTACK]

like him, long as KG and pierce stay .   

[kozlodoev]

This guy is better than Green, I think he has posted all star numbers but he has that Antione Walker inefficiency granted.  He is a better rebounder and scorer.  Neither are knockout shooters and both are good shot blockers but one has to give the nod to Smith on BPG.  Smith is a better passer than peeps realize, think of Antione Walker with jumping ability.  He is a mediocre albeit streaky shooter and TO prone.



    Ranks #26 in the NBA in Points Per Game (17.4)
    Ranks #22 in the NBA in Rebounds Per Game (8.6)
    Ranks #39 in the NBA in Assists Per Game (4.1)
    Ranks #40 in the NBA in Steals Per Game (1.23)
    Ranks #7 in the NBA in Blocks Per Game (2.15)
    Ranks #27 in the NBA in Minutes Per Game (35.7)
    Ranks #40 in the NBA in Minutes Played (1714)
    Ranks #18 in the NBA in Field Goals Made (348)
    Ranks #24 in the NBA in Field Goal Attempts (756)
    Ranks #38 in the NBA in Free Throw Attempts (194)
    Ranks #24 in the NBA in Defensive Rebounds (321)
    Ranks #15 in the NBA in Defensive Rebounds Per Game (6.7)
    Ranks #23 in the NBA in Total Rebounds (414)
    Ranks #49 in the NBA in Assists (195)
    Ranks #48 in the NBA in Steals (59)

He also projects to be twice as expensive as Green.

[rsmrostov]

wrong attitude, not a great shooter, over-sized for SF, good enough do defend PF?

[crimson_stallion]

wrong attitude, not a great shooter, over-sized for SF, good enough do defend PF?

1. Rondo has the same problem, but how much do we love him here?

2. Neither is Green, or Bass, or Lee.  We are not a team filled with good shooters...we are a team sprinkled with passable shooters (which Smith is). 

3. So is Lebron (oversized for a SF), but I don't hear Miami fans complaining.  Josh Smith is an athletic freak and is not far off Lebron in terms of his physical talents.

4. He can defend PF's at least as well as Lebron can, probably better due to his superior extra height and superior shotblocking.  We had Big Baby spending how much time at the center spot, and he didn't do too badly.  Smith is (IMO) a far superior defensive player then Big Baby against bigger opponents due to his height, length, athleticism and shotblocking ability.

[JBcat]

Bass, Lee, Melo, and a first is as far as I will go in going after him.  Start both Pierce and Green at the wing spots for the rest of year, and we'll have to sign 2 additional players off the scrap heap.

[SHAQATTACK]

This guy is better than Green, I think he has posted all star numbers but he has that Antione Walker inefficiency granted.  He is a better rebounder and scorer.  Neither are knockout shooters and both are good shot blockers but one has to give the nod to Smith on BPG.  Smith is a better passer than peeps realize, think of Antione Walker with jumping ability.  He is a mediocre albeit streaky shooter and TO prone.



    Ranks #26 in the NBA in Points Per Game (17.4)
    Ranks #22 in the NBA in Rebounds Per Game (8.6)
    Ranks #39 in the NBA in Assists Per Game (4.1)
    Ranks #40 in the NBA in Steals Per Game (1.23)
    Ranks #7 in the NBA in Blocks Per Game (2.15)
    Ranks #27 in the NBA in Minutes Per Game (35.7)
    Ranks #40 in the NBA in Minutes Played (1714)
    Ranks #18 in the NBA in Field Goals Made (348)
    Ranks #24 in the NBA in Field Goal Attempts (756)
    Ranks #38 in the NBA in Free Throw Attempts (194)
    Ranks #24 in the NBA in Defensive Rebounds (321)
    Ranks #15 in the NBA in Defensive Rebounds Per Game (6.7)
    Ranks #23 in the NBA in Total Rebounds (414)
    Ranks #49 in the NBA in Assists (195)
    Ranks #48 in the NBA in Steals (59)

He also projects to be twice as expensive as Green.

good point,  and will he be twice as productive ? 

Smith is alot of bling

[rsmrostov]

wrong attitude, not a great shooter, over-sized for SF, good enough do defend PF?

1. Rondo has the same problem, but how much do we love him here?

2. Neither is Green, or Bass, or Lee.  We are not a team filled with good shooters...we are a team sprinkled with passable shooters (which Smith is). 

