Author Topic: Rumor: Rondo to the Kings for #4 and Thompson/Hawes  (Read 18361 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Re: Rondo to the Kings for #4 and Thompson.
« Reply #15 on: June 12, 2009, 07:53:25 PM »

Offline Chris

  • Global Moderator
  • Dennis Johnson
  • ******************
  • Posts: 18008
  • Tommy Points: 642
I don't like Evans as a PG, he's more a combo in the mold of D West and if Danny is going to trade Rondo or Ray for the #4 pick, I sure hope that Tyreke Evans isn't the cornerstone of the deal that we get back. After Griffin, this draft is a crap shoot and trading Ray or Rondo for anyone that isn't Blake Griffin is a huge gamble. Thompson and Evans for Rondo is a horrible deal.

Now if they want to go Ray for Thompson, Nocioni, Thomas' contract and the #4, I might consider that. Thompson looks like he could be a stud like PF which means we don't resign Baby, Nocioni is the backup wing we've been looking for, Thomas' contract expires so we can use his money to resign Rondo, and the C's could draft James Harden, who I think could eventually be very Ray like.

Harden is 6'5", has a 6'10" wingspan, is a good set shooter from the outside, a very good free throw shooter, a plus rebounder for his position and has decent passing skills in transition where he excels. He has a great shooters form and just needs to develop getting his shot off off the dribble and while coming around screens in catch and shoot situations.

If we're trading into the Top 5 (which I highly doubt), outside of Griffin, Harden's the guy I would want on the C's.

Agreed.  He is NBA ready right now, and he may turn into the next Paul Pierce if he reaches his potential.  I would definitely want him more than Evans.

Re: Rondo to the Kings for #4 and Thompson.
« Reply #16 on: June 12, 2009, 08:03:14 PM »

Offline Diggles

  • Jayson Tatum
  • Posts: 879
  • Tommy Points: 46
I would consider this

Rondo/Scal/T Allen/Pruitt

for Nocioni, Hawes and the #4 if they would also throw in a future 1st.

Rondo is too talented, not to get alot oftalent back!
Diggles

Re: Rondo to the Kings for #4 and Thompson.
« Reply #17 on: June 12, 2009, 08:09:19 PM »

Offline Chris

  • Global Moderator
  • Dennis Johnson
  • ******************
  • Posts: 18008
  • Tommy Points: 642
I would consider this

Rondo/Scal/T Allen/Pruitt

for Nocioni, Hawes and the #4 if they would also throw in a future 1st.

Rondo is too talented, not to get alot oftalent back!

I would take that package in a second, even without the future first.  I think Hawes is almost, if not as good a prospect as Rondo is, and he is at a more premium position. 

I don't think the Kings would consider it though.

Re: Rondo to the Kings for #4 and Thompson.
« Reply #18 on: June 12, 2009, 08:42:57 PM »

Offline rondohondo

  • NCE
  • Danny Ainge
  • **********
  • Posts: 10756
  • Tommy Points: 1196
If they do happen to do a deal like this , Francisco Garcia needs to be included. Apparently Sacremento is willing to give up Hawes and the # 4 to get Rondo. Now I think Hawes is going to be a really good C. Something along the lines of Chris Kaman but a better scorer, so that really makes me think hard about the deal

Here's the trade I would want to see

Bos sends: Rondo, Giddens or Walker, Scal and TA

Sac sends: Hawes, Garcia, #4 pick

I think this is actually a good trade for both teams.

Why For Sacremento

Sacremento gets their Man in Rondo to team up with Kevin Martin for the next 10+ seasons. This will be one of the top 5 backcourts in the NBA and both players are very young.

The Kings will also be getting 5 MIL in expiring Salaries between Scal and TA, along with a young wing player with Potential in Walker or Giddens.


This trade gives them an top 5-8 PG who can still get much better. It also gives them more cap space. The Kings will have about 20 MIL to spend on free agents in 2010- 2011. They could easily add another piece to the puzzle by signing one of

Joe Johnson
Rip Hamilton
Chris Bosh
Amare Stoudamire

Potential Kings 2010-2011 Roster
PG: Rondo   / Udrich
SG: Martin  / Walker or Giddens
SF: Nocioni /
PF: Bosh    
 C: Vet FA

That looks like a really good young team that can grow together.


