Author Topic: Bass vs. Sully  (Read 11128 times)

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Re: Bass vs. Sully
« Reply #60 on: October 07, 2012, 02:03:52 PM »

Offline cman88

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sully IS goign to get playing time...I dont get these comments"well its exhibition games'

it sure is, but you can still see the difference between sullinger...and the other rookies like christmas, smith etc.

Sullinger has alot of poise, and seems to know where to be in the right place for rebounds and cuts to the basket to get the easy hoops.

he is going to get time playing this year

Re: Bass vs. Sully
« Reply #61 on: October 07, 2012, 02:05:32 PM »

Offline BudweiserCeltic

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Sullinger is pretty squarely Bass's backup, I just hope very much his minutes don't drop below 15-18 because of Jeff Green taking them at the 4.

Based on what? The 26 min of glorified exhibition he played the other night? Bass will play around 30 at the 4 and Green is gonna play another 10 at the 4 with smallball so MAYBE Sully gets 8min there.

You're aware you're arguing against a post from August 28 right?

Re: Bass vs. Sully
« Reply #62 on: October 07, 2012, 03:36:31 PM »

Offline LooseCannon

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I am fine with the idea that Bass starts out ahead of Sullinger on the depth chart at the beginning of the season, with Sully's chance of moving up depending mainly on whether or not he can become a better defender than Bass and not on offense/rebounding.
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Re: Bass vs. Sully
« Reply #63 on: October 07, 2012, 04:05:42 PM »

Offline TripleOT

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To me, Sully fits way better than Bass with KG, and Bass fits better with the hulking Darko than wide-bodied Sullinger. 

Bass has already proven that he can not play effectively inside and isn't much or a rebounder.  Bass is very good at what he does - shoot open 17 footers. Unfortunately, that's what KG is also good at offensively at the tail end of his career. 

Sully will get a ton of cheapie baskets with the starters, along with good offensive rebounding opportunities.  Whatever defensive deficiencies he might have as a first year player can be better masked by playing with better players on the first team, including THREE who are at the top defensively for their position, in RR, AB and KG. 

Bass will benefit by being the only jump shooting big on the second unit, and will also benefit from playing with a center and SF with great size. I'll take Bass, Darko, Green, Lee and JET as a second unit over any other in the league.     

Re: Bass vs. Sully
« Reply #64 on: October 07, 2012, 05:24:09 PM »

Offline Vermont Green

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To me, Sully fits way better than Bass with KG, and Bass fits better with the hulking Darko than wide-bodied Sullinger. 

Bass has already proven that he can not play effectively inside and isn't much or a rebounder.  Bass is very good at what he does - shoot open 17 footers. Unfortunately, that's what KG is also good at offensively at the tail end of his career. 

Sully will get a ton of cheapie baskets with the starters, along with good offensive rebounding opportunities.  Whatever defensive deficiencies he might have as a first year player can be better masked by playing with better players on the first team, including THREE who are at the top defensively for their position, in RR, AB and KG. 

Bass will benefit by being the only jump shooting big on the second unit, and will also benefit from playing with a center and SF with great size. I'll take Bass, Darko, Green, Lee and JET as a second unit over any other in the league.     
I agree with this to the point that Sullinger, based on his play in the exhibition games, appears like he can play very well with the first unit.  He seems to like to hang around the basket and wait for passes and rebound.

I don't think what we have seen in these games is a mirage.  I think we are seeing what he can do.  He is only 20 and will likely be on a steep improvement curve, even over this season.  I am sure he will have steps forward and steps backwards but now can anyone not like what we have seen so far?

Re: Bass vs. Sully
« Reply #65 on: October 07, 2012, 05:57:45 PM »

Offline LooseCannon

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To me, Sully fits way better than Bass with KG, and Bass fits better with the hulking Darko than wide-bodied Sullinger.     

What if neither Darko nor Collins earn Doc's trust?  Who fits better next to Wilcox?  Who fits better if Doc plays one of them as the "center" next to Green as the PF in a smallball lineup?
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Re: Bass vs. Sully
« Reply #66 on: October 07, 2012, 10:51:24 PM »

Offline TripleOT

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To me, Sully fits way better than Bass with KG, and Bass fits better with the hulking Darko than wide-bodied Sullinger.     

What if neither Darko nor Collins earn Doc's trust?  Who fits better next to Wilcox?  Who fits better if Doc plays one of them as the "center" next to Green as the PF in a smallball lineup?

