Author Topic: A Game of Thrones (contains spoilers)  (Read 155152 times)

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Re: A Game of Thrones (contains spoilers)
« Reply #1170 on: August 22, 2017, 11:02:41 AM »

Offline kozlodoev

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I mean, questioning the believability of travel distances in a show about dragons and zombies and white walkers seems  a little silly - but part of what has made it a fun show is that, under the circumstances, it seems pretty believable.
I don't think so. All works of fiction have their established internal set of rules. In GoT, zombies and dragons are real. Warped time travel wasn't, at least not until they decided to go off the book. They could have established alternate rules for time and space early on, but they didn't.  Doing it now hurts the credibility of the show.
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Re: A Game of Thrones (contains spoilers)
« Reply #1171 on: August 22, 2017, 11:09:24 AM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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If you look at a map of Westeros, it seems like Dragonstone is a lot closer to Eas****ch than Highgarden. To me, that was way more unbelievable. They would've had to take the Dothraki to Highgarden (or along the road to King's Landing) in boats, right?  How could they get to Highgarden without sailing ALL THE WAY around Dorne (the bottom of the continent) and then getting off the boats and riding to wherever the loot train was.

This episode they said the dragon attack was in the Blackwater Rush, aka fairly close to King's Landing. Close enough that they made a point of saying the gold wagons were already through the gates.  Still basically impossible to land an entire army without anyone being aware they were around.



You're right - at least not that we know of but the White Walkers are usually very conspicuous. I suppose they could've rezzed them earlier and forced them to stay still until night, but that one doesn't fit with the rest we've seen so far.
I thought wights were supposed to be nocturnal to begin with.

Not that I'm aware of - Hardhome was in the day and the wights definitely hung around the Superfriends for at least a full 24 hours.

Re: A Game of Thrones (contains spoilers)
« Reply #1172 on: August 22, 2017, 12:44:43 PM »

Offline Csfan1984

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I wanted to see if anyone besides me actually believed that they were on the island for more than one night? The travel time is one reason. But the biggest second reason for me thinking that it was longer than one night was that some of them were sleeping. There is no way in hell I fall a sleep the first night being surrounded. Now the second night do to exhaustion and the fact the enemy didn't cross the first night I might take that chance to sleep.
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Re: A Game of Thrones (contains spoilers)
« Reply #1173 on: August 22, 2017, 12:54:33 PM »

Offline jaketwice

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I mean, questioning the believability of travel distances in a show about dragons and zombies and white walkers seems  a little silly - but part of what has made it a fun show is that, under the circumstances, it seems pretty believable.
I don't think so. All works of fiction have their established internal set of rules. In GoT, zombies and dragons are real. Warped time travel wasn't, at least not until they decided to go off the book. They could have established alternate rules for time and space early on, but they didn't.  Doing it now hurts the credibility of the show.

You are always so disagreeable. That's exactly what I said!

Re: A Game of Thrones (contains spoilers)
« Reply #1174 on: August 22, 2017, 12:56:05 PM »

Offline Spilling Green Dye

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I wanted to see if anyone besides me actually believed that they were on the island for more than one night? The travel time is one reason. But the biggest second reason for me thinking that it was longer than one night was that some of them were sleeping. There is no way in hell I fall a sleep the first night being surrounded. Now the second night do to exhaustion and the fact the enemy didn't cross the first night I might take that chance to sleep.

When I watched the episode I had assumed they were on the island for at least 3 or 4 days before the fighting began.  While it was a stretch that Daenerys got there in time, it is plausible  https://www.reddit.com/r/freefolk/comments/6u75t3/lets_do_the_math_on_how_long_it_would_take_a/

The only thing that annoys me about the whole timing is that the Directors could have easily added a line in to address it, such as "We've been stuck here 4-days, and ran out of food this morning.  What are our options at this point?" 