Why For Boston

Hawes

 I think Hawes is the real deal as a starting C in the NBA. He has to be just a level under Rondo as far as Prospects in the NBA. He has a low Post game on offense thats getting better and can really shoot the ball, can block shots, a decent rebounder who can get better. Has Potential to be a good Defensive player, especially working with KG, Perk and Clifford Ray everyday.

We wouls now have 2 top 10 Centers on our Roster , which could come in very handy in future trade, because Quality, young starting Centers are hard to come by in the NBA.

Francisco Garcia

A lot of people don't know much about this guy, but he would be a perfect fit on a Contending team. He is basically Tayshon Prince. They both shoot 37% from 3's for their career's , they are long , hard nose defenders and both score about the same and rebound near the same for their careers.

Garcia is going to be making 5-6 MIL for the next 5 seasons, but that might be a very reasonable contract for a guy who can play both the SG and SF, Can hit the 3 with consistency , tough + long defender and can handle the ball. He would be our new James Posey

#4 Pick

This is where we can get either Rubio as our future PG possibly, or draft Ray Allen's backup and future replacement. Harden would be a great pick here if he is available because he can step in and be a 6th man right away with potential to be a Brandon Roy type.


Free Agents

Now we would have to add a playoff tested PG to run the team while Rubio develops on the bench( if thats who we choose)

I would want Bibby as my 1st option, then Miller or Kidd

2009-2010 Roster

PG: Bibby( MLE)  / Rubio(#4 Pick) or Marbury
SG: Ray          / Haren(#4 Pick) or FA Vet
SF: PP           / Francisco Garcia
PF: KG           / BBD
 C: Perk         / Hawes


Now that looks like a team that can still contend for a title , while building for the future at the same time
« Last Edit: June 12, 2009, 09:36:55 PM by rondohondo »

Re: Rondo to the Kings for #4 and Thompson.
« Reply #19 on: June 12, 2009, 08:44:57 PM »

Offline winsomme

  • Paul Silas
  • ******
  • Posts: 6058
  • Tommy Points: 255
I think of the two positions (PG pr SG) the one i would feel better about having a rookie in is PG.

part of that has to do with who the rookie would be getting (Rubio vs Evans/Harden) and part of it has to do with keeping GPA together for another shot a Title.

If Rubio is as good as we hear, I think he could keep feeding the ball to GPA and getting them their looks. We'd lose all the Rondo nuances (athleticism, knowing where and how GPA like the ball, rebounding, fearlessness, etc), but I think ultimately we'd have the best chance at a Title in 2009/2010 keeping GPA together.

also, moving Rondo gives us the best chance at landing a player in the 2010 FA windfall. We wouldn't have to spend all that money on Rondo + we'd have Ray's expiring contract coming off the books. With Pierce due for an extension (we could maybe knock his salary down some for that season) and only 4 players under contract (KG, Pierce, Perk, Rubio), we could have money to go after a pretty good player.

anyway, still want to stay as is, but if i had to choose between moving Ray or Rondo for a pick, I would move Rondo.

and Rondo for #4 +Thompson actually isn't that bad....especially when you consider the salary savings of not having to re-up Rajon.

roster:

Rubio/Vet PG/Eddie
Ray/Walker/TA
Pierce/Hill?/Scals
KG/Thompson/Powe
Perk/Dice
While I think any major trade is unlikely, I have to say I think the quality in the top of this draft is probably more in SG's than PG's. I'm not sold on the hype that is Rubio but then again all I've seen is you tube stuff.Also Jrue Holiday is kinda small for my liking. I have however seen Evans, Harden, and Wayne Ellington and as much as I'm not sold on Evans I love Ellington and Harden and think DeRozan might be a pretty decent wing player as well.

Trading Rondo I think hurts this team way more than trading Ray and I think long term, the better impact in this draft is in SGs.

but they would be targeting one guy if they made the move not the depth of the draft...I see what you're saying, but i don't think the depth at a position is the key factor.

as to which position would cause bigger ripples next season, I think back to 2008. While Rondo was solid in the playoffs, it was really GPA that got us that Title. Rondo was a very young PG and still pretty inconsistent, yet we were still able to win it all.

Obviously, the reports would have to be right about Rubio for it to work, but I think GPA could guide him pretty effectively and take up the slack for youth just like they did with Rajon.

plus, there is the potential salary considerations of not having to give that big extension to Rondo.

as for Harden and Evans, I was pretty disappointed in both of them down the stretch of the NCAA season. I like Harden more, but I think overall it would be harder to get him to be a reliable scoring option on next years team...harder than getting Rubio to be at the level of Rondo in 2008, anyway...

again, overall, I'm still on the retool the bench train...
I think you have to address the depth of the draft because the pick the Celtics would be receiving would be the fourth and not the second. There's no guarantee that Rubio will be there at #4. So n gambling which player you are going to deal away, you have to think which will be more easily replaced at #4 and not think only, trade Rondo get Rubio because there is no guarantee of that.

