Author Topic: what would you give up for Anderson Varejao?  (Read 3965 times)

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Re: what would you give up for Anderson Varejao?
« Reply #60 on: December 05, 2012, 05:26:09 PM »

Offline LooseCannon

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So according to Chad Ford Kawhi Leonard isn't enough to land Varejao.  The original thought added Blair and Bonnar, which I gather from Ford's tone isn't enough either.

I think the claim that the Cavs would want multiple young assets is a reasonable one.  It is reasonable to think that Cleveland would hold out for that level of return and it is reasonable to think that Cleveland should hold out for that level of return.
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Re: what would you give up for Anderson Varejao?
« Reply #61 on: December 05, 2012, 05:31:49 PM »

Offline Chris

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So according to Chad Ford Kawhi Leonard isn't enough to land Varejao.  The original thought added Blair and Bonnar, which I gather from Ford's tone isn't enough either.

I think the claim that the Cavs would want multiple young assets is a reasonable one.  It is reasonable to think that Cleveland would hold out for that level of return and it is reasonable to think that Cleveland should hold out for that level of return.

Right.  Because the question isn't "what is Anderson Varajao worth", it is "what will it take to convince Cleveland to give up Anderson Varajao?"

I think a lot of times, live by the assumption that any team not 10 games above .500 is desperate to get rid of any player above 25 years old.  And that just isn't how it works.  Cleveland is in a position of power, where they have no need to trade Varajao this season, so they can ask for the moon for him, if a team is desperate to have him.

Re: what would you give up for Anderson Varejao?
« Reply #62 on: December 05, 2012, 05:40:23 PM »

Offline BballTim

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Mike (San Antonio)


Do you think Cleveland will trade Varejao while his value is high. Would a Spurs trade involving Leonard, Blair and Bonner be a good deal for both teams?
Chad Ford
  (1:23 PM)


They're open to it. But it would have to be a very good deal. Varejao is playing as well as any big man in the NBA. There is no reason to trade him unless they are getting back multiple young assets in return. He has a cap friendly contract (based on his performance this year) ... Kawhi Leonard would obviously be attractive to them, but it's going to take more than that to get an All-Star center like Varejao.

So according to Chad Ford Kawhi Leonard isn't enough to land Varejao.  The original thought added Blair and Bonnar, which I gather from Ford's tone isn't enough either.

  According to Ford Varejao is an all-star center.
I'm pretty sure he was referring to his play this year, you know when he is 15/15 and will easily make the all star team if he stays healthy.

  I'm sure that's the hope, that putting up good numbers on a bad team will get him the nod. I just think that referring to a player in his 30s who's never made an all-star team as an all star is fairly ignorant.

Re: what would you give up for Anderson Varejao?
« Reply #63 on: December 05, 2012, 05:45:40 PM »

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He's on a rampage through the league - the Cavs will be asking for the moon. But everyone else in the league is going to be terrified that Varejao goes down for the season after they overpay for him.

I think there will be too much distance between the Cavs' estimation of Varejao and the available buyers' ability to pay for a bargain to be struck. 

Sadly, I predict that Varejao will spend his golden years toiling for one of the worst rosters in the league.

Why are they one of the worst rosters in the league?  They have one of the best young players in the league, and a ton of assets.  I really don't think Cleveland gets enough credit for the position they are in right now.  They have their superstar, and are poised to surround him with very good players.  Just give it a little time.

Starters

Cleveland has a star PG in the making in Kyrie Irving and an above average starting big man in Varejao (30 years old, only played a combined 56 games in last two seasons). .

Their other three starters (Waiters, Gee, T.Thompson) are amongst the worst in the league at their positions. Tristan Thompson is an amazing athlete with little to no basketball skills. Dion Waiters is struggling mightily to create offense (36% FG%). Alonzo Gee lacks the size/athleticism and skill-level to make it as a starting SF in the league.

There is some potential there with Thompson and Waiters but neither look like sure-things at this point. Alonzo Gee is a solid bench player who is being asked to fill too large a role.

