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[vinnie]

you're a known rondo detractor. the team and franchise and his play put him on this pedestal...he earned it. team will be fine until the playoffs where they have absolutely no shot

This. Although Rondo has been terrible in the playoffs (insert sarcasm sound). I honestly cannot take it anymore. I think I have to leave here forever because the stuff I am reading is literally hurting my head,

[vinnie]

Whether Celtics are different or better without Rondo, the point is this team does not skip a beat when he is out

We have all seen Pierce looking old this season. If he just plays the point guard position the whole game, he'll have an advantage over anyone that guards him. Pierce whos not even a point guard can rack up triple doubles just like Rondo, So Rondo's stat line must not be that unique or impressive. Not saying Rondo sucks, but it does say something

It means this team is talented and has offensive weapons, which any point guard can take advantage of to be effective. Especially if a replacement point guard can score as well as facilitate offense, how would we be worse off without Rondo for the playoffs? And for all of the Rondo classic playoff moments, there is at least the same number of playoff games where he's no where to be found with no impact on the game, a turnover machine, or letting an average point guard score 30 on him. (Game 5 2012 EFC against the Heat surely rings a bell with him coming up small in the post-season). And many other examples where he played horribly

Actually no, I don't remember that. What I do remember is Rondo scoring 9 points in the final 3 minutes of game 7 against the Sixers to advance to the ECF (ending the game with 18/10/10), while Pierce was fouled out on the bench. I also recall him putting up 22 points, 10 rebounds, and 14 assists in game 7 of the ECF against the Heat and was the only Celtic able to score in the last six minutes of the game, while Chris Bosh and Lebron James continuously burned us every time down the floor. Then of course there was game 2 where he played every second of the game, putting up 44/10/8 while scoring all 12 of Boston's points in overtime. In game 6 he was the only player to keep us even remotely close to the Heat, scoring 21 points while the "Big 3" combined for just 31.

For the series he averaged 20.9pts, 11.3ast, 7rbs, .700FT%, .488FG%, and was the leading scorer for the Celtics and the 2nd best rebounder. (Then you have our "scorers" in Pierce who averaged 19ppg on .344FG% and Ray who averaged 11.9ppg on .377FG%; their opponents, Lebron and Wade, combined for 55ppg on .480FG%)

Meanwhile, Chalmers scored more than 14 points exactly once against Rondo, and that was in game 2 when he had 22 points to Rajon's 44. On the series he averaged only 12ppg, 4.6ast, 3.1rbs, .591FT% .310-3pt%, and .456FG% in 38min.

For the entire 2012 playoffs (among players with 500+ minutes) he was 7th in OWS, 3rd in DWS (behind Lebron and KG), tied for 3rd best PER and defensive rating, 5th in WS/48, 8th in total points, and was easily the best rebounding guard.

But yeah, keep on believing that Rondo's a terrible playoff performer who is easily replaceable with any average point guard in the NBA.

Great post, but why bother? The Rondo haters are never going to listen to any facts.

[eugen]

you're a known rondo detractor. the team and franchise and his play put him on this pedestal...he earned it. team will be fine until the playoffs where they have absolutely no shot

This. Although Rondo has been terrible in the playoffs (insert sarcasm sound). I honestly cannot take it anymore. I think I have to leave here forever because the stuff I am reading is literally hurting my head,

Tell me when Rondo has been important the playoff?? Any stats?

[wahz]

We have an ex point guard as a head coach. Its not some amazing mystery to me this coach hasn't cared about adding a genuine point guard behind him all these years and instead has marched through guys who can dribble but can shoot the ball.

Honestly I am going to really be shocked if they add a point guard. They know better, imho.

[KGs Knee]

I'll tell you what, I'll play along for just one brief moment.  Maybe the team will play better without Rondo for a period of time.

The one thing I've noticed this year is that most all of the players on this team seem to defer to Rondo, even KG/Pierce to a point.  They've become dependant on his exceptional play-making ability.  As a result, it seems the effectiveness of these other players is entirely tied to how well Rondo plays in any particular game. On the whole, it may, at times, actually be a detriment to the individual games of the rest of the roster in some aspects.

