Author Topic: Royce White missing games and practices  (Read 5537 times)

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Re: Royce White missing games and practices
« Reply #75 on: November 17, 2012, 09:18:57 AM »

Offline Celtics18

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If it was worth the risk, then it was also worth ensuring that they created an environment that was comfortable for Royce White.  It doesn't seem like they did that.  It seems like they treated him like just another rookie. 


I kinda disagree. If you are getting paid millions by an organization to play basketball and you declare for a draft to be selected to play in the NBA, it is not your employer's prerogative to make sure you can play basketball with an NBA travel schedule.

If Royce White needed to only play home games and not much else, this needed to be made clear to all the teams while they were doing their draft interviews. Which would have lead to 30 teams not touching the guy with a ten foot pole on draft night.

What is the bet that Royce and his agent sugar coated this situation at draft time?

I'm not making light of his disorder or his fear of flying but why did Royce declare for the draft, knowing all about his struggles and probably knowing a fair bit about what an NBA team expects travel-wise?

I kinda disagree with your disagreement.  It is the employer's prerogative.  Just like with any player, it's up to the GM to pick a player who will be able to perform, and it's up to the coaching staff to help that player turn into the most productive player he can be.

Caveat emptor.  It's not like the Rockets didn't have plenty of warning that they were taking a guy who had some issues and was going to need to be handled with care. If they couldn't deal with that, then they probably shouldn't have drafted him.

Maybe there's no team that will be able to meet Royce White's needs, but my guess is that he could find a home where he could be a good NBA player.  I'm no psychiatrist, but my guess is also that it's as much about the interpersonal relationships and how he feels he was treated by the Rockets as it is about flights and practices. 

As to your last paragraph, Royce White declared for the draft because he thought he would be drafted.  He was right.  I'm sure he didn't plan on this stuff happening.

It's like saying, "How dare Gabe Pruitt declare himself for the NBA draft when he knows he doesn't have what it takes to make it as an NBA player?  The honorable thing for Gabe to do would be to go straight to Europe or the D-League and not waste an NBA franchise's draft pick and money."


Re: Royce White missing games and practices
« Reply #76 on: November 17, 2012, 09:30:13 AM »

Offline moiso

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If it was worth the risk, then it was also worth ensuring that they created an environment that was comfortable for Royce White.  It doesn't seem like they did that.  It seems like they treated him like just another rookie. 


I kinda disagree. If you are getting paid millions by an organization to play basketball and you declare for a draft to be selected to play in the NBA, it is not your employer's prerogative to make sure you can play basketball with an NBA travel schedule.

If Royce White needed to only play home games and not much else, this needed to be made clear to all the teams while they were doing their draft interviews. Which would have lead to 30 teams not touching the guy with a ten foot pole on draft night.

What is the bet that Royce and his agent sugar coated this situation at draft time?

I'm not making light of his disorder or his fear of flying but why did Royce declare for the draft, knowing all about his struggles and probably knowing a fair bit about what an NBA team expects travel-wise?

I kinda disagree with your disagreement.  It is the employer's prerogative.  Just like with any player, it's up to the GM to pick a player who will be able to perform, and it's up to the coaching staff to help that player turn into the most productive player he can be.

Caveat emptor.  It's not like the Rockets didn't have plenty of warning that they were taking a guy who had some issues and was going to need to be handled with care. If they couldn't deal with that, then they probably shouldn't have drafted him.

Maybe there's no team that will be able to meet Royce White's needs, but my guess is that he could find a home where he could be a good NBA player.  I'm no psychiatrist, but my guess is also that it's as much about the interpersonal relationships and how he feels he was treated by the Rockets as it is about flights and practices. 

As to your last paragraph, Royce White declared for the draft because he thought he would be drafted.  He was right.  I'm sure he didn't plan on this stuff happening.

It's like saying, "How dare Gabe Pruitt declare himself for the NBA draft when he knows he doesn't have what it takes to make it as an NBA player?  The honorable thing for Gabe to do would be to go straight to Europe or the D-League and not waste an NBA franchise's draft pick and money."
Should a janitor apply to be a surgeon or pilot knowing he can't do the jobs?  What if some idiot actually hires him due to a faulty background check?

I'm not going to apply for a job that I'm incapable of doing.

Re: Royce White missing games and practices
« Reply #77 on: November 17, 2012, 09:33:08 AM »

Offline crownsy

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If it was worth the risk, then it was also worth ensuring that they created an environment that was comfortable for Royce White.  It doesn't seem like they did that.  It seems like they treated him like just another rookie. 


