Author Topic: What is next for Scott Brown?  (Read 2551 times)

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Re: What is next for Scott Brown?
« Reply #15 on: November 13, 2012, 10:05:21 AM »

Offline JSD

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Brown lost the election because of all these uneducated voters came out, saw a D next to some woman's name and filled it in. That is MA for you.

Brown wins a special election because those folks who come out in droves for a presidential election don't otherwise.

I think this is more than a little unfair.  While I agree that Brown lost because of the letter next to his name, I think the voting public were actually pretty well informed about this election.  The problem was, the majority of MA voters were scared to death of having Republicans take control of the Senate. 

This is the problem with Senate and to a lesser extent Congressional elections.  Because so much is voted on party lines in those houses, and the balance of power can have such a huge effect on what gets done, party plays a much bigger role than even the presidential election, where I think the individual is taken much more into account.

I don't think it's unfair at all. More people come out for presidential elections to submit their American Idol like votes. In the process it gives anyone with a D next to their name here in MA an advantage.

Do you live in MA?  Because speaking as someone who does my darndest to avoid political ads, etc. it was VERY hard to avoid this election.  The market was saturated with information about Brown and Warren.  The vast majority of people knew who they were voting for.


Yes, I live in MA and work in Boston. And let me tell you, I can't remember a race and ad campaign(s) LESS about the issues than this Warren/Brown race.

Re: What is next for Scott Brown?
« Reply #16 on: November 13, 2012, 10:08:29 AM »

Offline Chris

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Brown lost the election because of all these uneducated voters came out, saw a D next to some woman's name and filled it in. That is MA for you.

Brown wins a special election because those folks who come out in droves for a presidential election don't otherwise.

I think this is more than a little unfair.  While I agree that Brown lost because of the letter next to his name, I think the voting public were actually pretty well informed about this election.  The problem was, the majority of MA voters were scared to death of having Republicans take control of the Senate. 

This is the problem with Senate and to a lesser extent Congressional elections.  Because so much is voted on party lines in those houses, and the balance of power can have such a huge effect on what gets done, party plays a much bigger role than even the presidential election, where I think the individual is taken much more into account.

I don't think it's unfair at all. More people come out for presidential elections to submit their American Idol like votes. In the process it gives anyone with a D next to their name here in MA an advantage.

Do you live in MA?  Because speaking as someone who does my darndest to avoid political ads, etc. it was VERY hard to avoid this election.  The market was saturated with information about Brown and Warren.  The vast majority of people knew who they were voting for.


Yes, I live in MA and work in Boston. And let me tell you, I can't remember a race and ad campaign(s) LESS about the issues than this Warren/Brown race.

That's different than being uneducated.  You are right that this election was all about the parties.  But that doesn't mean people didn't know who or what they were voting for.  They were voting for control of the Senate. 

Re: What is next for Scott Brown?
« Reply #17 on: November 13, 2012, 10:18:46 AM »

Online KCattheStripe

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If the choice is between Governor or a vacant Senate seat, e should choose the special election senate seat. Deval will run circles around him.

Re: What is next for Scott Brown?
« Reply #18 on: November 13, 2012, 10:19:24 AM »

Offline JSD

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Brown lost the election because of all these uneducated voters came out, saw a D next to some woman's name and filled it in. That is MA for you.

Brown wins a special election because those folks who come out in droves for a presidential election don't otherwise.

I think this is more than a little unfair.  While I agree that Brown lost because of the letter next to his name, I think the voting public were actually pretty well informed about this election.  The problem was, the majority of MA voters were scared to death of having Republicans take control of the Senate. 

This is the problem with Senate and to a lesser extent Congressional elections.  Because so much is voted on party lines in those houses, and the balance of power can have such a huge effect on what gets done, party plays a much bigger role than even the presidential election, where I think the individual is taken much more into account.

I don't think it's unfair at all. More people come out for presidential elections to submit their American Idol like votes. In the process it gives anyone with a D next to their name here in MA an advantage.

Do you live in MA?  Because speaking as someone who does my darndest to avoid political ads, etc. it was VERY hard to avoid this election.  The market was saturated with information about Brown and Warren.  The vast majority of people knew who they were voting for.


Yes, I live in MA and work in Boston. And let me tell you, I can't remember a race and ad campaign(s) LESS about the issues than this Warren/Brown race.