This is absolutely NOT Rondo's fault, however.  It is the fault of the coaching staff and the other players on the roster.  These are highly paid professionals.  It is inexcusable they rely so heavily on one player to "pick them up".

So, going forward, maybe now that the teams security blanket is gone, they'll be forced to sink or swim on thier own, and have to pick up their play.  It happens in sports all the time.  The "lead dog" goes down and the troops rally.

At the end of the day though, in basketball a team only can go as far as it's best player can take it.  Point blank, Rondo is this teams best player.  There will be no title coming to Boston this year.  Which at the end of the day, is really all that matters here in Boston. Or at least that seems to be the company line.

[OsirusCeltics]

Whether Celtics are different or better without Rondo, the point is this team does not skip a beat when he is out

We have all seen Pierce looking old this season. If he just plays the point guard position the whole game, he'll have an advantage over anyone that guards him. Pierce whos not even a point guard can rack up triple doubles just like Rondo, So Rondo's stat line must not be that unique or impressive. Not saying Rondo sucks, but it does say something

It means this team is talented and has offensive weapons, which any point guard can take advantage of to be effective. Especially if a replacement point guard can score as well as facilitate offense, how would we be worse off without Rondo for the playoffs? And for all of the Rondo classic playoff moments, there is at least the same number of playoff games where he's no where to be found with no impact on the game, a turnover machine, or letting an average point guard score 30 on him. (Game 5 2012 EFC against the Heat surely rings a bell with him coming up small in the post-season). And many other examples where he played horribly

  I don't remember a ton about game 5 vs the Heat. From the box score it looks like Rondo had a weak shooting game. It also looks like he played all but 4 minutes of that game and the Celts were a -7 in those 4 minutes.

  But Rondo's played 92 playoff games in his career, let me know how many you can find where someone scored 30 on Rondo.

From Louis Williams to Jameer Nelson to Billups to Mo Williams. Too many scored or neared 30 on Rondo
Everyone has their bad playoff games, so I wont blame that on Rondo. But for all the accolades fans want to praise on Rondo's playoff moments, he has just as many horrible playoff games that cost the Celtics a chance to win. And if he is the leader of the team, he should be the leader in taking responsibility

His playoff games when he dominated are almost equal to playoff games when he was non-existent and had no impact on the game. I'm sure Celtics can find a guard (Or maybe already on the team) that can be more consistent than that

[D.o.s.]

Whether or not we'll bring back Banner 18, make the Finals, make the ECF, get swept in the first round, or miss the playoffs entirely remains to be seen. Games aren't played by prediction.


But a year without Rondo is a serious bummer any way you slice it. Season-ending injuries to unique/great/good players suck.

[BballTim]

Whether Celtics are different or better without Rondo, the point is this team does not skip a beat when he is out

We have all seen Pierce looking old this season. If he just plays the point guard position the whole game, he'll have an advantage over anyone that guards him. Pierce whos not even a point guard can rack up triple doubles just like Rondo, So Rondo's stat line must not be that unique or impressive. Not saying Rondo sucks, but it does say something

It means this team is talented and has offensive weapons, which any point guard can take advantage of to be effective. Especially if a replacement point guard can score as well as facilitate offense, how would we be worse off without Rondo for the playoffs? And for all of the Rondo classic playoff moments, there is at least the same number of playoff games where he's no where to be found with no impact on the game, a turnover machine, or letting an average point guard score 30 on him. (Game 5 2012 EFC against the Heat surely rings a bell with him coming up small in the post-season). And many other examples where he played horribly

  I don't remember a ton about game 5 vs the Heat. From the box score it looks like Rondo had a weak shooting game. It also looks like he played all but 4 minutes of that game and the Celts were a -7 in those 4 minutes.

  But Rondo's played 92 playoff games in his career, let me know how many you can find where someone scored 30 on Rondo.