I kinda disagree. If you are getting paid millions by an organization to play basketball and you declare for a draft to be selected to play in the NBA, it is not your employer's prerogative to make sure you can play basketball with an NBA travel schedule.

If Royce White needed to only play home games and not much else, this needed to be made clear to all the teams while they were doing their draft interviews. Which would have lead to 30 teams not touching the guy with a ten foot pole on draft night.

What is the bet that Royce and his agent sugar coated this situation at draft time?

I'm not making light of his disorder or his fear of flying but why did Royce declare for the draft, knowing all about his struggles and probably knowing a fair bit about what an NBA team expects travel-wise?

I kinda disagree with your disagreement.  It is the employer's prerogative.  Just like with any player, it's up to the GM to pick a player who will be able to perform, and it's up to the coaching staff to help that player turn into the most productive player he can be.

Caveat emptor.  It's not like the Rockets didn't have plenty of warning that they were taking a guy who had some issues and was going to need to be handled with care. If they couldn't deal with that, then they probably shouldn't have drafted him.

Maybe there's no team that will be able to meet Royce White's needs, but my guess is that he could find a home where he could be a good NBA player.  I'm no psychiatrist, but my guess is also that it's as much about the interpersonal relationships and how he feels he was treated by the Rockets as it is about flights and practices. 

As to your last paragraph, Royce White declared for the draft because he thought he would be drafted.  He was right.  I'm sure he didn't plan on this stuff happening.

It's like saying, "How dare Gabe Pruitt declare himself for the NBA draft when he knows he doesn't have what it takes to make it as an NBA player?  The honorable thing for Gabe to do would be to go straight to Europe or the D-League and not waste an NBA franchise's draft pick and money."
Should a janitor apply to be a surgeon or pilot knowing he can't do the jobs?  What if some idiot actually hires him due to a faulty background check?

I'm not going to apply for a job that I'm incapable of doing.

Both those professions have strict controls in place to prevent that from happening.

So does the NBA in a sense, it's called the scouting department and now getting a free year of college tape and reports.

Houston's scouting department obviously let them down, not sure why that's Royce White's fault. He's clearly athletically skilled enough to play the position.

 Under the logic here, Should every draft bust feel like they stole money, or is it different with Royce because of the stigma we associate with mental health issues?

I shed no tears for Houston, they evaluated the risk vs. reward and came to the conclusion that drafting a player who most said would be top 10 but for his mental health concerns was good value at pick 18. They were wrong.


“I will hurt you for this. A day will come when you think you’re safe and happy and your joy will turn to ashes in your mouth. And you will know the debt is paid.” – Tyrion

Re: Royce White missing games and practices
« Reply #78 on: November 17, 2012, 09:38:04 AM »

Offline moiso

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If it was worth the risk, then it was also worth ensuring that they created an environment that was comfortable for Royce White.  It doesn't seem like they did that.  It seems like they treated him like just another rookie. 


I kinda disagree. If you are getting paid millions by an organization to play basketball and you declare for a draft to be selected to play in the NBA, it is not your employer's prerogative to make sure you can play basketball with an NBA travel schedule.

If Royce White needed to only play home games and not much else, this needed to be made clear to all the teams while they were doing their draft interviews. Which would have lead to 30 teams not touching the guy with a ten foot pole on draft night.

What is the bet that Royce and his agent sugar coated this situation at draft time?

I'm not making light of his disorder or his fear of flying but why did Royce declare for the draft, knowing all about his struggles and probably knowing a fair bit about what an NBA team expects travel-wise?

I kinda disagree with your disagreement.  It is the employer's prerogative.  Just like with any player, it's up to the GM to pick a player who will be able to perform, and it's up to the coaching staff to help that player turn into the most productive player he can be.

Caveat emptor.  It's not like the Rockets didn't have plenty of warning that they were taking a guy who had some issues and was going to need to be handled with care. If they couldn't deal with that, then they probably shouldn't have drafted him.

Maybe there's no team that will be able to meet Royce White's needs, but my guess is that he could find a home where he could be a good NBA player.  I'm no psychiatrist, but my guess is also that it's as much about the interpersonal relationships and how he feels he was treated by the Rockets as it is about flights and practices. 

As to your last paragraph, Royce White declared for the draft because he thought he would be drafted.  He was right.  I'm sure he didn't plan on this stuff happening.

