Author Topic: Celtics/Hawks trade idea (Josh Smith to C's)  (Read 9622 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Celtics/Hawks trade idea (Josh Smith to C's)
« on: January 11, 2012, 10:20:58 AM »

Offline Eddie20

  • Don Nelson
  • ********
  • Posts: 8497
  • Tommy Points: 975
Boston Receives:

Josh Smith
Zaza Pachulia


Atlanta Receives

Ray Allen
Chris Wilcox


Why for Boston?

Smith immediately increases our lack of athletic ability. He could start at the 3 (moving Pierce to the 2), or he could start at the 4 (moving KG to the 5 and inserting Pietrus at the 2 for better shooting). Him and Rondo are close friends and their on-court chemistry, particularly on breaks, will pay immediate dividends.

Smith on Rondo:
Quote
"He's one of my close friends," Smith said. "If I tell him anything [personal], it won't get out. We talk about everything. He's like one of my brothers. He would fight for me just like I would fight for him

Pachulia, although not a fan favorite in Boston, will bring some toughness and physical play to a team that has been lacking it since Perk was traded. He can rebound, runs the floor well for a big, and will get under the skin of opponents.

This summer looks bleak in terms of landing a big name FA. Instead the summer of 13 looks much more promising when some major players (Love, Gordon, etc.) won't have the restricted tag attached to their name. So the key would be to add players, like Smith and Pachulia, that have contracts that expire in 2013. We can get a close look at Smith, which allows to make a better decision on whether or not he's a building block for the future, while not compromising cap space going forward.

This also gives us a complimentary piece to Rondo and the fast pace team Ainge looks to be trying to build. Smith, Green (if health permits), & Rondo could be a devastating trio in transition.

Why not for Boston?

Losing Allen could be a major locker room problem. On the court, his shooting created space. Not having him around would definitely hurt spacing.

Why for Atlanta?

Allen brings to the Hawks something they seem to have lacked for some time, veteran leadership and player that can space the floor for Joe Johnson and Al Horford.

Both Allen and Wilcox have expiring contracts, so the Hawks would be shedding approximately 17.2 million in salary for next season. This is important for a team that was nearly sold in November. The smaller payroll makes it much more likely for a prospective owner to buy the team.

Smith has been on the block for some and seems as though the feeling is mutual:

 Adrian Wojnarowski:
Quote
Josh Smith hasn’t changed his mind on a future with his hometown Atlanta Hawks: He believes he’s probably run his course with Atlanta. Without an owner committed to making the changes to push this team past its second-round Eastern Conference ceiling, sources said he’d still welcome the team putting him into a trade.

Why not for Atlanta?

Allen is a FA and there is no certainty that he will re-sign with the Hawks. This could be a major obstacle for Atlanta since, save for cap space, they would have nothing to show for trading away Smith.


NOTE:

This trade cannot be completed until after March 1st because of Wilcox's deal

Re: Celtics/Hawks trade idea (Josh Smith to C's)
« Reply #1 on: January 11, 2012, 10:21:36 AM »

Online Moranis

  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 33464
  • Tommy Points: 1533
Atlanta laughs and hangs up the phone.
2023 Historical Draft - Brooklyn Nets - 9th pick

Bigs - Pau, Amar'e, Issel, McGinnis, Roundfield
Wings - Dantley, Bowen, J. Jackson
Guards - Cheeks, Petrovic, Buse, Rip

Re: Celtics/Hawks trade idea (Josh Smith to C's)
« Reply #2 on: January 11, 2012, 10:31:07 AM »

Offline Eddie20

  • Don Nelson
  • ********
  • Posts: 8497
  • Tommy Points: 975
Atlanta laughs and hangs up the phone.

Really? What do you think Atlanta can get for Smith? Is a team going to give a young rising star for Smith? For that, wouldn't they just stay pat? Is a team going to give a high 1st rd draft pick for him? I really doubt that a team would take on his salary and trade a high pick, especially with the talent in this year's draft.

