Boston/Washington Idea

[wdleehi]

When a terrible team finally says "you can have these guys for matching salaries", it should be red flags everywhere.


Just say no!

[GrandTheftRondo]

Two things:

1) People need to stop being so selective and quite frankly unrealistic. Yes, maybe McGee and Blatche aren't good fits, but we aren't in a position to do much else besides take risks on flawed players or take salary back in exchange for sweeteners.  If not this deal, these are the types of deals that Danny likely is going to have to choose from.  I swear some people on this board would shoot down LeBron for  second round pick ideas because he doesn't have a good jump shot, has never won anything, and has a contract that hurts our cap flexibility (not to mention studs like Leon Powe and Ryan Gomes can be found in the second round).

2) While I am not completely sold on the OP's trade proposal, I have been thinking more and more that if Danny is going to make a deal, this is the type of deal to make. First let me say that I am OK with Danny sitting pat and not making a trade. However it is looking more and more like there won't be anyone worth signing to max deals this summer anyway. The last thing we want to do is spend for the sake of spending like Dumars did a few years back when he inked Ben Gordon and Charlie Villanueva to ridiculous contracts. Thus, I'd be on board with Danny offering to take back salary for a year or two (though preferably not 3 like with Blatche) in exchange for sweeteners that could blossom in a better environment (like McGee).

We could then bring back Ray and KG, nurture the rebuilding team for a year or two and then begin setting ourselves up for the summer of 2013 or 2014.

TP.

People are really acting like we have our pick of all the great starting centers in the NBA. We don't. We have a hole in the middle, a huge hole that just has not been filled since the Perk trade. We have to get someone there. How many times do we have to see other teams get to the basket at will, how many times do we have to get out rebounded by double digits before we say enough is enough?

Javale McGee would never be my first choice. Or second...third...fourth...fifth...you get the point. But with the situation we're in now, I would take him. The Wizards have young, talented players who just can't seem to get it right. We've been able to mold players before, and I think McGee could be one of those players. He's young and healthy which is more than we can say of anyone we've had in that position for the past what...2, 3 years now?

Javale McGee is low risk, high reward IMO. Not sure about giving up those first rounders though.

[Jon]

Two things:

1) People need to stop being so selective and quite frankly unrealistic. Yes, maybe McGee and Blatche aren't good fits, but we aren't in a position to do much else besides take risks on flawed players or take salary back in exchange for sweeteners.  If not this deal, these are the types of deals that Danny likely is going to have to choose from.  I swear some people on this board would shoot down LeBron for  second round pick ideas because he doesn't have a good jump shot, has never won anything, and has a contract that hurts our cap flexibility (not to mention studs like Leon Powe and Ryan Gomes can be found in the second round).

2) While I am not completely sold on the OP's trade proposal, I have been thinking more and more that if Danny is going to make a deal, this is the type of deal to make. First let me say that I am OK with Danny sitting pat and not making a trade. However it is looking more and more like there won't be anyone worth signing to max deals this summer anyway. The last thing we want to do is spend for the sake of spending like Dumars did a few years back when he inked Ben Gordon and Charlie Villanueva to ridiculous contracts. Thus, I'd be on board with Danny offering to take back salary for a year or two (though preferably not 3 like with Blatche) in exchange for sweeteners that could blossom in a better environment (like McGee).

We could then bring back Ray and KG, nurture the rebuilding team for a year or two and then begin setting ourselves up for the summer of 2013 or 2014.

TP.

People are really acting like we have our pick of all the great starting centers in the NBA. We don't. We have a hole in the middle, a huge hole that just has not been filled since the Perk trade. We have to get someone there. How many times do we have to see other teams get to the basket at will, how many times do we have to get out rebounded by double digits before we say enough is enough?

Javale McGee would never be my first choice. Or second...third...fourth...fifth...you get the point. But with the situation we're in now, I would take him. The Wizards have young, talented players who just can't seem to get it right. We've been able to mold players before, and I think McGee could be one of those players. He's young and healthy which is more than we can say of anyone we've had in that position for the past what...2, 3 years now?

