Trade Pierce instead of Sugar Ray

[AnythingIsPossible]

Ray allen is coming off back to back allstar years and a TITLE where he easily coulda been MVP, but ya let's brake this up and trade him lol.  Without Ray this team has NO OUTSIDE shooter.  We need him to win more titles.  Trading Pierce for Grant Hill and Amare makes alot more sense, if your gona trade anyone.  Just cause Ray has an expiring contract, doesn't mean you have to trade him. He can be resigned to a lesser contract extension while maintaing this nucleus.  People seem to forget that we didn't have KG in the playoffs, yet still shoulda beat Orldando if we weren't outcoached!   Ray is going nowhere!

[Donoghus]

Ray allen is coming off back to back allstar years and a TITLE where he easily coulda been MVP, but ya let's brake this up and trade him lol.  Without Ray this team has NO OUTSIDE shooter.  We need him to win more titles.  Trading Pierce for Grant Hill and Amare makes alot more sense, if your gona trade anyone.  Just cause Ray has an expiring contract, doesn't mean you have to trade him. He can be resigned to a lesser contract extension while maintaing this nucleus.  People seem to forget that we didn't have KG in the playoffs, yet still shoulda been Orldando if we weren't outcoached!   Ray is going nowhere!

So you think we're better off by keeping Ray and starting Grant Hill at the 3?  A 37 year old who was seeing limited time off the bench last season and now you're going to start him at SF?  That's going to make the Celtics better and win us more championships?  Amare's nice and all but you already have a pretty good complementary center in Perkins and KG is your PF.

[AnythingIsPossible]

I'm saying we shouldn't trade any of the Big three period. The only way we trade Ray or Pierce is if we get a young stud in return like Wade or Lebron.  Having Amare coming off the bench is scary tho, ala Kevin Mchale back in the day.  Grant Hill is probably in better shape then Pierce btw.

[Casperian]

Plus, as has already been mentioned, Ray is worth more right now, as he has the expiring contract...

This is a huge misconception, imo.

If you make a trade, you´re looking to win the trade, which simply means you get more value in return than you give up. It is correct that Ray (and his contract) has more value, but can we get more value in return?

Ray Allen has value as one of the best wingmen in the league and as an expiring contract.
Paul Pierce (only) has value as one of the best wingmen in the league.
Of course, the term "value" is relative, since it completely depends on what you want to accomplish, and we have absolutely no clue what Ainge´s masterplan looks like.
Additionally, if you trade Ray, you´re only using one half of his value. The receiving team will most likely either look for an elite wingman or an expiring contract, not both. Ray´s expiring contract only means more possibilities for trades, not better trades in general.

I say if we trade Pierce, we could get more value in return than we give up (not counting the intangibles).

Let`s say we trade Pierce for a young player, a Draft Pick in 2010 and a big expiring contract. To Utah, for example, who have the Knicks` 2010, or the Clippers, who have the Wolves 2010 pick. We´d have a team of KG, Ray, Rondo, Perk, a high Draft Pick in an allegedly stacked Draft, and a boatload of capspace for the summer of 2010.

Tell me we´re not "the" top destination for a young superstar who wants to win a ring.
Initially, I wanted the Celtics to stay away from "the summer of 2010", and loot teams that want to shed salary, but I´m not so sure about that anymore.

Anyway, if I was Danny Ainge, I wouldn´t trade Pierce, either (because I do count the intangibles).

[Bankshot]

I'm saying we shouldn't trade any of the Big three period. The only way we trade Ray or Pierce is if we get a young stud in return like Wade or Lebron.  Having Amare coming off the bench is scary tho, ala Kevin Mchale back in the day.  Grant Hill is probably in better shape then Pierce btw.

LOL.  Yeah, the Grant "can't stay healthy for one full season" Hill.

[AnythingIsPossible]

Hill was just an idea to through out.  Amare was the main reason.  Trading Rondo and Ray for Paul is ridiculous because we lose two allstars and two key guuys and recieve one in return.  We should trade Pierce for a stud defensive SF and a stud backup back guy.  We don't need pierce's offense with Rondo, Ray, and KG here.

[Steve Weinman]

I'm saying we shouldn't trade any of the Big three period.

I realize this will no doubt sound preposterous, but I found this assessment a bit surprising in light of the title of the thread that you started.

-sw

[AnythingIsPossible]

I'm actually not a fan of Amare's attitude however. He's been known to be a crybaby like Pierce.  I would love haveing a guy like Prince tho starting at SF. Great defender and complimentary player.

[AnythingIsPossible]

I'm saying we shouldn't trade any of the Big three period.

I realize this will no doubt sound preposterous, but I found this assessment a bit surprising in light of the title of the thread that you started.

-sw

Steve if it helps the team now AND in the future then i'm all for it. But i'm not for making trades just because a guy has an expiring contract.  Trading pierce makes more sense then trading Ray however for the good of the team.

[Scribbles]

I'm actually not a fan of Amare's attitude however. He's been known to be a crybaby like Pierce.  I would love haveing a guy like Prince tho starting at SF. Great defender and complimentary player.

When has Pierce been a crybaby?  He asked for more help, which he has a right to do.  A lot of players would simply screw the franchise over and demand a trade.  Pierce however wanted to stay a Celtic and win as a Celtic, thus demanded for more help, and not a trade.   

[wdleehi]

I'm actually not a fan of Amare's attitude however. He's been known to be a crybaby like Pierce.  I would love haveing a guy like Prince tho starting at SF. Great defender and complimentary player.

Since when is Pierce a crybaby?

[AnythingIsPossible]

I'm actually not a fan of Amare's attitude however. He's been known to be a crybaby like Pierce.  I would love haveing a guy like Prince tho starting at SF. Great defender and complimentary player.

When has Pierce been a crybaby?  He asked for more help, which he has a right to do.  A lot of players would simply screw the franchise over and demand a trade.  Pierce however wanted to stay a Celtic and win as a Celtic, thus demanded for more help, and not a trade.   

Pierce did DEMAND a trade if ainge didn't make a deal. People seem to forget this!  He signed a huge extension a year before and said he wanted to stick around and build through the draft if need be, then he goes and demands a trade after they abysmal 06-07 season.

[wdleehi]

I'm actually not a fan of Amare's attitude however. He's been known to be a crybaby like Pierce.  I would love haveing a guy like Prince tho starting at SF. Great defender and complimentary player.

When has Pierce been a crybaby?  He asked for more help, which he has a right to do.  A lot of players would simply screw the franchise over and demand a trade.  Pierce however wanted to stay a Celtic and win as a Celtic, thus demanded for more help, and not a trade.   

Pierce did DEMAND a trade if ainge didn't make a deal. People seem to forget this!  He signed a huge extension a year before and said he wanted to stick around and build through the draft if need be, then he goes and demands a trade after they abysmal 06-07 season.

Thank you Pierce for demanding a team that could win.  Who knows, we could still be waiting for 17 if Pierce hadn't made these demands (that most stars do on losing teams)

[AnythingIsPossible]

Do u think that Bird, Magic, Jordan, KG would ever give that self indulging Oscar speech after the celtics recieved their Rings on banner night?  Cmon now.

[wdleehi]

Do u think that Bird, Magic, Jordan, KG would ever give that self indulging Oscar speech after the celtics recieved their Rings on banner night?  Cmon now.

Does that matter? 


What matters is that Pierce could make that speech.  You know, by being the Finals MVP.