Author Topic: GOP in Deep Trouble, Ron Paul Looking Good  (Read 11454 times)

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GOP in Deep Trouble, Ron Paul Looking Good
« on: November 07, 2012, 08:10:57 PM »

Offline JSD

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Romney lost today to a guy who is overseeing a horrible economy, prosecuting unpopular wars, and who can barely string 5 words together without a teleprompter. This was the best the Republican Party can do. Not only are the Republicans evil, they're evil and contemptible losers, which is far worse.

The biggest losers tonight are of course people who value peace and freedom, but we would have also lost if Romney won. The GOP is right up there in the loser category, however. The GOP lost seats in the Senate, and did little to improve its position in the House. It has served up two ridiculously bad nominees in a row, claiming "electability" and then going down in flames.

Rand Paul certainly came out of this looking very bad as well. He fell in line behind the party masters, banking on some advantage to be gained through an endorsement of Romney. He ended up just looking politically unsavvy and unprincipled. There is little to be gained either, from playing ball with a Party that as inept as the GOP at this point.

It's not beyond the realm of possibility that the GOP may actually show sign of disintegration in the next several years. The GOP has ceased to present any sort of actual alternative, and worse yet, it can't run a winning candidate. Once that happens, the coalition that makes up your political party will begin to fall apart.

The Ron Paul movement is a big winner here. The GOP told the libertarians in the party to get lost, and the GOP paid for it. Interestingly, both Iowa and Nevada, where Ron Paul supporters gained control of the state party, both went to Obama after the Romney campaign actively fought to disenfranchise Ron Paul supporters. I guess the GOP got what it wanted there.

There is exactly one movement that offers any real opposition to the status quo, and it ain't the conservative movement, which is on life support and entering a permanent vegetative state. Ron Paul's libertarian movement, brimming with well-educated young people, is the only thing left standing. The GOP operatives who predicted a big victory tonight just look pathetic.

On foreign policy, if it proves to be true that Obama is truly reluctant to engage in the mass murder of Iranians, that may be a victory there all by itself. Time well tell on that one.

And finally, when the economy enters a deep recession in a couple of years (or sooner), it will be good that Obama will be in office. You all know how it would have gone otherwise: After a couple of years of Romney misrule, the media will decide that Romney was the candidate of "free markets." Then, mired in a depression, our wise overlords will declare that "we tried that free market thing, and look what happened."

http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/125562.html

We will nopw start to see a shift towards libertarianism in the Republican party. Ron Paul galvenized so many people on a state  and local level that liberty leaning canditates are going to spring up, run and win a lot of Republican primaries gonig forward.

To me, the GOP losing so big like they did last night was a major step in getting a party together that can actually compete with the liberal, socially accepting message.

Re: GOP in Deep Trouble, Ron Paul Looking Good
« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2012, 08:17:33 PM »

Offline D Dub

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as a life-long DEM, have to admit that I kind of like the Ron Paul movement. 

If the GOP would adopt his foriegn policy & social views I'd consider switching.

That said, I'm not down with a 3 party system.  Having 34% of our population become 'majority opinion' is sketchy; left or right...

Re: GOP in Deep Trouble, Ron Paul Looking Good
« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2012, 08:36:28 PM »

Offline JSD

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By the way, 9 "Ron Paul Republicans" elected to Congress yesterday: Thomas Massie, Justin Amash, David Schweikert, Walter Jones, Kerry Bentivolio, Steve Stockman, Randy Weber, Ted Yoho, and Ted Cruz

Re: GOP in Deep Trouble, Ron Paul Looking Good
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2012, 09:07:18 PM »

Offline KGs Knee

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Libertarians have a real opportunity here.

I truly believe a majority of the people want fiscal conservatism.  If the Libertarian party would just be true (as a whole) to its "individual liberty" core, thus embracing more supposed "liberal" social ideals, it would quickly oust the GOP.

The time for a new direction is upon us.

Re: GOP in Deep Trouble, Ron Paul Looking Good
« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2012, 09:33:25 PM »

Offline slamtheking

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Republicans need to get away from their fringe and religious wings of the party and stick to fiscally conservative policies. 

when their nominees embrace the extremism of their religious wing as well as their intrusion into personal issues (abortion, contraception, sexual identity, etc..) they lose much of any appeal they may have had with voters that might agree with their financial views.

Re: GOP in Deep Trouble, Ron Paul Looking Good
« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2012, 10:26:57 PM »

Offline indeedproceed

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The GOP needs to change for sure but I doubt libertarianism is the answer. At least not wholesale shifts towards it.

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Re: GOP in Deep Trouble, Ron Paul Looking Good
« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2012, 12:19:59 AM »

Offline KGs Knee

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The GOP needs to change for sure but I doubt libertarianism is the answer. At least not wholesale shifts towards it.

Do either the Democrats or Republicans have wholesale monopolies of the agenda?

Re: GOP in Deep Trouble, Ron Paul Looking Good
« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2012, 12:38:05 AM »

Offline indeedproceed

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The GOP needs to change for sure but I doubt libertarianism is the answer. At least not wholesale shifts towards it.

Do either the Democrats or Republicans have wholesale monopolies of the agenda?

No, and a good point. But the general laisee faire philosophy of the libertarian party is closer to the republican platform than the democratic one. 'Do what you will, but you're responsible for the outcome' isn't really in line with the social, economic, or foreign policy doctorine of the democrats or republicans, but the economic policy is closer to that of republicans, as are general viewpoints on entitlement programs.