What happens if New York trades up and gets the #2 and takes Rubio after we have already traded Rondo away? Then you're screwed because you have to go after a Miller or Bibby with the MLE and have little money left for back up bigs. If you trade Ray for the #4 and like all three of Harden, Evans, and Ellington, then you would be guaranteed of getting one of the guys you want.

that's a good point, but they could also do the trade during the draft so that they know who was there at #4 when they decided to pull the trigger on the deal....

but yeah, if they do the deal ahead of time, they could definitely get snookered if they are targeting one guy.

Re: Rondo to the Kings for #4 and Thompson.
« Reply #20 on: June 12, 2009, 09:38:05 PM »

Offline footey

  • Reggie Lewis
  • ***************
  • Posts: 15965
  • Tommy Points: 1833
Rondo's not going anywhere, guys, never mind a 4th pick in a weak draft.  C'mon, get real.

Re: Rondo to the Kings for #4 and Thompson.
« Reply #21 on: June 12, 2009, 11:25:23 PM »

Offline slamtheking

  • NCE
  • Red Auerbach
  • *******************************
  • Posts: 31869
  • Tommy Points: 10047
I don't like Evans as a PG, he's more a combo in the mold of D West and if Danny is going to trade Rondo or Ray for the #4 pick, I sure hope that Tyreke Evans isn't the cornerstone of the deal that we get back. After Griffin, this draft is a crap shoot and trading Ray or Rondo for anyone that isn't Blake Griffin is a huge gamble. Thompson and Evans for Rondo is a horrible deal.

Now if they want to go Ray for Thompson, Nocioni, Thomas' contract and the #4, I might consider that. Thompson looks like he could be a stud like PF which means we don't resign Baby, Nocioni is the backup wing we've been looking for, Thomas' contract expires so we can use his money to resign Rondo, and the C's could draft James Harden, who I think could eventually be very Ray like.

Harden is 6'5", has a 6'10" wingspan, is a good set shooter from the outside, a very good free throw shooter, a plus rebounder for his position and has decent passing skills in transition where he excels. He has a great shooters form and just needs to develop getting his shot off off the dribble and while coming around screens in catch and shoot situations.
while that's not a horrible idea, you still have holes for back PG and C.  Although you plug the hole for a back up wing you now have to find a starting SG (when you just gave up an allstar at that position)

Re: Rondo to the Kings for #4 and Thompson.
« Reply #22 on: June 12, 2009, 11:47:09 PM »

Offline lon3lytoaster

  • Antoine Walker
  • ****
  • Posts: 4608
  • Tommy Points: 157
  • Word aapp!
I wonder if Portland would be willing to trade Oden for a top-five pick so they can take Curry? If they did that, we could either swing a 4 team trade, or a three team then turn around and trade with Portland.

Basically what I'm thinking is, Trade Rondo for Thompson and four, then Ray for Butler, James and five theeennn! Trade Portland five, and contract fillers for Oden and Blake. Either this or do a four way with Portland getting Caron Butler someway, as well as the fifth pick. We would then pick either Rubio, Harden, or Evans (Boo)

Guiness... hell'uva drug.

Re: Rumor: Rondo to the Kings for #4 and Thompson/Hawes
« Reply #23 on: June 13, 2009, 12:33:18 AM »

Offline KungPoweChicken

  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2101
  • Tommy Points: 228
The idea of trading Rondo really makes me sick to my stomach, but not as sick as the idea of Evans. That guy is going to be the next Tony Allen.

Re: Rondo to the Kings for #4 and Thompson.
« Reply #24 on: June 13, 2009, 12:36:50 AM »

Offline The Walker Wiggle

  • Antoine Walker
  • ****
  • Posts: 4568
  • Tommy Points: 758
  • Pretend Hinkie
Can we get some question marks in these thread titles? Not signaling you out WW, you're a good poster.

Ha, yes, totally fair request. Though I do hope I caused at least one spit take.

...There's no guarantee that Rubio will be there at #4. So gambling on which player you are going to deal away, you have to think which will be more easily replaced at #4 and not think only, trade Rondo get Rubio because there is no guarantee of that.

