Divide In The Locker Room

[mgent]

Wasn't it Gary Washburn that first reported last year Ray Allen's unhappiness after losing his starting job and almost being traded for OJ Mayo?

Wasn't there absolutely no quotes from Allen, just what most people considered garbage speculation(and yes, I was one of those people) on Washburn's part?

Wasn't Washburn proven to be right after Ray Allen left for Miami and all that stuff came out from Doc, Danny and some others?

Let's not be so fast to dismiss Washburn again as the last time he did this, he was right.

Fair enough, but come on.  This is a non-story.

Just because some guys laugh and joke after a loss, that's supposed to mean they don't care about it and aren't worried about how the team is playing?  I don't care if Washburn is the best in the business, he's not reading anybody's mind.  That could just be their way of dealing.  Obviously KG is going to be furious after losing, that's how he's built.  I don't think we should be worried because everybody isn't taking his lead on that.

And I wouldn't read so much into Pierce's confidence.  Of course he thinks we're going to go on a run, I wouldn't mistake that for complacency.

[Celtics18]

I'm not even going to blame Washburn.  He didn't title his piece; "Divide in the Locker Room."

There's nothing in that article other than reporting that this is a frustrated team.  Surprise!  We weren't going to figure that one out without you, Gary. 

We'll probably get a whole season's worth of speculations over the sources of "the splintered locker room" out of this bit of non-news, though.

That's how it works.  Who's to blame?  Who's the bad seed? 

Nonsense. 

[nickagneta]

Wasn't it Gary Washburn that first reported last year Ray Allen's unhappiness after losing his starting job and almost being traded for OJ Mayo?

Wasn't there absolutely no quotes from Allen, just what most people considered garbage speculation(and yes, I was one of those people) on Washburn's part?

Wasn't Washburn proven to be right after Ray Allen left for Miami and all that stuff came out from Doc, Danny and some others?

Let's not be so fast to dismiss Washburn again as the last time he did this, he was right.

Fair enough, but come on.  This is a non-story.

Just because some guys laugh and joke after a loss, that's supposed to mean they don't care about it and aren't worried about how the team is playing?  I don't care if Washburn is the best in the business, he's not reading anybody's mind.  That could just be their way of dealing.  Obviously KG is going to be furious after losing, that's how he's built.  I don't think we should be worried because everybody isn't taking his lead on that.

And I wouldn't read so much into Pierce's confidence.  Of course he thinks we're going to go on a run, I wouldn't mistake that for complacency.

I tend to agree with you mgent. I thought Washburn's article last year looked like an op-ed and said as much. But he obviously knew stuff going on behind the scenes and didn't have permission to quote anyone.

Maybe the same thing is happening now. Maybe he is just speculating, which is what I think. But I am not 100% sure anymore after how he was the first to report Ray's discontent last year and it looked like wild speculation then.

If there's a major trade where some newer players leave, maybe we will have to revisit Washburn's reporting as more than just speculation.

[Celts Fan 92]

til i heard bout players scrappin dis aint a story man. different personalities react different to losses im sure Jeff Green was one of da guys who was laughin at losses lookin at his twitter account he's a laid back type of dude like dat

[cltc5]

If youre laughing and joking and you've done your job.  Fine.  But if Youre laughing and joking and not doing your job.  Hit the road!

[hpantazo]

Wasn't it Gary Washburn that first reported last year Ray Allen's unhappiness after losing his starting job and almost being traded for OJ Mayo?

Wasn't there absolutely no quotes from Allen, just what most people considered garbage speculation(and yes, I was one of those people) on Washburn's part?

Wasn't Washburn proven to be right after Ray Allen left for Miami and all that stuff came out from Doc, Danny and some others?

Let's not be so fast to dismiss Washburn again as the last time he did this, he was right.

Fair enough, but come on.  This is a non-story.

Just because some guys laugh and joke after a loss, that's supposed to mean they don't care about it and aren't worried about how the team is playing?  I don't care if Washburn is the best in the business, he's not reading anybody's mind.  That could just be their way of dealing.  Obviously KG is going to be furious after losing, that's how he's built.  I don't think we should be worried because everybody isn't taking his lead on that.

And I wouldn't read so much into Pierce's confidence.  Of course he thinks we're going to go on a run, I wouldn't mistake that for complacency.

I tend to agree with you mgent. I thought Washburn's article last year looked like an op-ed and said as much. But he obviously knew stuff going on behind the scenes and didn't have permission to quote anyone.