From Louis Williams to Jameer Nelson to Billups to Mo Williams. Too many scored or neared 30 on Rondo
Everyone has their bad playoff games, so I wont blame that on Rondo. But for all the accolades fans want to praise on Rondo's playoff moments, he has just as many horrible playoff games that cost the Celtics a chance to win. And if he is the leader of the team, he should be the leader in taking responsibility

His playoff games when he dominated are almost equal to playoff games when he was non-existent and had no impact on the game. I'm sure Celtics can find a guard (Or maybe already on the team) that can be more consistent than that

  Okay, so we now have a list of players who never scored 30 against Rondo in the playoffs (well, them and the rest of the point guards in the nba). Rondo doesn't have tons of playoff games where he disappears, maybe you're remembering them the way you're remembering all the games where he gave up 30 points to average point guards.

[OsirusCeltics]

Whether Celtics are different or better without Rondo, the point is this team does not skip a beat when he is out

We have all seen Pierce looking old this season. If he just plays the point guard position the whole game, he'll have an advantage over anyone that guards him. Pierce whos not even a point guard can rack up triple doubles just like Rondo, So Rondo's stat line must not be that unique or impressive. Not saying Rondo sucks, but it does say something

It means this team is talented and has offensive weapons, which any point guard can take advantage of to be effective. Especially if a replacement point guard can score as well as facilitate offense, how would we be worse off without Rondo for the playoffs? And for all of the Rondo classic playoff moments, there is at least the same number of playoff games where he's no where to be found with no impact on the game, a turnover machine, or letting an average point guard score 30 on him. (Game 5 2012 EFC against the Heat surely rings a bell with him coming up small in the post-season). And many other examples where he played horribly

  I don't remember a ton about game 5 vs the Heat. From the box score it looks like Rondo had a weak shooting game. It also looks like he played all but 4 minutes of that game and the Celts were a -7 in those 4 minutes.

  But Rondo's played 92 playoff games in his career, let me know how many you can find where someone scored 30 on Rondo.

From Louis Williams to Jameer Nelson to Billups to Mo Williams. Too many scored or neared 30 on Rondo
Everyone has their bad playoff games, so I wont blame that on Rondo. But for all the accolades fans want to praise on Rondo's playoff moments, he has just as many horrible playoff games that cost the Celtics a chance to win. And if he is the leader of the team, he should be the leader in taking responsibility

His playoff games when he dominated are almost equal to playoff games when he was non-existent and had no impact on the game. I'm sure Celtics can find a guard (Or maybe already on the team) that can be more consistent than that

  Okay, so we now have a list of players who never scored 30 against Rondo in the playoffs (well, them and the rest of the point guards in the nba). Rondo doesn't have tons of playoff games where he disappears, maybe you're remembering them the way you're remembering all the games where he gave up 30 points to average point guards.

2009- Game 7 2nd round against the Magic. Played horribly and cost the Celtics the game. Wasn't pushing the offense causing turnovers. His play made Ainge blast him in the media
- Couple of games in the Bulls 1st round series where Rose outplayed him


2008- Game 5 EFC against the Pistons. People questioning if Sam Cassell should start instead

2010- Game 7 NBA Finals. NIce stat line, but no where to be found. Stopped driving the ball, passed when open. Lakers played 4 on 5 and made the Celtics easier to defend

2012- Game 6 against the Sixers, looked out of the game. DIdn't drive, dribbled the ball too much till the offense got stagnant, etc.

-Game 5 against the Heat. Caused turnovers, passed the ball too many times when he was wide open, lack of shooting caused Heat to play 5 on 4, horrible defense. Missed a chance to close out the Heat at home


Not sure if there's more, but these are the ones I member off head. And all of those games were pivitol important games. He's a good player, but his "godly playoff dominance" is overblown

[kgainez]

you're a known rondo detractor. the team and franchise and his play put him on this pedestal...he earned it. team will be fine until the playoffs where they have absolutely no shot

This. Although Rondo has been terrible in the playoffs (insert sarcasm sound). I honestly cannot take it anymore. I think I have to leave here forever because the stuff I am reading is literally hurting my head,

holla

[eugen]

I'll tell you what, I'll play along for just one brief moment.  Maybe the team will play better without Rondo for a period of time.

