Author Topic: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!  (Read 7247 times)

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Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #90 on: January 12, 2013, 10:06:38 AM »

Offline tenn_smoothie

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Quote from: mctyson or during free agency. [/quote

Danny would not be doing his job if he wasn't "shopping" Pierce.  He is the GM and VP of Personnel.  His job is one thing and one thing only:  to give Doc the absolute best talent he can that gives them the best shot to win Banner 18, and to do so under the owner's financial requirements.


Wasn't the "more talented" argument used for the Jeff Green deal ? look where that one got us - we have been looking for a center ever since.

chemistry and playing as a unit is half the battle. look at the mess the "very talented" Lakers are in right now. i said when Nash was acquired that he and Kobe's styles would clash and sure enough. then they go and get the absolute wrong coach for their strongest playing style (half court - pound it inside).

but this "talent" emphasis has been going on since the league started - the late 60's Lakers couldn't win a title, the mid 70's sixers also lost in the finals, the 90's Knicks and the 2004 Lakers]. talent only gets you part way there - gotta have chemistry and the talented parts have to mesh and not clash.

Your point about chemistry is well-taken.

But the talent argument is a valid one, also.

I think what you're getting at is that prioritizing talent over chemistry is not always going to benefit you in the short term.  It's not always a win-now move.  The Green trade certainly didn't seem to improve the 2010-2011 team in the short term, though I still strongly believe that team was never going anywhere without a healthy Shaq; if Shaq had been healthy for the playoff run, we might view the trade a lot differently in terms of how it affected the team that year.  In the long term, I am of the opinion that the Green trade really benefited the Celtics.  We're much better off with Green than we would be with Perk making similar money, in my opinion. 

Similarly, trading Pierce for the sake of talent probably wouldn't improve the team this year.  But in any case trading Pierce would be a sign that Ainge doesn't think the team is going to win it all this year -- he'd be positioning the team to be more competitive in the future (i.e. post-Pierce/KG).

talent is important and making moves with the long-term in mind is also smart - the only problem with that philosophy is that it doesn't fit the Celtics current situation - which is a Win Now.

Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #91 on: January 12, 2013, 10:09:39 AM »

Offline alajet

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Bledsoe would need to go to Memphis in that trade.

Doesn't make sense for him to end up in Boston and for Memphis to get so little.

Honestly, I'd rather have Bledsoe as a cheap young piece rather than Gay, who is overpaid not as good as Pierce.

Yeah, that's another way to go with it.

I think it'd be pretty tough for the Clippers to give Bledsoe for a 35 year old Paul Pierce + the other pieces they'd need to include to match salaries. Better chance with Rudy Gay (26 years old) since he'd be a long term piece alongside CP3, Griffin and D.Jordan.

That offer probably wouldn't be on the table for Pierce.

Edit: Oh, that's the original trade. Pierce to LAC. Yeah, I'm not sure there is enough value there for the Clippers. They are losing three big rotation pieces with Odom, Bledsoe and Caron. I think they need more value going there way for it to be worthwhile for them. Maybe take Bledsoe out of the deal. Then there is nowhere near enough for Memphis. Ahh ... I don't know.

It doesn't look like there is a workable three team trade there between the Clips (Pierce), Boston (Gay) and Memphis. Not enough assets available for Memphis to receive if losing Pierce and not getting Pierce to make it worthwhile for everyone.

I think you're probably right -- would be tough for the Clips to sacrifice depth to upgrade at SF.

But Butler to Pierce is a pretty huge upgrade.  And I'm sure the Clips realize that their depth won't mean as much in the playoffs.  Adding another elite scorer to their starting lineup could make them much harder to beat in a series against the Thunder or the Heat.

Anyway, as I've said previously, the Clippers are the only team I can even imagine trading for Pierce.  Nobody else has both the assets and the situation for it to make sense.  Teams like the Pacers aren't close enough to real title contention to make it worthwhile.  Ainge isn't going to trade Pierce for a highly paid player with no upside like Granger or Gay.

Well said. If there is a team that wants a veteran at the end of his career, that team would be trying to contend, and the closest thing could be the Clippers.

But I disagree that their bench will mean less come play-off time. They have a bench can completely destroy the opposition and unless you are really crushing them against their starters, you are in trouble.

Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #92 on: January 12, 2013, 10:12:53 AM »

Offline CoachBo

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Seven pages for the annual smokescreen, eh, and from a reporter whose accuracy record is questionable?

LOL.

Pierce isn't going anywhere.

Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #93 on: January 12, 2013, 10:27:25 AM »

Offline Yoki_IsTheName

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Here we go again.

Pierce is playing great this season, and even with that I dont think teams would offer really good value for him since he's what, 34 now...

He'll retire a Celtic.f
"The rim is looking bigger and bigger every game." - PP

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Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #94 on: January 12, 2013, 10:31:27 AM »

Offline PhoSita

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Seven pages for the annual smokescreen, eh, and from a reporter whose accuracy record is questionable?

LOL.

Pierce isn't going anywhere.

Heheh, yeah, good point.  But hey, we've got to talk about something, right?
Quote from: BBallTim
Parker isn't going to score 30 ppg and rebuilds generally take longer than 1 year. Relax.

Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #95 on: January 12, 2013, 11:37:30 AM »

Offline pearljammer10

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Seven pages for the annual smokescreen, eh, and from a reporter whose accuracy record is questionable?

LOL.

Pierce isn't going anywhere.

Heheh, yeah, good point.  But hey, we've got to talk about something, right?

Haha. Good stuff.
DKC: GM Boston Celtics: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AuCTllmkG26udHRaa0xrWm1qZTExaHltaEdtZzVRNFE&usp=sharing#gid=50
PICK 2: Trail Blazers
PG: Lillard/ReggieJackson
SG: D. Green/Miller/Wroten
SF: Leonard/Prince
PF: Aldridge/Diaw
C:  Noah/Birdman/Perkins

Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #96 on: January 12, 2013, 12:07:09 PM »

Offline kozlodoev

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What team is going to trade the Celtics something of value for Pierce?  Who is a Paul Pierce away from being a contender, THIS year?

Only one I can think of is the Clippers (who are already a contender).

Butler + Odom + Bledsoe

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Pierce + Wilcox + Barbosa

That could make sense if the Celtics then trade Rondo for something. Bledsoe has been phenomenal in limited minutes for the Clips and pairing him with Bradley could give the Celtics a ferocious, very fast and athletic combo in the backcourt on both ends of the floor.

The Clippers would obviously prefer not to give up Bledsoe, who has been GREAT this year, but going from Butler to Pierce is a pretty huge upgrade, and could make them nearly unstoppable this season.
Thanks, but I'd like a little more than a pile of spare parts and garbage for Paul Pierce.
Managing Rilski Sportist to glory at http://www.buzzerbeater.com

Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #97 on: January 12, 2013, 12:32:23 PM »

Offline CFAN38

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There are obvously a lot of problems with trading Pierce.

The biggest one I see is the return fitting in with the current team. Danny just gave a nice sized contract to Green. If pierce is traded for a SF this player has to be light years ahead of Green for it to make sense. If the SFs rank Durnat, Lebron, Melo in the first tier then the 2nd tier is Prob Pierce, George, Deng, Iqidala, Gay then 3rd would be Batum, Wallace, Galinari. Obviously the 2nd and 3rd are debatable. But with starters minutes Green would be close to that 3rd tier and possibly a lower end 2nd tier (compare his stats his last year in OKC to gay/Deng).

I personally only trade the captain for a big man under 28 who has the potential to be the defensive anchor post KG. I just dont think this is going to happen.

Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #98 on: January 12, 2013, 12:56:24 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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What team is going to trade the Celtics something of value for Pierce?  Who is a Paul Pierce away from being a contender, THIS year?

Only one I can think of is the Clippers (who are already a contender).

Butler + Odom + Bledsoe

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Pierce + Wilcox + Barbosa

That could make sense if the Celtics then trade Rondo for something. Bledsoe has been phenomenal in limited minutes for the Clips and pairing him with Bradley could give the Celtics a ferocious, very fast and athletic combo in the backcourt on both ends of the floor.

The Clippers would obviously prefer not to give up Bledsoe, who has been GREAT this year, but going from Butler to Pierce is a pretty huge upgrade, and could make them nearly unstoppable this season.
Thanks, but I'd like a little more than a pile of spare parts and garbage for Paul Pierce.