Bench

Little of note on the bench - Jeremy Pargo, Daniel Gibson, CJ Miles, Omri Casspi, Sandro Samuels, Tyler Zeller, Jon Leuer.

One of the worst benches in the league.

Overall

This is a weak team with a lot of uncertainty about it's future (outside of Kyrie Irving).

Re: what would you give up for Anderson Varejao?
« Reply #64 on: December 05, 2012, 05:47:46 PM »

Offline CelticG1

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What's this Varejaos second year as a starter in the league?

Good job! Good effort!

Re: what would you give up for Anderson Varejao?
« Reply #65 on: December 05, 2012, 06:22:04 PM »

Offline scaryjerry

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Yeah lets trade a franchise player in rondo for a role player  8)  gotta love it!

Re: what would you give up for Anderson Varejao?
« Reply #66 on: December 05, 2012, 06:46:24 PM »

Offline Moranis

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He's on a rampage through the league - the Cavs will be asking for the moon. But everyone else in the league is going to be terrified that Varejao goes down for the season after they overpay for him.

I think there will be too much distance between the Cavs' estimation of Varejao and the available buyers' ability to pay for a bargain to be struck. 

Sadly, I predict that Varejao will spend his golden years toiling for one of the worst rosters in the league.

Why are they one of the worst rosters in the league?  They have one of the best young players in the league, and a ton of assets.  I really don't think Cleveland gets enough credit for the position they are in right now.  They have their superstar, and are poised to surround him with very good players.  Just give it a little time.

Starters

Cleveland has a star PG in the making in Kyrie Irving and an above average starting big man in Varejao (30 years old, only played a combined 56 games in last two seasons). .

Their other three starters (Waiters, Gee, T.Thompson) are amongst the worst in the league at their positions. Tristan Thompson is an amazing athlete with little to no basketball skills. Dion Waiters is struggling mightily to create offense (36% FG%). Alonzo Gee lacks the size/athleticism and skill-level to make it as a starting SF in the league.

There is some potential there with Thompson and Waiters but neither look like sure-things at this point. Alonzo Gee is a solid bench player who is being asked to fill too large a role.

Bench

Little of note on the bench - Jeremy Pargo, Daniel Gibson, CJ Miles, Omri Casspi, Sandro Samuels, Tyler Zeller, Jon Leuer.

One of the worst benches in the league.

Overall

This is a weak team with a lot of uncertainty about it's future (outside of Kyrie Irving).
I don't think you are giving their young guys (outside of Irving of course) enough credit.  Thompson looks like he is the 4th best player from his draft (Irving, Faried, Valanciunas) and is getting better.  Waiters looks like he will be a scoring monster.  He is inefficient, but he is also a rookie playing a lot of minutes with a big role on his team.  That is not easy.  Zeller looks pretty good in his limited role.  Boobie Gibson is still only 26. 

I think if Irving can get and stay healthy he just makes that team, but they have some guys who like legit.  Couple that with the high draft pick they will have this year (along with Miami's and their own very high 2nd), so they appear headed to Cody Zeller, Nerlens Noel, or one of the top tier guard/wings, so they should add that one other piece they will need. 

Couple that with the hugely valuable asset that is Varejao, who they will move at some point in the next year, and I think they should be a pretty solid team in 3 years or so.  In fact if they could add Leonard, Blair, and Bonnar for Varejao (the trade discussed by Chad Ford), that sets them at PG, SG, SF, and PF.  Say they add Noel, that sets them at center with some solid young players on the bench (Zeller, Blair, Gee, Casspi, Gibson). 

I think they are positioned fairly well and they will have a lot of cap room the next couple of summers in which they could add a star. 
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Re: what would you give up for Anderson Varejao?
« Reply #67 on: December 05, 2012, 07:02:19 PM »

Offline LooseCannon

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I think they are positioned fairly well and they will have a lot of cap room the next couple of summers in which they could add a star.

