Author Topic: US Constitution / Gun Law Talk (Merged Threads)  (Read 14586 times)

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Re: US Constitution / Gun Law Talk (Merged Threads)
« Reply #75 on: December 21, 2012, 11:21:25 AM »

Offline indeedproceed

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Anyone who thought the NRA's event today would be a classy even handed look at tragedy and a frank self-examination of firearm regulation and its role in the shootings...well let's just say you didn't win the pool.

Whoever thought it would be a hyperbolic crazy-fest of wild unsubstantiated claims, please claim your prize at the back bar.

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Re: US Constitution / Gun Law Talk (Merged Threads)
« Reply #76 on: December 21, 2012, 11:35:30 AM »

Offline The4Time2Doctor0

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 I would love for the NRA to explain to me the difference between responsible gun ownership and responsible playing/viewing of violent video games and movies? these clowns just did a great disservice to responsible gun owners. talk about being completely out of touch. its time for these old buttholes to go away. wow, I knew they didn't get it, but I still can't believe what I just listened to. all they said is its everybody's fault but ours. clowns. clowns.

Re: US Constitution / Gun Law Talk (Merged Threads)
« Reply #77 on: December 21, 2012, 12:11:36 PM »

Online colincb

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I would love for the NRA to explain to me the difference between responsible gun ownership and responsible playing/viewing of violent video games and movies? these clowns just did a great disservice to responsible gun owners. talk about being completely out of touch. its time for these old buttholes to go away. wow, I knew they didn't get it, but I still can't believe what I just listened to. all they said is its everybody's fault but ours. clowns. clowns.
You mean more guns won't result in fewer gun deaths?  How socialist of you.

Re: US Constitution / Gun Law Talk (Merged Threads)
« Reply #78 on: December 21, 2012, 12:14:52 PM »

Online KGs Knee

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Today's statements by the NRA need to be viewed in two parts.

Yes, some of the staements made towards assigning blame seemed out of place a bit.  Take from that what you will.

The second part, which I think deserves more attention, deals with protecting our schools better.

We have armed guards at airports, courthouses, and other govenrment buildings.  The reason for this is to protect people from danger.  Why should we not protect our children as well?

Another point I often wonder about, and it somewhat related to the above, deals with where many of these shooting s take place.  Just based on simple observation, it seems most take place in suburban or rural areas.  You don't hear of very many occurences in urban areas.  Coincidentally, most inner-city schools have armed police.

Re: US Constitution / Gun Law Talk (Merged Threads)
« Reply #79 on: December 21, 2012, 03:10:51 PM »

Offline indeedproceed

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Here is a former army sniper on gun control, and his reasoning behind it:

http://soundcloud.com/onpointradio/caller-frank-on-gun-control

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Re: US Constitution / Gun Law Talk (Merged Threads)
« Reply #80 on: December 21, 2012, 04:47:09 PM »

Online hpantazo

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Anyone who thought the NRA's event today would be a classy even handed look at tragedy and a frank self-examination of firearm regulation and its role in the shootings...well let's just say you didn't win the pool.

Whoever thought it would be a hyperbolic crazy-fest of wild unsubstantiated claims, please claim your prize at the back bar.

Wow, the NRA had a chance to show some class, compassion, and leadership on a major issue, and threw it all away. What an awful response to the recent tragic events. Seriously? Putting armed police offers in every school is the proposed solution!?! That's just terrible. Turn our school systems and our society into a police state with armed officers at every corner to protect from all of the armed crazy people, yea, that really helps  ::)

It would be a dream come true for the NRA of course, the amount of gun sales would skyrocket.

Re: US Constitution / Gun Law Talk (Merged Threads)
« Reply #81 on: December 21, 2012, 04:59:43 PM »

Online colincb

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Today's statements by the NRA need to be viewed in two parts.

Yes, some of the staements made towards assigning blame seemed out of place a bit.  Take from that what you will.

The second part, which I think deserves more attention, deals with protecting our schools better.

We have armed guards at airports, courthouses, and other govenrment buildings.  The reason for this is to protect people from danger.  Why should we not protect our children as well?

Another point I often wonder about, and it somewhat related to the above, deals with where many of these shooting s take place.  Just based on simple observation, it seems most take place in suburban or rural areas.  You don't hear of very many occurences in urban areas.  Coincidentally, most inner-city schools have armed police.
... and most of them are semi-retired from my personal observation, just like a lot of rent-a-cops that I've used myself. They're useless against professionals or some nut who comes in with guns blazing. We'd need well-trained armed guards everywhere including day care centers, grocery stores, Chucky Cheese, movie theatres, churches, schools, etc ad infinitum wherever people congregate OR we get rid of the semi-automatics that multiply the power of evil.  The latter is a lot cheaper alternative without the military state. I've travelled to countries where there are arms everywhere and it's not something I want to see here just to placate the nitwit who thinks he can fend off an army only to have their whackjob offspring use the semi-automatics to slaughter innocents.

