Author Topic: Vintage Tommy fires up about Rondo, Owns Tanguay in process.  (Read 3638 times)

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Re: Vintage Tommy fires up about Rondo, Owns Tanguay in process.
« Reply #15 on: November 26, 2012, 09:14:40 AM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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Re: Vintage Tommy fires up about Rondo, Owns Tanguay in process.
« Reply #16 on: November 26, 2012, 09:26:04 AM »

Offline scaryjerry

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I really don't like him fishing for assists though. It's going to cost us a game eventually.

That crap where he tried to hand it back to Bass when he had an open lay up was just pure garbage.
He had 10 assists, why mess around with crap like that.
And don't say that he was trying to get Bass involved- he was trying to get another assist.

The stat padding is bogus.
I just can't wait till this streak is over because he's giving up many easy shots.

Hes always done that....I'm pretty sure he knew he was wrong on that particular one hence the ensuing layups

Re: Vintage Tommy fires up about Rondo, Owns Tanguay in process.
« Reply #17 on: November 26, 2012, 10:50:41 AM »

Offline PhoSita

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I saw somebody on Twitter liken Rondo's streak to the Red Sox sellout streak because of the Detroit game.

Haters gonna hate, I guess.
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Re: Vintage Tommy fires up about Rondo, Owns Tanguay in process.
« Reply #18 on: November 26, 2012, 11:05:42 AM »

Offline crownsy

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I saw somebody on Twitter liken Rondo's streak to the Red Sox sellout streak because of the Detroit game.

Haters gonna hate, I guess.

I don't get that mentaility at all either. I understand they were down big, but you think at no time during Stockton or Magics streak that the JAzz or Lakers were up big or down big when they got assists?

It seems whenever one of the older legands in sports falls, a push is made by the media, possably to discredit the newer generation of athletes relative to the "old gaurd" new rules come into place. So far on the Rondo streak:

1) assists are easier to get, doesn't count

(even though one can youtube stockton and magic "x assist" games and see that they get just as many questionable assists)

2) he has hall of famers on his team, doesn't count

(because apperntly Karl Malone and the Multitude of lakers all stars were trash)

3) He's specificly trying for it, doesn't count

(this one is the funniest to me, like stockton and magic were simpiltons, and never figured out "boy, this is like my 30 or 40th game with 10 assists +, that's pretty good." and just magically learned they were on a streak when a helpful reporter pointed it out post streak)

4) He pads stats on fast breaks, doesn't count

(as if John stockton, a guy who ALWAYS rewarded karl for running, didn't pass up layups for Karl trailing the play. Same with Magic and Kareem)

5) since some of the games happened at home, Doesn't count do to scorekeeper giving him hometown benifit of doubt
(because Stockton and Magic NEVER played at home during thier streaks...)

6) the team is aware of it and trying to get him assists, doesn't count.

(this one again relies on the premise that Stockton's teamates and Magic's teamates were A) complete idiots that never realized they had a streak going and contributed to it or B) If the Celtics weren't invested in getting him his streak they'd be....bricking shots on purpose i guess? passing up easy layups to make an extra pass?)

It's ridiculous, and I agree with Tommy that alot of it is driven by people, media and otherwise, who are invested on the "He wouldn't be any good except for the team he's on" narrative.


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Re: Vintage Tommy fires up about Rondo, Owns Tanguay in process.
« Reply #19 on: November 26, 2012, 11:13:13 AM »

Offline BballTim

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I really don't like him fishing for assists though. It's going to cost us a game eventually.

That crap where he tried to hand it back to Bass when he had an open lay up was just pure garbage.
He had 10 assists, why mess around with crap like that.
And don't say that he was trying to get Bass involved- he was trying to get another assist.

The stat padding is bogus.
I just can't wait till this streak is over because he's giving up many easy shots.

  Since this is a Tommy thread, it's worth pointing out that he's been talking about how it's important to reward bigs who make the effort to run on the break since well before Rondo came into the league. As you pointed out he already had 10 assists so you can't even criticize him for trying to get to 10 assists on that play. The "stat padding" claim is pretty silly. Rondo's the only player I've ever heard of that's been accused of stat padding for passing the ball to open teammates.

Re: Vintage Tommy fires up about Rondo, Owns Tanguay in process.
« Reply #20 on: November 26, 2012, 11:15:13 AM »

Offline Boris Badenov

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The Orlando announcers ended up looking really silly last night (though they probably didn't realize it).

They kept griping and would not let it go. I was watching the game pretty carefully and saw just one debatable assist decision by Rondo (the fast break). Every other play was 100% the right pass.