It's like saying, "How dare Gabe Pruitt declare himself for the NBA draft when he knows he doesn't have what it takes to make it as an NBA player?  The honorable thing for Gabe to do would be to go straight to Europe or the D-League and not waste an NBA franchise's draft pick and money."
Should a janitor apply to be a surgeon or pilot knowing he can't do the jobs?  What if some idiot actually hires him due to a faulty background check?

I'm not going to apply for a job that I'm incapable of doing.

Both those professions have strict controls in place to prevent that from happening.

So does the NBA in a sense, it's called the scouting department and now getting a free year of college tape and reports.

Houston's scouting department obviously let them down, not sure why that's Royce White's fault. He's clearly athletically skilled enough to pay the position.

 Under the logic here, Should every draft bust feel like they stole money, or is it different with Royce because of the stigma we associate with mental health issues?

I shed no tears for Houston, they evaluated the risk vs. reward and came to the conclusion that drafting a player who most said would be top 10 but for his mental health concerns was good value at pick 18. They were wrong.
You are right but let me try another one to make my point a little clearer.  Would you apply to work at a deli if you were deathly afraid to go near the meat slicers?

Re: Royce White missing games and practices
« Reply #79 on: November 17, 2012, 09:53:23 AM »

Offline crownsy

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If it was worth the risk, then it was also worth ensuring that they created an environment that was comfortable for Royce White.  It doesn't seem like they did that.  It seems like they treated him like just another rookie. 


I kinda disagree. If you are getting paid millions by an organization to play basketball and you declare for a draft to be selected to play in the NBA, it is not your employer's prerogative to make sure you can play basketball with an NBA travel schedule.

If Royce White needed to only play home games and not much else, this needed to be made clear to all the teams while they were doing their draft interviews. Which would have lead to 30 teams not touching the guy with a ten foot pole on draft night.

What is the bet that Royce and his agent sugar coated this situation at draft time?

I'm not making light of his disorder or his fear of flying but why did Royce declare for the draft, knowing all about his struggles and probably knowing a fair bit about what an NBA team expects travel-wise?

I kinda disagree with your disagreement.  It is the employer's prerogative.  Just like with any player, it's up to the GM to pick a player who will be able to perform, and it's up to the coaching staff to help that player turn into the most productive player he can be.

Caveat emptor.  It's not like the Rockets didn't have plenty of warning that they were taking a guy who had some issues and was going to need to be handled with care. If they couldn't deal with that, then they probably shouldn't have drafted him.

Maybe there's no team that will be able to meet Royce White's needs, but my guess is that he could find a home where he could be a good NBA player.  I'm no psychiatrist, but my guess is also that it's as much about the interpersonal relationships and how he feels he was treated by the Rockets as it is about flights and practices. 

As to your last paragraph, Royce White declared for the draft because he thought he would be drafted.  He was right.  I'm sure he didn't plan on this stuff happening.

It's like saying, "How dare Gabe Pruitt declare himself for the NBA draft when he knows he doesn't have what it takes to make it as an NBA player?  The honorable thing for Gabe to do would be to go straight to Europe or the D-League and not waste an NBA franchise's draft pick and money."
Should a janitor apply to be a surgeon or pilot knowing he can't do the jobs?  What if some idiot actually hires him due to a faulty background check?

I'm not going to apply for a job that I'm incapable of doing.

Both those professions have strict controls in place to prevent that from happening.

So does the NBA in a sense, it's called the scouting department and now getting a free year of college tape and reports.

Houston's scouting department obviously let them down, not sure why that's Royce White's fault. He's clearly athletically skilled enough to pay the position.

 Under the logic here, Should every draft bust feel like they stole money, or is it different with Royce because of the stigma we associate with mental health issues?

I shed no tears for Houston, they evaluated the risk vs. reward and came to the conclusion that drafting a player who most said would be top 10 but for his mental health concerns was good value at pick 18. They were wrong.
You are right but let me try another one to make my point a little clearer.  Would you apply to work at a deli if you were deathly afraid to go near the meat slicers?

That's a bad analogy. He's a good meat slicer. He's afraid to travel.

so the analogy should be

"If I was a fantastic meat slicer, would I apply to a job where I sliced meat in different cities if I knew I had a problem traveling?"

and the answer is probably yes, because one assumes that I would want to employ my meat slicing talents, and would be hopeful I could overcome my fear of traveling.

