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[mgent]

There's a reason that the one sport we see enforcing bans is the one where it probably affects performance the least. (And I still think that the number of guys using is pretty high in MLB.)

You really think so?  An awful lot of extraordinary things happened during the Steroid Era.  Especially with regard to all the HR records.  Heck, Brady Anderson got 50 batting leadoff and nobody even remembers him now.

Good point, but I suspect that if everyone on the Pats' OL was juiced and playing against defenses where no one was taking PEDs, they would score about 100 points a game. I don't think we can ever see that edge, though, because in my opinion all of those guys are probably taking something, and have been since high school.

Just my guess though.

True.  It's weird reading old stories about NFL players openly juicing in the 70s (before steroids were illegal).  That stuff's been a part of the culture for generations now. 

I don't know how much of the NBA is on PEDs - my guess is it helps with recovery as much as an on-court advantage.  I do have a pet theory that D-Wade quit (or dialed back) juicing after he tore his shoulder up that one season.  That's a classic PED-type injury, and his physique changed pretty dramatically after that.

Interesting.  I think Lebron would be a good person to test first.
- Built like a freak of nature. 
- Emotionally unstable (constantly crying to refs over calls/non-calls)
- has a game based on his physical attributes.
- can't shoot worth a [dang] and that's the one thing PEDs wouldn't help.

I'm not saying he's using but he's the first one I start with if they do start testing in the NBA.  Can only hope that a positive test would force Stern to vacate that title.   

Based on physical appearance alone, I would say:

Ron Artest
Dwight Howard
Blake Griffin
Ben Wallace
Kendrick Perkins
Corey Maggette
Tony Allen
Ben Gordon

So this is just Red Bull?

[Celtics4ever]

  The U.S. still holds him in high regard.

I dunno people don't like cheaters.  He pretty much threw in the towel.  I hate cycling to me he was a guy who beat down cancer.   But I do not look to buy things he endorses because of that.  It's not like I avoid things he endorses like I do with Kobe or LeBron but he has never sold me anything. 

[Army_of_One_Nation]

In MLB, "greenies" or amphetamines were widely used before players even started taking steroids. But, that never comes up when someone from the '70's or the '80's gets the honor of being nominated for Hall of Fame induction.

I can't say what other baseball players did before the '70's, but you sure could speculate a lot of things that happened then.

[Boris Badenov]

Based on physical appearance alone, I would say:

Ron Artest
Dwight Howard
Blake Griffin
Ben Wallace
Kendrick Perkins
Corey Maggette
Tony Allen
Ben Gordon

So this is just Red Bull?

Haha. Yes, he should probably make the list too.

[Mr Green]

I'm incredibly cynical about the majority of professional athletes, especially Michael Phelps.

I remember watching Ben Johnson run 100m in 9.79 seconds at the 1988 Olympics. He subsequently tested positive for Stanozolol and was stripped of his gold medal several days later. Fast forward 24 years to London 2012 and I'm supposed to believe that Usain Bolt can run 100m in 9.63 seconds while clean? Whatever.

That being said, I think Lance Armstrong should be left alone. It amuses me to see so many Europeans unable to deal with the fact that none of them can ever be considered as the greatest push bike rider in history.

The USADA is the one going after him, not any Europeans. In fact, the UCI, based in Switzerland, has been a pretty pro Armstrong organization. I think it's funny that people get so caught up in nationalism and all that that they fail to understand that the case against Armstrong comes from the USADA, which is in turn based on testimony that came forward during a federal investigation into corruption on the US Postal team.

As for him being left alone, why? Tyler Hamilton was just stripped of his 2004 gold medal. Investigations into other cyclists are pretty much ongoing, why should Armstrong get a pass?

I think you misunderstood me. I wasn't referring to the USADA at all. I was referring to the European push bike racing community at large, as their whinging at cafes on weekends amuses me on a personal level. Not disimilar to when the English still get upset when Diego Maradona's success is mentioned in conversation.

I think you call it trolling? 

[dlpin]

this is a pretty good summary of Lance's history and the evidence against him:

http://cavalierfc.tumblr.com/post/30172302298/its-not-about-the-bike

[nickagneta]

I'm not going to read 4 pages of this thread to see if this has already been written but I thought it self evident that it was Lance Armstrong that ruined Lance Armstrong.

[Rondo2287]

Honestly though, wasn't lance just the best cheater? I don't know enough about cycling, but I hear that EVERYBODY cheats.  So based on that, my opinion of lance hasnt changed

[KGs Knee]

So this is just Red Bull?

That looks like a guy that goes to the gym a LOT.  Not a body builder.

I'm not sure what the point you were trying to make with the pictures of his dunks was.  Spud Web could dunk too.

[Mr Green]

this is a pretty good summary of Lance's history and the evidence against him:

http://cavalierfc.tumblr.com/post/30172302298/its-not-about-the-bike

Many thanks for the link. If the content is accurate then it looks like the USADA have ticked all the boxes except for catching him red handed. No wonder he has thrown in the towel and given up.

[ACF]

Of course we all know that whoever came in second and third in the years that Lance won were clean 

[dlpin]

Of course we all know that whoever came in second and third in the years that Lance won were clean 

No, but most of the second and third cyclists in those years have already been busted. There is no reason to stop at them.

[Moranis]

http://espn.go.com/sports/endurance/story/_/id/8814744/report-lance-armstrong-banned-competing-all-olympic-sports-considering-publicly-admitting-used-performance-enhancing-drugs

Interesting.

[eja117]

http://espn.go.com/sports/endurance/story/_/id/8814744/report-lance-armstrong-banned-competing-all-olympic-sports-considering-publicly-admitting-used-performance-enhancing-drugs

Interesting.

the New York Times cites anonymous sources. To me that's like "the Politboro made something up again"

[Neurotic Guy]

I guess when it all boils down, the lesson should be that Lance Armstrong is just a person. No better or worse than most of us.  We've all had our hands in the proverbial cookie jar in small (or large) ways and probably all know what it's like to deny the truth or outright lie in order to avoid blame or shame. 

I guess I couldn't care less about his titles, his loss of titles, his admissions of guilt, or his future.  He's just another fallible person like the rest of us.  For those who feel cheated by his actions (probably like those who feel Clemens, McGuire, Bonds, etc. cheated you) I understand feeling duped. But it's long over and at the end of the day he is famous for riding bicycles as Bonds is famous for hitting a ball with a stick. I hope to hear very little about this in the coming days but am sure it will make big news if Lance admits his guilt.