No, always Cs play better without Rondo.

[Moranis]

Whether Celtics are different or better without Rondo, the point is this team does not skip a beat when he is out

We have all seen Pierce looking old this season. If he just plays the point guard position the whole game, he'll have an advantage over anyone that guards him. Pierce whos not even a point guard can rack up triple doubles just like Rondo, So Rondo's stat line must not be that unique or impressive. Not saying Rondo sucks, but it does say something

It means this team is talented and has offensive weapons, which any point guard can take advantage of to be effective. Especially if a replacement point guard can score as well as facilitate offense, how would we be worse off without Rondo for the playoffs? And for all of the Rondo classic playoff moments, there is at least the same number of playoff games where he's no where to be found with no impact on the game, a turnover machine, or letting an average point guard score 30 on him. (Game 5 2012 EFC against the Heat surely rings a bell with him coming up small in the post-season). And many other examples where he played horribly

  I don't remember a ton about game 5 vs the Heat. From the box score it looks like Rondo had a weak shooting game. It also looks like he played all but 4 minutes of that game and the Celts were a -7 in those 4 minutes.

  But Rondo's played 92 playoff games in his career, let me know how many you can find where someone scored 30 on Rondo.

From Louis Williams to Jameer Nelson to Billups to Mo Williams. Too many scored or neared 30 on Rondo
Everyone has their bad playoff games, so I wont blame that on Rondo. But for all the accolades fans want to praise on Rondo's playoff moments, he has just as many horrible playoff games that cost the Celtics a chance to win. And if he is the leader of the team, he should be the leader in taking responsibility

His playoff games when he dominated are almost equal to playoff games when he was non-existent and had no impact on the game. I'm sure Celtics can find a guard (Or maybe already on the team) that can be more consistent than that

  Okay, so we now have a list of players who never scored 30 against Rondo in the playoffs (well, them and the rest of the point guards in the nba). Rondo doesn't have tons of playoff games where he disappears, maybe you're remembering them the way you're remembering all the games where he gave up 30 points to average point guards.

PG's rarely score 30 ppg, the better gauge is did the PG do better in the post season against Rondo then they did in the regular season as a whole and in that, the answer is yes quite often.  Just take the 09/10 playoff run.  Derek Fisher and Jameer Nelson both had better series against Rondo than their regular season averages.  Mo Williams was about the same.  Only Mike Bibby was appreciably worse against Rondo and he was a part-time player that year.

Rondo clearly picks it up in the playoffs, but that is mostly his scoring, not his overall play and defense.  He just plays so much more aggressively offensively, which leads to a lot more big scoring and rebounding games in the playoffs, but it also leads to a lot more just downright awful shooting games.  People always ignore that about every third game Rondo is atrocious in the playoffs and probably costs us the game that he won with the monster game 2 games earlier.  A more consistent player but with a smaller peak, certainly might not win the games Rondo does, but probably doesn't lose the games Rondo loses either.     

[BballTim]

Whether Celtics are different or better without Rondo, the point is this team does not skip a beat when he is out

We have all seen Pierce looking old this season. If he just plays the point guard position the whole game, he'll have an advantage over anyone that guards him. Pierce whos not even a point guard can rack up triple doubles just like Rondo, So Rondo's stat line must not be that unique or impressive. Not saying Rondo sucks, but it does say something

It means this team is talented and has offensive weapons, which any point guard can take advantage of to be effective. Especially if a replacement point guard can score as well as facilitate offense, how would we be worse off without Rondo for the playoffs? And for all of the Rondo classic playoff moments, there is at least the same number of playoff games where he's no where to be found with no impact on the game, a turnover machine, or letting an average point guard score 30 on him. (Game 5 2012 EFC against the Heat surely rings a bell with him coming up small in the post-season). And many other examples where he played horribly

  I don't remember a ton about game 5 vs the Heat. From the box score it looks like Rondo had a weak shooting game. It also looks like he played all but 4 minutes of that game and the Celts were a -7 in those 4 minutes.

  But Rondo's played 92 playoff games in his career, let me know how many you can find where someone scored 30 on Rondo.