Re: Celtics/Hawks trade idea (Josh Smith to C's)
« Reply #3 on: January 11, 2012, 10:53:37 AM »

Offline Kane3387

  • Don Nelson
  • ********
  • Posts: 8269
  • Tommy Points: 944
  • Intensity!!!
Right around the draft last year it was reported by Woj that Atlanta wanted to trade for Smith for either Kg or Ray Allen.


KG: "Dude.... What is up with yo shorts?!"

CBD_2016 Cavs Remaining Picks - 14.14

Re: Celtics/Hawks trade idea (Josh Smith to C's)
« Reply #4 on: January 11, 2012, 10:57:08 AM »

Offline Chris

  • Global Moderator
  • Dennis Johnson
  • ******************
  • Posts: 18008
  • Tommy Points: 642
Atlanta laughs and hangs up the phone.

Really? What do you think Atlanta can get for Smith? Is a team going to give a young rising star for Smith? For that, wouldn't they just stay pat? Is a team going to give a high 1st rd draft pick for him? I really doubt that a team would take on his salary and trade a high pick, especially with the talent in this year's draft.

Multiple premium assets.  This trade would essentially be a salary dump, and its not going to happen...especially Ray doesn't fill a need for them, since their best player already plays SG.

Re: Celtics/Hawks trade idea (Josh Smith to C's)
« Reply #5 on: January 11, 2012, 11:00:19 AM »

Online Moranis

  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 33464
  • Tommy Points: 1533
Atlanta laughs and hangs up the phone.

Really? What do you think Atlanta can get for Smith? Is a team going to give a young rising star for Smith? For that, wouldn't they just stay pat? Is a team going to give a high 1st rd draft pick for him? I really doubt that a team would take on his salary and trade a high pick, especially with the talent in this year's draft.

Multiple premium assets.  This trade would essentially be a salary dump, and its not going to happen...especially Ray doesn't fill a need for them, since their best player already plays SG.
exactly.  If the Celtics provided some actual value to Atlanta, like say taking Johnson, then sure I think there is a trade there, but they aren't just going to salary dump Smith (and include Zaza) for someone they don't need.
2023 Historical Draft - Brooklyn Nets - 9th pick

Bigs - Pau, Amar'e, Issel, McGinnis, Roundfield
Wings - Dantley, Bowen, J. Jackson
Guards - Cheeks, Petrovic, Buse, Rip

Re: Celtics/Hawks trade idea (Josh Smith to C's)
« Reply #6 on: January 11, 2012, 11:13:42 AM »

Offline slamtheking

  • NCE
  • Red Auerbach
  • *******************************
  • Posts: 31869
  • Tommy Points: 10047
Atlanta laughs and hangs up the phone.

Really? What do you think Atlanta can get for Smith? Is a team going to give a young rising star for Smith? For that, wouldn't they just stay pat? Is a team going to give a high 1st rd draft pick for him? I really doubt that a team would take on his salary and trade a high pick, especially with the talent in this year's draft.

Multiple premium assets.  This trade would essentially be a salary dump, and its not going to happen...especially Ray doesn't fill a need for them, since their best player already plays SG.
exactly.  If the Celtics provided some actual value to Atlanta, like say taking Johnson, then sure I think there is a trade there, but they aren't just going to salary dump Smith (and include Zaza) for someone they don't need.
This.

C's would have to take back JJ to really give them salary relief.  If, and it's pretty far-fetched, we were going down that road, we do this we'd probably have to swing a real salary dump for them while maintaining a chance for them to compete this year.

