Author Topic: Chris Paul Still better than Rondo?  (Read 7642 times)

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Re: Chris Paul Still better than Rondo?
« Reply #165 on: November 15, 2012, 06:57:07 PM »

Offline bfrombleacher

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I'm still trying to process the idea that Rondo playing more minutes is anything other than how sad our on-ball guard situation is.

Semi-related, CP3 and the Clips trounced Miami last night. And I enjoyed the hell out of it.

Last night: Rondo 25 mins

It's coming together

Re: Chris Paul Still better than Rondo?
« Reply #166 on: November 15, 2012, 07:20:49 PM »

Offline celtsfan84

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It's cool when CP and Deron play their backsides off against the Bobcats and Wizards and pump up good stats, but I really want to see them racking up 44/10/8 against the best team in the NBA.

Rondo could average that if he wanted, but he doesn't. The quality that makes Rondo deserve to be a Top 5 player in general is his ability to always show up when needed and to outplay basically anyone. Where are CP and Deron in the playoffs and against Rajon? Oh right, they play on mediocre teams and RR always shuts 'em down.

Just because the NBA promotes the Clips or Lakers more than everyone else (except the Heat), it doesn't mean they are really legitimate contenders? The Lakers are old and have a terrible bench, but Clips are in fact good, but 2nd round is their ceiling, and the lobs and flashy plays aren't going to buy 'em nothing else than highlight clips on youtube..

If Rondo could average 44/10/8 then he should, and we'd have the last 5 championships. What a slacker.

Trust me, he could. What's the point in playing your mind off vs the Bobcats/Hornets/Nets/Wizards?

So are you saying he tanks it for most of the season?  Not really the type of player I'd be interested in.  Some players are able to play their best against all competition.  Ask Michael Jordan, the driving force behind a 72 win team.  Why take nights off?  Is he tired?


  I think it's reasonably prudent that Rondo not play as aggressively during the season as he does during the playoffs. We're not better off with our best player fighting through more nagging injuries than he gets now. OTOH, he learned about (somewhat) coasting through the season from PP/KG/RA. I'm assuming that you're not interested in that type of player?

He should probably play less minutes then if that is the goal. 

And KG, Paul, and Ray were a bit older, no?  Was KG coasting in his mid 20s?  You assume incorrectly.

There's also a pretty big difference between slowing things down and deciding to purposely not play your best basketball. 

By the way, where was Rondo's 44/10/8 in Game 7 against Miami if he can drop those games at will?  I'd like  to have had Banner 18 last year.  Saving it for next year, maybe?

Re: Chris Paul Still better than Rondo?
« Reply #167 on: November 15, 2012, 07:36:53 PM »

Offline Celtics18

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Championships might not be everything but they sure do matter alot when comparing players. Not so much role players but leaders of a team. If two players are close in skill and one player has championships and the other doesn't then im leaning more towards the guy that led *Or was a huge part* his team to a ring over the guy that didn't. Paul hasn't even sniffed a championship ring yet. Rondo has one *Even tho he wasn't the leader that year* and hes been to another final *Shoulda won that but the refs screwed us*. Rondo also had a unbelievable game 2 against the heat *Refs screwed us in that to we should have won*. Correct me if im wrong but has chris paul ever even lead his team past the second round yet?

Well, by that very narrow, one-sided criteria that ignores coaches, teammates, and about a million other variables, where does that rank CP3 in the NBA?

Certainly below Tony Parker who has three championships and might head the PG list, below Rondo, below D-Rose whose team went to the Eastern Finals last year, below DeRon whose Jazz team went to the Western Finals against the Lakers, below Nash whose Suns team went to the Western Finals agaisnt the Lakers fairly recently, below Westbrook whose team went to the Finals this past season and the Western Finals last season.

Does CP3 even crack the top 10?  Is he even in the top 50 of overall players?

I don't want to speak for Smurf, but I think the point he is making is that when players are fairly evenly matched that playoff success (particularly, being a champion) can clearly tip the scales in one player's favor. 

It may not be fair to really good players playing for bad or mediocre teams, but there is an expectation that great players need to win. 

Rondo is a proven winner when the games matter most.  That counts for a lot, in my book. 

