Author Topic: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!  (Read 6801 times)

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Offline RyNye

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Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #45 on: January 11, 2013, 06:20:56 PM »
That would be pretty awful if Wyc blocked a trade that would benefit the team.

Fortunately, Pierce for Gay straight-up would NOT benefit the team. Even at this age, Pierce is a better player than Gay, and while Gay is younger, he is 26. By this age, it is unlikely that he is going to make a huge leap. He is what he is at this point in his career. And what he is is a worse player than Paul Pierce.

Compare their numbers:

http://www.thenbageek.com/players/compare?utf8=✓&player_ids%5B%5D=15&player_ids%5B%5D=150

Pierce scores more points, grabs more rebounds, is a better passer, has better shooting percentages and points per shot, gets more steals, and draws more fouls. The only categories in which Gay has an edge are blocks (but neither are good shot blockers, and the margin of difference is minimal), turnovers (but Pierce has a higher usage rate, and again, the margin of difference is minimal), and fouls (Pierce plays more physical defense, which results in more fouls).

Why would we make this trade? From a basketball stand-point it doesn't make any sense because Pierce is clearly superior, from a money stand-point it doesn't make any sense because Pierce is on a better contract, and from an "intangibles" stand-point it doesn't make any sense for reasons I am sure I don't have to point out. And this isn't even getting into Gay's injury issues.

I very much hope this trade does not happen, and Wyc would be justified in blocking it from every possible angle.

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Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #46 on: January 11, 2013, 06:21:42 PM »
What team is going to trade the Celtics something of value for Pierce?  Who is a Paul Pierce away from being a contender, THIS year?

  How many contenders wouldn't improve their chances with Paul Pierce on the roster? And who's to say the team that gets him won't want him next year? He's still a top sf.

Offline mctyson

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Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #47 on: January 11, 2013, 06:23:18 PM »
Quote
Team executives involved in exploratory trade talks report that the Knicks (Amar'e Stoudemire), Lakers (Pau Gasol), Raptors (Bargnani) and Celtics (Paul Pierce) are open to discussing their high-profile names. In every case but one, the early indications are that none could be moved without a bad contract going back in return. (In Stoudemire's case, his health and the $45 million left on his contract after this season almost certainly will prevent any deal from happening.) The lone exception, executives say, may be Pierce, whose ruthless scoring prowess and championship experience come with another attractive feature: only $4 million of his $15.3 million salary is guaranteed next season. With the Celtics playing better since Avery Bradley returned from injury, president Danny Ainge once again finds himself trying to determine whether the remnants of the 2007-08 championship team have enough to make one more run. Some rival executives believe the Celtics recently waived Jarvis Varnado and Kris Joseph to create roster flexibility for a potential trade. If Ainge decides to stand pat, a deal involving Pierce -- which would mark the true end of the Big Three era -- could be re-examined around the draft or during free agency.

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/story/21539972/postups-gay-trade-bait-as-grizzlies-maneuver-between-winning-taxes

Say it isn't so.



Danny would not be doing his job if he wasn't "shopping" Pierce.  He is the GM and VP of Personnel.  His job is one thing and one thing only:  to give Doc the absolute best talent he can that gives them the best shot to win Banner 18, and to do so under the owner's financial requirements.

That does NOT mean we are trading him.  Just that Danny is looking to see what is out there on the market for this team now and in the future.  Hypothetically, if the Clippers were to offer Blake Griffin for Pierce would you say no, just because PP is a legend?  Of course not.  Danny is never going to find out if those opportunities exist by shutting his mouth or making players untouchable.

Put me down as someone who is very much against trading Pierce, for a lot of reasons.  But if there was an incredible deal out there to bring us an All Star-worthy player in his mid 20's, who could produce like PP and make this team a serious threat for the title for years to come, I'd do it.  And so would Danny.

And that's why Danny is one of the best in the biz.

Offline Kane3387

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Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #48 on: January 11, 2013, 06:24:54 PM »
What team is going to trade the Celtics something of value for Pierce?  Who is a Paul Pierce away from being a contender, THIS year?

  How many contenders wouldn't improve their chances with Paul Pierce on the roster? And who's to say the team that gets him won't want him next year? He's still a top sf.


Don't see SA doing it but a trade of Kawhi Leonard, Stephen Jackson, and Matt Bonner for Paul Pierce probably wins them a banner this year.

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ab3l6ze

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Offline Jeff

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Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #49 on: January 11, 2013, 06:26:34 PM »
I'm not open to it.  But I'm a sentimentalist.
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Offline ScottHow

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Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #50 on: January 11, 2013, 06:26:50 PM »
That would be pretty awful if Wyc blocked a trade that would benefit the team.

Fortunately, Pierce for Gay straight-up would NOT benefit the team. Even at this age, Pierce is a better player than Gay, and while Gay is younger, he is 26. By this age, it is unlikely that he is going to make a huge leap. He is what he is at this point in his career. And what he is is a worse player than Paul Pierce.