Re: US Constitution / Gun Law Talk (Merged Threads)
« Reply #82 on: December 21, 2012, 05:11:35 PM »

Online hpantazo

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Today's statements by the NRA need to be viewed in two parts.

Yes, some of the staements made towards assigning blame seemed out of place a bit.  Take from that what you will.

The second part, which I think deserves more attention, deals with protecting our schools better.

We have armed guards at airports, courthouses, and other govenrment buildings.  The reason for this is to protect people from danger.  Why should we not protect our children as well?

Another point I often wonder about, and it somewhat related to the above, deals with where many of these shooting s take place.  Just based on simple observation, it seems most take place in suburban or rural areas.  You don't hear of very many occurences in urban areas.  Coincidentally, most inner-city schools have armed police.
... and most of them are semi-retired from my personal observation, just like a lot of rent-a-cops that I've used myself. They're useless against professionals or some nut who comes in with guns blazing. We'd need well-trained armed guards everywhere including day care centers, grocery stores, Chucky Cheese, movie theatres, churches, schools, etc ad infinitum wherever people congregate OR we get rid of the semi-automatics that multiply the power of evil.  The latter is a lot cheaper alternative without the military state. I've travelled to countries where there are arms everywhere and it's not something I want to see here just to placate the nitwit who thinks he can fend off an army only to have their whackjob offspring use the semi-automatics to slaughter innocents.

that's right, I mean, do people really believe that if you put armed guards at schools the shooters won't attack playgrounds, Chucky Cheese, movie theaters, malls, etc.? It would quickly escalate to having armed guards literally everywhere. That's not the type of society I want to live in.

Re: US Constitution / Gum Law Talk (Merged Threads)
« Reply #83 on: December 21, 2012, 05:16:12 PM »

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If we don't need guns because people will act irrationally, then we should follow that logic and mandate no car can go over 55. Nobody needs to drive faster than that anyway.

The car to gun analogy is ridiculous.

Guns are made to fire projectiles at lethal speed. Cars are transportation devices. In order to obtain a driver's license, I have to sit through a written exam and a road exam. My car has to meet safety and emission standards. Owning and operating a car is outrageously more regulated than owning an operating a gun.


Tangent:I would much rather see gun ownership face a tobacco style escalation of taxes and restrictions than armed guards posted at every public place.
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Re: US Constitution / Gun Law Talk (Merged Threads)
« Reply #84 on: December 21, 2012, 06:32:17 PM »

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"According to a 2002 Secret Service study of 41 targeted school attacks, in 8% of the incidents, a law enforcement officer ended the violence. In most cases, researchers noted, the attack was so quick that it could not be stopped."

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2012/12/21/nra-newtown-police-in-schools/1784953/

Re: US Constitution / Gum Law Talk (Merged Threads)
« Reply #85 on: December 21, 2012, 06:44:34 PM »

Offline Bombastic Jones

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If we don't need guns because people will act irrationally, then we should follow that logic and mandate no car can go over 55. Nobody needs to drive faster than that anyway.

The car to gun analogy is ridiculous.

Guns are made to fire projectiles at lethal speed. Cars are transportation devices. In order to obtain a driver's license, I have to sit through a written exam and a road exam. My car has to meet safety and emission standards. Owning and operating a car is outrageously more regulated than owning an operating a gun.


Tangent:I would much rather see gun ownership face a tobacco style escalation of taxes and restrictions than armed guards posted at every public place.

I think a steep Pigovian tax; restrictions; and at least as much licensing as it takes to drive.

As for the NRA solution, three things:

1) Columbine had armed guards, it didnt help there and most likely would not help in future situations;
2) Would the NRA agree to a gun/ammo tax to pay for the armed guards?;
3) the "school to prison pipeline" is a crappy thing, putting more cops in schools would increase this problem.

Re: US Constitution / Gun Law Talk (Merged Threads)
« Reply #86 on: December 21, 2012, 08:44:33 PM »

Online nickagneta

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Wasnt there trained professionals that were well armed at Camp Hood? Shooter then was still able to kill 12 and injured 20 before all those trained soldiers with guns were able to get to him and take him out.