That's different than being uneducated.  You are right that this election was all about the parties.  But that doesn't mean people didn't know who or what they were voting for.  They were voting for control of the Senate.

You were suggesting that living in this market and being saturated with information (ads ect.) somehow meant that people knew the issues. The vast majority did not, partially because the ads didn't address anything of substance. I learned that Scott Brown hates woman and that Elizabeth Warren lied about being an American Indian.

Re: What is next for Scott Brown?
« Reply #19 on: November 13, 2012, 10:20:03 AM »

Offline Rondo2287

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If the choice is between Governor or a vacant Senate seat, e should choose the special election senate seat. Deval will run circles around him.

Agreed, Deval is great at running for office.
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Re: What is next for Scott Brown?
« Reply #20 on: November 13, 2012, 10:21:45 AM »

Offline JSD

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If the choice is between Governor or a vacant Senate seat, e should choose the special election senate seat. Deval will run circles around him.

Agreed, Deval is great at running for office.

Deval isn't seeking reelection in 2014, from what I understand.

Re: What is next for Scott Brown?
« Reply #21 on: November 13, 2012, 10:29:32 AM »

Offline Chris

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Brown lost the election because of all these uneducated voters came out, saw a D next to some woman's name and filled it in. That is MA for you.

Brown wins a special election because those folks who come out in droves for a presidential election don't otherwise.

I think this is more than a little unfair.  While I agree that Brown lost because of the letter next to his name, I think the voting public were actually pretty well informed about this election.  The problem was, the majority of MA voters were scared to death of having Republicans take control of the Senate. 

This is the problem with Senate and to a lesser extent Congressional elections.  Because so much is voted on party lines in those houses, and the balance of power can have such a huge effect on what gets done, party plays a much bigger role than even the presidential election, where I think the individual is taken much more into account.

I don't think it's unfair at all. More people come out for presidential elections to submit their American Idol like votes. In the process it gives anyone with a D next to their name here in MA an advantage.

Do you live in MA?  Because speaking as someone who does my darndest to avoid political ads, etc. it was VERY hard to avoid this election.  The market was saturated with information about Brown and Warren.  The vast majority of people knew who they were voting for.


Yes, I live in MA and work in Boston. And let me tell you, I can't remember a race and ad campaign(s) LESS about the issues than this Warren/Brown race.

That's different than being uneducated.  You are right that this election was all about the parties.  But that doesn't mean people didn't know who or what they were voting for.  They were voting for control of the Senate.

You were suggesting that living in this market and being saturated with information (ads ect.) somehow meant that people knew the issues. The vast majority did not, partially because the ads didn't address anything of substance. I learned that Scott Brown hates woman and that Elizabeth Warren lied about being an American Indian.

No, what I said is that they knew who they were voting for.  Your original post (which was incredibly inflamatory towards everyone who voted for Warren IMO), suggested that the voters didn't even know who Warren was, just that she had a D next to her name. 

I think plenty of people voted for Warren because she is a Democrat.  But I don't think that means they are "uneducated".

Re: What is next for Scott Brown?
« Reply #22 on: November 13, 2012, 10:31:47 AM »

Offline Chris

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If the choice is between Governor or a vacant Senate seat, e should choose the special election senate seat. Deval will run circles around him.

Agreed, Deval is great at running for office.

He also is overall very well liked in MA, not just for his ability to run. 

But, my theory is based on the idea that Patrick won't run next term.  He has higher ambitions. 

Re: What is next for Scott Brown?
« Reply #23 on: November 13, 2012, 10:45:48 AM »

Offline JSD

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Brown lost the election because of all these uneducated voters came out, saw a D next to some woman's name and filled it in. That is MA for you.

Brown wins a special election because those folks who come out in droves for a presidential election don't otherwise.

I think this is more than a little unfair.  While I agree that Brown lost because of the letter next to his name, I think the voting public were actually pretty well informed about this election.  The problem was, the majority of MA voters were scared to death of having Republicans take control of the Senate. 

This is the problem with Senate and to a lesser extent Congressional elections.  Because so much is voted on party lines in those houses, and the balance of power can have such a huge effect on what gets done, party plays a much bigger role than even the presidential election, where I think the individual is taken much more into account.

I don't think it's unfair at all. More people come out for presidential elections to submit their American Idol like votes. In the process it gives anyone with a D next to their name here in MA an advantage.