Would I be correct in thinking I could overcome the fear of traveling? I would hope so, as I'm sure Royce was hopeful.

Should I not apply to a job that I know I'm highly skilled for because I might not be able to manage my mental illness? Should I stay in Topeka, Kansas and be a fantastic meat slicer no one cares about because I have an illness that might impact my career?

The thing people are confusing or disregarding here, and we had the same problem with deleonte, is this belief that people with mental health illnesses should give up on trying to improve themselves and live their life according to the limitations of their disease. That whatever makes the person "all cray cray" is a permanent condition they should be ashamed of and not try to improve or manage.

There seems to be this Idea that White is sitting there going "Muahhahaha I had no intention of attempting to overcome or manage my WELL KNOWN PRIOR TO EMPLOYMENT OFFER mental handicap, now I can screw over the poor, helpless rockets!!"

I'm sure he's just as frustrated as the rockets. Do you think he wants to give up his lifelong dream and succumb to his mental illness? I'm gonna guess the answer is probably no.

“I will hurt you for this. A day will come when you think you’re safe and happy and your joy will turn to ashes in your mouth. And you will know the debt is paid.” – Tyrion

Re: Royce White missing games and practices
« Reply #80 on: November 17, 2012, 10:59:33 AM »

Offline Arok325

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You can blame the Rockets all you want for not having a plan to deal with White and his mental illness but it appears to me they have made every effort to accommodate his demands. They wanted him to attend sessions with a therapist which declined to attend (doesn't seem like a difficult request to me), they picked up the tab on his bus/RV/whatever travel to games (again, seems like quite a nice employer offer to me), they have even allowed him to skip games and practices so he can deal with his issues. What more can they do to for the guy!?

It seems to me like they have done everything that should be required of them to make this thing work and more. The miscommunication is obviously on White's part. He's the one who is making this ordeal public and quite frankly he looks like a fool. This kid thinks that because he suffers from a disability that he can put an entire organization at its knees so that he can get what he wants. But wait, let's look at the real issue here.

The real issue is the kid is demanding playing time so that he can feel less anxious about everything. This is an unreasonable request. You earn playing time you aren't handed it. This kid thinks he's such a commodity (his words) that he can make the company that employs him meet every one of his demands. The Rockets have to protect their owns interests and I wouldn't be surprised if they cut him as soon as Monday when he meets with the GM. At some point the risk outweighs the reward. Personally, I would've already cut him and the fact that the Rockets haven't yet is a testament to the fact that they're doing everything necessary to keep this kid on the team.

Also, let's be honest here, the Rocket's aren't even losing that much if they cut their losses with White. Plenty of 16th picks don't make it in the pros. The kid is talented but stories like this are a dime a dozen in the NBA. At some point, and I imagine soon, they will decide to move forward and then White will be left without a job. The kid won't have much of a career after that so he better stop acting like he has all the leverage here. Seriously, the decision for him is between having an NBA career or becoming a martyr and playing for the Globetrotters for the rest of his days.

Re: Royce White missing games and practices
« Reply #81 on: November 17, 2012, 11:10:22 AM »

Offline moiso

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The fact that White sounds so pompous in his tweets and statements doesn't help people's opinions of him either.  I can't believe how cocky he sounds for a rookie who has yet to play a minute in the nba.

I would far more sympathetic if he sounded a little more humble.  People usually have to fit into the world, and not expect the world to change for them.  The Rockets appear to be bending over backwards to accomodate the kid, but obviously it's not nearly enough for White.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2012, 11:15:48 AM by moiso »

Re: Royce White missing games and practices
« Reply #82 on: November 17, 2012, 11:31:59 AM »

Offline crownsy

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The fact that White sounds so pompous in his tweets and statements doesn't help people's opinions of him either.  I can't believe how cocky he sounds for a rookie who has yet to play a minute in the nba.

I would far more sympathetic if he sounded a little more humble.  People usually have to fit into the world, and not expect the world to change for them.  The Rockets appear to be bending over backwards to accomodate the kid, but obviously it's not nearly enough for White.

Oh absolutely, but he's a teenager (or is he 20?) with a mental illness that has teenage responses to Adult's telling him he needs to be more responsible.

I.E he's a jackoff, as most teenagers are haha. I'd like to go back in time and slap the taste out of 19 year old crownsy's mouth, but at the time i thought I had it allllll figured out  ;)
“I will hurt you for this. A day will come when you think you’re safe and happy and your joy will turn to ashes in your mouth. And you will know the debt is paid.” – Tyrion

Re: Royce White missing games and practices
« Reply #83 on: November 17, 2012, 12:13:30 PM »

Online Roy H.

