Author Topic: I'm not calling for Doc's head, but...  (Read 2624 times)

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Re: I'm not calling for Doc's head, but...
« Reply #15 on: December 30, 2012, 01:39:00 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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I think Danny sees the position of head coach as a long-term one, rather than having a results-oriented, what-have-you-done-for-me-lately viewpoint.  I see Danny viewing Doc a lot the same way that the Pittsburgh Steelers handled Bill Cowher.  In the late 90s, a lot of fans were calling for Cowher's head, but the team stuck with him, and went on to win another Super Bowl.

I've been as frustrated with Doc as anybody, but he's good at building relationships with his players, and we know he can reach the mountain top.  He's won a championship, and arguably he's gotten his team to overachieve in the playoffs in three of the last four years.  Danny was also happy with the way he developed some of the younger guys on the team.  For better or for worse, then, Doc is probably here as long as he wants to be.

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Re: I'm not calling for Doc's head, but...
« Reply #16 on: December 30, 2012, 01:40:22 PM »

Offline Donoghus

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I think Danny sees the position of head coach as a long-term one, rather than having a results-oriented, what-have-you-done-for-me-lately viewpoint.  I see Danny viewing Doc a lot the same way that the Pittsburgh Steelers handled Bill Cowher.  In the late 90s, a lot of fans were calling for Cowher's head, but the team stuck with him, and went on to win another Super Bowl.

I've been as frustrated with Doc as anybody, but he's good at building relationships with his players, and we know he can reach the mountain top.  He's won a championship, and arguably he's gotten his team to overachieve in the playoffs in three of the last four years.  Danny was also happy with the way he developed some of the younger guys on the team.  For better or for worse, then, Doc is probably here as long as he wants to be.

This. 


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Re: I'm not calling for Doc's head, but...
« Reply #17 on: December 30, 2012, 01:55:29 PM »

Offline Lightskinsmurf

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I think Danny sees the position of head coach as a long-term one, rather than having a results-oriented, what-have-you-done-for-me-lately viewpoint.  I see Danny viewing Doc a lot the same way that the Pittsburgh Steelers handled Bill Cowher.  In the late 90s, a lot of fans were calling for Cowher's head, but the team stuck with him, and went on to win another Super Bowl.

I've been as frustrated with Doc as anybody, but he's good at building relationships with his players, and we know he can reach the mountain top.  He's won a championship, and arguably he's gotten his team to overachieve in the playoffs in three of the last four years.  Danny was also happy with the way he developed some of the younger guys on the team.  For better or for worse, then, Doc is probably here as long as he wants to be.

I agree with some of this. I don't think we overachieved tho. I think we underachieved. Only one championship? Considering every year since the big 3 came together was a championship or bust year? That's not overachieving.

Re: I'm not calling for Doc's head, but...
« Reply #18 on: December 30, 2012, 02:02:26 PM »

Offline The4Time2Doctor0

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is can't watch Jason terry anymore and pierce needs his minutes cut. this is docs problem relying on two lame horses.

Re: I'm not calling for Doc's head, but...
« Reply #19 on: December 30, 2012, 02:07:35 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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I think Danny sees the position of head coach as a long-term one, rather than having a results-oriented, what-have-you-done-for-me-lately viewpoint.  I see Danny viewing Doc a lot the same way that the Pittsburgh Steelers handled Bill Cowher.  In the late 90s, a lot of fans were calling for Cowher's head, but the team stuck with him, and went on to win another Super Bowl.

I've been as frustrated with Doc as anybody, but he's good at building relationships with his players, and we know he can reach the mountain top.  He's won a championship, and arguably he's gotten his team to overachieve in the playoffs in three of the last four years.  Danny was also happy with the way he developed some of the younger guys on the team.  For better or for worse, then, Doc is probably here as long as he wants to be.

I agree with some of this. I don't think we overachieved tho. I think we underachieved. Only one championship? Considering every year since the big 3 came together was a championship or bust year? That's not overachieving.

Taking Orlando to 7 games in 2009 with no KG was overachieving.