Then, in OT Rondo parted the waters on that drive (Jameer Nelson almost fell down jumping back to cover his man), and the ORL guys got all snarky: "Oh, when the game is on the line he takes the shot, finally."

What they completely failed to realize is that Rondo's unselfish play all game up to that point was exactly what led the ORL defenders to bite so badly on his ball fake!

Watch the play at around 0:45



Silly. I would expect Matt Goukas to know more basketball than that.

Re: Vintage Tommy fires up about Rondo, Owns Tanguay in process.
« Reply #21 on: November 26, 2012, 11:21:05 AM »

Offline Donoghus

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As long as their winning and Rondo is playing his normal self, I have no concerns about the streak.  I think the media is making it more of a distraction than it is although let's not be nieve that Rondo isn't aware of what's going on, either.

The one thing I could do without is things along the lines of that garbage play with Bass last night.  Take the layoff.  That was pretty bush stat pad attempt, plain & simple.


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Re: Vintage Tommy fires up about Rondo, Owns Tanguay in process.
« Reply #22 on: November 26, 2012, 11:27:25 AM »

Offline crownsy

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As long as their winning and Rondo is playing his normal self, I have no concerns about the streak.  I think the media is making it more of a distraction than it is although let's not be nieve that Rondo isn't aware of what's going on, either.

The one thing I could do without is things along the lines of that garbage play with Bass last night.  Take the layoff.  That was pretty bush stat pad attempt, plain & simple.

I was upset it got blocked, but like BBall said, this isn't some new amazing thing for pass heavy point gaurds to do to reward big men who run.

Stockton consistantily did it every time Karl ran the floor with him on a break, was it bush then?

Nash also did it with amare, though not as often as Stockton did it since amare's intrest in playing good D and running the floor afterwards is about zilch.

Rose does it for Noah off blocks alot, bush for them to do it?

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Re: Vintage Tommy fires up about Rondo, Owns Tanguay in process.
« Reply #23 on: November 26, 2012, 11:29:16 AM »

Offline nickagneta

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He might already be there, but if Rondo breaks the streak, averages almost 3-4 assists per game more than the nearest PG, shoots over 50% from the field and continues his okay to good mid range game, continues to grab 2-2.5 steals a game, and the Celtics start winning regularly, does that now make the best PG in the league?

I think it might.
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Re: Vintage Tommy fires up about Rondo, Owns Tanguay in process.
« Reply #24 on: November 26, 2012, 11:32:17 AM »

Offline BballTim

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I saw somebody on Twitter liken Rondo's streak to the Red Sox sellout streak because of the Detroit game.

Haters gonna hate, I guess.

  What Rondo's done so far is more impressive than what Magic did. The Lakers scored 12 more baskets a game than the Celts do. If the Celts scored like that Rondo' streak would be consecutive games with 13 or so assists, not 10.

Re: Vintage Tommy fires up about Rondo, Owns Tanguay in process.
« Reply #25 on: November 26, 2012, 11:34:20 AM »

Offline PhoSita

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6) the team is aware of it and trying to get him assists, doesn't count.

(this one again relies on the premise that Stockton's teamates and Magic's teamates were A) complete idiots that never realized they had a streak going and contributed to it or B) If the Celtics weren't invested in getting him his streak they'd be....bricking shots on purpose i guess? passing up easy layups to make an extra pass?)

It's ridiculous, and I agree with Tommy that alot of it is driven by people, media and otherwise, who are invested on the "He wouldn't be any good except for the team he's on" narrative.

This one is the biggest hangup for me.  We're not talking about a player gunning for a streak of 20+ pt games.  This isn't David Robinson scoring over 70 points to win the scoring title.  It's pretty hard for a player, and his teammates, to work hard to rack up assists, and have that be a detriment to the team's goals. 

How people can find a way to criticize a player for passing the ball and setting up teammates to score is baffling.  Sure, there are times when Rondo seems to pass up higher percentage looks he could take himself to get assists.  But I'd say that only happens a very small percentage of the time.  I don't think the Celtics offense could be any more efficient with Rondo looking to score more.  He's pretty much at this ceiling efficiency-wise scoring 13-15 points a game on 10-12 shots.
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Re: Vintage Tommy fires up about Rondo, Owns Tanguay in process.
« Reply #26 on: November 26, 2012, 11:35:38 AM »

Online foulweatherfan

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As long as their winning and Rondo is playing his normal self, I have no concerns about the streak.  I think the media is making it more of a distraction than it is although let's not be nieve that Rondo isn't aware of what's going on, either.

The one thing I could do without is things along the lines of that garbage play with Bass last night.  Take the layoff.  That was pretty bush stat pad attempt, plain & simple.

