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[Moranis]

Nope and wade and Lebron were never an ideal fit for this reason...wade is far superior to kyrie athletically, defensively, kyrie is a great shooter after dribbling around the duration of the shot clock and frankly I'm starting to get sick of how overrated he is...he's had no impacts on wins, better than wade? Ha....he's not Derrick rose people.

I would take Kyrie Irving over D-Rose any day of the week. D-Rose is incredibly overrated (not saying he isn't a GOOD basketball player, but he is NOT an MVP-caliber player). The fact that the Bulls are doing so well in his absence is proof that he was not the most valuable player on that team.

Irving is still young and unpolished, but is already better than D-Rose was as a rookie.

Lol@taking kyrie Irving over Derrick rose...that guy who after 3 years in the league won an MVP, led his team to the playoffs every year and prohibitive favorites before his injury, the best record and the conference finals on a franchise that had done nothing since Jordan...lol@ taking a guy who hasn't had an impact on wins over d rose. Is jj reddick better then Lebron too?

Irving is pretty polished actually...rose changed a culture and won an mvp and wasn't nearly polished at all. Irving isn't an mvp, isn't a culture changer, he's a nice cute little player with a nice jump shot.

I think you are underselling Kyrie Irving.  He had a rookie season that is right up there with the all time best rookie season for a PG.  It was the best when you look at totals, efficiency, etc. probably since Magic. 

And if you put Lebron on the Cavs right now with Irving, Varejao, Thompson, Waiters, Zeller, etc. I would think that team would be one of the favorites in the East if not the team to beat. 

[scaryjerry]

Nope and wade and Lebron were never an ideal fit for this reason...wade is far superior to kyrie athletically, defensively, kyrie is a great shooter after dribbling around the duration of the shot clock and frankly I'm starting to get sick of how overrated he is...he's had no impacts on wins, better than wade? Ha....he's not Derrick rose people.

I would take Kyrie Irving over D-Rose any day of the week. D-Rose is incredibly overrated (not saying he isn't a GOOD basketball player, but he is NOT an MVP-caliber player). The fact that the Bulls are doing so well in his absence is proof that he was not the most valuable player on that team.

Irving is still young and unpolished, but is already better than D-Rose was as a rookie.

Lol@taking kyrie Irving over Derrick rose...that guy who after 3 years in the league won an MVP, led his team to the playoffs every year and prohibitive favorites before his injury, the best record and the conference finals on a franchise that had done nothing since Jordan...lol@ taking a guy who hasn't had an impact on wins over d rose. Is jj reddick better then Lebron too?

Irving is pretty polished actually...rose changed a culture and won an mvp and wasn't nearly polished at all. Irving isn't an mvp, isn't a culture changer, he's a nice cute little player with a nice jump shot.

I think you are underselling Kyrie Irving.  He had a rookie season that is right up there with the all time best rookie season for a PG.  It was the best when you look at totals, efficiency, etc. probably since Magic. 

And if you put Lebron on the Cavs right now with Irving, Varejao, Thompson, Waiters, Zeller, etc. I would think that team would be one of the favorites in the East if not the team to beat.

but without LeBron they're a lottery team?put LeBron on any team and they're the team to beat.put a healtjy rose instead of Irving, you're a top seed as opposed to a lottery team...don't see the debate and until kyrie can win I don't care about his numbers..what rose did as a rookie in the playoffs= more impressive..
Irving nice little shooter and all star talent.. rose an athletic specimen franchise changing hall of fame talent

[Kane3387]

If the Cavs can develop their young talent and Dwyane Wade continues to physically decline then I can definitely see him going home.

As good as Miami is, without LeBron, they're probably no more then a playoff team exiting the first round.

[Roy H.]

put a healtjy rose instead of Irving, you're a top seed as opposed to a lottery team

Rose isn't getting the current Cavs roster (minus Irving) to the playoffs, let alone a top seed.  No way.