3. So is Lebron (oversized for a SF), but I don't hear Miami fans complaining.  Josh Smith is an athletic freak and is not far off Lebron in terms of his physical talents.

4. He can defend PF's at least as well as Lebron can, probably better due to his superior extra height and superior shotblocking.  We had Big Baby spending how much time at the center spot, and he didn't do too badly.  Smith is (IMO) a far superior defensive player then Big Baby against bigger opponents due to his height, length, athleticism and shotblocking ability.

some most love Rondo, I can't stand him.

[GreenEnvy]

Don't like his game.

Don't think his overall defense is game changing like KG or Bradley.

Don't think he can shoot better than Green or Bass.

Don't think he can contain LeBron significantly better than Green could.

He's made exactly the same number of All-Star games as Green and Bass.

Will almost assuredly get overpaid in July, just hope it isn't us.

In today's day and age of overvalued big men, Josh Smith is a genuine max contract guy.

Stop and have a think about what Perkins is making, what Omer Asik is making, and what Roy Hibbert is making in relation to their production.

Josh Smith is a guy that averages over 17 points, 8.5 rebounds, 4 assists, 1 steal and 2 blocks per game. He's the only guy in the NBA right now putting up those numbers across those 5 statistical areas, and he's been putting up those type of numbers for pretty much his entire career (his career stats are not far below).

His current field goal percentage (46%) and three point percentage (35%) are both actually slightly higher than what Jeff Green is putting up for us this season, and he's actually shooting 53% from the field and 47% from three over his last 10 games.

Yes Green is better from midrange, where he shoots 36% (versus 30% for Smith).  Josh Smith however is better inside, where he shoots 71% inside the restricted area (62% for Green) and 33% outside the restricted area (26% for Green).

Smith is also a stronger finisher, as he has only 29 Blocks-Against versus 37 for Green (despite Smith playing more minutes). 

Basically what it comes down to offensively is that Green is a better outside scorer, while Smith is a more effective scorer inside the paint.  Personally I think we could use more interior scoring, so I'd welcome Smith's skill with the higher percentage shots. 

Both guys get to the free throw line well.

Outside of Outside shooting and turnovers, Smith > Green in every statistical area including rebounding and shotblocking - two areas where we could really use a boost.

I love Green right now with the way he's been playing, but it's hard to see Smith as anything but an upgrade.  Not a massive upgrade, but a significant one.

The guy is a career 29% shooter from 3 and 66% from the line. He is not a good shooter. He routinely takes questionable shots.

He is a good player at $11 million. He is virtually untradable (hey if Joe Johnson at $20+M can get moved anyone can) at $17 million.

I don't want to get tied down to his contract for the next 4-5 seasons. I could live with it if we kept Pierce AND Green (because we would still be able to compete for as long as KG continues to lace em up), but that won't happen.

He is the PF version of Rondo. I am not crazy about the PG version of Rondo, but at least he is on a value contract. Can't wait til Rondo gets his next contract and he gets wildly overpaid by us. Just hope Smith isn't here for that duo to take up half our cap.

[reelbig4]

Don't know if it posted, from Jared Sullinger facebook page, So here is the planned out trade:
Boston Gets: Josh Smith, Anthony Morrow, 2nd round pick from Atlanta
Atlanta Gets: JJ Hickson, Fab Melo, Wes Mathews, 1st round pick from Boston, 1st round pick from Portland
Portland Gets: Courtney Lee, Brandon Bass, Devin Harris, 2nd round pick from Boston, 2nd round pick from Atlanta!~ZM13*

[Onslaught]

I'll keep this short. I don't like him at all.

[sofutomygaha]

#1 Smith will get a max deal next year

#2 The Celtics won't give him a max deal

#3 The Celtics are somehow still in the running

----> NO ONE is willing to give up both assets and max money for Smith

----> Atlanta ain't getting much for Smith

I think Smith is headed to a contender, and the Hawks are going to get weak sauce in return. It might well be us, and it might be our sauce.

but oh noes I do not want us to even think about re-signing him for max money

[wdleehi]

I don't mind the idea of Smith for the rest of this season (as long as it doesn't cost Pierce or KG)



I am completely against the long term max or near max contract. 



In half a season, he is a bonus to this team and can push them to the next level. 



After that, the more money he makes, the harder it becomes to get this team it's next star, the more his warts (and almost all players have them) become uglier and uglier.