Re: Chris Paul Still better than Rondo?
« Reply #168 on: November 15, 2012, 08:03:28 PM »

Offline BballTim

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It's cool when CP and Deron play their backsides off against the Bobcats and Wizards and pump up good stats, but I really want to see them racking up 44/10/8 against the best team in the NBA.

Rondo could average that if he wanted, but he doesn't. The quality that makes Rondo deserve to be a Top 5 player in general is his ability to always show up when needed and to outplay basically anyone. Where are CP and Deron in the playoffs and against Rajon? Oh right, they play on mediocre teams and RR always shuts 'em down.

Just because the NBA promotes the Clips or Lakers more than everyone else (except the Heat), it doesn't mean they are really legitimate contenders? The Lakers are old and have a terrible bench, but Clips are in fact good, but 2nd round is their ceiling, and the lobs and flashy plays aren't going to buy 'em nothing else than highlight clips on youtube..

If Rondo could average 44/10/8 then he should, and we'd have the last 5 championships. What a slacker.

Trust me, he could. What's the point in playing your mind off vs the Bobcats/Hornets/Nets/Wizards?

So are you saying he tanks it for most of the season?  Not really the type of player I'd be interested in.  Some players are able to play their best against all competition.  Ask Michael Jordan, the driving force behind a 72 win team.  Why take nights off?  Is he tired?


  I think it's reasonably prudent that Rondo not play as aggressively during the season as he does during the playoffs. We're not better off with our best player fighting through more nagging injuries than he gets now. OTOH, he learned about (somewhat) coasting through the season from PP/KG/RA. I'm assuming that you're not interested in that type of player?

He should probably play less minutes then if that is the goal. 


  It's not the minutes, it's the pounding that he would take.

Re: Chris Paul Still better than Rondo?
« Reply #169 on: November 15, 2012, 08:50:20 PM »

Offline celtsfan84

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It's cool when CP and Deron play their backsides off against the Bobcats and Wizards and pump up good stats, but I really want to see them racking up 44/10/8 against the best team in the NBA.

Rondo could average that if he wanted, but he doesn't. The quality that makes Rondo deserve to be a Top 5 player in general is his ability to always show up when needed and to outplay basically anyone. Where are CP and Deron in the playoffs and against Rajon? Oh right, they play on mediocre teams and RR always shuts 'em down.

Just because the NBA promotes the Clips or Lakers more than everyone else (except the Heat), it doesn't mean they are really legitimate contenders? The Lakers are old and have a terrible bench, but Clips are in fact good, but 2nd round is their ceiling, and the lobs and flashy plays aren't going to buy 'em nothing else than highlight clips on youtube..

If Rondo could average 44/10/8 then he should, and we'd have the last 5 championships. What a slacker.

Trust me, he could. What's the point in playing your mind off vs the Bobcats/Hornets/Nets/Wizards?

So are you saying he tanks it for most of the season?  Not really the type of player I'd be interested in.  Some players are able to play their best against all competition.  Ask Michael Jordan, the driving force behind a 72 win team.  Why take nights off?  Is he tired?


  I think it's reasonably prudent that Rondo not play as aggressively during the season as he does during the playoffs. We're not better off with our best player fighting through more nagging injuries than he gets now. OTOH, he learned about (somewhat) coasting through the season from PP/KG/RA. I'm assuming that you're not interested in that type of player?

He should probably play less minutes then if that is the goal. 


  It's not the minutes, it's the pounding that he would take.

Statistically speaking, his numbers are pretty similar in the regular season and the postseason.  In some areas, worse.  This year, for instance, per 36 minutes, he scored 1.4 more points, 1.2 more rebounds, and 1.6 less assists.  Other postseasons have similarly marginal increases and decreases in given areas.

The difference between "tank mode season" Rondo and "full effort playoff" Rondo seems to be truly no difference at all.

Regardless, my intent was to say that the idea that CP3 inflates his stats against poor teams and that is why he outscores Rondo is pretty ridiculous.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2012, 08:55:44 PM by celtsfan84 »

Re: Chris Paul Still better than Rondo?
« Reply #170 on: November 15, 2012, 08:55:52 PM »

Offline OsirusCeltics

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Of course Chris Paul is better than Rondo. Why do we have 12 pages discussing an easy topic?

Re: Chris Paul Still better than Rondo?
« Reply #171 on: November 15, 2012, 09:05:24 PM »

Offline celtsfan84

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Of course Chris Paul is better than Rondo. Why do we have 12 pages discussing an easy topic?

