Author Topic: Brooklyn Nets fire coach Avery Johnson  (Read 4696 times)

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Re: Brooklyn Nets fire coach Avery Johnson
« Reply #60 on: December 27, 2012, 05:33:07 PM »

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Would love to see Jackson be there and fail.

Funny thing is the GM is Billy King, say guy who messed up Philly.

Re: Brooklyn Nets fire coach Avery Johnson
« Reply #61 on: December 27, 2012, 05:54:42 PM »

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Iso Joe + Deron is a TERRIBLE combination unless you consistently give Joe the ball late in the clock. Also, as many have noted, Lopez and Humphries can score points, but they don't do much else. You don't just throw talented offensive players together and expect to get a top team, especially not with Deron Williams' game falling off the table the past few years. The Nets were all-hype...a 5-8 seed team being sold as a legit contender. Not surprised they're struggling.

I'd say this is spot on.  The roster is a defensive nightmare and the pieces fit together so poorly offensively.  It's more of a "fantasy basketball" team than a real basketball team.  Who protects the rim?  Who defends quick big men? Who can run pick and roll with DeRon? Who spaces the floor for Lopez to operate in the post?  It is such an awful fit.

The problem, as Fafnir pointed out, is this roster is stuck in place.  Well above the tax and on long contracts.  The (flawed) roster can't change, so desperation says to change the coach.  Brooklyn is destined to be a mediocre 6 or 7 seed or so for the next 5 or 6 years.

Have to double agree with both of these. Not only are they are terrible fit together, but they are so DUMB, it actually ticks me off to watch these guys play against one another.

I disagree, I think only one piece doesn't fit (Humphries) and when (if) they fix that problem ... Brooklyn will be a force in the East.

I really like the Deron + JJ + G.Wallace + B.Lopez mix. Now they need a Varejao type to round it out. To provide that high level interior defense and rebounding presence they sorely need alongside B.Lopez' highly skilled offensive game.

Re: Brooklyn Nets fire coach Avery Johnson
« Reply #62 on: December 27, 2012, 06:43:28 PM »

Offline Rtpas11

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word has it... Jay said "They're getting Phil Jackson" Joe Johnson is about to go off in that Triangle Offense
"I'm tired of being the everything that gets nothing"

Re: Brooklyn Nets fire coach Avery Johnson
« Reply #63 on: December 27, 2012, 06:53:35 PM »

Offline celtsfan84

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Iso Joe + Deron is a TERRIBLE combination unless you consistently give Joe the ball late in the clock. Also, as many have noted, Lopez and Humphries can score points, but they don't do much else. You don't just throw talented offensive players together and expect to get a top team, especially not with Deron Williams' game falling off the table the past few years. The Nets were all-hype...a 5-8 seed team being sold as a legit contender. Not surprised they're struggling.

I'd say this is spot on.  The roster is a defensive nightmare and the pieces fit together so poorly offensively.  It's more of a "fantasy basketball" team than a real basketball team.  Who protects the rim?  Who defends quick big men? Who can run pick and roll with DeRon? Who spaces the floor for Lopez to operate in the post?  It is such an awful fit.

The problem, as Fafnir pointed out, is this roster is stuck in place.  Well above the tax and on long contracts.  The (flawed) roster can't change, so desperation says to change the coach.  Brooklyn is destined to be a mediocre 6 or 7 seed or so for the next 5 or 6 years.

Have to double agree with both of these. Not only are they are terrible fit together, but they are so DUMB, it actually ticks me off to watch these guys play against one another.

I disagree, I think only one piece doesn't fit (Humphries) and when (if) they fix that problem ... Brooklyn will be a force in the East.

I really like the Deron + JJ + G.Wallace + B.Lopez mix. Now they need a Varejao type to round it out. To provide that high level interior defense and rebounding presence they sorely need alongside B.Lopez' highly skilled offensive game.

Maybe so.  Their pieces still really don't fit.

