Author Topic: Josh Smith an elite defender?  (Read 2350 times)

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Re: Josh Smith an elite defender?
« Reply #30 on: February 16, 2013, 04:17:18 PM »

Offline Celtics18

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Wow! I must be really missing something here. How can a knucklehead like Smith who may have outstanding athleticism contribute to a team defense concept that has taken many players more than a half season to master. Just because Smith can block shots does not make him a great team defender.

Smith and Rondo both are great athletes that can play good defense if they want to; but they often just don't. To call Smith an elite defender when he has shown such a clear lack of discipline this season is a stretch. Kind of like saying Rondo is an elite defender.

Rondo is an elite defender. 

Re: Josh Smith an elite defender?
« Reply #31 on: February 16, 2013, 04:57:57 PM »

Offline gar

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Like I said. Can't have a discussion about what it means to be an elite defender if it just hear say. Also the point is how Smith would fit with the Celtics system which values team defense and not individual athletic prowess which may or may not add up to great defense. It is a mind set and is more than steals or blocks.

Re: Josh Smith an elite defender?
« Reply #32 on: February 16, 2013, 04:59:47 PM »

Offline gar

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Also when Rondo plays with Garnett he can gamble. When he plays with anyone else it exposes his weakness as a defender which is that he simply does not stay in front of his man.

Re: Josh Smith an elite defender?
« Reply #33 on: February 16, 2013, 05:11:31 PM »

Offline BballTim

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Also when Rondo plays with Garnett he can gamble. When he plays with anyone else it exposes his weakness as a defender which is that he simply does not stay in front of his man.

  Rondo generally does a good job staying in front of his man. It' not a weakness of his, they normally need a pick to get past him. A lot of people think Rondo's never supposed to gamble, I don't think that's the case at all.

Re: Josh Smith an elite defender?
« Reply #34 on: February 16, 2013, 06:15:07 PM »

Offline dreamgreen

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I don;t know if he is or not, but he would be much better than Bass and would be our best rebounder, something we need badly.

Re: Josh Smith an elite defender?
« Reply #35 on: February 16, 2013, 06:17:58 PM »

Offline CelticsFan9

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Wow! I must be really missing something here. How can a knucklehead like Smith who may have outstanding athleticism contribute to a team defense concept that has taken many players more than a half season to master. Just because Smith can block shots does not make him a great team defender.

Smith and Rondo both are great athletes that can play good defense if they want to; but they often just don't. To call Smith an elite defender when he has shown such a clear lack of discipline this season is a stretch. Kind of like saying Rondo is an elite defender.

Rondo is an elite defender when he wants to be one.

Fixed it for you.

Re: Josh Smith an elite defender?
« Reply #36 on: February 16, 2013, 06:34:19 PM »

Offline Celtics18

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Wow! I must be really missing something here. How can a knucklehead like Smith who may have outstanding athleticism contribute to a team defense concept that has taken many players more than a half season to master. Just because Smith can block shots does not make him a great team defender.

Smith and Rondo both are great athletes that can play good defense if they want to; but they often just don't. To call Smith an elite defender when he has shown such a clear lack of discipline this season is a stretch. Kind of like saying Rondo is an elite defender.

Rondo is an elite defender when he wants to be one.

Fixed it for you.

Which is way more often than he's given credit for.

Re: Josh Smith an elite defender?
« Reply #37 on: February 16, 2013, 06:40:00 PM »

Offline CelticsFan9

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Wow! I must be really missing something here. How can a knucklehead like Smith who may have outstanding athleticism contribute to a team defense concept that has taken many players more than a half season to master. Just because Smith can block shots does not make him a great team defender.

Smith and Rondo both are great athletes that can play good defense if they want to; but they often just don't. To call Smith an elite defender when he has shown such a clear lack of discipline this season is a stretch. Kind of like saying Rondo is an elite defender.

Rondo is an elite defender when he wants to be one.

Fixed it for you.

Which is way more often than he's given credit for.

I don't know, it's pretty frustrating to watch Rondo reach and play passing lanes a lot and fail to come up with a steal.  But I guess I can give him benefit of the doubt because he does rack up a bunch of steals.

To me, what's unforgivable is watching him fail to even try to get over screens.  I have yelled at my TV when I see Rondo just lackadaisically run into a screen and pretend like it's the Great Wall of China.  I hate when he does that.

Re: Josh Smith an elite defender?
« Reply #38 on: February 16, 2013, 06:50:35 PM »

Offline Celtics18

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Wow! I must be really missing something here. How can a knucklehead like Smith who may have outstanding athleticism contribute to a team defense concept that has taken many players more than a half season to master. Just because Smith can block shots does not make him a great team defender.

Smith and Rondo both are great athletes that can play good defense if they want to; but they often just don't. To call Smith an elite defender when he has shown such a clear lack of discipline this season is a stretch. Kind of like saying Rondo is an elite defender.

Rondo is an elite defender when he wants to be one.

Fixed it for you.

Which is way more often than he's given credit for.

I don't know, it's pretty frustrating to watch Rondo reach and play passing lanes a lot and fail to come up with a steal.  But I guess I can give him benefit of the doubt because he does rack up a bunch of steals.