Because I'm dumb enough to continue to reply, I guess.  I'll stop now.

Re: Chris Paul Still better than Rondo?
« Reply #172 on: November 15, 2012, 10:28:05 PM »

Offline OsirusCeltics

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Of course Chris Paul is better than Rondo. Why do we have 12 pages discussing an easy topic?

Because I'm dumb enough to continue to reply, I guess.  I'll stop now.

Yeah your post on this topic was so on point

The only thing Rondo has over Paul is his rebounding, and assists are about equal
I guess everyone overlooks the advantages Paul has in shooting, consistent play night after night, steals, scoring in crunch time huh?  ::)

Re: Chris Paul Still better than Rondo?
« Reply #173 on: November 15, 2012, 11:25:24 PM »

Offline vinnie

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Yes

Re: Chris Paul Still better than Rondo?
« Reply #174 on: November 16, 2012, 12:20:42 AM »

Offline Kane3387

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CP3 is the the best PG in the NBA.

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Re: Chris Paul Still better than Rondo?
« Reply #175 on: November 16, 2012, 12:44:59 AM »

Offline CelticG1

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People will continue to make excuses for Paul and continue to state that Rondo gets to play with 3 HOF even though said HOF's were certainly past their prime.

Clippers were supposedly title contenders last year and then fell flat on their face and people made excuses. Now clippers are supposedly title contenders this year but everyone is already lining up excuses for them.

Paul apparently turns his team into a title contender but at the same time has little chance of making a playoff run due to his supporting cast. My god that's laughable

They made it the 2nd round?  How is it falling on their face?



And just because Paul is a better player, how is that a slight at Rondo who is a top 5 PG?

Ok the clips barely made into the second round (with homecourt?) And then had about as an embarrassing second round as you can have. To a team that pretty much got smoked in the WCF.

Are the clippers a title contending team this year? It seems many people think they are including several people you quoted in this thread (for some unknown reason). So how well should a title contending team with Paul do?


They were the 5th seed against Memphis.  (and Paul played really well to push them over the edge)

Huh? Played really well against the Grizz? He played decent I certainly wouldnt say he played really well or raised his game in any sort of fashion. Did you watch that series? I did but took a look at the boxscores just in case I missed something drastic. Nope I didn't...oh and beware do not take a look at his games against the spurs.

I guess its somewhat of an accomplishment to win a round in the playoffs against a team that finished one game ahead of you. Maybe that title contending team can do it again this year!

Re: Chris Paul Still better than Rondo?
« Reply #176 on: November 16, 2012, 09:03:23 AM »

Offline scaryjerry

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Of course Chris Paul is better than Rondo. Why do we have 12 pages discussing an easy topic?

So then the clippers should easily be finals bound

Until then


Chris Paul's done nothing....average at best

Re: Chris Paul Still better than Rondo?
« Reply #177 on: November 16, 2012, 09:36:09 AM »

Offline relja

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Stats per 36 and 48 minutes are worthless and don't tell anything. Only for stat nerds like Hollinger.

Re: Chris Paul Still better than Rondo?
« Reply #178 on: November 16, 2012, 09:42:42 AM »

Offline scaryjerry

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If you replace dirk nowitzki wit Chris Paul on the mavericks title team do you make it out of the first round? Sorry not a top player...top pg sure...better than rondo? Eh barely

Are you of the opinion that if you replaced Dirk Nowinski, one of the most dominate big men of this generation, with Rajon Rondo, they go any farther? For sure not.

All your analogy proves is that a game breaking 7 footer is more valuable than a Point Guard. Shocking Stuff
I haven't argued Rondo is better.. I think its close and they're top pgs

I'm arguing against Paul being a top 5 player

Ok so how is he easily a better player then dirk then if dirk is more valuable,, won an mvp and carried his team to a title? Not seeing it

Re: Chris Paul Still better than Rondo?
« Reply #179 on: November 16, 2012, 09:49:31 AM »

Offline scaryjerry

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Chris Paul looked awesome last night.  He's unstoppable when he wants to be.

The clippers didn't win that game because of Chris paul they won it because of Blake's 22 and 14 and Crawford and bledsoe combining for 34 off the bench

 

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