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[PhoSita]

Both look solid but not spectacular, with good skills but notable flaws. But I like the heart of both players.

I doubt the answer is 'yes' -- I'm curious what people think.

Would be interesting to trot out a young squad built largely around Walker, Bradley, MKG and Sully in future years. Hard-nosed group.

  So who gets to pull KG and PP aside and say "Sorry, we decided to cut back on our chances of contending now because we'd like to field a scrappy, hard-nosed team without any stars in the future"?

Well I imagine this kind of move would signal that the team is trying to build a core for the future rather than prioritize winning now.  So it would probably have to coincide somehow with trading Pierce and KG.

Not saying that's a smart course of action.  But clearly this would not be a move intended to make KG or Pierce happy.

[ssspence]

Both look solid but not spectacular, with good skills but notable flaws. But I like the heart of both players.

I doubt the answer is 'yes' -- I'm curious what people think.

Would be interesting to trot out a young squad built largely around Walker, Bradley, MKG and Sully in future years. Hard-nosed group.

  So who gets to pull KG and PP aside and say "Sorry, we decided to cut back on our chances of contending now because we'd like to field a scrappy, hard-nosed team without any stars in the future"?

I'm not a believer that the Cs very slim championship hopes really ride on Rondo. Not in a half-court team built around KG and Pierce.

Kidd-Gilchrist's defense would be a nice boost to their needs, IMO. In short, I don't think this is somehow a rebuild.

[GreenFaith1819]

I really like both players, especially MKG.

But nope.

EDIT: Mis-read the thread - my bad.

I think they (CHA) would offer that. Rondo would be a nice piece to build around.

I'd hope Danny says no, though.

[pearljammer10]

They might but I don't like it for us one bit.

[Boris Badenov]

There is no way Charlotte does this for the following reasons:

1. They really like MKG and do see All-Star potential. He is only 19 and already an average offensive player with room for improvement, and will certainly be an elite defender.

2. Rondo has two years left on his contract and probably would be out of there in a heartbeat, probably to the Lakers or some nonsense just to spite Danny.

3. Even if they don't see MKG as a franchise player, they are going to have at least two more shots at the lottery in the next two years with him on the team, and then it would take 2-3 years for any franchise player they get to develop. By then Rondo is maybe 30 or 31 (or gone!), while MKG is still only 23 and just hitting his peak.

4. Walker has shown close to Ben Gordon-type offensive numbers while being a much better defender. He is a valuable piece in his own right.

5. Rondo has proven to be a great player when surrounded by other great players, but hasn't proved that he can play well surrounded by a weak team. I'm not saying I think he couldn't do that, but for any offensively limited player that is going to be a concern.

[BballTim]

5. Rondo has proven to be a great player when surrounded by other great players, but hasn't proved that he can play well surrounded by a weak team. I'm not saying I think he couldn't do that, but for any offensively limited player that is going to be a concern.

  Rondo played fine earlier in the season when the team struggled, he did last year as well. I wonder how many of the "Rondo can't play well without a great cast" still think his assists will drop significantly when he doesn't have Ray to pass to.

[PhoSita]

5. Rondo has proven to be a great player when surrounded by other great players, but hasn't proved that he can play well surrounded by a weak team. I'm not saying I think he couldn't do that, but for any offensively limited player that is going to be a concern.

  Rondo played fine earlier in the season when the team struggled, he did last year as well. I wonder how many of the "Rondo can't play well without a great cast" still think his assists will drop significantly when he doesn't have Ray to pass to.

I think we still have yet to see what Rondo will be like when he's on a team without any scorers like Pierce or KG. 

Not making any judgment either way.  But it's fair to have some doubts about how effective he might be in that situation, given that he's not a natural scorer, despite the fact that occasionally he does have a good scoring night (and that one 44 point game).

[BballTim]

5. Rondo has proven to be a great player when surrounded by other great players, but hasn't proved that he can play well surrounded by a weak team. I'm not saying I think he couldn't do that, but for any offensively limited player that is going to be a concern.