To me, what's unforgivable is watching him fail to even try to get over screens.  I have yelled at my TV when I see Rondo just lackadaisically run into a screen and pretend like it's the Great Wall of China.  I hate when he does that.

I've yelled at my TV when I've seen players get in the lane and watched Kevin Garnett not even attempt to make a play. 

Now, I'll willingly admit that Kevin Garnett is the best defender I've ever seen play, but the above is a true story and it's happened on more than one occasion. 

I'm just trying to help put things into perspective. 

Re: Josh Smith an elite defender?
« Reply #39 on: February 16, 2013, 06:55:22 PM »

Offline CelticsFan9

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Wow! I must be really missing something here. How can a knucklehead like Smith who may have outstanding athleticism contribute to a team defense concept that has taken many players more than a half season to master. Just because Smith can block shots does not make him a great team defender.

Smith and Rondo both are great athletes that can play good defense if they want to; but they often just don't. To call Smith an elite defender when he has shown such a clear lack of discipline this season is a stretch. Kind of like saying Rondo is an elite defender.

Rondo is an elite defender when he wants to be one.

Fixed it for you.

Which is way more often than he's given credit for.

I don't know, it's pretty frustrating to watch Rondo reach and play passing lanes a lot and fail to come up with a steal.  But I guess I can give him benefit of the doubt because he does rack up a bunch of steals.

To me, what's unforgivable is watching him fail to even try to get over screens.  I have yelled at my TV when I see Rondo just lackadaisically run into a screen and pretend like it's the Great Wall of China.  I hate when he does that.

I've yelled at my TV when I've seen players get in the lane and watched Kevin Garnett not even attempt to make a play. 

Now, I'll willingly admit that Kevin Garnett is the best defender I've ever seen play, but the above is a true story and it's happened on more than one occasion. 

I'm just trying to help put things into perspective.

Well played.  TP.

In KG's defense, he's not 26 and super athletic.  And at least KG doesn't take entire games off like Rondo is prone to doing.  The times when KG has bad games are primarily because he just can't being it every night like he used to.  The same cannot be said for Rondo.

Re: Josh Smith an elite defender?
« Reply #40 on: February 16, 2013, 06:59:48 PM »

Offline Meadowlark_Scal

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Finally a trade i agree with Josh smith for bass and green...now that is a good idea...keep rondo....you got the present, and the future....get sully back..a solid inside rebounder, bradley.....you got a team with a present and a future...! MeadowLark_Scal approves this message...!

Re: Josh Smith an elite defender?
« Reply #41 on: February 16, 2013, 07:10:54 PM »

Offline Celtics18

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Wow! I must be really missing something here. How can a knucklehead like Smith who may have outstanding athleticism contribute to a team defense concept that has taken many players more than a half season to master. Just because Smith can block shots does not make him a great team defender.

Smith and Rondo both are great athletes that can play good defense if they want to; but they often just don't. To call Smith an elite defender when he has shown such a clear lack of discipline this season is a stretch. Kind of like saying Rondo is an elite defender.

Rondo is an elite defender when he wants to be one.

Fixed it for you.

Which is way more often than he's given credit for.

I don't know, it's pretty frustrating to watch Rondo reach and play passing lanes a lot and fail to come up with a steal.  But I guess I can give him benefit of the doubt because he does rack up a bunch of steals.

To me, what's unforgivable is watching him fail to even try to get over screens.  I have yelled at my TV when I see Rondo just lackadaisically run into a screen and pretend like it's the Great Wall of China.  I hate when he does that.

I've yelled at my TV when I've seen players get in the lane and watched Kevin Garnett not even attempt to make a play. 

Now, I'll willingly admit that Kevin Garnett is the best defender I've ever seen play, but the above is a true story and it's happened on more than one occasion. 

I'm just trying to help put things into perspective.

Well played.  TP.

In KG's defense, he's not 26 and super athletic.  And at least KG doesn't take entire games off like Rondo is prone to doing.  The times when KG has bad games are primarily because he just can't being it every night like he used to.  The same cannot be said for Rondo.

Despite reading about it constantly here on CelticsBlog, I have never seen Rondo take an entire game off (not one in which he was actually playing, that is).

 

Re: Josh Smith an elite defender?
« Reply #42 on: February 16, 2013, 07:18:41 PM »

Offline CelticsFan9

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Wow! I must be really missing something here. How can a knucklehead like Smith who may have outstanding athleticism contribute to a team defense concept that has taken many players more than a half season to master. Just because Smith can block shots does not make him a great team defender.

Smith and Rondo both are great athletes that can play good defense if they want to; but they often just don't. To call Smith an elite defender when he has shown such a clear lack of discipline this season is a stretch. Kind of like saying Rondo is an elite defender.

Rondo is an elite defender when he wants to be one.

Fixed it for you.

Which is way more often than he's given credit for.

I don't know, it's pretty frustrating to watch Rondo reach and play passing lanes a lot and fail to come up with a steal.  But I guess I can give him benefit of the doubt because he does rack up a bunch of steals.

