Author Topic: Israel v Hamas  (Read 9446 times)

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Re: Israel v Hamas
« Reply #15 on: November 17, 2012, 06:49:42 PM »

Offline LooseCannon

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I don't really care who wins this one.
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Re: Israel v Hamas
« Reply #16 on: November 17, 2012, 06:50:56 PM »

Online D.o.s.

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Not going to get into the tinfoil territory, but it's pretty clear that Israel has been waiting a long time to clamp down militarily on Gaza.

And it's not like the Palestinians were living in freedom before hand, what with the blockades and sanctions and whatnot.

So, if you're Hamas, you're kind of stuck with living in permanent poverty if you don't do anything, and getting invaded if you do.

Additionally, the antipathy between both sides cuts equally, so you can't just say "Hamas wants to destroy the Jews" without acknowledging the other. Of course, that statement is also silly, because a lot of the Palestinians and Israeli Jews are from the same ethnic stock.

It's two angry governments putting a whole lot of innocent people in a whole lot of danger for a pair of stupid, outmoded ideologies.
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Re: Israel v Hamas
« Reply #17 on: November 17, 2012, 07:19:19 PM »

Offline Brendan

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The good thing about topics like this is gives you insight behind the screen names of the morality on this board.

Hamas is a terrorist organization, bent on destruction of Israel, allied with Iran, indiscriminately launching missiles into Israel trying to hit civilian targets. Israel is a US ally, liberal democracy, that would leave Gaza alone if it would bring peace (they've tried that it doesn't work.) So yeah, I'm on Israel's side. Are there civilian casualties? Yes, but it's clear Israel is trying to avoid them.

Everyone gets up in arms about the displaced "Palestinians" - but what about the displaced Jews from the arab block countries since the end of the colonial period? The oldest Jewish communities in the world have been systematically whiped out - communities that survived the Romans, the Crusades, and the Caliphate. Israel has absorbed those people. But Jordan, Egypt, and Lebanon have kept the "refugees" in camps to keep political pressure on the Israelis. Frankly I favor a one state solution at this point. I think Israel should annex all of Gaza and the West Bank and say "we're done with this charade, you've had decades to settle in peacefully, but didn't do it. We're moving on."

Re: Israel v Hamas
« Reply #18 on: November 17, 2012, 07:54:23 PM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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re they playing a basketball game or something? I don't understand with post.

Wars have winners.   I guess you have never been in one or served your country as I have.   

Re: Israel v Hamas
« Reply #19 on: November 17, 2012, 08:00:52 PM »

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Fun fact: our own military service and the plight of ancient Jewish communities have little to no bearing on the current situation:

That there are loads of innocent civilians in Gaza. There are loads of innocent civilians in Israel. This is not going to end well for either group, and all the violence is doing is radicalizing each side against the other.

I'll go out on a limb here and say that both sides are never going to stop committing acts of terror, whether it be an air strike, a car bomb, or a rocket, as long as the current leaderships in both groups have a say.
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The thing about dealing with the media in this business is that they thrive on rumors and get bored with reality.

Re: Israel v Hamas
« Reply #20 on: November 17, 2012, 08:03:03 PM »

Offline LooseCannon

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Everyone gets up in arms about the displaced "Palestinians" - but what about the displaced Jews from the arab block countries since the end of the colonial period? The oldest Jewish communities in the world have been systematically whiped out - communities that survived the Romans, the Crusades, and the Caliphate. Israel has absorbed those people. But Jordan, Egypt, and Lebanon have kept the "refugees" in camps to keep political pressure on the Israelis. Frankly I favor a one state solution at this point. I think Israel should annex all of Gaza and the West Bank and say "we're done with this charade, you've had decades to settle in peacefully, but didn't do it. We're moving on."

Well, if we're going to go that far back, then we should be talking about reparations for descendents of slaves.
"The worst thing that ever happened in sports was sports radio, and the internet is sports radio on steroids with lower IQs.” -- Brian Burke, former Toronto Maple Leafs senior adviser, at the 2013 MIT Sloan Sports Analytics Conference

Re: Israel v Hamas
« Reply #21 on: November 17, 2012, 08:06:12 PM »

Offline crownsy

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Everyone gets up in arms about the displaced "Palestinians" - but what about the displaced Jews from the arab block countries since the end of the colonial period? The oldest Jewish communities in the world have been systematically whiped out - communities that survived the Romans, the Crusades, and the Caliphate. Israel has absorbed those people. But Jordan, Egypt, and Lebanon have kept the "refugees" in camps to keep political pressure on the Israelis. Frankly I favor a one state solution at this point. I think Israel should annex all of Gaza and the West Bank and say "we're done with this charade, you've had decades to settle in peacefully, but didn't do it. We're moving on."

Well, if we're going to go that far back, then we should be talking about reparations for descendents of slaves.

Considering the islamic world roots it's hate for the other religions, rightly or wrongly, mostly in the crusades, I'd say both sides are way ahead of you.
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Re: Israel v Hamas
« Reply #22 on: November 17, 2012, 08:08:03 PM »

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Fight war not wars?
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Re: Israel v Hamas
« Reply #23 on: November 17, 2012, 08:42:22 PM »

Offline Change

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re they playing a basketball game or something? I don't understand with post.