Reaching the Finals in 2010 -- and leading in the 4th quarter even without Perk in Game 7 -- after finishing 4th in the East was overachieving.

Taking the Heat to 7 games last year in the Eastern Finals was overachieving.

This "championship or bust" talk is silly, and if that's how fans view our team, I guess I feel sorry for them.  Sometimes, you have to honestly assess a team's championship hopes, and tip your cap to them for trying, but falling short.  Outside of the self-inflicted collapse of the 2011 team, every year this team has left it's heart on the floor.

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Re: I'm not calling for Doc's head, but...
« Reply #20 on: December 30, 2012, 02:09:38 PM »

Offline Donoghus

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Given everything, I thought both '09 & last season were overachieving. 



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Re: I'm not calling for Doc's head, but...
« Reply #21 on: December 30, 2012, 04:51:03 PM »

Offline SCeltic34

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I've personally been very critical of Doc this season.  I think he's a good coach who has done a poor job. 

Anyway this thread got me thinking: what about other head coaches around the league who are heading underachieving teams?

Sixers - Even without Bynum, the Sixers have a lot of young, athletic, and talented players on their roster.  But somehow they have a worse record than we do.  At 14-17, I'd say they're underperforming.  Should Doug Collins be fired?

Mavericks - Sure, the Mavs don't have any All-Stars outside of Dirk, who has only recently returned from injury.  The Mavs roster has a lot of solid veterans, but they're having many of the same problems the C's have - poor defense, poor rebounding, and overall (seeming) lack of effort and grit.  The Mavs are 12-18. Should Rick Carlisle be fired?

Nuggets - Typical George Karl team that doesn't play defense, but I see their roster and I think they should be better than 2 games over .500.  Maybe the Nuggets don't qualify as an underachieving team, but they certainly could be better given the quality and depth of their roster.  They have been very inconsistent over the season.  Should Karl be fired?

I think all three of the coaches listed above are very good coaches, especially Collins and Carlisle.  They deserve to be head coaches on their respective teams.  And so does Doc. 

Re: I'm not calling for Doc's head, but...
« Reply #22 on: December 30, 2012, 05:27:19 PM »

Offline Who

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I've personally been very critical of Doc this season.  I think he's a good coach who has done a poor job. 

Anyway this thread got me thinking: what about other head coaches around the league who are heading underachieving teams?

Sixers - Even without Bynum, the Sixers have a lot of young, athletic, and talented players on their roster.  But somehow they have a worse record than we do.  At 14-17, I'd say they're underperforming.  Should Doug Collins be fired?

Mavericks - Sure, the Mavs don't have any All-Stars outside of Dirk, who has only recently returned from injury.  The Mavs roster has a lot of solid veterans, but they're having many of the same problems the C's have - poor defense, poor rebounding, and overall (seeming) lack of effort and grit.  The Mavs are 12-18. Should Rick Carlisle be fired?

Nuggets - Typical George Karl team that doesn't play defense, but I see their roster and I think they should be better than 2 games over .500.  Maybe the Nuggets don't qualify as an underachieving team, but they certainly could be better given the quality and depth of their roster.  They have been very inconsistent over the season.  Should Karl be fired?

I think all three of the coaches listed above are very good coaches, especially Collins and Carlisle.  They deserve to be head coaches on their respective teams.  And so does Doc.

I think Doug Collins has done an incredible job keeping his team alive without Andrew Bynum there. That team has no right to close to .500 right now. I think D.Collins is one of the early Coach of the Year candidates for the job he has been doing with Philly this season. Incredible.

I believe the Nuggets have played a very hard schedule to begin the season. I think they had a huge number of road games vs home games. So there W-L isn't really a surprise. They were expected to start slowly but finish strongly. 2 games above .500 is a fine return on a difficult opening to the season.

Dallas are a good solid team (high 40s win wise) with Dirk in the lineup but without him they are firmly a below .500 team. I thought Carlisle did a great job getting them to punch above their weight (12 wins, 15 losses) for as long as he while they were without Dirk. Now they are just trying to get Dirk back in game shape and work him into the team. Dallas is on the right track because of the quality of their coach.