Do you live in MA?  Because speaking as someone who does my darndest to avoid political ads, etc. it was VERY hard to avoid this election.  The market was saturated with information about Brown and Warren.  The vast majority of people knew who they were voting for.


Yes, I live in MA and work in Boston. And let me tell you, I can't remember a race and ad campaign(s) LESS about the issues than this Warren/Brown race.

That's different than being uneducated.  You are right that this election was all about the parties.  But that doesn't mean people didn't know who or what they were voting for.  They were voting for control of the Senate.

You were suggesting that living in this market and being saturated with information (ads ect.) somehow meant that people knew the issues. The vast majority did not, partially because the ads didn't address anything of substance. I learned that Scott Brown hates woman and that Elizabeth Warren lied about being an American Indian.

No, what I said is that they knew who they were voting for.  Your original post (which was incredibly inflamatory towards everyone who voted for Warren IMO), suggested that the voters didn't even know who Warren was, just that she had a D next to her name. 

I think plenty of people voted for Warren because she is a Democrat.  But I don't think that means they are "uneducated".

It is not inflammatory. I think I was pretty squared away in making my point, but let me put it this way: Warren benefited from the increased number of uneducated voters that make their way out during the presidential election here in MA. If this were Texas I would be saying opposite and would be talking about how Brown benefitted.

Re: What is next for Scott Brown?
« Reply #24 on: November 13, 2012, 10:55:31 AM »

Offline Donoghus

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Brown lost the election because of all these uneducated voters came out, saw a D next to some woman's name and filled it in. That is MA for you.

Brown wins a special election because those folks who come out in droves for a presidential election don't otherwise.

I think this is more than a little unfair.  While I agree that Brown lost because of the letter next to his name, I think the voting public were actually pretty well informed about this election.  The problem was, the majority of MA voters were scared to death of having Republicans take control of the Senate. 

This is the problem with Senate and to a lesser extent Congressional elections.  Because so much is voted on party lines in those houses, and the balance of power can have such a huge effect on what gets done, party plays a much bigger role than even the presidential election, where I think the individual is taken much more into account.

I don't think it's unfair at all. More people come out for presidential elections to submit their American Idol like votes. In the process it gives anyone with a D next to their name here in MA an advantage.

Do you live in MA?  Because speaking as someone who does my darndest to avoid political ads, etc. it was VERY hard to avoid this election.  The market was saturated with information about Brown and Warren.  The vast majority of people knew who they were voting for.


Yes, I live in MA and work in Boston. And let me tell you, I can't remember a race and ad campaign(s) LESS about the issues than this Warren/Brown race.

That's different than being uneducated.  You are right that this election was all about the parties.  But that doesn't mean people didn't know who or what they were voting for.  They were voting for control of the Senate.

You were suggesting that living in this market and being saturated with information (ads ect.) somehow meant that people knew the issues. The vast majority did not, partially because the ads didn't address anything of substance. I learned that Scott Brown hates woman and that Elizabeth Warren lied about being an American Indian.

No, what I said is that they knew who they were voting for.  Your original post (which was incredibly inflamatory towards everyone who voted for Warren IMO), suggested that the voters didn't even know who Warren was, just that she had a D next to her name. 

I think plenty of people voted for Warren because she is a Democrat.  But I don't think that means they are "uneducated".

It is not inflammatory. I think I was pretty squared away in making my point, but let me put it this way: Warren benefited from the increased number of uneducated voters that make their way out during the presidential election here in MA. If this were Texas I would be saying opposite and would be talking about how Brown benefitted.

Actually, it was inflammatory and pretty ignorant statement to make.


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Re: What is next for Scott Brown?
« Reply #25 on: November 13, 2012, 11:02:28 AM »

Offline IndeedProceed

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Brown lost the election because of all these uneducated voters came out, saw a D next to some woman's name and filled it in. That is MA for you.

Brown wins a special election because those folks who come out in droves for a presidential election don't otherwise.

I think this is more than a little unfair.  While I agree that Brown lost because of the letter next to his name, I think the voting public were actually pretty well informed about this election.  The problem was, the majority of MA voters were scared to death of having Republicans take control of the Senate. 

This is the problem with Senate and to a lesser extent Congressional elections.  Because so much is voted on party lines in those houses, and the balance of power can have such a huge effect on what gets done, party plays a much bigger role than even the presidential election, where I think the individual is taken much more into account.

I don't think it's unfair at all. More people come out for presidential elections to submit their American Idol like votes. In the process it gives anyone with a D next to their name here in MA an advantage.

