Author Topic: Celtics Allegedly Offer Bradley, Melo, Picks for Gortat (unconfirmed)  (Read 6351 times)

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Re: Celtics Allegedly Offer Bradley, Melo, Picks for Gortat (unconfirmed)
« Reply #60 on: November 23, 2012, 07:44:27 PM »

Offline angryguy77

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Really don't want to see Bradley go. Don't do it Danny.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2012, 07:50:34 PM by angryguy77 »

Re: Celtics Allegedly Offer Bradley, Melo, Picks for Gortat (unconfirmed)
« Reply #61 on: November 23, 2012, 07:56:03 PM »

Offline The Rondo Show

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I would love to have Gortat. However, I would be heartbroken to lose Avery
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Re: Celtics Allegedly Offer Bradley, Melo, Picks for Gortat (unconfirmed)
« Reply #62 on: November 23, 2012, 08:42:50 PM »

Offline Lightskinsmurf

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You guys really underrate and underestimate Melo. I won't be surprised if we call him up and HE becomes the reason we win some games.

Yeah, he has really helped us thus far, crack kill brain cells I guess....
You obviously failed to understand my point. What I am saying is that you guys consider Melo complete useless garbage of a player. That's not true. You guys think he can't do anything. From what I have seen, Melo wants to learn. Melo is willing to do what it takes to improve himself. As they say, "Where there's a will, there's a way." My point is its not too far-fetched to say that he will soon be able to help us at some point.

Maybe, but gortat can help us NOW. We are in win NOW mode.

Re: Celtics Allegedly Offer Bradley, Melo, Picks for Gortat (unconfirmed)
« Reply #63 on: November 23, 2012, 08:49:14 PM »

Offline relja

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For Bradley? No.

Re: Celtics Allegedly Offer Bradley, Melo, Picks for Gortat (unconfirmed)
« Reply #64 on: November 23, 2012, 09:18:09 PM »

Online Celtics4ever

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You obviously failed to understand my point. What I am saying is that you guys consider Melo complete useless garbage of a player. That's not true. You guys think he can't do anything. From what I have seen, Melo wants to learn. Melo is willing to do what it takes to improve himself. As they say, "Where there's a will, there's a way." My point is its not too far-fetched to say that he will soon be able to help us at some point.

Wanting to learn and ability learn are two different things.  He was so far buried on the bench he wasn't going to see the light of day.  He is a potential guy right now otherwise he would not be on the Red Claws.

I will post his Red Claw stats they are playing right now.

2 points.  0 Assists 1 Rebound, 3 Blocks so far.  1:38 left to go in 3rd.   Doesn't look dominant but anyone would admit he can block shots.

http://www.nba.com/dleague/games/20121123/MNECTN/gameinfo.html?ls=gt2hp2021200001


But ready to contribute now? The stats don't support it. I hope he proves me wrong.... 

Re: Celtics Allegedly Offer Bradley, Melo, Picks for Gortat (unconfirmed)
« Reply #65 on: November 23, 2012, 09:24:52 PM »

Offline BASS_THUMPER

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yall already know how this works


people are like

"why is doc playing him"

"why didnt doc do that"

ainge and doc holdin hands and going shoppin

Re: Celtics Allegedly Offer Bradley, Melo, Picks for Gortat (unconfirmed)
« Reply #66 on: November 23, 2012, 10:33:13 PM »

Offline bfrombleacher

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Re: BREAKING! Celtics offer Bradley, Melo, and multiple draft picks for Gortat!
« Reply #67 on: November 23, 2012, 11:21:16 PM »

Offline crimson_stallion

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how abouit keep our defensive pest bradley and trade melo with Lee and Green???

Then we have bass, Sully, JET, barbosa and wilcox coming off the bench. only problem is a guy to back up The Truth. still a strong bench it would seem. unless we can put bass at the 3 and sully at the 4 and wilcox at the 5.

put KG back to the 4. Gortat starts at the 5.

Then if you look at today's game against OKC, who defends Durant??

Barbosa, Terry or Bradley?  They ae all giving up 8 inches.

Green did a very good job on Durant today.

Plus Lee (6M) + Green (9M) + Fab (1M) = 16M

Gortat = 7M

Re: Celtics Allegedly Offer Bradley, Melo, Picks for Gortat (unconfirmed)
« Reply #68 on: November 23, 2012, 11:30:10 PM »

Offline Yoki_IsTheName

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Lets do it. I don't want Bradley gone but Gortat, production wise would give us a great help to WIN NOW.


On a side note, while I appreciate your report, i really do. My question is mr. OP, why do you even care?

I thought you gave up on this team? I though you're done with this team? Unless you just want us to know the news then I rest my case. Outside of that, why bother when you already gave up,  on this team. Didn't you post that "I'm done with this team" thread a few days ago?
« Last Edit: November 23, 2012, 11:41:14 PM by Yoki_IsTheName »
"The rim is looking bigger and bigger every game." - PP

http://tinyurl.com/n8py37p


Re: Celtics Allegedly Offer Bradley, Melo, Picks for Gortat (unconfirmed)
« Reply #69 on: November 23, 2012, 11:40:35 PM »

Offline jdz101

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Lets do it. I don't want Bradley gone but Gortat, production wise would give us a great help to WIN NOW.