Maybe the same thing is happening now. Maybe he is just speculating, which is what I think. But I am not 100% sure anymore after how he was the first to report Ray's discontent last year and it looked like wild speculation then.

If there's a major trade where some newer players leave, maybe we will have to revisit Washburn's reporting as more than just speculation.

Washburn has been pretty spot on about his insight into the team imo. I think he does have a relationship with the team where he knows what's going on but can't flat out quote players or coaches or make precise accusations. As you said, he alluded to the Ray Allen issues last year, and he was right. Jackie MacMullen said everyone knew about the Ray Allen issues for a long time. I think he's trying to let us know subtly that KG and some of the vets are not at all happy with the attitudes of some of the new guys on the team. KG had made similar statements over a month ago too, and things apparently got worse since then.

We know KG, Paul and Rondo are the type of players who give everything to win, and take their goal of wining a title extremely seriously. The question is, which guys are not seriously dedicated to winning? I would think Terry is, considering he's a vet who won a ring on Dallas, but I'm having my doubts now about him, the way he's played defense so far. I think Lee is very dedicated. Bass and Green imo look like they are just happy to be in the NBA and getting paid. Sullinger is legit, and dedicated, he's just a rookie though.

[Celtics4ever]

So trade Bass and Green they ought to be able to get something for those two.

[mgent]

Wasn't it Gary Washburn that first reported last year Ray Allen's unhappiness after losing his starting job and almost being traded for OJ Mayo?

Wasn't there absolutely no quotes from Allen, just what most people considered garbage speculation(and yes, I was one of those people) on Washburn's part?

Wasn't Washburn proven to be right after Ray Allen left for Miami and all that stuff came out from Doc, Danny and some others?

Let's not be so fast to dismiss Washburn again as the last time he did this, he was right.

Fair enough, but come on.  This is a non-story.

Just because some guys laugh and joke after a loss, that's supposed to mean they don't care about it and aren't worried about how the team is playing?  I don't care if Washburn is the best in the business, he's not reading anybody's mind.  That could just be their way of dealing.  Obviously KG is going to be furious after losing, that's how he's built.  I don't think we should be worried because everybody isn't taking his lead on that.

And I wouldn't read so much into Pierce's confidence.  Of course he thinks we're going to go on a run, I wouldn't mistake that for complacency.

I tend to agree with you mgent. I thought Washburn's article last year looked like an op-ed and said as much. But he obviously knew stuff going on behind the scenes and didn't have permission to quote anyone.

Maybe the same thing is happening now. Maybe he is just speculating, which is what I think. But I am not 100% sure anymore after how he was the first to report Ray's discontent last year and it looked like wild speculation then.

If there's a major trade where some newer players leave, maybe we will have to revisit Washburn's reporting as more than just speculation.

Bottom line here:  If there is a trade it's not going to have anything to do with players laughing and joking after losses.

I was never contesting, or even saying anything about Washburn's reporting.  He's saying the team needs a change, and it's at a point in time where a trade is very likely, or at least much more likely than Ray leaving by free agency while KG stayed.  Not sure I see the comparison.  And I wouldn't really refer his evaluation of the locker room status as speculation.  I'm sure the players make their emotions abundantly clear.

[hpantazo]

Wasn't it Gary Washburn that first reported last year Ray Allen's unhappiness after losing his starting job and almost being traded for OJ Mayo?

Wasn't there absolutely no quotes from Allen, just what most people considered garbage speculation(and yes, I was one of those people) on Washburn's part?

Wasn't Washburn proven to be right after Ray Allen left for Miami and all that stuff came out from Doc, Danny and some others?

Let's not be so fast to dismiss Washburn again as the last time he did this, he was right.

Fair enough, but come on.  This is a non-story.

Just because some guys laugh and joke after a loss, that's supposed to mean they don't care about it and aren't worried about how the team is playing?  I don't care if Washburn is the best in the business, he's not reading anybody's mind.  That could just be their way of dealing.  Obviously KG is going to be furious after losing, that's how he's built.  I don't think we should be worried because everybody isn't taking his lead on that.

And I wouldn't read so much into Pierce's confidence.  Of course he thinks we're going to go on a run, I wouldn't mistake that for complacency.

I tend to agree with you mgent. I thought Washburn's article last year looked like an op-ed and said as much. But he obviously knew stuff going on behind the scenes and didn't have permission to quote anyone.

Maybe the same thing is happening now. Maybe he is just speculating, which is what I think. But I am not 100% sure anymore after how he was the first to report Ray's discontent last year and it looked like wild speculation then.