Re: US Constitution / Gun Law Talk (Merged Threads)
« Reply #87 on: December 21, 2012, 09:26:55 PM »

Offline celtsfan619

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A LITTLE GUN HISTORY

In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control. >From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated
In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, a total
of 13 million Jews and others who were unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated.
China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated
Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million educated people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control: 56 million.
You won't see this data on the US evening news, or hear politicians disseminating this information.
Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws adversely affect only the law-abiding citizens.
Take note my fellow Americans, before it's too late!
The next time someone talks in favor of gun control, please remind them of this history lesson.
With guns, we are 'citizens'. Without them, we are 'subjects'.
During WWII the Japanese decided not to invade America because they knew most Americans were ARMED!
SWITZERLAND ISSUES EVERY HOUSEHOLD A GUN!
SWITZERLAND'S GOVERNMENT TRAINS EVERY ADULT THEY ISSUE A RIFLE.
SWITZERLAND HAS THE LOWEST GUN RELATED CRIME RATE OF ANY CIVILIZED COUNTRY IN THE WORLD!!!
IT'S A NO BRAINER!
OUR GOVERNMENT WOULD JUST BE WASTING MILLIONS OF OUR TAX DOLLARS IN AN EFFORT TO MAKE ALL LAW ABIDING CITIZENS AN EASY TARGET FOR ANY OF OUR MANY ENEMIES.
the solution to this problem isn't in reforming gun laws

Re: US Constitution / Gun Law Talk (Merged Threads)
« Reply #88 on: December 22, 2012, 08:35:45 PM »

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A LITTLE GUN HISTORY

In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control. >From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated
In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, a total
of 13 million Jews and others who were unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated.
China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated
Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million educated people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control: 56 million.
You won't see this data on the US evening news, or hear politicians disseminating this information.
Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws adversely affect only the law-abiding citizens.
Take note my fellow Americans, before it's too late!
The next time someone talks in favor of gun control, please remind them of this history lesson.
With guns, we are 'citizens'. Without them, we are 'subjects'.
During WWII the Japanese decided not to invade America because they knew most Americans were ARMED!
SWITZERLAND ISSUES EVERY HOUSEHOLD A GUN!
SWITZERLAND'S GOVERNMENT TRAINS EVERY ADULT THEY ISSUE A RIFLE.
SWITZERLAND HAS THE LOWEST GUN RELATED CRIME RATE OF ANY CIVILIZED COUNTRY IN THE WORLD!!!
IT'S A NO BRAINER!
OUR GOVERNMENT WOULD JUST BE WASTING MILLIONS OF OUR TAX DOLLARS IN AN EFFORT TO MAKE ALL LAW ABIDING CITIZENS AN EASY TARGET FOR ANY OF OUR MANY ENEMIES.
the solution to this problem isn't in reforming gun laws

A) Correlation does not equate to causation
B) Seriously, dude? So Switzerland's low gun crime rate has nothing to do with how homogeneous they are, the relatively low population, and several bazillion other factor, but is only due to the guns in every home?
Quote from: Mark Cuban
The thing about dealing with the media in this business is that they thrive on rumors and get bored with reality.

Re: US Constitution / Gun Law Talk (Merged Threads)
« Reply #89 on: December 22, 2012, 09:13:26 PM »

Online JSD

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A LITTLE GUN HISTORY

In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control. >From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated
In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, a total
of 13 million Jews and others who were unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated.
China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated
Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million educated people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control: 56 million.
You won't see this data on the US evening news, or hear politicians disseminating this information.
Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws adversely affect only the law-abiding citizens.
Take note my fellow Americans, before it's too late!
The next time someone talks in favor of gun control, please remind them of this history lesson.
With guns, we are 'citizens'. Without them, we are 'subjects'.
During WWII the Japanese decided not to invade America because they knew most Americans were ARMED!
SWITZERLAND ISSUES EVERY HOUSEHOLD A GUN!
SWITZERLAND'S GOVERNMENT TRAINS EVERY ADULT THEY ISSUE A RIFLE.
SWITZERLAND HAS THE LOWEST GUN RELATED CRIME RATE OF ANY CIVILIZED COUNTRY IN THE WORLD!!!
IT'S A NO BRAINER!
OUR GOVERNMENT WOULD JUST BE WASTING MILLIONS OF OUR TAX DOLLARS IN AN EFFORT TO MAKE ALL LAW ABIDING CITIZENS AN EASY TARGET FOR ANY OF OUR MANY ENEMIES.
the solution to this problem isn't in reforming gun laws

Amen! TP.

 

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