On a side note, while I appreciate your report, i really do. My question is mr. OP is, why do you even care?

I thought you gave up on this team? I though you're done with this team? Unless you just want us to know the news then I rest my case. Outside of that, why bother when you already have up on this team. Didn't you post that "I'm done with this team" thread a few days ago? What, sudden change of heart, Mr. band wagoner?

Yeah he loved that terry 3 in the game thread aswell. Pretty sure according to him this team was garbage two days ago.


how much wood would a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck was chris bosh?

Re: Celtics Allegedly Offer Bradley, Melo, Picks for Gortat (unconfirmed)
« Reply #70 on: November 23, 2012, 11:45:11 PM »

Offline Big Rondo

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Bradley is NOT the difference between where we are now and Banner 18.

Gortat very well may be...

What don't you guys understand about that?

???
Offense sells tickets, Defense wins games, Rebounds win championships.

Re: Celtics Allegedly Offer Bradley, Melo, Picks for Gortat (unconfirmed)
« Reply #71 on: November 23, 2012, 11:59:55 PM »

Offline crimson_stallion

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Bold statement. I'm sure Cooper, Jordan, etc. would have something to say about it.

I love Bradley, but I would love him much more if he had prototypical SG size. As great as a defender as he is, bigger guards can still shoot over him. That'll never change.

It's a legit possiblility.  The idea of bigger guards shooting over Bradley is all 'on paper'.  In all the time I watched Bradley I saw no signs of him being dominated by larger SG's.  He has held his own against anyone he's gone up against. 

Also his defensive intensity is (IMHO) right up there at Michael Jordan levels right now.  He's only 21 years old and has only really played one full season in the league. 

I'm not saying he will be the best on ball defender of all time, but the potential is definately there for him to be a legendary defensive player when all is said and done.

This trade is really hard for me.  On one hand Bradley is one of the few players on this team that I really don't want to see leave - I love what this guys brings. His effort, his hustle, the way he dominates on defense.  Plus there is his youth (and hence potential), his speed in the open court. 

On the other hand there are really only five centers in the league who help you on offense, on defense AND on rebounds:

* Dwight Howard
* Andrew Bynum
* Al Hortford
* Joakim Noah
* Marcin Gortat

Varejao and Chandler are offensively limited.  Jefferson, Amare and Monroe are defensively limited.  Brook Lopez rebounds like a small forward. Bosh is a Power Forward pretending to be a Center.

That means Marcin is a top 10 center AT LEAST, possibly even top 5.  For a team that lacks size, rebounding and interior defense as much as we do, it's hard to turn down an opportunity to pick up a player with Gortat's talent...especially when you look at the contract he's on.  Take a look at what guys like Hibbert and Asik are getting paid - if he was a free agent Gortat would be (or at the very least be close to) a max contract guy.

If this trade was for Lee and Melo (or Bass and Melo) I'd yes in a heart beat.  If it was for Bass and Lee (I dont think the numbers match) it would be a bit tougher, but I'd still take it for sure.

For Avery it's really tough.  Especially when you look at the salary matching, because that means we'd need to give up another 5M or so player (Lee, Bass, Terry) ALONG with Avery in order to make it work. 

Giving up Bass or Lee + Sullinger makes the most sense.  With Gortat starting and KG moving to PF we would have three bigs (Bass, Sully, Wilcox) fighting for minutes off the bench. That's a waste of good talent, becasue no way we can get all of them good playing time.

Likewise once Bradley returns - assuming he starts - we are not going to be able to find time for Barbosa, Lee AND Terry off the bench.  One of those guys will need to have his playing time sacrificed, otherwise it's going to hurt them all.

Trading Lee + Sully matches perfectly on the Salaries (around 8M there) and it gives Phoenix two talented young players who are good enough to start now. 

For us it leaves us with a fantastic 4 guard rotation (Rondo, Bradley, Barbosa, Terry) and a great front court rotation (KG, Gortat, Bass, Wilcox). 

I really don't know who I'd rather keep out of Sully and Bass.  Both have fought so hard for us and both are high energy players who can contribute in multiple ways (Bass with defense adn scoring, Sully with scoring and rebounding).  Bass give more athletism while Sully is younger and has more upside.

Losing either would be hard, but worth it if it means getting a big of Gortat's calibre in return. 

With Rondo, Bradley, Pierce, Garnett, Gortat we have arguably the best starting 5 in the NBA.  Very few teams would have the size to matchup with that PP/KG/MG front line, especially if the Lakers do trade Gasol out.

Our bench (Barbosa, Terry, Green, Bass, Wilcox) also looks very good.   

We would never (ever) have to play small Bass/Sully at center again because KG, Gortat and Wilcox can easilly cover it between them.

We proved today that we CAN beat a good team without Avery...but Lee's defense on Kevin Martin and Sully's hustle had a lot to do with that. 