I don't consider any of those teams to be underachieving.

Boston, on the other hand, are really struggling out there. 
« Last Edit: December 30, 2012, 05:33:51 PM by Who »

Re: I'm not calling for Doc's head, but...
« Reply #23 on: December 30, 2012, 05:33:02 PM »

Offline Lightskinsmurf

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I think Danny sees the position of head coach as a long-term one, rather than having a results-oriented, what-have-you-done-for-me-lately viewpoint.  I see Danny viewing Doc a lot the same way that the Pittsburgh Steelers handled Bill Cowher.  In the late 90s, a lot of fans were calling for Cowher's head, but the team stuck with him, and went on to win another Super Bowl.

I've been as frustrated with Doc as anybody, but he's good at building relationships with his players, and we know he can reach the mountain top.  He's won a championship, and arguably he's gotten his team to overachieve in the playoffs in three of the last four years.  Danny was also happy with the way he developed some of the younger guys on the team.  For better or for worse, then, Doc is probably here as long as he wants to be.

I agree with some of this. I don't think we overachieved tho. I think we underachieved. Only one championship? Considering every year since the big 3 came together was a championship or bust year? That's not overachieving.

Taking Orlando to 7 games in 2009 with no KG was overachieving.

Reaching the Finals in 2010 -- and leading in the 4th quarter even without Perk in Game 7 -- after finishing 4th in the East was overachieving.

Taking the Heat to 7 games last year in the Eastern Finals was overachieving.

This "championship or bust" talk is silly, and if that's how fans view our team, I guess I feel sorry for them.  Sometimes, you have to honestly assess a team's championship hopes, and tip your cap to them for trying, but falling short.  Outside of the self-inflicted collapse of the 2011 team, every year this team has left it's heart on the floor.

I respectfully disagree.

Re: I'm not calling for Doc's head, but...
« Reply #24 on: December 30, 2012, 05:40:24 PM »

Offline vinnie

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And, while some people keep pointing to last year, I believe this team is much more like the self-inflicted collapse team of 2011. As for Doc, he is a good to very good coach who can stay as long as he wants. He is part of the problem this year, but a much bigger problem is the players he has been given to coach.

Re: I'm not calling for Doc's head, but...
« Reply #25 on: December 30, 2012, 06:03:18 PM »

Offline SCeltic34

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I've personally been very critical of Doc this season.  I think he's a good coach who has done a poor job. 

Anyway this thread got me thinking: what about other head coaches around the league who are heading underachieving teams?

Sixers - Even without Bynum, the Sixers have a lot of young, athletic, and talented players on their roster.  But somehow they have a worse record than we do.  At 14-17, I'd say they're underperforming.  Should Doug Collins be fired?

Mavericks - Sure, the Mavs don't have any All-Stars outside of Dirk, who has only recently returned from injury.  The Mavs roster has a lot of solid veterans, but they're having many of the same problems the C's have - poor defense, poor rebounding, and overall (seeming) lack of effort and grit.  The Mavs are 12-18. Should Rick Carlisle be fired?

Nuggets - Typical George Karl team that doesn't play defense, but I see their roster and I think they should be better than 2 games over .500.  Maybe the Nuggets don't qualify as an underachieving team, but they certainly could be better given the quality and depth of their roster.  They have been very inconsistent over the season.  Should Karl be fired?

I think all three of the coaches listed above are very good coaches, especially Collins and Carlisle.  They deserve to be head coaches on their respective teams.  And so does Doc.

I think Doug Collins has done an incredible job keeping his team alive without Andrew Bynum there. That team has no right to close to .500 right now. I think D.Collins is one of the early Coach of the Year candidates for the job he has been doing with Philly this season. Incredible.

I believe the Nuggets have played a very hard schedule to begin the season. I think they had a huge number of road games vs home games. So there W-L isn't really a surprise. They were expected to start slowly but finish strongly. 2 games above .500 is a fine return on a difficult opening to the season.