To me, what's unforgivable is watching him fail to even try to get over screens.  I have yelled at my TV when I see Rondo just lackadaisically run into a screen and pretend like it's the Great Wall of China.  I hate when he does that.

I've yelled at my TV when I've seen players get in the lane and watched Kevin Garnett not even attempt to make a play. 

Now, I'll willingly admit that Kevin Garnett is the best defender I've ever seen play, but the above is a true story and it's happened on more than one occasion. 

I'm just trying to help put things into perspective.

Well played.  TP.

In KG's defense, he's not 26 and super athletic.  And at least KG doesn't take entire games off like Rondo is prone to doing.  The times when KG has bad games are primarily because he just can't being it every night like he used to.  The same cannot be said for Rondo.

Despite reading about it constantly here on CelticsBlog, I have never seen Rondo take an entire game off (not one in which he was actually playing, that is).

 

Eh, agree to disagree.

Sure, every game Rondo makes some outstanding play, but I've watched maybe 5 or 6 games where Rondo is on cruise control from start-to-finish.  Then you add in countless other games when he plays great for a quarter or two and then checks out.  One of those games that I'll never forget is game 4 vs. Philly last year, when we started the game up like 20-4 with Rondo faking behind-the-back passes and scoring at will, and then in the second half he did basically nothing and we lost.  That game really ticked me off big time.

Re: Josh Smith an elite defender?
« Reply #43 on: February 16, 2013, 07:27:47 PM »

Offline Celtics18

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Wow! I must be really missing something here. How can a knucklehead like Smith who may have outstanding athleticism contribute to a team defense concept that has taken many players more than a half season to master. Just because Smith can block shots does not make him a great team defender.

Smith and Rondo both are great athletes that can play good defense if they want to; but they often just don't. To call Smith an elite defender when he has shown such a clear lack of discipline this season is a stretch. Kind of like saying Rondo is an elite defender.

Rondo is an elite defender when he wants to be one.

Fixed it for you.

Which is way more often than he's given credit for.

I don't know, it's pretty frustrating to watch Rondo reach and play passing lanes a lot and fail to come up with a steal.  But I guess I can give him benefit of the doubt because he does rack up a bunch of steals.

To me, what's unforgivable is watching him fail to even try to get over screens.  I have yelled at my TV when I see Rondo just lackadaisically run into a screen and pretend like it's the Great Wall of China.  I hate when he does that.

I've yelled at my TV when I've seen players get in the lane and watched Kevin Garnett not even attempt to make a play. 

Now, I'll willingly admit that Kevin Garnett is the best defender I've ever seen play, but the above is a true story and it's happened on more than one occasion. 

I'm just trying to help put things into perspective.

Well played.  TP.

In KG's defense, he's not 26 and super athletic.  And at least KG doesn't take entire games off like Rondo is prone to doing.  The times when KG has bad games are primarily because he just can't being it every night like he used to.  The same cannot be said for Rondo.

Despite reading about it constantly here on CelticsBlog, I have never seen Rondo take an entire game off (not one in which he was actually playing, that is).

 

Eh, agree to disagree.

Sure, every game Rondo makes some outstanding play, but I've watched maybe 5 or 6 games where Rondo is on cruise control from start-to-finish.  Then you add in countless other games when he plays great for a quarter or two and then checks out.  One of those games that I'll never forget is game 4 vs. Philly last year, when we started the game up like 20-4 with Rondo faking behind-the-back passes and scoring at will, and then in the second half he did basically nothing and we lost.  That game really ticked me off big time.

That's just an example of the selective viewing which I feel goes on in regards to Rondo.  Do you really see anyone in the NBA ever control a game from start to finish for every minute they are on the floor? 

I don't see it very often, not even from the likes of Lebron James and Kevin Durant. 

I understand having high standards for our young, rising star, but the expectations set for him are simply too unrealistic.  Then, when he doesn't reach the unrealistic expectations set for him, fans start calling him lazy and disinterested.

What I do know is that he's shown countless times that he is indeed an elite level talent in the NBA.  I'd be careful about tossing that kind of talent away.  If we do, it could come back to bite us. 

Re: Josh Smith an elite defender?
« Reply #44 on: February 16, 2013, 08:17:34 PM »

Offline BballTim

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Wow! I must be really missing something here. How can a knucklehead like Smith who may have outstanding athleticism contribute to a team defense concept that has taken many players more than a half season to master. Just because Smith can block shots does not make him a great team defender.

Smith and Rondo both are great athletes that can play good defense if they want to; but they often just don't. To call Smith an elite defender when he has shown such a clear lack of discipline this season is a stretch. Kind of like saying Rondo is an elite defender.

Rondo is an elite defender when he wants to be one.

Fixed it for you.

Which is way more often than he's given credit for.

I don't know, it's pretty frustrating to watch Rondo reach and play passing lanes a lot and fail to come up with a steal.  But I guess I can give him benefit of the doubt because he does rack up a bunch of steals.

  I guess you should get a note to Doc and tell him to have Rondo play defense the way *you* want him to and stick to his man like glue instead of disrupting opposing offenses by playing the passing lanes.
 

 

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