Javale McGee is low risk, high reward IMO. Not sure about giving up those first rounders though.

Exactly.  And while McGee and Blatche may not end up being the future cornerstones of a future championship team, I think if DA brought back KG (and possibly Ray next year) we could cultivate these guys into (at the very least) more palatable trade pieces (especially in a year or two when Blatche's deal has only 1-2 years left).  I mean BBD didn't have a great attitude, but he fell in line and generally played hard next to KG.  Let's also not forget that Ray (and to a lesser extent Paul) didn't have a great reputation for defense until he came to a better situation here. 

Then, come the 2013-2014 season/the summer of 2014, we'd have some pieces to possibly trade and Pierce either serving as an expiring deal (to trade) or actually expiring and clearing room (in the summer of 2014). 

It's not signing Howard or drafting the next Durant in the draft, but it could set us up to at least be in position to do what we did in '07: have young pieces and expiring contracts to trade for stars to put around Rondo.  And in a perfect world, one of the young pieces would be on his way to becoming a star as well. 

[LooseCannon]

Yes, maybe McGee and Blatche aren't good fits, but we aren't in a position to do much else besides take risks on flawed players or take salary back in exchange for sweeteners.

These aren't the type of flawed players I want the Celtics to take on.  I prefer older, less athletic, but intelligent players to young, athletic knuckleheads.

[Jon]

Yes, maybe McGee and Blatche aren't good fits, but we aren't in a position to do much else besides take risks on flawed players or take salary back in exchange for sweeteners.

These aren't the type of flawed players I want the Celtics to take on.  I prefer older, less athletic, but intelligent players to young, athletic knuckleheads.

But again, Tony Allen and Big Baby Davis were knuckleheads that were fortunate enough to land in Boston where they were forced to stay in line by the Big Three  If they had landed in Washington (or a situation like it), they likely would've been labeled the same way on this board.

I'm not saying McGee and Blatche are part of this team's future.  However, I could see a scenario where come here, do significantly better, and then are eventually dealt away by Danny in a deal to actually land a bonafide star here in a couple of years. 

That's how we landed KG and Ray to begin with.  The problem is, right now, we have very little in the way of assets.  And this could be one way to acquire them. 

It's easy to shoot down deals like this one; however, it's not like we have lots of options here.  No big star is likely to come here this summer and we don't have the assets or the picks to land a big star in a trade or in the draft. 

[GrandTheftRondo]

Yes, maybe McGee and Blatche aren't good fits, but we aren't in a position to do much else besides take risks on flawed players or take salary back in exchange for sweeteners.

These aren't the type of flawed players I want the Celtics to take on.  I prefer older, less athletic, but intelligent players to young, athletic knuckleheads.

I respectfully disagree.

I'm kind of over the older, higher risk of injury, can't play for more than 5 minutes without being winded players. This team has more than enough of that. We need some athleticism. And when you're older, you're a bit  more set in your ways. Not as easy to mold. With a younger player, its a bit easier to teach them things.

I can understand your point of view though.

[Evantime34]

Yes, maybe McGee and Blatche aren't good fits, but we aren't in a position to do much else besides take risks on flawed players or take salary back in exchange for sweeteners.

These aren't the type of flawed players I want the Celtics to take on.  I prefer older, less athletic, but intelligent players to young, athletic knuckleheads.

I respectfully disagree.

I'm kind of over the older, higher risk of injury, can't play for more than 5 minutes without being winded players. This team has more than enough of that. We need some athleticism. And when you're older, you're a bit  more set in your ways. Not as easy to mold. With a younger player, its a bit easier to teach them things.

I can understand your point of view though.

That and the more athletic players aid in the fast break style that Rondo is most effective playing. This offseason I expect them to take another step towards becoming the up tempo running team that fits Rondo's style.

[LooseCannon]

It's easy to shoot down deals like this one; however, it's not like we have lots of options here.  No big star is likely to come here this summer and we don't have the assets or the picks to land a big star in a trade or in the draft. 