Dallas are a good solid team (high 40s win wise) with Dirk in the lineup but without him they are firmly a below .500 team. I thought Carlisle did a great job getting them to punch above their weight (12 wins, 15 losses) for as long as he while they were without Dirk. Now they are just trying to get Dirk back in game shape and work him into the team. Dallas is on the right track because of the quality of their coach.

I don't consider any of those teams to be underachieving.

Boston, on the other hand, are really struggling out there.

Philly is 2-8 in their last 10 games.  They've had a tough schedule and did manage to beat Memphis, but they've been struggling.  They even lost to us back on the 8th ;p.  Considering their roster, even without Bynum, I would definitely say that they are underachieving.

Dallas also is 2-8 in their last 10, but they've played the Heat, Grizzlies, Spurs, Thunder, and Nuggets in their last 5 games, so I'll cut them some slack.

 

Re: I'm not calling for Doc's head, but...
« Reply #26 on: December 30, 2012, 06:39:12 PM »

Offline j804

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I think Danny sees the position of head coach as a long-term one, rather than having a results-oriented, what-have-you-done-for-me-lately viewpoint.  I see Danny viewing Doc a lot the same way that the Pittsburgh Steelers handled Bill Cowher.  In the late 90s, a lot of fans were calling for Cowher's head, but the team stuck with him, and went on to win another Super Bowl.

I've been as frustrated with Doc as anybody, but he's good at building relationships with his players, and we know he can reach the mountain top.  He's won a championship, and arguably he's gotten his team to overachieve in the playoffs in three of the last four years.  Danny was also happy with the way he developed some of the younger guys on the team.  For better or for worse, then, Doc is probably here as long as he wants to be.

I agree with some of this. I don't think we overachieved tho. I think we underachieved. Only one championship? Considering every year since the big 3 came together was a championship or bust year? That's not overachieving.

Taking Orlando to 7 games in 2009 with no KG was overachieving.

Reaching the Finals in 2010 -- and leading in the 4th quarter even without Perk in Game 7 -- after finishing 4th in the East was overachieving.

Taking the Heat to 7 games last year in the Eastern Finals was overachieving.

This "championship or bust" talk is silly, and if that's how fans view our team, I guess I feel sorry for them.  Sometimes, you have to honestly assess a team's championship hopes, and tip your cap to them for trying, but falling short.  Outside of the self-inflicted collapse of the 2011 team, every year this team has left it's heart on the floor.
I agree spot on Roy, yea I'll criticize Doc as with the players they are all at fault and deserve some blame do not want him fired though. As long as KG is here dont think Doc is going anywhere.


Re: I'm not calling for Doc's head, but...
« Reply #27 on: December 30, 2012, 10:17:49 PM »

Offline scaryjerry

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doc has been exposed this season...like him but he's not a great coach like he's been credited with in recent years...Tom thibodeau was the genius behind our finals teams

we did quite well the last 2 years without Thibs
yeah..lose before the finals after mediocre regular seasons(both seasons where thibs teams finished first). losing thibs was rough... an actual coach to go along with docs managing of personalities
« Last Edit: December 30, 2012, 10:38:16 PM by scaryjerry »

Re: I'm not calling for Doc's head, but...
« Reply #28 on: December 30, 2012, 10:56:02 PM »

Offline dark_lord

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Taking Orlando to 7 games in 2009 with no KG was overachieving.

Reaching the Finals in 2010 -- and leading in the 4th quarter even without Perk in Game 7 -- after finishing 4th in the East was overachieving.

Taking the Heat to 7 games last year in the Eastern Finals was overachieving.

This "championship or bust" talk is silly, and if that's how fans view our team, I guess I feel sorry for them.  Sometimes, you have to honestly assess a team's championship hopes, and tip your cap to them for trying, but falling short.  Outside of the self-inflicted collapse of the 2011 team, every year this team has left it's heart on the floor.


Re: I'm not calling for Doc's head, but...
« Reply #29 on: December 30, 2012, 11:29:22 PM »

Offline The Rondo Show

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It seems as though Doc has lost control of this team. No effort, no passion, it's brutal
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