Something like Ray and KG for JJ and Smith with filler on both sides to even it out.  Can't see why they'd do it since they're primary asset that's left is Horford

Re: Celtics/Hawks trade idea (Josh Smith to C's)
« Reply #7 on: January 11, 2012, 11:23:40 AM »

Offline green7

  • Jaylen Brown
  • Posts: 611
  • Tommy Points: 30
Atlanta laughs and hangs up the phone.

you celtics fans love to  hype up other team players like this lol the hawks would love to have a sharp shooter like ray with an expiring contract and get josh smith off the books after giving joe johnson all that money and they can finally start ivan johnson to see what he's really about.......but why would the c's want this deal when ray is playing so great?
« Last Edit: January 11, 2012, 11:30:53 AM by green7 »

Re: Celtics/Hawks trade idea (Josh Smith to C's)
« Reply #8 on: January 11, 2012, 11:33:37 AM »

Online jambr380

  • K.C. Jones
  • *************
  • Posts: 13002
  • Tommy Points: 1756
  • Everybody knows what's best for you
Would it really be that bad taking on JJ as a salary dump? It would just extend our 'window' with Johnson instead of Ray (kind of a wash) and we would have Smith added to the team. I guess it puts off the rebuilding process, but I would love to see what this team could do the next few years.

Edit: Obviously making this work within the salary cap would be difficult - do we have to include KG, as well?

Re: Celtics/Hawks trade idea (Josh Smith to C's)
« Reply #9 on: January 11, 2012, 11:34:53 AM »

Offline PosImpos

  • NCE
  • Frank Ramsey
  • ************
  • Posts: 12383
  • Tommy Points: 903
  • Rondo = Good
Atlanta laughs and hangs up the phone.
Never forget the Champs of '08, or the gutsy warriors of '10.

"I know you all wanna win, but you gotta do it TOGETHER!"
- Doc Rivers

Re: Celtics/Hawks trade idea (Josh Smith to C's)
« Reply #10 on: January 11, 2012, 11:58:20 AM »

Offline wdleehi

  • In The Rafters
  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 34023
  • Tommy Points: 1607
  • Basketball is Newtonian Physics
Atlanta laughs and hangs up the phone.

you celtics fans love to  hype up other team players like this lol the hawks would love to have a sharp shooter like ray with an expiring contract and get josh smith off the books after giving joe johnson all that money and they can finally start ivan johnson to see what he's really about.......but why would the c's want this deal when ray is playing so great?


What position will Ray play?  They already have Johnson at the SG.  Neither should be a SF or a PG. 


I would expect them to be looking for a starting C in a trade of Smith so they can then mover Horford to the PF spot. 

Re: Celtics/Hawks trade idea (Josh Smith to C's)
« Reply #11 on: January 11, 2012, 12:28:50 PM »

Online snively

  • Rajon Rondo
  • *****
  • Posts: 5866
  • Tommy Points: 454
Joe Johnson is a contract you don't come back from: 4 years, $90 mil left on that contract once this year is through. 

As for Josh Smith, last year Gerald Wallace was obtained for Joel Przybilla's expiring, a low-level prospect (Dante Cunningham) and a couple of mid-to-late first-rounders.  Certainly Charlotte was in a different situation than Atlanta, but Smith shouldn't be too much more expensive. 

I could see JO, Bass and both of our 2012 picks doing the trick.  Rondo/Ray/Pierce/Smith/KG with Daniels/Pietrus/Wilcox/Stiemsma off the bench would be an intriguing team. 
2016 CelticsBlog Draft: Chicago Bulls

Head Coach: Fred Hoiberg

Starters: Rubio, Danny Green, Durant, Markieff Morris, Capela
Bench: Sessions, Shumpert, G. Green, T. Booker, Frye
Deep Bench: CJ Watson, H. Thompson, P. Zipser, Papagiannis, Mejri

Re: Celtics/Hawks trade idea (Josh Smith to C's)
« Reply #12 on: January 11, 2012, 12:34:17 PM »

Offline Chris

  • Global Moderator
  • Dennis Johnson
  • ******************
  • Posts: 18008
  • Tommy Points: 642
Joe Johnson is a contract you don't come back from: 4 years, $90 mil left on that contract once this year is through. 

As for Josh Smith, last year Gerald Wallace was obtained for Joel Przybilla's expiring, a low-level prospect (Dante Cunningham) and a couple of mid-to-late first-rounders.  Certainly Charlotte was in a different situation than Atlanta, but Smith shouldn't be too much more expensive. 