If there's a major trade where some newer players leave, maybe we will have to revisit Washburn's reporting as more than just speculation.

Bottom line here:  If there is a trade it's not going to have anything to do with players laughing and joking after losses.

I was never contesting, or even saying anything about Washburn's reporting.  He's saying the team needs a change, and it's at a point in time where a trade is very likely, or at least much more likely than Ray leaving by free agency while KG stayed.  Not sure I see the comparison.  And I wouldn't really refer his evaluation of the locker room status as speculation.  I'm sure the players make their emotions abundantly clear.

I think the laughing and joking after losses is just an example and a subte way of saying some players are just not dedicated to winning like KG, Paul and Rondo are. If that's the case, I believe a guy like KG, giving his all to compete and win one more ring before he retires, would be extremely frustrated when they lose because some players are not really concerned about missing defensive rotations or fighting to get rebounds, loose balls, and shots in the paint instead of jacking up jumpers.

As for players making their emotions clear, the celtics have had a code all throughout the Doc Rivers-Danny Ainge era that internal conflicts stay private, and whatever issues players and coaches have are not discussed publicly.

[ScoobyDoo]

This kind of divide wouldn't suprise me. I remember either Doc or KG saying earlier this year that some guys think they can just put on a Celtic jersey and "be" a Celtic but that truly being a Celtic requires far, far more than that.

That's paraphrased obviously, but this "divide" sounds like just more of the same from what was said earlier this season.

If there are guys in the locker room playing with that attitude, I'd trade them for a fish taco if i had to. I'd rather take it on the chin then deal with that BS.   

[wahz]

I actually read the article and it clearly suggests PP and KG aren't on the same page...as far as their level of concern. Who here wouldn't expect that? I bet PP and Bass are among the guys trying to blow off losses and I highly doubt KG, Rajon and Terry are. Terry is a very serious competitor and and solid locker room guy and there is no way he is taking this lightly THOUGH like Paul he is optimistic by nature.

This all means nothing. Its just as well that some guys freak out and others stay optimistic.

[Celtics18]

Wasn't it Gary Washburn that first reported last year Ray Allen's unhappiness after losing his starting job and almost being traded for OJ Mayo?

Wasn't there absolutely no quotes from Allen, just what most people considered garbage speculation(and yes, I was one of those people) on Washburn's part?

Wasn't Washburn proven to be right after Ray Allen left for Miami and all that stuff came out from Doc, Danny and some others?

Let's not be so fast to dismiss Washburn again as the last time he did this, he was right.

Fair enough, but come on.  This is a non-story.

Just because some guys laugh and joke after a loss, that's supposed to mean they don't care about it and aren't worried about how the team is playing?  I don't care if Washburn is the best in the business, he's not reading anybody's mind.  That could just be their way of dealing.  Obviously KG is going to be furious after losing, that's how he's built.  I don't think we should be worried because everybody isn't taking his lead on that.

And I wouldn't read so much into Pierce's confidence.  Of course he thinks we're going to go on a run, I wouldn't mistake that for complacency.

I tend to agree with you mgent. I thought Washburn's article last year looked like an op-ed and said as much. But he obviously knew stuff going on behind the scenes and didn't have permission to quote anyone.

Maybe the same thing is happening now. Maybe he is just speculating, which is what I think. But I am not 100% sure anymore after how he was the first to report Ray's discontent last year and it looked like wild speculation then.

If there's a major trade where some newer players leave, maybe we will have to revisit Washburn's reporting as more than just speculation.

Oh, come on.  If a trade happens, you are going to credit Washburn for breaking the story based on that piece? 

I've read at least a couple of dozen pieces here on CelticsBlog claiming that a trade of some kind is coming that are more convincing than Gary Washburn's latest.

[hpantazo]

Wasn't it Gary Washburn that first reported last year Ray Allen's unhappiness after losing his starting job and almost being traded for OJ Mayo?

Wasn't there absolutely no quotes from Allen, just what most people considered garbage speculation(and yes, I was one of those people) on Washburn's part?

Wasn't Washburn proven to be right after Ray Allen left for Miami and all that stuff came out from Doc, Danny and some others?

Let's not be so fast to dismiss Washburn again as the last time he did this, he was right.

Fair enough, but come on.  This is a non-story.

Just because some guys laugh and joke after a loss, that's supposed to mean they don't care about it and aren't worried about how the team is playing?  I don't care if Washburn is the best in the business, he's not reading anybody's mind.  That could just be their way of dealing.  Obviously KG is going to be furious after losing, that's how he's built.  I don't think we should be worried because everybody isn't taking his lead on that.