Re: A Game of Thrones (contains spoilers)
« Reply #1175 on: August 22, 2017, 12:57:34 PM »

Offline jaketwice

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If you look at a map of Westeros, it seems like Dragonstone is a lot closer to Eas****ch than Highgarden. To me, that was way more unbelievable. They would've had to take the Dothraki to Highgarden (or along the road to King's Landing) in boats, right?  How could they get to Highgarden without sailing ALL THE WAY around Dorne (the bottom of the continent) and then getting off the boats and riding to wherever the loot train was.

This episode they said the dragon attack was in the Blackwater Rush, aka fairly close to King's Landing. Close enough that they made a point of saying the gold wagons were already through the gates.  Still basically impossible to land an entire army without anyone being aware they were around.



You're right - at least not that we know of but the White Walkers are usually very conspicuous. I suppose they could've rezzed them earlier and forced them to stay still until night, but that one doesn't fit with the rest we've seen so far.
I thought wights were supposed to be nocturnal to begin with.

Not that I'm aware of - Hardhome was in the day and the wights definitely hung around the Superfriends for at least a full 24 hours.

Oh that makes a lot more sense then. Thanks.

Re: A Game of Thrones (contains spoilers)
« Reply #1176 on: August 22, 2017, 01:23:27 PM »

Online Roy H.

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Where'd the giant chains come from? And who hooked them to the dragon?


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Re: A Game of Thrones (contains spoilers)
« Reply #1177 on: August 22, 2017, 01:52:56 PM »

Offline slamtheking

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Where'd the giant chains come from? And who hooked them to the dragon?
well there were plenty of the dead that fell through the ice so they'd have been available to do it.  it's not like they'd drown.

Re: A Game of Thrones (contains spoilers)
« Reply #1178 on: August 22, 2017, 01:56:25 PM »

Offline Redz

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Where'd the giant chains come from? And who hooked them to the dragon?

They keep them around just in case.  You never know when you might need them. Like Sam's rope in LOTR.

I was wondering about the mechanIcs of tying the chains to the Dragon as well.  Maybe they put all the dead guys who had fallen under water already to work.  They might as well do something while they're down there.

I did like the visual of the Wight who the Hound knocked the jaw off of with the stone. 

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Re: A Game of Thrones (contains spoilers)
« Reply #1179 on: August 22, 2017, 02:05:24 PM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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I wanted to see if anyone besides me actually believed that they were on the island for more than one night? The travel time is one reason. But the biggest second reason for me thinking that it was longer than one night was that some of them were sleeping. There is no way in hell I fall a sleep the first night being surrounded. Now the second night do to exhaustion and the fact the enemy didn't cross the first night I might take that chance to sleep.

When I watched the episode I had assumed they were on the island for at least 3 or 4 days before the fighting began.  While it was a stretch that Daenerys got there in time, it is plausible  https://www.reddit.com/r/freefolk/comments/6u75t3/lets_do_the_math_on_how_long_it_would_take_a/

The only thing that annoys me about the whole timing is that the Directors could have easily added a line in to address it, such as "We've been stuck here 4-days, and ran out of food this morning.  What are our options at this point?" 

I hate to fanfic too much but it really would've helped if they had been stuck there as a cliffhanger at the end of this episode. Maybe close with Thoros having died and them not realizing it til he's rezzed and they have to put him down. Spend some time with them using a little ingenuity to keep breaking holes in the surface of the lake, trading more banter (one of the better parts of the episode), etc.  Next episode they're basically at the end of their rope and the wights find a way across, then Dany with the big save.

Could've been a cool sequence despite the goofy premise, but they sprinted through it rather than letting the desperation of the situation set in.

Re: A Game of Thrones (contains spoilers)
« Reply #1180 on: August 22, 2017, 02:11:59 PM »

Offline danglertx

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I don't understand why there weren't taking Gendry's hammer to the ice non stop to keep it from freezing over... and also makeing a place they could get drinking water, maybe even catch a fish somehow.   Do the people in this made up world not understand the dynamics of water and freezing?

But then again, it was freezing north of the wall, how the heck was that not completely frozen over anyway?