I was upset it got blocked, but like BBall said, this isn't some new amazing thing for pass heavy point gaurds to do to reward big men who run.

Stockton consistantily did it every time Karl ran the floor with him on a break, was it bush then?

Nash also did it with amare, though not as often as Stockton did it since amare's intrest in playing good D and running the floor afterwards is about zilch.

Rose does it for Noah off blocks alot, bush for them to do it?

I think there's a big difference between not liking that play and not liking point guards passing to big men on the break.

Nobody's saying Rondo shouldn't reward bigs who run the floor - rather, the criticism is based on the game being close, and Rondo being about 4 paces ahead of any defender, and stopping to pass it backwards to a guy who was about 1/2 pace ahead, who then got blocked at the rim. 

I like that Rondo looks for other guys to finish on the break - it's great for the team.  If it's an easy finish either way I'm all for it.  But when he deliberately makes a simple basket more difficult in a close game, I don't see anything wrong with criticizing it.

Re: Vintage Tommy fires up about Rondo, Owns Tanguay in process.
« Reply #27 on: November 26, 2012, 11:41:24 AM »

Offline Donoghus

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As long as their winning and Rondo is playing his normal self, I have no concerns about the streak.  I think the media is making it more of a distraction than it is although let's not be nieve that Rondo isn't aware of what's going on, either.

The one thing I could do without is things along the lines of that garbage play with Bass last night.  Take the layoff.  That was pretty bush stat pad attempt, plain & simple.

I was upset it got blocked, but like BBall said, this isn't some new amazing thing for pass heavy point gaurds to do to reward big men who run.

Stockton consistantily did it every time Karl ran the floor with him on a break, was it bush then?

Nash also did it with amare, though not as often as Stockton did it since amare's intrest in playing good D and running the floor afterwards is about zilch.

Rose does it for Noah off blocks alot, bush for them to do it?

I think there's a big difference between not liking that play and not liking point guards passing to big men on the break.

Nobody's saying Rondo shouldn't reward bigs who run the floor - rather, the criticism is based on the game being close, and Rondo being about 4 paces ahead of any defender, and stopping to pass it backwards to a guy who was about 1/2 pace ahead, who then got blocked at the rim. 

I like that Rondo looks for other guys to finish on the break - it's great for the team.  If it's an easy finish either way I'm all for it.  But when he deliberately makes a simple basket more difficult in a close game, I don't see anything wrong with criticizing it.

Exactly.  That particular play was dumb.  Things ended up working out in the end but that pass didn't need to be made at all when he was steps ahead of anyone with nothing but basket in front of him.

He should've taken the layup.  Period.

He still had one heckuva game, though.  Just that play was unnecessary and pretty dumb.


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Re: Vintage Tommy fires up about Rondo, Owns Tanguay in process.
« Reply #28 on: November 26, 2012, 11:43:27 AM »

Offline PhoSita

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I saw somebody on Twitter liken Rondo's streak to the Red Sox sellout streak because of the Detroit game.

Haters gonna hate, I guess.

  What Rondo's done so far is more impressive than what Magic did. The Lakers scored 12 more baskets a game than the Celts do. If the Celts scored like that Rondo' streak would be consecutive games with 13 or so assists, not 10.

That's not even the most exasperating thing, though.  Were the assists in the Detroit game not real assists?  Were they phantom passes to phantom players making phantom buckets, with phantom defenders, like phantom butts in the empty seats at Fenway? 

Unless somebody can go through tape of all the games Stockton and Magic played with double digit assists and tell me that every single of those assists came in "meaningful" minutes, I call that analogy bogus.

Quote from: nickagneta
He might already be there, but if Rondo breaks the streak, averages almost 3-4 assists per game more than the nearest PG, shoots over 50% from the field and continues his okay to good mid range game, continues to grab 2-2.5 steals a game, and the Celtics start winning regularly, does that now make the best PG in the league?

I think it might.

I think people are still gonna give guys like Paul and Westbrook that nod because they are more dangerous with the ball in their hands in a one or two possession game when a basket or two will seal the deal.  Rondo is always going to be behind guys like Paul, Westbrook, Rose, and D-Will in that regard.  But over the course of an entire game, I think it's hard to find a point guard who does more to help his team win -- even if none of the advanced stats seems to be able to adequately account for Rondo's value.
Quote from: BBallTim
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Re: Vintage Tommy fires up about Rondo, Owns Tanguay in process.
« Reply #29 on: November 26, 2012, 12:32:32 PM »

Offline cltc5

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i have Philly csn >:(.  And i freakin hate it!  gotta watch sixers, phillies, etc all the darn time.  And the broadcasting is turrible.

 

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