And I wouldn't read so much into Pierce's confidence.  Of course he thinks we're going to go on a run, I wouldn't mistake that for complacency.

I tend to agree with you mgent. I thought Washburn's article last year looked like an op-ed and said as much. But he obviously knew stuff going on behind the scenes and didn't have permission to quote anyone.

Maybe the same thing is happening now. Maybe he is just speculating, which is what I think. But I am not 100% sure anymore after how he was the first to report Ray's discontent last year and it looked like wild speculation then.

If there's a major trade where some newer players leave, maybe we will have to revisit Washburn's reporting as more than just speculation.

Oh, come on.  If a trade happens, you are going to credit Washburn for breaking the story based on that piece? 

I've read at least a couple of dozen pieces here on CelticsBlog claiming that a trade of some kind is coming that are more convincing than Gary Washburn's latest.

I don't think he meant that we should credit Washburn for breaking a trade if it happens. I think he means if a trade does happen, maybe he was right that some players just don't want to compete and there was friction in the locker room. He in no way suggests a trade in the article though.

[mgent]

Wasn't it Gary Washburn that first reported last year Ray Allen's unhappiness after losing his starting job and almost being traded for OJ Mayo?

Wasn't there absolutely no quotes from Allen, just what most people considered garbage speculation(and yes, I was one of those people) on Washburn's part?

Wasn't Washburn proven to be right after Ray Allen left for Miami and all that stuff came out from Doc, Danny and some others?

Let's not be so fast to dismiss Washburn again as the last time he did this, he was right.

Fair enough, but come on.  This is a non-story.

Just because some guys laugh and joke after a loss, that's supposed to mean they don't care about it and aren't worried about how the team is playing?  I don't care if Washburn is the best in the business, he's not reading anybody's mind.  That could just be their way of dealing.  Obviously KG is going to be furious after losing, that's how he's built.  I don't think we should be worried because everybody isn't taking his lead on that.

And I wouldn't read so much into Pierce's confidence.  Of course he thinks we're going to go on a run, I wouldn't mistake that for complacency.

I tend to agree with you mgent. I thought Washburn's article last year looked like an op-ed and said as much. But he obviously knew stuff going on behind the scenes and didn't have permission to quote anyone.

Maybe the same thing is happening now. Maybe he is just speculating, which is what I think. But I am not 100% sure anymore after how he was the first to report Ray's discontent last year and it looked like wild speculation then.

If there's a major trade where some newer players leave, maybe we will have to revisit Washburn's reporting as more than just speculation.

Oh, come on.  If a trade happens, you are going to credit Washburn for breaking the story based on that piece? 

I've read at least a couple of dozen pieces here on CelticsBlog claiming that a trade of some kind is coming that are more convincing than Gary Washburn's latest.

I don't think he meant that we should credit Washburn for breaking a trade if it happens. I think he means if a trade does happen, maybe he was right that some players just don't want to compete and there was friction in the locker room. He in no way suggests a trade in the article though.

How do you figure?  You mean aside from him talking about how the new players are doing more bad than good, titling the artile "Celtics in need of a change," and outright saying it:

There is growing uncertainty as to whether these Celtics are capable of greatness.

That indifference could divide the locker room and force Ainge to make a major move.

Something has to change, and it’s highly unlikely the current Celtics are capable of a resurgence.

“To win, you’ve got to play well,” Rivers said. “Winning is hard. And I don’t know if all our guys get that yet. You have to play hard to win an NBA game, one game. It’s difficult, and we’re not doing it.”

Rivers can’t teach his players to play hard, that has to come from within.

[csfansince60s]

I actually read the article and it clearly suggests PP and KG aren't on the same page...as far as their level of concern. Who here wouldn't expect that? I bet PP and Bass are among the guys trying to blow off losses and I highly doubt KG, Rajon and Terry are. Terry is a very serious competitor and and solid locker room guy and there is no way he is taking this lightly THOUGH like Paul he is optimistic by nature.

This all means nothing. Its just as well that some guys freak out and others stay optimistic.

I agree with the first paragraph but not the second. I think that the differing senses of urgency that Pierce ang KG are feeling do mean something, especially to KG.
 
PP and Rondo feel that they (and the team)can turn it off and on at will. For someone like KG who NEVER turns it off, this can't sit real well.

+1 for the insight of your first paragraph.