What happens if New York trades up and gets the #2 and takes Rubio after we have already traded Rondo away?

Well, there's little indication right now that Memphis is willing to take Rubio at 2 and risk being rebuked. And if the Celtics were worried about OKC I imagine they could move up from 4 to 2 at minimal expense. Sure New York has interest but what do they have to offer besides #8? Team is in fully salary shed mode for 2010.

How is this on CelticsBlog? This is so heavily weighted in the Kings favor.

You know, I've suspected that The Walker Wiggle is a closet Kings fan for a long time. Good catch.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2009, 01:17:44 AM by The Walker Wiggle »

Re: Rondo to the Kings for #4 and Thompson.
« Reply #25 on: June 13, 2009, 12:48:07 AM »

Offline guava_wrench

  • Satch Sanders
  • *********
  • Posts: 9931
  • Tommy Points: 777
I wonder if Portland would be willing to trade Oden for a top-five pick so they can take Curry? If they did that, we could either swing a 4 team trade, or a three team then turn around and trade with Portland.

Basically what I'm thinking is, Trade Rondo for Thompson and four, then Ray for Butler, James and five theeennn! Trade Portland five, and contract fillers for Oden and Blake. Either this or do a four way with Portland getting Caron Butler someway, as well as the fifth pick. We would then pick either Rubio, Harden, or Evans (Boo)

Guiness... hell'uva drug.
I think Oden is still more valuable than Curry.

Re: Rumor: Rondo to the Kings for #4 and Thompson/Hawes
« Reply #26 on: June 13, 2009, 01:22:33 AM »

Offline vagrantwade

  • Jaylen Brown
  • Posts: 560
  • Tommy Points: 42
Rubio = Garbage

Rondo = Not getting traded.


Re: Rondo to the Kings for #4 and Thompson.
« Reply #27 on: June 13, 2009, 01:45:07 AM »

Offline youcanthandlethetruth113

  • Bill Walton
  • *
  • Posts: 1086
  • Tommy Points: 153
I don't think I would do it for Thompson, but if it was Hawes, then I would have to strongly consider it (although if its for Evans, I would be VERY disapointed).  I think Hawes is going to be a star, and one of the best Centers in the league for a long time.  He has the most advanced low post game of any young player in the league other than Al Jefferson, and he will only get better as he continues to get stronger.  He has tremendous footwork on offense and defense, and great touch. 

Thompson on the other hand scares me.  He seems kind of soft, and I just have a feeling when teams start gameplanning for him, he will completely disappear.  He reminds me a lot of Channing Frye.

Chris,

First of all...great post! I think you hit the nail right on the head with both of your comments here, however I'm skeptical the other way around.

You see, Hawes is the one who scares me. Yes he's massive, but he seems more like a gentle giant than somebody who enjoys getting down and dirty in the post. Also, just a hunch, but I feel like we can label him injury prone right now. He also seems to get very tired rather quickly, which is nothing short of alarming.

Thompson on the other hand is a kid who I feel just has raw talent and a body to match. I feel he needs coaching (Clifford Ray say hello to your next project!) and PT (backup KG till Powe returns?) and then the jury can be out. I totally feel what you're saying with the comparison to Channing Frye though. The difference between them is that Channing will forever be shy while Thompson simply needs encouragement to come out of his shell and not be afraid to make mistakes.

Thoughts?
"Perk is not an alley-oop guy" - Tommy Heinson - Feb 27th 2008 vs. Cleveland

Re: Rumor: Rondo to the Kings for #4 and Thompson/Hawes
« Reply #28 on: June 13, 2009, 06:49:47 AM »

Offline Eja117

  • NCE
  • Bill Sharman
  • *******************
  • Posts: 19274
  • Tommy Points: 1254
At first I thought this was Rondo for 4, Hawes, AND Thompson and I thought "that's probably not the worst trade I ever heard. I still probably wouldn't do it"

Then I saw it was Hawes OR Thompson and I thought "Ok now THAT is maybe one of the worst trades I ever heard"

Re: Rumor: Rondo to the Kings for #4 and Thompson/Hawes
« Reply #29 on: June 13, 2009, 07:43:16 AM »

Offline clover

  • Front Page Moderator
  • Paul Silas
  • ******
  • Posts: 6130
  • Tommy Points: 315
I presume this rumor comes from the Kings' side of things, which means it's the version of the trade that they'd like to do.