  Rondo played fine earlier in the season when the team struggled, he did last year as well. I wonder how many of the "Rondo can't play well without a great cast" still think his assists will drop significantly when he doesn't have Ray to pass to.

I think we still have yet to see what Rondo will be like when he's on a team without any scorers like Pierce or KG. 

Not making any judgment either way.  But it's fair to have some doubts about how effective he might be in that situation, given that he's not a natural scorer, despite the fact that occasionally he does have a good scoring night (and that one 44 point game).

  What exactly do you think "scorers like Pierce or KG" means? KG is currently 40th in per36 scoring. Paul's better at 12th, but you make it sound like it's still 2008. I guess your assumption is that Rondo's going to be playing on a team that's roughly equivalent (offensively) to Rondo and last year's Charlotte team but that's fairly unlikely.

[PhoSita]

5. Rondo has proven to be a great player when surrounded by other great players, but hasn't proved that he can play well surrounded by a weak team. I'm not saying I think he couldn't do that, but for any offensively limited player that is going to be a concern.

  Rondo played fine earlier in the season when the team struggled, he did last year as well. I wonder how many of the "Rondo can't play well without a great cast" still think his assists will drop significantly when he doesn't have Ray to pass to.

I think we still have yet to see what Rondo will be like when he's on a team without any scorers like Pierce or KG. 

Not making any judgment either way.  But it's fair to have some doubts about how effective he might be in that situation, given that he's not a natural scorer, despite the fact that occasionally he does have a good scoring night (and that one 44 point game).

  What exactly do you think "scorers like Pierce or KG" means? KG is currently 40th in per36 scoring. Paul's better at 12th, but you make it sound like it's still 2008. I guess your assumption is that Rondo's going to be playing on a team that's roughly equivalent (offensively) to Rondo and last year's Charlotte team but that's fairly unlikely.

What I mean is we don't know what would happen if you put Rondo on a team like, say, the Hornets, or the Raptors, or the Magic, or the Wizards, or the Suns, and so on.  A team without a player who you can really single out as a capable 1st option on offense.


Even take this Celtics team.  Play a few games without Pierce or Garnett and see what happens when the top offensive options are Rondo, Jeff Green, and Jason Terry.  I think the belief that some people have is that in that situation Rondo doesn't have the natural scoring ability to efficiently carry the load offensively. 

Teams without much talent need players who can take a lot of shots, otherwise their offense completely lacks consistency or focus.

[BballTim]

5. Rondo has proven to be a great player when surrounded by other great players, but hasn't proved that he can play well surrounded by a weak team. I'm not saying I think he couldn't do that, but for any offensively limited player that is going to be a concern.

  Rondo played fine earlier in the season when the team struggled, he did last year as well. I wonder how many of the "Rondo can't play well without a great cast" still think his assists will drop significantly when he doesn't have Ray to pass to.

I think we still have yet to see what Rondo will be like when he's on a team without any scorers like Pierce or KG. 

Not making any judgment either way.  But it's fair to have some doubts about how effective he might be in that situation, given that he's not a natural scorer, despite the fact that occasionally he does have a good scoring night (and that one 44 point game).

  What exactly do you think "scorers like Pierce or KG" means? KG is currently 40th in per36 scoring. Paul's better at 12th, but you make it sound like it's still 2008. I guess your assumption is that Rondo's going to be playing on a team that's roughly equivalent (offensively) to Rondo and last year's Charlotte team but that's fairly unlikely.

What I mean is we don't know what would happen if you put Rondo on a team like, say, the Hornets, or the Raptors, or the Magic, or the Wizards, or the Suns, and so on.  A team without a player who you can really single out as a capable 1st option on offense.

  I'd guess Rondo would get more points and assists, like he normally has in the games PP/KG/RA missed over the last few years.