From Louis Williams to Jameer Nelson to Billups to Mo Williams. Too many scored or neared 30 on Rondo
Everyone has their bad playoff games, so I wont blame that on Rondo. But for all the accolades fans want to praise on Rondo's playoff moments, he has just as many horrible playoff games that cost the Celtics a chance to win. And if he is the leader of the team, he should be the leader in taking responsibility

His playoff games when he dominated are almost equal to playoff games when he was non-existent and had no impact on the game. I'm sure Celtics can find a guard (Or maybe already on the team) that can be more consistent than that

  Okay, so we now have a list of players who never scored 30 against Rondo in the playoffs (well, them and the rest of the point guards in the nba). Rondo doesn't have tons of playoff games where he disappears, maybe you're remembering them the way you're remembering all the games where he gave up 30 points to average point guards.

2009- Game 7 2nd round against the Magic. Played horribly and cost the Celtics the game. Wasn't pushing the offense causing turnovers. His play made Ainge blast him in the media
- Couple of games in the Bulls 1st round series where Rose outplayed him


2008- Game 5 EFC against the Pistons. People questioning if Sam Cassell should start instead

2010- Game 7 NBA Finals. NIce stat line, but no where to be found. Stopped driving the ball, passed when open. Lakers played 4 on 5 and made the Celtics easier to defend

2012- Game 6 against the Sixers, looked out of the game. DIdn't drive, dribbled the ball too much till the offense got stagnant, etc.

-Game 5 against the Heat. Caused turnovers, passed the ball too many times when he was wide open, lack of shooting caused Heat to play 5 on 4, horrible defense. Missed a chance to close out the Heat at home


Not sure if there's more, but these are the ones I member off head. And all of those games were pivitol important games. He's a good player, but his "godly playoff dominance" is overblown

  Rondo didn't disappear in game 5 vs the Heat, he just missed some shots. Miami's point guards were a combined 3-11 for 9 points. You'd call that bad defense, or possibly "an average pg scoring 30 against Rondo". But even if I gave you that game 5, your claim was that Rondo has a game where he disappears for every good game he has, so you're short at least 8-10 games from last year's playoffs.

[pearljammer10]

Whether Celtics are different or better without Rondo, the point is this team does not skip a beat when he is out

We have all seen Pierce looking old this season. If he just plays the point guard position the whole game, he'll have an advantage over anyone that guards him. Pierce whos not even a point guard can rack up triple doubles just like Rondo, So Rondo's stat line must not be that unique or impressive. Not saying Rondo sucks, but it does say something

It means this team is talented and has offensive weapons, which any point guard can take advantage of to be effective. Especially if a replacement point guard can score as well as facilitate offense, how would we be worse off without Rondo for the playoffs? And for all of the Rondo classic playoff moments, there is at least the same number of playoff games where he's no where to be found with no impact on the game, a turnover machine, or letting an average point guard score 30 on him. (Game 5 2012 EFC against the Heat surely rings a bell with him coming up small in the post-season). And many other examples where he played horribly

  I don't remember a ton about game 5 vs the Heat. From the box score it looks like Rondo had a weak shooting game. It also looks like he played all but 4 minutes of that game and the Celts were a -7 in those 4 minutes.

  But Rondo's played 92 playoff games in his career, let me know how many you can find where someone scored 30 on Rondo.

From Louis Williams to Jameer Nelson to Billups to Mo Williams. Too many scored or neared 30 on Rondo
Everyone has their bad playoff games, so I wont blame that on Rondo. But for all the accolades fans want to praise on Rondo's playoff moments, he has just as many horrible playoff games that cost the Celtics a chance to win. And if he is the leader of the team, he should be the leader in taking responsibility

His playoff games when he dominated are almost equal to playoff games when he was non-existent and had no impact on the game. I'm sure Celtics can find a guard (Or maybe already on the team) that can be more consistent than that

  Okay, so we now have a list of players who never scored 30 against Rondo in the playoffs (well, them and the rest of the point guards in the nba). Rondo doesn't have tons of playoff games where he disappears, maybe you're remembering them the way you're remembering all the games where he gave up 30 points to average point guards.