Wars have winners.   I guess you have never been in one or served your country as I have.   

We got WWII vet on the board. Who knww? because that was the last war that was declared.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2012, 09:06:18 PM by Change »

Re: Israel v Hamas
« Reply #24 on: November 17, 2012, 08:48:25 PM »

Online Neurotic Guy

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These are the worst discussions.

We all benefit and are victim to our own heritage, family culture, the 'words of wisdom' of our elders and the media we favor (mostly as a result of the prior influences).  I am not suggesting that none of us think for ourselves, I AM suggesting that we grow up learning and embedding biases and we then seek to confirm our biases throughout our lives.  This is not to say that we can't learn, grow and change. But... with regard to the unceasing conflict and sometimes terror that those in and around Israel experience as a generational part of life -- something that is undoubtedly braided into the core of family and community culture on both sides, this is something we shouldn't even begin to think we can comprehend as Americans.
It is impossible for us, sitting in our safe homes with our computers, snacks, I-pods, and our 'first-world worries', to know anything real about 'who started it', 'who is to blame', 'who is unreasonable', 'who controls the media', or to know, with any semblance of validity, what is the solution. 
We convine ourselves that the media is either correct or influenced by propaganda depending on our bias, and in the end, we don't know, we can't know, and it doesn't matter what we think.   

If Jewish Americans and Palestinian (or Arab) Americans can't speak to each other without staunchly taking sides and/or being offended by the other's perspective, then how will those who actually experience the terror ever find peace.  Let's start by admitting that both sides have been, and are, at fault and that endlessly seeking fault and laying blame is no different than searching for and justifying retaliation. And so it goes.

Re: Israel v Hamas
« Reply #25 on: November 17, 2012, 08:54:22 PM »

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Fun fact: our own military service and the plight of ancient Jewish communities have little to no bearing on the current situation:

That there are loads of innocent civilians in Gaza. There are loads of innocent civilians in Israel. This is not going to end well for either group, and all the violence is doing is radicalizing each side against the other.

I'll go out on a limb here and say that both sides are never going to stop committing acts of terror, whether it be an air strike, a car bomb, or a rocket, as long as the current leaderships in both groups have a say.

We got WWII vet on the board. Who knww? because that was the last war that was declared.

If you're thinking in terms of American history, sure.
Quote from: Mark Cuban
The thing about dealing with the media in this business is that they thrive on rumors and get bored with reality.

Re: Israel v Hamas
« Reply #26 on: November 17, 2012, 09:05:41 PM »

Offline Change

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Fun fact: our own military service and the plight of ancient Jewish communities have little to no bearing on the current situation:

That there are loads of innocent civilians in Gaza. There are loads of innocent civilians in Israel. This is not going to end well for either group, and all the violence is doing is radicalizing each side against the other.

I'll go out on a limb here and say that both sides are never going to stop committing acts of terror, whether it be an air strike, a car bomb, or a rocket, as long as the current leaderships in both groups have a say.

We got WWII vet on the board. Who knww? because that was the last war that was declared.

If you're thinking in terms of American history, sure.

Wrong quote. Meant to quote Celtics4ever. Apologies.

Re: Israel v Hamas
« Reply #27 on: November 17, 2012, 09:23:28 PM »

Online Roy H.

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Hamas is a terrorist organization, bent on destruction of Israel, allied with Iran, indiscriminately launching missiles into Israel trying to hit civilian targets.

That's pretty much my perspective.  I hope Israel annihilates them. 

I'm not opposed to a Palestinian state in theory.  I am opposed to rewarding terrorism, and I'm opposed to the people who cheer terrorism and vote to put terrorists into power.


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Re: Israel v Hamas
« Reply #28 on: November 17, 2012, 09:27:28 PM »

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Hamas is a terrorist organization, bent on destruction of Israel, allied with Iran, indiscriminately launching missiles into Israel trying to hit civilian targets.

That's pretty much my perspective.  I hope Israel annihilates them. 

I'm not opposed to a Palestinian state in theory.  I am opposed to rewarding terrorism, and I'm opposed to the people who cheer terrorism and vote to put terrorists into power.

By extension, every single President, Senator, and Congressional Representative you've ever voted for has lost.
Quote from: Mark Cuban
The thing about dealing with the media in this business is that they thrive on rumors and get bored with reality.

Re: Israel v Hamas
« Reply #29 on: November 17, 2012, 09:31:59 PM »

Online Roy H.

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Hamas is a terrorist organization, bent on destruction of Israel, allied with Iran, indiscriminately launching missiles into Israel trying to hit civilian targets.

That's pretty much my perspective.  I hope Israel annihilates them. 

I'm not opposed to a Palestinian state in theory.  I am opposed to rewarding terrorism, and I'm opposed to the people who cheer terrorism and vote to put terrorists into power.

By extension, every single President, Senator, and Congressional Representative you've ever voted for has lost.

Please don't attempt to manipulate my words through your attempts to be clever.



D. Cousins / F. Ezeli / P. Antic
D. West / R. Anderson / C. Copeland
L. Deng / V. Carter / D. Rudez
A. Iguodala / M. Ginobili / B. Gordon
K. Irving / S. Livingston / S. Blake

Once a CrotoNat, always a CrotoNat.  CelticsBlog Draft Champions, 2009 & 2012

 

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