[scaryjerry]

put a healtjy rose instead of Irving, you're a top seed as opposed to a lottery team

Rose isn't getting the current Cavs roster (minus Irving) to the playoffs.  No way.

absolutely does if only an 8 seed

 rose is a franchise changing talent, Irving is a nice player

[Roy H.]

put a healtjy rose instead of Irving, you're a top seed as opposed to a lottery team

Rose isn't getting the current Cavs roster (minus Irving) to the playoffs.  No way.

absolutely does if only an 8 seed

 rose is a franchise changing talent, Irving is a nice player

Well, at least you've backed off on your "top seed" argument.

They're both franchise players, you just haven't watched enough Cavs games.  Irving was the best "clutch" player in the NBA last year, and his scoring + efficiency was the highest for any rookie since Tim Duncan, and the highest for a guard since Michael Jordan.  Very impressive.

[scaryjerry]

put a healtjy rose instead of Irving, you're a top seed as opposed to a lottery team

Rose isn't getting the current Cavs roster (minus Irving) to the playoffs.  No way.

absolutely does if only an 8 seed

 rose is a franchise changing talent, Irving is a nice player

Well, at least you've backed off on your "top seed" argument.

They're both franchise players, you just haven't watched enough Cavs games.  Irving was the best "clutch" player in the NBA last year, and his scoring + efficiency was the highest for any rookie since Tim Duncan, and the highest for a guard since Michael Jordan.  Very impressive.

but if he had the athletic prowess of LeBron or rose (or Jordan) or was as big as Duncan he'd be a franchise changing talent..he's about as athletic as mo Williams no one is debating he's a great little efficient shooter, rose clearly can't touch him in that regard.
was Mark price better than Jordan?

[Roy H.]

put a healtjy rose instead of Irving, you're a top seed as opposed to a lottery team

Rose isn't getting the current Cavs roster (minus Irving) to the playoffs.  No way.

absolutely does if only an 8 seed

 rose is a franchise changing talent, Irving is a nice player

Well, at least you've backed off on your "top seed" argument.

They're both franchise players, you just haven't watched enough Cavs games.  Irving was the best "clutch" player in the NBA last year, and his scoring + efficiency was the highest for any rookie since Tim Duncan, and the highest for a guard since Michael Jordan.  Very impressive.

but if he had the athletic prowess of LeBron or rose he'd be a franchise changing talent..he's about as athletic as mo Williams no one is debating he's a great little efficient shooter, rose clearly can't touch him in that regard

Do franchise players need to be super athletic?

The fact that Irving lacks Rose's athleticism doesn't limit him in any way.  He's an amazing shooter, has great instincts, doesn't shrink under pressure, and is possibly the best ball-handler in the NBA. 

I again question how much you've seen Kyrie Irving, if you're comparing him to Mark Price (and presumably, Rose to Michael Jordan).  I'm pretty sure Price couldn't do this at 20 years old:



or this:

[Fafnir]

put a healtjy rose instead of Irving, you're a top seed as opposed to a lottery team

Rose isn't getting the current Cavs roster (minus Irving) to the playoffs.  No way.

absolutely does if only an 8 seed

 rose is a franchise changing talent, Irving is a nice player

Well, at least you've backed off on your "top seed" argument.

They're both franchise players, you just haven't watched enough Cavs games.  Irving was the best "clutch" player in the NBA last year, and his scoring + efficiency was the highest for any rookie since Tim Duncan, and the highest for a guard since Michael Jordan.  Very impressive.

but if he had the athletic prowess of LeBron or rose he'd be a franchise changing talent..he's about as athletic as mo Williams no one is debating he's a great little efficient shooter, rose clearly can't touch him in that regard

Do franchise players need to be super athletic?

The fact that Irving lacks Rose's athleticism doesn't limit him in any way.  He's an amazing shooter, has great instincts, doesn't shrink under pressure, and is possibly the best ball-handler in the NBA.

Its going to limit his defense and rebounding impact. But his shooting also opens up things for him that Rose doesn't have. He's a PG anyways, you can live with defensive and rebounding issues at that position.

[scaryjerry]

kyrie is good don't take it like I'm saying he isn't...his only chance to be better than rose is if rose never fully recovers...I've seen all the gifs you just posted and many of his games...not a franchise changer on the rose level who was making LeBron like impact in his first few years, his team even stays in the hunt because they know they can do real damage when he returns healthy.