Compare their numbers:

http://www.thenbageek.com/players/compare?utf8=✓&player_ids%5B%5D=15&player_ids%5B%5D=150

Pierce scores more points, grabs more rebounds, is a better passer, has better shooting percentages and points per shot, gets more steals, and draws more fouls. The only categories in which Gay has an edge are blocks (but neither are good shot blockers, and the margin of difference is minimal), turnovers (but Pierce has a higher usage rate, and again, the margin of difference is minimal), and fouls (Pierce plays more physical defense, which results in more fouls).

Why would we make this trade? From a basketball stand-point it doesn't make any sense because Pierce is clearly superior, from a money stand-point it doesn't make any sense because Pierce is on a better contract, and from an "intangibles" stand-point it doesn't make any sense for reasons I am sure I don't have to point out. And this isn't even getting into Gay's injury issues.

I very much hope this trade does not happen, and Wyc would be justified in blocking it from every possible angle.

Well if that trade happened it would be a move looking towards the future.

My intial post wasn't even about a Pierce/Gay trade. It's just about any trade that would benefit the team that would get blocked for sentimental value.

Online PhoSita

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Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #51 on: January 11, 2013, 06:28:29 PM »
What team is going to trade the Celtics something of value for Pierce?  Who is a Paul Pierce away from being a contender, THIS year?

  How many contenders wouldn't improve their chances with Paul Pierce on the roster? And who's to say the team that gets him won't want him next year? He's still a top sf.

Well, look, I wasn't suggesting that teams wouldn't be better than Pierce.  But $15 million is a fairly large salary to match in a deal.  Most contenders would have to break up some of their integral pieces to get him.  Plus, they'd need to give the Celtics a player of some pretty substantial value to convince them to trade.

So we need to be talking about a team that thinks they're a Paul Pierce at SF away from being at least one of the 4-5 teams with the best shot at a championship, and a team that doesn't already have a better player at SF.

That list, to me, includes the following:

Clippers
Spurs

That's it.

And a trade for Pierce doesn't seem like the sort of thing the Spurs would do (they don't tend to make mid-season trades) and it would be difficult to make the salaries match.
"You're never as good as you think you are, you're never as bad as you think you are, and you're never far from either."

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Online PhoSita

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Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #52 on: January 11, 2013, 06:29:43 PM »
What team is going to trade the Celtics something of value for Pierce?  Who is a Paul Pierce away from being a contender, THIS year?

  How many contenders wouldn't improve their chances with Paul Pierce on the roster? And who's to say the team that gets him won't want him next year? He's still a top sf.


Don't see SA doing it but a trade of Kawhi Leonard, Stephen Jackson, and Matt Bonner for Paul Pierce probably wins them a banner this year.

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ab3l6ze

Yeah, it's not their style.  I think it would definitely be a significant upgrade for them.  But there's no way the Celtics are trading Pierce for Kawhi Leonard, basically.
"You're never as good as you think you are, you're never as bad as you think you are, and you're never far from either."

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Offline mctyson

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Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #53 on: January 11, 2013, 06:31:30 PM »
I take solace in the fact that I don't think Wyc would allow this.

I also take solace in the fact that Danny will run all these by Doc, not that Doc has an approval button, but that Doc probably is allowed to give his blessing or not.

Pierce isn't going anywhere I predict.

Offline barefacedmonk

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Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #54 on: January 11, 2013, 06:37:23 PM »
Quote
Would Mark Cuban trade Dirk Nowitzki for Dwight Howard? "No knock on Dwight, I just won't trade Dirk," Cuban told @DavidBaumann33.

I hope Wyc thinks along the same lines when it comes to the Captain.
"An ounce of practice is worth more than tons of preaching." - M.K. Gandhi


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Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #55 on: January 11, 2013, 06:40:48 PM »
Quote
Would Mark Cuban trade Dirk Nowitzki for Dwight Howard? "No knock on Dwight, I just won't trade Dirk," Cuban told @DavidBaumann33.

I hope Wyc thinks along the same lines when it comes to the Captain.

Agreed.  There's a place for loyalty, and yes, sentimentality in sports.  We hear "it's a business" so much that sometimes it's nice to appreciate those times when it isn't.

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Offline gpap

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Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #56 on: January 11, 2013, 06:49:31 PM »
Oh no....the shame! Oh no!

Offline Greenbean

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Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #57 on: January 11, 2013, 07:01:54 PM »
Quote
Would Mark Cuban trade Dirk Nowitzki for Dwight Howard? "No knock on Dwight, I just won't trade Dirk," Cuban told @DavidBaumann33.

I hope Wyc thinks along the same lines when it comes to the Captain.

Agreed.  There's a place for loyalty, and yes, sentimentality in sports.  We hear "it's a business" so much that sometimes it's nice to appreciate those times when it isn't.

Couldn't agree more... Pierce has been an ideal captain and leader for 6 years now...if chemistry fell apart after perk left....imagine this...

Besides...I wouldn't do it for gay...I don't think he has the same passion for the game pierce does.

Offline lon3lytoaster

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Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #58 on: January 11, 2013, 07:04:26 PM »
Why? He's still probably a top-3 SF, certainly top 5. There's really no way of trading him and getting anything close to a suitable replacement.

Offline Celtics18

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Re: Celtics "open to discussing Paul Pierce"?!
« Reply #59 on: January 11, 2013, 07:05:02 PM »
No. 
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