Do you live in MA?  Because speaking as someone who does my darndest to avoid political ads, etc. it was VERY hard to avoid this election.  The market was saturated with information about Brown and Warren.  The vast majority of people knew who they were voting for.


Yes, I live in MA and work in Boston. And let me tell you, I can't remember a race and ad campaign(s) LESS about the issues than this Warren/Brown race.

That's different than being uneducated.  You are right that this election was all about the parties.  But that doesn't mean people didn't know who or what they were voting for.  They were voting for control of the Senate.

You were suggesting that living in this market and being saturated with information (ads ect.) somehow meant that people knew the issues. The vast majority did not, partially because the ads didn't address anything of substance. I learned that Scott Brown hates woman and that Elizabeth Warren lied about being an American Indian.

No, what I said is that they knew who they were voting for.  Your original post (which was incredibly inflamatory towards everyone who voted for Warren IMO), suggested that the voters didn't even know who Warren was, just that she had a D next to her name. 

I think plenty of people voted for Warren because she is a Democrat.  But I don't think that means they are "uneducated".

It is not inflammatory. I think I was pretty squared away in making my point, but let me put it this way: Warren benefited from the increased number of uneducated voters that make their way out during the presidential election here in MA. If this were Texas I would be saying opposite and would be talking about how Brown benefitted.

Your point would be merit-less in either scenario without corroborating information. Your assumption that the vast majority of people who voted in this election that didn't vote in last election is conditional on 3 points:

1) That they are in fact, uninformed.

2) That they are in fact, more uninformed than the people who voted last time.

3) That they voted democrat.

You can't validate any 1 of those 3 points. You accusation is empirically baseless aside from the fact that more people voted.

And, on top of that, one would have to think that it was even more baseless considering Mass is the stat with the highest level of average educational attainment, and there is a clear correlation between educational attainment and voter knowledge.

I'm sure that some of the people who voted this time that chose not to vote last time were 'uninformed' (although, as Chris said, that's relatively impossible), but there is nothing to say that a larger part of those people were more uninformed this time than in a non-Presidential election cycle.

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Re: What is next for Scott Brown?
« Reply #26 on: November 13, 2012, 11:04:08 AM »

Offline JSD

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According to Boston.com, Deval Patrick has
pledged not to seek a third term. You've got to think this is one direction Brown is considering.

Re: What is next for Scott Brown?
« Reply #27 on: November 13, 2012, 11:15:56 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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According to Boston.com, Deval Patrick has
pledged not to seek a third term. You've got to think this is one direction Brown is considering.
Plus that has the benefit of giving him some time off campaigning.

Running 3 Senate elections in four years with a fourth looming in 2016 (if he were to be elected in a special) has to be completley exhausting.

Re: What is next for Scott Brown?
« Reply #28 on: November 13, 2012, 11:17:23 AM »

Offline JSD

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Please… There is no doubt more 'casual voters' that only come out during presidential elections. Of all those new casual voters, how many of them are less informed or base their vote on how others around them are voting or because of an attack ad? I would argue A TON. Otherwise, why are these candidates spending so much time on these ads that don’t even address the issues!

Also, there is a strong ‘correlation’ between individuals and peer influence. So my take is not meritless.

Re: What is next for Scott Brown?
« Reply #29 on: November 13, 2012, 11:23:36 AM »

Offline IndeedProceed

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Please… There is no doubt more 'casual voters' that only come out during presidential elections. Of all those new casual voters, how many of them are less informed or base their vote on how others around them are voting or because of an attack ad? I would argue A TON. Otherwise, why are these candidates spending so much time on these ads that don’t even address the issues!

Your argument would be speculative and based on nothing but a gut feeling. That's why its meritless.

Quote
Also, there is a strong ‘correlation’ between individuals and peer influence.

You're saying people voted Warren because their friends did? What's that have to do with the condition of Greg Oden's knees? People probably voted for Scott Brown because their dad did. People probably wrote in Ron Paul in the presidential slot because they had a kooky extremely vocal and persistent friend who was a Ron Paul supporter that eventually won them over. What does any of it matter?

You might as well say 'Elizabeth Warren won the Senate election because Mass typically votes democratic, especially in presdiential election years.'

One could actually verify that, and it doesn't imply an entire voting demographic is stupid.

Quote
So my take is not meritless.

Stand by it. Proof or it didn't happen.

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