Having patience is a legitimate option.  If the Celtics can't sign Dwight Howard in the summer, I would be interested in renting out cap space to take on salary from a team that needs to clear cap space to be able to sign Howard (or another free agent).

[wdleehi]

Two things:

1) People need to stop being so selective and quite frankly unrealistic. Yes, maybe McGee and Blatche aren't good fits, but we aren't in a position to do much else besides take risks on flawed players or take salary back in exchange for sweeteners.  If not this deal, these are the types of deals that Danny likely is going to have to choose from.  I swear some people on this board would shoot down LeBron for  second round pick ideas because he doesn't have a good jump shot, has never won anything, and has a contract that hurts our cap flexibility (not to mention studs like Leon Powe and Ryan Gomes can be found in the second round).

2) While I am not completely sold on the OP's trade proposal, I have been thinking more and more that if Danny is going to make a deal, this is the type of deal to make. First let me say that I am OK with Danny sitting pat and not making a trade. However it is looking more and more like there won't be anyone worth signing to max deals this summer anyway. The last thing we want to do is spend for the sake of spending like Dumars did a few years back when he inked Ben Gordon and Charlie Villanueva to ridiculous contracts. Thus, I'd be on board with Danny offering to take back salary for a year or two (though preferably not 3 like with Blatche) in exchange for sweeteners that could blossom in a better environment (like McGee).

We could then bring back Ray and KG, nurture the rebuilding team for a year or two and then begin setting ourselves up for the summer of 2013 or 2014.

TP.

People are really acting like we have our pick of all the great starting centers in the NBA. We don't. We have a hole in the middle, a huge hole that just has not been filled since the Perk trade. We have to get someone there. How many times do we have to see other teams get to the basket at will, how many times do we have to get out rebounded by double digits before we say enough is enough?

Javale McGee would never be my first choice. Or second...third...fourth...fifth...you get the point. But with the situation we're in now, I would take him. The Wizards have young, talented players who just can't seem to get it right. We've been able to mold players before, and I think McGee could be one of those players. He's young and healthy which is more than we can say of anyone we've had in that position for the past what...2, 3 years now?

Javale McGee is low risk, high reward IMO. Not sure about giving up those first rounders though.

You have it backwards.

This is a high risk, low reward.

If it works out, the Celtics are overpaying for role players.

But chances are, it doesn't work out and the Celtics are looking for creative ways to give them away much like the Wizards are doing. 

[wdleehi]

It's easy to shoot down deals like this one; however, it's not like we have lots of options here.  No big star is likely to come here this summer and we don't have the assets or the picks to land a big star in a trade or in the draft. 

Having patience is a legitimate option.  If the Celtics can't sign Dwight Howard in the summer, I would be interested in renting out cap space to take on salary from a team that needs to clear cap space to be able to sign Howard (or another free agent).

This is the hardest options for fans to swallow, even when it is the best option out there.


I am ready to be patient.  I don't want this team to go the way of the late 90s Knicks. 

[Evantime34]

It's easy to shoot down deals like this one; however, it's not like we have lots of options here.  No big star is likely to come here this summer and we don't have the assets or the picks to land a big star in a trade or in the draft. 

Having patience is a legitimate option.  If the Celtics can't sign Dwight Howard in the summer, I would be interested in renting out cap space to take on salary from a team that needs to clear cap space to be able to sign Howard (or another free agent).

This is the hardest options for fans to swallow, even when it is the best option out there.


I am ready to be patient.  I don't want this team to go the way of the late 90s Knicks. 

I wouldn't be shocked if we strike out on the free agents we like this offseason. Then I think we bring back Ray (if he doesn't retire), Bass and Green. We hope Bradley, JJJ and our first rounders develop then wait until the 2013 free agent class

[GrandTheftRondo]

Javale McGee is making 2.5 million this year...I wouldn't consider taking that on as an overpayment when you consider Jermaine O'Neal is making 6.2 million.