Wilcox is an 11th man type on a good team.  Actually, he was an 11th man on a horrible team the year before coming to Boston.

Re: Bass vs. Sully
« Reply #67 on: October 07, 2012, 11:22:39 PM »

Offline kg is king

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To me, Sully fits way better than Bass with KG, and Bass fits better with the hulking Darko than wide-bodied Sullinger.     

What if neither Darko nor Collins earn Doc's trust?  Who fits better next to Wilcox?  Who fits better if Doc plays one of them as the "center" next to Green as the PF in a smallball lineup?

Wilcox is an 11th man type on a good team.  Actually, he was an 11th man on a horrible team the year before coming to Boston.
Agreed. Wilcox is nothing special. Was never anything special in his 10 years in the league. He's good for depth but expecting him to play a major role for a contender is a bit of a stretch.
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Re: Bass vs. Sully
« Reply #68 on: October 08, 2012, 12:31:50 AM »

Offline eja117

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I'm starting to think Sully is special and Bass is good

Re: Bass vs. Sully
« Reply #69 on: October 08, 2012, 06:18:07 AM »

Offline relja

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I don't think people are taking into account the possibility that Bass also improves his game over the offseason. He's coming into the prime of his career and improved substantially in his 1st season in Boston. Continuity could do even more wonders for a guy who has floated around the league thus far in his career.



Did he really improve at all?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/bassbr01.html

He improved his PPG, but that's because he played 5 more minutes a game.

His points, and rebounds per 36 minutes dropped, his rebounds to a career low, and his points to his lowest since his second year in the league.

Also his TS%, his Win Shares per 48, and his rebounding percentages were all near career lows, despite a pretty consistent Usage rate.

All that adds up to an overall drop in efficiency, combined with an increase in minutes.

Not that he's a bad player or anything, he's a good player, and I'm comfortable with him as a starter. He just didn't seem to improve with the bigger role or increased minutes.

The stats aren't always everything.

Re: Bass vs. Sully
« Reply #70 on: October 08, 2012, 08:41:40 AM »

Offline Roy H.

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I don't think people are taking into account the possibility that Bass also improves his game over the offseason. He's coming into the prime of his career and improved substantially in his 1st season in Boston. Continuity could do even more wonders for a guy who has floated around the league thus far in his career.

Did he really improve at all?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/bassbr01.html

He improved his PPG, but that's because he played 5 more minutes a game.

His points, and rebounds per 36 minutes dropped, his rebounds to a career low, and his points to his lowest since his second year in the league.

Also his TS%, his Win Shares per 48, and his rebounding percentages were all near career lows, despite a pretty consistent Usage rate.

All that adds up to an overall drop in efficiency, combined with an increase in minutes.

Not that he's a bad player or anything, he's a good player, and I'm comfortable with him as a starter. He just didn't seem to improve with the bigger role or increased minutes.

Bass' defense improved pretty substantially in the Boston defense, though.  Part of it is having teammates to help cover, but Bass did an excellent job in his own right.

Bass ranked 16th in the NBA in terms of points allowed per possession.  He ranked 14th in isolation situations, 7th on post-ups, and 2nd covering the pick-and-roll man.

That grades out to a phenomenal defender.  Add in the "KG factor" and the overall Boston defense, and maybe there's a downward adjustment from "phenomenal" to "very good".  That's still pretty impressive from a guy who had previously been regarded as pretty average.


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Re: Bass vs. Sully
« Reply #71 on: October 08, 2012, 09:01:55 AM »

Offline scaryjerry

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Until sullinger can prove his worth consistently in something more then 2 meaningless preseason games against euroleague teams? Bass. Period end of story.

Re: Bass vs. Sully
« Reply #72 on: October 08, 2012, 03:53:01 PM »

Offline celtics2

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I liked what I saw in Turkey with Sully. Just from knowing Bass's game I'd say Sully ahead in Basketball IQ, knowing where to be, which makes up for his lack of athleticism, interacts well with players in his vicinity, not a gunner, gets his points cleaning up, is relentless on the boards, very good vision and outlet passes.

He looks better than Bass to me but heard some things about his back. Not enough info for me there. Do we need to baby him? If he has a history we'd be better bringing him in rather than a starting grind. This Team is better than last Seasons. IMHO!

Without being disrespectful for his contributions Allen hurt us last Season. Rondo has never been patient enough with Allen's ballet. We got very deep into the count way too often.

 

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