As a comparison, our Big 3 era lineup (Rondo, Ray, Paul, KG,Perkins) fit like a glove.
-Ray, KG, and Paul all spaced the floor for Rondo's penetration
-Rondo and KG or Paul and KG were lethal "pick your poison" combinations on pick and rolls
-Ray and Paul spaced the floor for KG's post game
-Perkins handled put back, screens, and the offensive glass

All 5 players had a defined role, there was little overlap.  Each brought something different and necessary to the table.  Brooklyn's roster doesn't do that. 

What exactly does Gerald Wallace or Brook Lopez bring on offense when Joe Johnson is working an ISO?  Poor outside shooting?

What exactly does anyone on the roster bring when Lopez is posting up?

Which big man runs pick and roll with DeRon or Joe?  The slow footed Lopez?

Varejao is a pretty high level role player.  A lot of teams would be really good if they added someone like him (Boston included).  And a team like Brooklyn, with aging stars, expensive and long contracts, and no flexibility, has no way of getting that final piece.  It is mission impossible to add Varejao or someone like him.

Re: Brooklyn Nets fire coach Avery Johnson
« Reply #64 on: December 27, 2012, 07:44:57 PM »

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I would liken the Nets somewhat to the 1990s Indiana Pacers.

With Brook Lopez in that Rik Smits role (very strong offensive threat with inside-outside game, below average but passable defender/rebounder). Gerald Wallace in the Derrick McKey role (high level defender, quality possession creator, auxiliary scorer). The PF position (the Humphries replacement) needs to be a Dale Davis type player (high level physical interior defender/rebounder).

And then with Deron Williams and Joe Johnson as a high powered backcourt (different and more effective than R.Miller and M.Jackson).



I think Joe Johnson is one of the most versatile scorers in the league. He is a very good jump-shooter from all over the court (close range, midrange, long two point, three point threat). He can space the floor. He has a lethal post-up game. He is a very strong ball-handler and passer. A very effective pull-up jumper off the dribble. Play pick and roll basketball. Effective on and off the ball due to his ball-handling and shooting ability. Not that good in transition anymore but an effective trailer and occasional finisher. At 6 foot 8 230lbs, JJ is a matchup nightmare for most two guards in the league.

I also think Deron Williams is one of the most well rounded scorers and overall point guards in basketball. He does pretty much everything on the court at a good to very strong level.

I consider Brook Lopez a really good pick and roll player because he is such a strong finisher around the rim (great touch around the basket, excellent size/frame) and because he can pick and pop as well as pick and roll. I think he works well with Deron or JJ there.

I think those three give Brooklyn a very strong base offensively to build their team around. I like the options they create and their capacity to play alongside one another due to the scoring versatility of Joe Johnson and Deron Williams + the inside/outside game of Brook Lopez. I blame Avery Johnson for the Nets disjointed offense so far.



Gerald Wallace should play both SF and PF minutes for New Jersey. When they need to matchup against quicker teams or want to create matchup problems for their opponents, they should switch G-Wallace there and up the tempo offensively and defensively.

They will be more of a slower team, a power based team, while Gerald Wallace is at the three. A very big perimeter trio and a center with good size. Hopefully someday a PF with good size. When they move Gerald Wallace to the four, that is where/when most of their transition opportunities will be.



I really like Mirza Teletovic on their bench. At 6-8 230lbs and another well-rounded scorer with shooting ability and a post up game. A good shot-creator. I think they have a strong offensive option there behind G-Wallace to put in a small-ball lineup alongside G-Wallace (PF). Very disappointed by his lack of minutes so far.

CJ Watson is a good two-way backup point guard. Blatche is a strong backup center. Very few, if any, backup centers possess the skill-level and offensive talent that Blatche brings to the table. A matchup problem. Marshon Brooks has shown some potential as a scorer. Not wild about Reggie Evans but he has some redeeming qualities (terrific rebounder, physical toughness, nastiness). So there is a fair bit of talent on the bench already.