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According to Woj, a lot of the complaints about "health issues" are coming because the Rockets aren't playing White:

Quote
White has turned down NBA D-League assignments, missed practices and conditioning workouts and tried to convince Rockets officials that his anxiety order would be much, much better if they would simply play him in games. This isn't a negotiation, and never will be.

 Houston redid White's contract so it could pay for White's RVs and car services on trips, because of his fear of flying. The Rockets have let him come and go this season without fining him. They owe him that patience and understanding, but they don't owe him playing time. It's earned in the NBA, the way three Houston rookies are trying to earn it.

If it was easier for White to manage his anxiety disorder when he was the star at Iowa State, well, that isn't the Rockets' problem. There's no leveraging an anxiety disorder to get out of a D-League demotion and onto the NBA floor.

When meetings with Rockets coaches and officials couldn't get White the minutes he wanted, when a demotion to Rio Grande and the bus trips of the minors had been broached, White stopped showing up to the team's facility for practices and games last week. Maybe it was a coincidence, but White is losing the benefit of the doubt.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nba--royce-white-s-battle-with-rockets-over-aniexty-disorder-could-cost-him-nba-career-16011709.html


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Re: Royce White missing games and practices
« Reply #84 on: November 17, 2012, 01:25:42 PM »

Offline TA9

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This guy needs to pull himself together.
Wont be surprised if he gets cut if this continues.
Dont tell me that the sky is the limit when there are footprints on the moon!

Re: Royce White missing games and practices
« Reply #85 on: November 17, 2012, 01:41:44 PM »

Offline RJ87

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Honestly what makes you think they didn't have a "strong" plan in place? They were negotiating with him and his agent before he even reported to camp initially.

Based on the current acrimony that plan that Royce agreed to is no longer to his liking. This isn't the Dolan's and their mess of an ownership, I doubt the Rockets have been running around violating the initial agreement they setup with Royce and his agent/lawyer/doctors.

Honestly, what makes you think they're being 100% upfront with how they've handled this situation? We're both making assumptions - you're assuming Houston is a well oiled machine, but who really knows what has been said behind the scenes. Maybe I'm assuming Royce doesn't have another agenda here because I've personally dealt a lot with ignorant people making hurtful, uninformed comments about mental health issues. One thing I feel pretty confident of, there's two sides to every story and we may never know how this has really played out between both parties. Royce is Twitter as his primary mouthpiece and that comes with its own disadvantages and the Rockets have PR team dedicatied to spinning this into the team's favor.I just think its really arrogant to assume that the Rockets are the perfectly run organization and they may not be making their own missteps, and it sounds like they have. Part of having a "strong plan" in place is outlining boundaries and consequences of certain behavior. Its not just getting him an RV or a car service.
Quote
Ainge had mentioned he expects Rondo to get paid 'star money.' On that subject, Rondo said, 'I'm making star money now, really. Its a pretty good living. I'll let my agent handle those terms.'

You have to be good before you can be great. Build a team instead of tearing it down.

Re: Royce White missing games and practices
« Reply #86 on: November 17, 2012, 01:48:25 PM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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This guy needs to pull himself together.
Wont be surprised if he gets cut if this continues.

They are just scard the Lakers or Celtics will pick him up for nothing and make an alstar out of him....LoL...

Re: Royce White missing games and practices
« Reply #87 on: November 17, 2012, 02:17:45 PM »

Offline ManUp

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It seems he faked it to make it into the 1st round. Now that he's got his guaranteed contract the real Royce White is coming out. Anxiety or not the story on him seems to be that he's an ****.

Re: Royce White missing games and practices
« Reply #88 on: November 17, 2012, 02:42:43 PM »

Offline TA9

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This guy needs to pull himself together.
Wont be surprised if he gets cut if this continues.

They are just scard the Lakers or Celtics will pick him up for nothing and make an alstar out of him....LoL...
Lol.. TP hahaha
Dont tell me that the sky is the limit when there are footprints on the moon!

Re: Royce White missing games and practices
« Reply #89 on: November 17, 2012, 03:10:06 PM »

Offline moiso

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It seems he faked it to make it into the 1st round. Now that he's got his guaranteed contract the real Royce White is coming out. Anxiety or not the story on him seems to be that he's an ****.
TP.  Agree 100%.

 

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