Maybe they can blow that cap space on a Bynum overpay.
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Re: what would you give up for Anderson Varejao?
« Reply #68 on: December 05, 2012, 08:32:55 PM »

Online Celtics4ever

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What's this Varejaos second year as a starter in the league?

You wish, he has started several years and truth be told played many of the minutes when Z was there when it mattered.

He does get hurt a lot but he always killed us with his size and mobility.

Re: what would you give up for Anderson Varejao?
« Reply #69 on: December 05, 2012, 08:37:46 PM »

Offline CelticG1

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What's this Varejaos second year as a starter in the league?

You wish, he has started several years and truth be told played many of the minutes when Z was there when it mattered.

He does get hurt a lot but he always killed us with his size and mobility.

Prooooooooooooove ittttt

Re: what would you give up for Anderson Varejao?
« Reply #70 on: December 05, 2012, 10:15:41 PM »

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What's this Varejaos second year as a starter in the league?

You wish, he has started several years and truth be told played many of the minutes when Z was there when it mattered.

He does get hurt a lot but he always killed us with his size and mobility.
I don't know about that, he was used in at least the vast majority of his games as an energy guy off the bench.

He did finish many games, but typically over bad foul shooters like Wallace and Shaq.  Big Z was an 80% shooter and pretty firmly ahead of Varejao in the rotation until he turned 34/35 or so.
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Anderson Varejao    Tiago Splitter    Matt Bonner
David West    Kenyon Martin    Brad Miller
Andre Iguodala    Josh Childress    Marquis Daniels
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Kirk Hinrich    Toney Douglas   + the legendary Kevin McHale

Re: what would you give up for Anderson Varejao?
« Reply #71 on: December 06, 2012, 09:15:25 AM »

Offline Moranis

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What's this Varejaos second year as a starter in the league?

You wish, he has started several years and truth be told played many of the minutes when Z was there when it mattered.

He does get hurt a lot but he always killed us with his size and mobility.
Andy has missed a lot of games the last 2 years, but was essentially healthy until then and rarely missed games.  That isn't a great sign, but he seems to have fully recovered from his ailments.  He isn't like Shaq or even Rondo in the injury department, you know guys that miss 10-15 games every single year.  I think you could make an argument he is like a Rik Smits type player, you know a guy that was generally healthy then had a 2 year stint where he missed a ton of games, but then came back healthy to finish his career (you know that is of course if Andy stays healthy this year).
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Re: what would you give up for Anderson Varejao?
« Reply #72 on: December 06, 2012, 09:30:39 AM »

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What's this Varejaos second year as a starter in the league?

You wish, he has started several years and truth be told played many of the minutes when Z was there when it mattered.

He does get hurt a lot but he always killed us with his size and mobility.
Andy has missed a lot of games the last 2 years, but was essentially healthy until then and rarely missed games.  That isn't a great sign, but he seems to have fully recovered from his ailments.  He isn't like Shaq or even Rondo in the injury department, you know guys that miss 10-15 games every single year.  I think you could make an argument he is like a Rik Smits type player, you know a guy that was generally healthy then had a 2 year stint where he missed a ton of games, but then came back healthy to finish his career (you know that is of course if Andy stays healthy this year).
If you're making the case AV could bounce back and be healthy after two iffy years why is Rondo often injured compared to him? (aka a worse injury risk than AV)

06-07 78 games
07-08 77 games
08-09 80 games
09-10 81 games
10-11 68 games
11-12 53 games
12-13 15 games

He's had two healthier years than AV, and a similar "healthy" track record before that.

Re: what would you give up for Anderson Varejao?
« Reply #73 on: December 06, 2012, 09:30:54 AM »

Offline scaryjerry

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Why are people calling him andy like hes a personal friend?

Decent role player, that's it

Re: what would you give up for Anderson Varejao?
« Reply #74 on: December 06, 2012, 09:32:44 AM »

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Why are people calling him andy like hes a personal friend?

Decent role player, that's it
Because Andy is easier to type than Varejao.

 

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