How did John know Gendry was the fastest?  Did they do time trials before leaving?  He said it like it was a fact.  Even if Gendry was hypothetically the fastest, they didn't need a sprinter, they needed a marathon runner.  Surely a Wildling would be a better distance runner in the snow than Gendry who had never even seen snow before.  Why didn't they all run back to the wall, where was Jon going?   

Has Benjen been stalking them?  Pretty unlikely he just shows up then.  Unless Gendry sent a raven to him as well. 

Why was there a fire?  Did they plant that there?  I'm so confused, why not just attack?  Did they run back, build a diversionary fire and then ambush the White Walker and his posse?  If so, that seems a bit convoluted.  It seems more prudent to just ambush them when they don't think anything is up. 

So many plot holes and hero shields in this season's GoT that really takes away from the enjoyment of the show if you want there to be any logic at all in it.  How did Jon not freeze to death? 

Re: A Game of Thrones (contains spoilers)
« Reply #1181 on: August 22, 2017, 02:41:05 PM »

Online Roy H.

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Has Benjen been stalking them?  Pretty unlikely he just shows up then.  Unless Gendry sent a raven to him as well.

Can Bran summons him? I think the prior Three Eyed Raven did, right? Or am I making that up?


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Re: A Game of Thrones (contains spoilers)
« Reply #1182 on: August 22, 2017, 03:00:14 PM »

Offline GratefulCs

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Has Benjen been stalking them?  Pretty unlikely he just shows up then.  Unless Gendry sent a raven to him as well.

Can Bran summons him? I think the prior Three Eyed Raven did, right? Or am I making that up?
you're not making it up

and it the ONLY way it makes ANY sense
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Re: A Game of Thrones (contains spoilers)
« Reply #1183 on: August 22, 2017, 03:09:37 PM »

Offline green_bballers13

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After the episode aired, fans vented frustrations online that Gendry running back to Eas****ch, sending a raven to Daenerys, and Daenerys arriving to save the day with her dragons all happened far too quickly. Alan Taylor, who directed “Beyond the Wall,” explained how the production team approached the timeline during filming.

“We were aware that timing was getting a little hazy,” Taylor told Variety. “We’ve got Gendry running back, ravens flying a certain distance, dragons having to fly back a certain distance…In terms of the emotional experience, [Jon and company] sort of spent one dark night on the island in terms of storytelling moments. We tried to hedge it a little bit with the eternal twilight up there north of The Wall. I think there was some effort to fudge the timeline a little bit by not declaring exactly how long we were there. I think that worked for some people, for other people it didn’t. They seemed to be very concerned about how fast a raven can fly but there’s a thing called plausible impossibilities, which is what you try to achieve, rather than impossible plausibilities. So I think we were straining plausibility a little bit, but I hope the story’s momentum carries over some of that stuff.”

“It’s cool that the show is so important to so many people that it’s being scrutinized so thoroughly,” he continued. “If the show was struggling, I’d be worried about those concerns, but the show seems to be doing pretty well so it’s OK to have people with those concerns.”

In other words, "Sure it's bad storytelling, but ratings are what matter".

Is it actually bad storytelling? Compared to what?

I personally think the show is gold, and a couple people in this country share this opinion. Otherwise they wouldn't alter their Sunday night plans so they could run home and watch the show the second it comes on.

It's entertainment people. Over analysis is not necessary!

Re: A Game of Thrones (contains spoilers)
« Reply #1184 on: August 22, 2017, 03:23:08 PM »

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Where'd the giant chains come from? And who hooked them to the dragon?

They keep them around just in case.  You never know when you might need them. Like Sam's rope in LOTR.

I was wondering about the mechanIcs of tying the chains to the Dragon as well.  Maybe they put all the dead guys who had fallen under water already to work.  They might as well do something while they're down there.

I did like the visual of the Wight who the Hound knocked the jaw off of with the stone.
the thing is, that could have been a week or two later when they pulled the dragon out of the ice.  Just because they showed it right after, doesn't mean it actually happened right after. 
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