I just don't know...such a hard call whether Gortat would be more important to us then Bradley or Lee + Sully or Bradley + Bass.

I have to say the thought of KG and Gortat on the floor at the same time (defensively) is super appealing, and combining that with Avery's perimeter defense would make us one hell of a defensive team.

All I'm thinking about right now is the defense + rebounding, but scoring is another thing to consider.  Gortat + Garnett would be a very good front court offensively.  Both can score inside or out, both are solid free throw shooters, both are mobile.

Re: Celtics Allegedly Offer Bradley, Melo, Picks for Gortat (unconfirmed)
« Reply #72 on: November 24, 2012, 12:05:58 AM »

Offline jdz101

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Bradley is NOT the difference between where we are now and Banner 18.

Gortat very well may be...

What don't you guys understand about that?

???

You can think a euro center who has never really been a part of playoffs basketball is the difference if you want. I don't.

He did well with Steve Nash in a pick and roll system but still wasn't really enough of a difference maker to win that team serious games.

Reasonable player on a mediocre team. Definitely not worth trading Avery for.


how much wood would a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck was chris bosh?

Re: Celtics Allegedly Offer Bradley, Melo, Picks for Gortat (unconfirmed)
« Reply #73 on: November 24, 2012, 12:20:25 AM »

Offline Yoki_IsTheName

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Bradley is NOT the difference between where we are now and Banner 18.

Gortat very well may be...

What don't you guys understand about that?

???

You can think a euro center who has never really been a part of playoffs basketball is the difference if you want. I don't.

He did well with Steve Nash in a pick and roll system but still wasn't really enough of a difference maker to win that team serious games.

Reasonable player on a mediocre team. Definitely not worth trading Avery for.


Still wouldn't solve our problems with the rebounding and shot blocking.

Avery can shut down anyone, but I we can't rebound it's useless. I love the kid, but I'd rather have Lee who can do a good job defensively as well (not Avery level) and have a Euro center who, while not have been in the playoffs, will still rebound and block shots for us than having a shutdown wing but we can't finish the defense because we allow offensive rebounds.
"The rim is looking bigger and bigger every game." - PP

http://tinyurl.com/n8py37p


Re: Celtics Allegedly Offer Bradley, Melo, Picks for Gortat (unconfirmed)
« Reply #74 on: November 24, 2012, 12:21:01 AM »

Offline crimson_stallion

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Bradley is NOT the difference between where we are now and Banner 18.

Gortat very well may be...

What don't you guys understand about that?

What evidence do you have to back this up?

What evidence do you have to suggest that Gortat will have a great impact than Bradley AND whichever other player (either Lee, Bass, Terry) we would have to give  up along with him in order to get Gortat?

Gortat is complaining about not getting involved in the offense enough in Phoenix.  Will he be happy being the 3rd or 4th scoring option (behind Pierce, KG and maybe Rondo) in Boston? 

Will success and winning games be enough to leave him satisfied with that?  Avery has played with this team for a year, he knows the guys, he knows his role and he plays it to perfection.

Will bringing in Gortat (and moving KG to PF) lower Garnett's efficiency?  Will KG be as dominant against quickier 4's as he is against 5's?  I think he will, but it's a valid argument. 

Does Gortat (at 28 years old) have the potential to be a future piece for us after Pierce and KG retire?  He will be 31 years old when that day comes, while Bradley will be 24 years old and not even approaching his peak yet.

With Bradley gone does Barbosa, Terry or Lee have the potential to be able to help carry this team once Pierce and KG retire?  Terry will be 38 years old, Barbosa will be 32, Lee will be about 30 but has shown no signs of being much more than a role player.   Neither one of those guys has much potential.

If we do make this trade, and Bradley DOES become an All-Start (or near All-Star) calibre player in 2 years time (at the ripe age of 23) while Gortat starts declinging and the team moves into rebuilding mode...will you be cursing at Danny for making the trade now?

I understand that we want to win a banner now (I do as much as anyone) but I think Danny and Doc are thinking about now AND the future.  They want to win now, but I don't think either of the wants to go through a rebuilding phase - and with all those years on Doc's contact he'd be potentially right in the middle of one. 

If Bradley sticks around and becomes the player he has the potential to be then the second Pierce, KG and Terry retire we will have about $30M in cap space that we can use to sign two max contract players that we could then pair with Rondo, Bradley, Green and either Bass or Sully.  We could potentially be a contending team for the next 2-3 years while PP and KG are still around, and then completely avoid ever having to go through a rebuilding phase. 

With the amount of chemistry Rondo, Bradley and Green could develop over those three years, we could afford to sign up multiple superstars to add to that core, potentially making us an even more dominant team then what we were in 2008 (or any year since).

Of course there is the risk of trusting in Bradley, but thre is ALWAYS a risk in any plan. 

If we can get Gortat for Lee and Bass (or Lee and Sully) plus Melo (if need be) and any number of picks I'd much rather that.  Bradley will never be wasted because even in the worst case scenario he will always have solid trade value based on his age, atleticism and defense alone. 

 

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