They are just one piece shy. A big piece. A Dale Davis (Anderson Varejao) level piece. You could call that player a high level player if you want or a low level star (may be more fitting considering their impact). either way, a really important player. Both of those are/where clearly very effective players. It's no small addition. It's a very significant piece of the puzzle and no sure thing that they'll be able to land that piece.

But if they get that piece, I would consider them a title contender. I think that is the final piece that when added to their current core puts them in the title mix. So they are not that far away. They are not a title contender today but they have a strong base there (Deron, JJ, B.Lopez, G.Wallace) that is close to being where they want to get to.

Now we'll just need to wait and see if they can get a bit of luck and pull it off. Land that final piece they need to complete their team. To take them to that next level.



I think this Kris Humphries situation will play a big role. They don't have that many (trade) assets. So he is a big variable here. As a trade asset.

What they get in return for him could play a huge role in deciding whether they can make (or not) an attractive offer for that final piece of their starting lineup (maybe not now but down the road).

Re: Brooklyn Nets fire coach Avery Johnson
« Reply #65 on: December 27, 2012, 08:10:36 PM »

Offline moiso

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Another thing the Nets are missing- a huge thing- is a leader.  The pacers were Reggie's team.  One would assume that Deron Williams should be the leader but it hasn't appeared that's the case so far.

Re: Brooklyn Nets fire coach Avery Johnson
« Reply #66 on: December 27, 2012, 08:17:44 PM »

Offline jdz101

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D-will was probably whining to management about Avery.

What a poison that guy is to basketball teams.


how much wood would a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck was chris bosh?

Re: Brooklyn Nets fire coach Avery Johnson
« Reply #67 on: December 27, 2012, 08:32:36 PM »

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I don't like to see him fired, but he isn't a good coach....this team has everything it needs, and humphries is a strong player, rebounds, scores...defends....
Lopez is an odd center....plays like he is shorter...and brings the ball down when he should keep it up...kendrick perkins disease....but overall it is a very solid team...as i always said deron is not 1/2 as good as rondo...

Re: Brooklyn Nets fire coach Avery Johnson
« Reply #68 on: December 27, 2012, 09:01:32 PM »

Offline Boris Badenov

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Anyone else feel not quite so good anymore about our big victory a couple of days ago?

Re: Brooklyn Nets fire coach Avery Johnson
« Reply #69 on: December 27, 2012, 09:10:40 PM »

Offline Celts Fan 92

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http://basketball.realgm.com/blog/225247/

"Hours away from Avery Johnson’s firing, Deron Williams sat on the far end of the locker room late Wednesday night, wearing a suit and playing games on his electronic products. The Brooklyn Nets had just dropped to .500 with a punctuating 15-point loss to the Bucks, and Williams was at ease, disengaged with his teammates and spent most of the night trying to beat a team family member in these little games.

There were players downright seething Wednesday night about the freefall that’s taking place right now. These are veterans openly questioning where the commitment has gone, the team’s fifth-leading scorer, Gerald Wallace, having to be the one to send messages to his teammates about their selfishness, about how they should hate losing too."


just a small piece from dat article like i said earlier they quit on Avery. D-Will aint no leader he's losin points smh

Re: Brooklyn Nets fire coach Avery Johnson
« Reply #70 on: December 27, 2012, 09:25:54 PM »

Offline syfy9

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http://basketball.realgm.com/blog/225247/

"Hours away from Avery Johnson’s firing, Deron Williams sat on the far end of the locker room late Wednesday night, wearing a suit and playing games on his electronic products. The Brooklyn Nets had just dropped to .500 with a punctuating 15-point loss to the Bucks, and Williams was at ease, disengaged with his teammates and spent most of the night trying to beat a team family member in these little games.