I could see JO, Bass and both of our 2012 picks doing the trick.  Rondo/Ray/Pierce/Smith/KG with Daniels/Pietrus/Wilcox/Stiemsma off the bench would be an intriguing team. 


What would you think if the C's traded Rondo for JO, Bass, and 2 late first round picks?

Re: Celtics/Hawks trade idea (Josh Smith to C's)
« Reply #13 on: January 11, 2012, 01:15:40 PM »

Online snively

  • Rajon Rondo
  • *****
  • Posts: 5866
  • Tommy Points: 454
Joe Johnson is a contract you don't come back from: 4 years, $90 mil left on that contract once this year is through. 

As for Josh Smith, last year Gerald Wallace was obtained for Joel Przybilla's expiring, a low-level prospect (Dante Cunningham) and a couple of mid-to-late first-rounders.  Certainly Charlotte was in a different situation than Atlanta, but Smith shouldn't be too much more expensive. 

I could see JO, Bass and both of our 2012 picks doing the trick.  Rondo/Ray/Pierce/Smith/KG with Daniels/Pietrus/Wilcox/Stiemsma off the bench would be an intriguing team. 


What would you think if the C's traded Rondo for JO, Bass, and 2 late first round picks?

Rondo's an all-star PG locked up on a bargain deal for 4 years.

Josh Smith is a good but not great swing forward who is overpaid by a few million per.  There's a significant difference.

Again, I point to Gerald Wallace, an athletic swing forward of similar value in a similar contract situation who got traded for Przybilla's expiring contract (equivalent to JO), Dante Cunningham (low-level prospect, inferior to Bass) and two first rounders that project to be on par with our 2012 first rounders. 
2016 CelticsBlog Draft: Chicago Bulls

Head Coach: Fred Hoiberg

Starters: Rubio, Danny Green, Durant, Markieff Morris, Capela
Bench: Sessions, Shumpert, G. Green, T. Booker, Frye
Deep Bench: CJ Watson, H. Thompson, P. Zipser, Papagiannis, Mejri

Re: Celtics/Hawks trade idea (Josh Smith to C's)
« Reply #14 on: January 11, 2012, 01:22:43 PM »

Online Moranis

  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 33464
  • Tommy Points: 1533
Joe Johnson is a contract you don't come back from: 4 years, $90 mil left on that contract once this year is through. 

As for Josh Smith, last year Gerald Wallace was obtained for Joel Przybilla's expiring, a low-level prospect (Dante Cunningham) and a couple of mid-to-late first-rounders.  Certainly Charlotte was in a different situation than Atlanta, but Smith shouldn't be too much more expensive. 

I could see JO, Bass and both of our 2012 picks doing the trick.  Rondo/Ray/Pierce/Smith/KG with Daniels/Pietrus/Wilcox/Stiemsma off the bench would be an intriguing team. 


What would you think if the C's traded Rondo for JO, Bass, and 2 late first round picks?

Rondo's an all-star PG locked up on a bargain deal for 4 years.

Josh Smith is a good but not great swing forward who is overpaid by a few million per.  There's a significant difference.

Again, I point to Gerald Wallace, an athletic swing forward of similar value in a similar contract situation who got traded for Przybilla's expiring contract (equivalent to JO), Dante Cunningham (low-level prospect, inferior to Bass) and two first rounders that project to be on par with our 2012 first rounders. 
Gerald Wallace is 4 years older than Josh Smith, was on a team that wasn't the 5th seed in the East (and coming off a playoff series victory), who doesn't block shots, who doesn't pass, etc.

Josh Smith is a significantly better all around player than Gerald Wallace. 
2023 Historical Draft - Brooklyn Nets - 9th pick

Bigs - Pau, Amar'e, Issel, McGinnis, Roundfield
Wings - Dantley, Bowen, J. Jackson
Guards - Cheeks, Petrovic, Buse, Rip