Not that this is anything but the broadest of brushes. It is far more nuanced. Fundementally both parties have stances on most issues that are not in line with pure libertarianism.

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Re: GOP in Deep Trouble, Ron Paul Looking Good
« Reply #8 on: November 08, 2012, 12:44:41 AM »

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Losing "big"?!?

One half of one percent of the popular vote ... a long, long way from a resounding victory.

Wow ... talk about spin.
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Re: GOP in Deep Trouble, Ron Paul Looking Good
« Reply #9 on: November 08, 2012, 01:06:23 AM »

Offline KGs Knee

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The GOP needs to change for sure but I doubt libertarianism is the answer. At least not wholesale shifts towards it.

Do either the Democrats or Republicans have wholesale monopolies of the agenda?

No, and a good point. But the general laisee faire philosophy of the libertarian party is closer to the republican platform than the democratic one. 'Do what you will, but you're responsible for the outcome' isn't really in line with the social, economic, or foreign policy doctorine of the democrats or republicans, but the economic policy is closer to that of republicans, as are general viewpoints on entitlement programs.

Not that this is anything but the broadest of brushes. It is far more nuanced. Fundementally both parties have stances on most issues that are not in line with pure libertarianism.

I'll agree there.

For instance, just a few of the social beliefs I hold:

Pro life
Pro gay marriage
Pro legalization
Strict(fairly) interpretation of constitution
Limited entitlement programs
Limited government
Pro equal rights/pay for women
Anti-death penalty (except in acts of war or terror)
In favor of a return of power to states

Try to fit that into either party

Re: GOP in Deep Trouble, Ron Paul Looking Good
« Reply #10 on: November 08, 2012, 01:08:21 AM »

Offline Change

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Losing "big"?!?

One half of one percent of the popular vote ... a long, long way from a resounding victory.

Wow ... talk about spin.

Obama 332 to Romney 206. It's a rout. The 5th time in last 6 Presidential elections Republicans lost the popular vote. President Obama overwhelmingly won female vote, youth vote, Hispanic vote, the Black vote, Asian vote, etc.... all minority groups 8 to 2. And the ways things are shaping up 2016 isn't looking too good for Republican either.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2012, 01:24:42 AM by Change »

Re: GOP in Deep Trouble, Ron Paul Looking Good
« Reply #11 on: November 08, 2012, 01:14:17 AM »

Online BudweiserCeltic

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Losing "big"?!?

One half of one percent of the popular vote ... a long, long way from a resounding victory.

Wow ... talk about spin.

That's like winning by 20 points, and saying it wasn't a blowout because they only grabbed 1 more rebound.

Re: GOP in Deep Trouble, Ron Paul Looking Good
« Reply #12 on: November 08, 2012, 01:49:32 AM »

Online foulweatherfan

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Losing "big"?!?

One half of one percent of the popular vote ... a long, long way from a resounding victory.

Wow ... talk about spin.

Obama 332 to Romney 206. It's a rout. The 5th time in last 6 Presidential elections Republicans lost the popular vote. President Obama overwhelmingly won female vote, youth vote, Hispanic vote, the Black vote, Asian vote, etc.... all minority groups 8 to 2. And the ways things are shaping up 2016 isn't looking too good for Republican either.

Obama is also up +2.3% in the popular vote.  Not sure where .5% comes from.

JSD may also be referring to the Republicans losing seats in the Senate, which they'd expected to take control of.  Not a good night for them any way it's sliced.

Re: GOP in Deep Trouble, Ron Paul Looking Good
« Reply #13 on: November 08, 2012, 02:20:14 AM »

Offline D Dub

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Saw this over at surfermag figured JSD would like:





Re: GOP in Deep Trouble, Ron Paul Looking Good
« Reply #14 on: November 08, 2012, 06:10:20 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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I don't think they are in that bad of trouble.   They still have a lot of capital and finance behind them and spending power.

Where the GOP fails is in it's inability to be more inclusive.   It has sadly become a party of angry white men and value (albeit selective) voters.  They have to get rid of some of their medieval thoughts on women and take a long hard look at how they treat minorities that are rapidly becoming the minority.  Try to appeal more to the middle class where the majority of people live in.  Roughly 12-18% of people identify as secular.   A lot of Americans believe in legalization of Marijuana and Gay Rights.   The Grand Old Party is going to have to adapt or die.

Now I have heard some folk suggest they lost because Romney was not conservative enough.   He didn't rise in the national polls until he self moderated in the debates.   Thinking like this will lead to a generational loss of power for them in the White House.  Now they control the HOUSE and truth be told 51 of the 55 Tea Party freshmen won re-election.  But some notable tea party guys with out there ideology went down like Allen West (FLA) and Joe Walsh (ILL).   Take this with a grain of salt too as gerrymandering protected a lot of these folk.  Others like Bachman barely won, so if folks believe they can simply maintain the status quo they are in for a rude awakening as the electorate continues to change.

Personally, I think they can fix things.   I am an independent and I don't care for either party.   The GOP would appeal to more if they didn't have the religious right dominating them.  Guys like Murdoch and Akins did them no favors.  I think fiscal conservatism is something many care about.  A lot think the government is wasteful in it's spending but a lot of the rest of the platform is dated.   This isn't the 1950's anymore Wally....

 

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