There were players downright seething Wednesday night about the freefall that’s taking place right now. These are veterans openly questioning where the commitment has gone, the team’s fifth-leading scorer, Gerald Wallace, having to be the one to send messages to his teammates about their selfishness, about how they should hate losing too."


just a small piece from dat article like i said earlier they quit on Avery. D-Will aint no leader he's losin points smh

It's the doodle jump, man. It's addicting.
I like Marcus Smart

Re: Brooklyn Nets fire coach Avery Johnson
« Reply #71 on: December 27, 2012, 09:28:51 PM »

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http://basketball.realgm.com/blog/225247/

"Hours away from Avery Johnson’s firing, Deron Williams sat on the far end of the locker room late Wednesday night, wearing a suit and playing games on his electronic products. The Brooklyn Nets had just dropped to .500 with a punctuating 15-point loss to the Bucks, and Williams was at ease, disengaged with his teammates and spent most of the night trying to beat a team family member in these little games.

There were players downright seething Wednesday night about the freefall that’s taking place right now. These are veterans openly questioning where the commitment has gone, the team’s fifth-leading scorer, Gerald Wallace, having to be the one to send messages to his teammates about their selfishness, about how they should hate losing too."


just a small piece from dat article like i said earlier they quit on Avery. D-Will aint no leader he's losin points smh

all I know is, if most of us went to work and played video games while our company failed to meet a goal, we would be fired.

Re: Brooklyn Nets fire coach Avery Johnson
« Reply #72 on: December 27, 2012, 09:31:33 PM »

Offline pearljammer10

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http://basketball.realgm.com/blog/225247/

"Hours away from Avery Johnson’s firing, Deron Williams sat on the far end of the locker room late Wednesday night, wearing a suit and playing games on his electronic products. The Brooklyn Nets had just dropped to .500 with a punctuating 15-point loss to the Bucks, and Williams was at ease, disengaged with his teammates and spent most of the night trying to beat a team family member in these little games.

There were players downright seething Wednesday night about the freefall that’s taking place right now. These are veterans openly questioning where the commitment has gone, the team’s fifth-leading scorer, Gerald Wallace, having to be the one to send messages to his teammates about their selfishness, about how they should hate losing too."


just a small piece from dat article like i said earlier they quit on Avery. D-Will aint no leader he's losin points smh

Never understood the DWill hype. Now his true colors are showing this season. Looks over weight, out of shape, and just getting worse. Ive Always had Rondo above Dwill and it looks like its finally becoming definitely clear.

Re: Brooklyn Nets fire coach Avery Johnson
« Reply #73 on: December 27, 2012, 09:36:46 PM »

Offline soap07

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Quote
He won't do it, but I would LOVE to see Phil take this job and tarnish his legacy, so that the rest of the world can clearly see how poor of a coach he really is.

11 rings. 11. A poor coach doesn't win 11 rings. It wouldn't make a single difference to his legacy if he lost every game as a coach of the Nets.

Re: Brooklyn Nets fire coach Avery Johnson
« Reply #74 on: December 27, 2012, 09:37:51 PM »

Offline Celts Fan 92

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http://basketball.realgm.com/blog/225247/

"Hours away from Avery Johnson’s firing, Deron Williams sat on the far end of the locker room late Wednesday night, wearing a suit and playing games on his electronic products. The Brooklyn Nets had just dropped to .500 with a punctuating 15-point loss to the Bucks, and Williams was at ease, disengaged with his teammates and spent most of the night trying to beat a team family member in these little games.

There were players downright seething Wednesday night about the freefall that’s taking place right now. These are veterans openly questioning where the commitment has gone, the team’s fifth-leading scorer, Gerald Wallace, having to be the one to send messages to his teammates about their selfishness, about how they should hate losing too."


just a small piece from dat article like i said earlier they quit on Avery. D-Will aint no leader he's losin points smh

Never understood the DWill hype. Now his true colors are showing this season. Looks over weight, out of shape, and just getting worse. Ive Always had Rondo above Dwill and it looks like its finally becoming definitely clear.
yea man cant believe people had him as da 2nd best PG. dude aint no winner nd admitted he was a system PG. if he cant get it done dis year his elite label should be removed

 

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