I understand patience, I would love to sign a good big man in the off season without giving up anything...but who are we being patient for? Dwight Howard?

I personally don't believe Dwight Howard will ever come to Boston in free agency but I could be wrong...

Roy Hibbert will be a free agent, but he's restricted and I see Indiana matching any offer. Marcus Camby will also be a free agent but he's about to turn 38 in a week or so. He will more than likely retire. Kris Humphries, while not a center is a good rebounding big man who is making 8 million this year. I would love him to be a Celtic but I really feel that he's going to get overpaid.

I'm not seeing this abundance of free agency options that we should wait for? Let me know who you guys are thinking about.

[pearljammer10]

Three young potential assets possibly all stars (young and mcgee anyway) for three washedup veteran oft injured role guys is not going to work, im sorry. Im not so sure that package could net us Blatche/McGee. You realize how big of a scorer Young is right?

[the_Bird]

It's easy to shoot down deals like this one; however, it's not like we have lots of options here.  No big star is likely to come here this summer and we don't have the assets or the picks to land a big star in a trade or in the draft. 

Having patience is a legitimate option.  If the Celtics can't sign Dwight Howard in the summer, I would be interested in renting out cap space to take on salary from a team that needs to clear cap space to be able to sign Howard (or another free agent).

This is the hardest options for fans to swallow, even when it is the best option out there.


I am ready to be patient.  I don't want this team to go the way of the late 90s Knicks. 

I agree, as long as it feels like we're moving in the right direction.  Those Knick teams, you knew that they were never going to get better until they completely cleared the decks, but they never had the patience to do so.  I'm willing to go through a few seasons of young guys making mistakes, as long as they're playing hard, getting better, and we have a sense that the team is moving forward with a plan.

If this means taking on a guy like Okafor, forgoing cap space but getting a couple of good draft picks...   that may be a good option. 

Just selfishly, though...  I really hope the rebuild doesn't mean "pick up talented knuckleheads because they're being given away and Doc might rehab them."  I'd just as soon not have to watch guys like Beasley and Andray Blatche. 

[rasta1]

It's easy to shoot down deals like this one; however, it's not like we have lots of options here.  No big star is likely to come here this summer and we don't have the assets or the picks to land a big star in a trade or in the draft. 

Having patience is a legitimate option.  If the Celtics can't sign Dwight Howard in the summer, I would be interested in renting out cap space to take on salary from a team that needs to clear cap space to be able to sign Howard (or another free agent).

This is the hardest options for fans to swallow, even when it is the best option out there.


I am ready to be patient.  I don't want this team to go the way of the late 90s Knicks. 

I agree, as long as it feels like we're moving in the right direction.  Those Knick teams, you knew that they were never going to get better until they completely cleared the decks, but they never had the patience to do so.  I'm willing to go through a few seasons of young guys making mistakes, as long as they're playing hard, getting better, and we have a sense that the team is moving forward with a plan.

If this means taking on a guy like Okafor, forgoing cap space but getting a couple of good draft picks...   that may be a good option. 

Just selfishly, though...  I really hope the rebuild doesn't mean "pick up talented knuckleheads because they're being given away and Doc might rehab them."  I'd just as soon not have to watch guys like Beasley and Andray Blatche. 

We've had our share of talented knuckleheads

and it brought us success

Part of trades:
Delonte West - problems
Marcus Banks - didn't care
Gerald Green - No Basketball IQ
Al Jefferson - Didn't play Defense
Sebastian Telfair - messed up

Tony Allen - shooting incident
BBD - retarded
Rondo - instability


I'll take high reward guys

It's not like the organization isn't willing to take a flyer on a nutcase

Marbury
Nate Robinson
Walker
Ricky Davis
probably more that i can't remember off the top of my head


Doc is a player's coach and we have veteran presence to straighten people up and play into the system

KG yelled at Glen Davis all the time, criticizing him and stuff

I wouldn't expect Blatche or McGee to do anything dumb with KG here