[PhoSita]

5. Rondo has proven to be a great player when surrounded by other great players, but hasn't proved that he can play well surrounded by a weak team. I'm not saying I think he couldn't do that, but for any offensively limited player that is going to be a concern.

  Rondo played fine earlier in the season when the team struggled, he did last year as well. I wonder how many of the "Rondo can't play well without a great cast" still think his assists will drop significantly when he doesn't have Ray to pass to.

I think we still have yet to see what Rondo will be like when he's on a team without any scorers like Pierce or KG. 

Not making any judgment either way.  But it's fair to have some doubts about how effective he might be in that situation, given that he's not a natural scorer, despite the fact that occasionally he does have a good scoring night (and that one 44 point game).

  What exactly do you think "scorers like Pierce or KG" means? KG is currently 40th in per36 scoring. Paul's better at 12th, but you make it sound like it's still 2008. I guess your assumption is that Rondo's going to be playing on a team that's roughly equivalent (offensively) to Rondo and last year's Charlotte team but that's fairly unlikely.

What I mean is we don't know what would happen if you put Rondo on a team like, say, the Hornets, or the Raptors, or the Magic, or the Wizards, or the Suns, and so on.  A team without a player who you can really single out as a capable 1st option on offense.

  I'd guess Rondo would get more points and assists, like he normally has in the games PP/KG/RA missed over the last few years.

And I'm not saying that couldn't happen.  I'm just saying we don't have a significant sample size of that.  Rondo's never been forced to play 10-20 straight games doing that.  And I think people who raise doubts about that have decent reasons to do so.

[Boris Badenov]

5. Rondo has proven to be a great player when surrounded by other great players, but hasn't proved that he can play well surrounded by a weak team. I'm not saying I think he couldn't do that, but for any offensively limited player that is going to be a concern.

  Rondo played fine earlier in the season when the team struggled, he did last year as well. I wonder how many of the "Rondo can't play well without a great cast" still think his assists will drop significantly when he doesn't have Ray to pass to.

I think we still have yet to see what Rondo will be like when he's on a team without any scorers like Pierce or KG. 

Not making any judgment either way.  But it's fair to have some doubts about how effective he might be in that situation, given that he's not a natural scorer, despite the fact that occasionally he does have a good scoring night (and that one 44 point game).

  What exactly do you think "scorers like Pierce or KG" means? KG is currently 40th in per36 scoring. Paul's better at 12th, but you make it sound like it's still 2008. I guess your assumption is that Rondo's going to be playing on a team that's roughly equivalent (offensively) to Rondo and last year's Charlotte team but that's fairly unlikely.

What I mean is we don't know what would happen if you put Rondo on a team like, say, the Hornets, or the Raptors, or the Magic, or the Wizards, or the Suns, and so on.  A team without a player who you can really single out as a capable 1st option on offense.

  I'd guess Rondo would get more points and assists, like he normally has in the games PP/KG/RA missed over the last few years.

My point was a little different. Of course you'd expect his numbers to go up. I was just saying that Rondo might be the type of player who's more valuable on a good team than a bad team.

I mean, there are some guys you can add to a 30-win team and it becomes a 50-win team, and other guys where that doesn't happen. And some guys you add to a 50-win team and it becomes a championship team. Other guys, not.

Not saying we know either way. Just that we don't know. And a team like CHA would have to consider that risk.

[wiley]

One reason you want Rondo on a good team and not a bad team
is that he is one of the better playoff performers in history.

Goes to waste if your team's not in the playoffs...

[barefacedmonk]

A lot of posters on this blog think Rondo is over-rated. Yet, they want Kemba Walker?!

[PhoSita]

I mean, there are some guys you can add to a 30-win team and it becomes a 50-win team, and other guys where that doesn't happen. And some guys you add to a 50-win team and it becomes a championship team. Other guys, not.

Not saying we know either way. Just that we don't know. And a team like CHA would have to consider that risk.

This is really well put.