[Fafnir]

kyrie is good don't take it like I'm saying he isn't...his only chance to be better than rose is if rose never fully recovers...I've seen all the gifs you just posted and many of his games...not a franchise changer on the rose level who was making LeBron like impact in his first few years, his team even stays in the hunt because they know they can do real damage when he returns healthy.

Rose wasn't/isn't close to LeBron like impact though.

The reason the Bulls stay in the hunt without him is that they have a really good defensive and rebounding team, things that don't really depend on Rose. We've seen plenty the past two years to realize that right?

[xmuscularghandix]

In 6 years Kyrie will be a dominant PG, a perenial All-Star, and only 26 years old. At the same time Lebron will be 34 years old, Wade will be 36 and most likely done due to the way he relies on his athleticism. Do you think if The Cavs offered Miami a 26 year old All-Star PG for a 34 year old Lebron James the Heat would take it?

How would Lebron winning 3-4 more rings in that period affect their answer?

[mgent]

kyrie is good don't take it like I'm saying he isn't...his only chance to be better than rose is if rose never fully recovers...I've seen all the gifs you just posted and many of his games...not a franchise changer on the rose level who was making LeBron like impact in his first few years, his team even stays in the hunt because they know they can do real damage when he returns healthy.

So number 1 picks reach their ceilings at age 20?

[Moranis]

Nope and wade and Lebron were never an ideal fit for this reason...wade is far superior to kyrie athletically, defensively, kyrie is a great shooter after dribbling around the duration of the shot clock and frankly I'm starting to get sick of how overrated he is...he's had no impacts on wins, better than wade? Ha....he's not Derrick rose people.

I would take Kyrie Irving over D-Rose any day of the week. D-Rose is incredibly overrated (not saying he isn't a GOOD basketball player, but he is NOT an MVP-caliber player). The fact that the Bulls are doing so well in his absence is proof that he was not the most valuable player on that team.

Irving is still young and unpolished, but is already better than D-Rose was as a rookie.

Lol@taking kyrie Irving over Derrick rose...that guy who after 3 years in the league won an MVP, led his team to the playoffs every year and prohibitive favorites before his injury, the best record and the conference finals on a franchise that had done nothing since Jordan...lol@ taking a guy who hasn't had an impact on wins over d rose. Is jj reddick better then Lebron too?

Irving is pretty polished actually...rose changed a culture and won an mvp and wasn't nearly polished at all. Irving isn't an mvp, isn't a culture changer, he's a nice cute little player with a nice jump shot.

I think you are underselling Kyrie Irving.  He had a rookie season that is right up there with the all time best rookie season for a PG.  It was the best when you look at totals, efficiency, etc. probably since Magic. 

And if you put Lebron on the Cavs right now with Irving, Varejao, Thompson, Waiters, Zeller, etc. I would think that team would be one of the favorites in the East if not the team to beat.

but without LeBron they're a lottery team?put LeBron on any team and they're the team to beat.put a healtjy rose instead of Irving, you're a top seed as opposed to a lottery team...don't see the debate and until kyrie can win I don't care about his numbers..what rose did as a rookie in the playoffs= more impressive..
Irving nice little shooter and all star talent.. rose an athletic specimen franchise changing hall of fame talent

They aren't exactly healthy.  It is hard to gauge how good the Cavs really are when they haven't been able to field a healthy squad between Kyrie and Andy (not to mention Boobie and Waiters).

[scaryjerry]

kyrie is good don't take it like I'm saying he isn't...his only chance to be better than rose is if rose never fully recovers...I've seen all the gifs you just posted and many of his games...not a franchise changer on the rose level who was making LeBron like impact in his first few years, his team even stays in the hunt because they know they can do real damage when he returns healthy.

Rose wasn't/isn't close to LeBron like impact though.

The reason the Bulls stay in the hunt without him is that they have a really good defensive and rebounding team, things that don't really depend on Rose. We've seen plenty the past two years to realize that right?

sure he is, LeBrons Cavs teams were great defensively with or without him...they're culture changers. in his first 3years rose had every single bit the LeBron impact in his first 3years, if not more..Cavs were middle of the pack playoff teams then and the bulls had the best record and a tougher road