2009- Game 7 2nd round against the Magic. Played horribly and cost the Celtics the game. Wasn't pushing the offense causing turnovers. His play made Ainge blast him in the media
- Couple of games in the Bulls 1st round series where Rose outplayed him


2008- Game 5 EFC against the Pistons. People questioning if Sam Cassell should start instead

2010- Game 7 NBA Finals. NIce stat line, but no where to be found. Stopped driving the ball, passed when open. Lakers played 4 on 5 and made the Celtics easier to defend

2012- Game 6 against the Sixers, looked out of the game. DIdn't drive, dribbled the ball too much till the offense got stagnant, etc.

-Game 5 against the Heat. Caused turnovers, passed the ball too many times when he was wide open, lack of shooting caused Heat to play 5 on 4, horrible defense. Missed a chance to close out the Heat at home


Not sure if there's more, but these are the ones I member off head. And all of those games were pivitol important games. He's a good player, but his "godly playoff dominance" is overblown

Four "bad" playoff games in four years? Yeah, great point.

[scaryjerry]

Whether Celtics are different or better without Rondo, the point is this team does not skip a beat when he is out

We have all seen Pierce looking old this season. If he just plays the point guard position the whole game, he'll have an advantage over anyone that guards him. Pierce whos not even a point guard can rack up triple doubles just like Rondo, So Rondo's stat line must not be that unique or impressive. Not saying Rondo sucks, but it does say something

It means this team is talented and has offensive weapons, which any point guard can take advantage of to be effective. Especially if a replacement point guard can score as well as facilitate offense, how would we be worse off without Rondo for the playoffs? And for all of the Rondo classic playoff moments, there is at least the same number of playoff games where he's no where to be found with no impact on tahe game, a turnover machine, or letting an average point guard score 30 on him. (Game 5 2012 EFC against the Heat surely rings a bell with him coming up small in the post-season). And many other examples where he played horribly

Actually no, I don't remember that. What I do remember is Rondo scoring 9 points in the final 3 minutes of game 7 against the Sixers to advance to the ECF (ending the game with 18/10/10), while Pierce was fouled out on the bench. I also recall him putting up 22 points, 10 rebounds, and 14 assists in game 7 of the ECF against the Heat and was the only Celtic able to score in the last six minutes of the game, while Chris Bosh and Lebron James continuously burned us every time down the floor. Then of course there was game 2 where he played every second of the game, putting up 44/10/8 while scoring all 12 of Boston's points in overtime. In game 6 he was the only player to keep us even remotely close to the Heat, scoring 21 points while the "Big 3" combined for just 31.

For the series he averaged 20.9pts, 11.3ast, 7rbs, .700FT%, .488FG%, and was the leading scorer for the Celtics and the 2nd best rebounder. (Then you have our "scorers" in Pierce who averaged 19ppg on .344FG% and Ray who averaged 11.9ppg on .377FG%; their opponents, Lebron and Wade, combined for 55ppg on .480FG%)

Meanwhile, Chalmers scored more than 14 points exactly once against Rondo, and that was in game 2 when he had 22 points to Rajon's 44. On the series he averaged only 12ppg, 4.6ast, 3.1rbs, .591FT% .310-3pt%, and .456FG% in 38min.

For the entire 2012 playoffs (among players with 500+ minutes) he was 7th in OWS, 3rd in DWS (behind Lebron and KG), tied for 3rd best PER and defensive rating, 5th in WS/48, 8th in total points, and was easily the best rebounding guard.

But yeah, keep on believing that Rondo's a terrible playoff performer who is easily replaceable with any average point guard in the NBA.

Great post, but why bother? The Rondo haters are never going to listen to any facts.

better then great post....osirusceltics just got owned by facts....but what he has to say about rondo carries no weight...and you're right he won't listen, period.

pierce was pathetic and dreadful in the playoffs...he should be traded for Rudy gay OSirus, what do you think of that? oh wait no he's above the franchise, on a pedestal, highest paid on the team and deserving of retiring a Celtic right?