Eric Bledsoe

Quote from: BBallTim
Parker isn't going to score 30 ppg and rebuilds generally take longer than 1 year. Relax.

Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #99 on: January 12, 2013, 01:19:15 PM »

Offline kozlodoev

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Please
Eric Bledsoe


Yes, I know who Eric Bledsoe is. Can you now please explain why I should be excited about swapping our starting SF and top scorer for a third-year guy who can't average 20 minutes per game, and seems to lack an NBA position?
Managing Rilski Sportist to glory at http://www.buzzerbeater.com

Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #100 on: January 12, 2013, 02:01:32 PM »

Online triboy16f

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only trades that make sense to me are with nuggets, Clippers, possibly the bucks, rockets. Bc these teams might be a pierce away to go deep in the playoffs/win a ring and for us, we get key future pieces and give Jeff Green the starting position

to clippers - pierce
to bos - bledsoe, butler, 1st round pick

I can't see who else clips can give you. Their team is not very young and had to give up a ton for paul. I wouldn't do this trade though, bc its not enough back in return for the long term

to denver - pierce, Bass
to bos - brewer , chandler, Mozgov

This trade would be good for both teams. I always like brewer and mozgov would help our need for a decent backup center. But the key to this deal would be pending on the health of Chandler. He would have to be fully healed from his injury. Green and Chandler both pretty young still would set our sf spot for a the long term

to bucks - pierce
to bos - harris, udoh 1st round pick + salary fill in

Or pierce and melo for Harris, Henson. But likely the bucks will not trade away Henson who is showing glimpse of his potential these past few games. But with no henson why one may consider this trade is, you get udoh a former 6th pick who is raw but has elite physical abilities for a pf/c. He can play right now but mainly rebound and block shots. Under Kg's guidance who knows how good he may become. Harris is a kid i've had my eye on ever since pre season. And he also has torched us this year. He has potential to be the "guy" in the 4th quarter. Has some paul pierce in him, has some rudy gay in him. Just needs time to play

To rockets: Pierce
To bos : Parsons + Royce White +salary fill ins

the rockets get pierce to make a deep run and the celts get a future sf who is already a good player. Royce white can be considered a bonus. Maybe someone in the celts org can get some sense into the kid and let him know not everything in life is not fair. Likely though the rockets would not make this trade. Parsons is much younger and a very good sf

« Last Edit: January 12, 2013, 02:08:51 PM by triboy16f »
Surprising players happen all the time -- that's why they're called surprises.

Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #101 on: January 12, 2013, 03:40:09 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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Please
Eric Bledsoe


Yes, I know who Eric Bledsoe is. Can you now please explain why I should be excited about swapping our starting SF and top scorer for a third-year guy who can't average 20 minutes per game, and seems to lack an NBA position?

You shouldn't.

But the whole premise of Paul Pierce being traded has to assume that Danny is basically blowing the team up.

So we're not going to be excited about that aspect of it.  Any trade of Paul Pierce will mean the team gets substantially worse in the short term.

That said, if Danny is blowing it up, trading Pierce and perhaps Rondo as well, I would get excited about a young backcourt of Bledsoe and Bradley combining with Sullinger and whoever Danny trades Rondo for.
Quote from: BBallTim
Parker isn't going to score 30 ppg and rebuilds generally take longer than 1 year. Relax.

Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #102 on: January 12, 2013, 03:43:18 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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only trades that make sense to me are with nuggets, Clippers, possibly the bucks, rockets. Bc these teams might be a pierce away to go deep in the playoffs/win a ring and for us, we get key future pieces and give Jeff Green the starting position


In terms of pieces for the future, I think Eric Bledsoe has more value than Wilson Chandler, Timofey Mozgov, Chandler Parsons, Tobias Harris, etc.

The only one that's close is Parsons.  But I don't see the incentive from the Rockets perspective.

Bledsoe is the only one of that group who has star upside.  You mentioned Henson, who is also intriguing, but there's too small a sample size there.  Plus, again, there's no incentive for the Bucks.

Also, any team that Pierce gets traded to would have to be one he'd actually want to spend his last season or three playing for.  Otherwise, he'll probably just retire.
Quote from: BBallTim
Parker isn't going to score 30 ppg and rebuilds generally take longer than 1 year. Relax.

 

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