Chad Ford - " C's are shopping Ray Allen for a top 5 or 10 Draft Pick"

[rondohondo]

No team except the wizards in the top 10 pick area would want allens services and i doubt they would want him since their pressing need is someone up front(which the draft can help them get). Chad ford is an idiot to make up this rumor.

A more likely trade occuring would be receiving James Posey, Rasual Butler(very good 3 point shooter), and hornets 21st pick for Ray Allen

The reason why the celtics would even think about such a trade is that there might be someone at 21 Danny might highly regard to get and will make a sudden impact(ie Bj Mullens if he drops, casspi)

The celtics issue right now is that they lack depth. Even with our team being near the same team that won last year we would still be missing important ingredients such as a pj brown, sam cassell, posey to help us battle teams like the lakers, orlando and cleveland.(no chance to sign such depth via free agency)

I think ray allen is gone and a trade to the hornets with the propsed players coming back might be the trick to get alot of decent depth while not weaknening the starting 5 tremendously 

Starting 5

Perk
Kg
PP
Butler
Rondo

Bench

Posey
Powe/Davis
House
Draft pick( pref Mullens, Casspi, Earl Clark)
Scal/T Allen
Walker/Giddens

vs

Starting 5

Perk
KG
PP
R. Allen
Rondo

Bench

Powe/Davis
House
Scal/T Allen
Walker/Giddens

Tell me which lineup do you think has a better chance to win it all?

 

Thats a pretty good call. Saves the Hornets some money and adds an allstar to their team. I like the idea as long as Danny thinks he can get a player at 21 .

[Fafnir]

No team except the wizards in the top 10 pick area would want allens services and i doubt they would want him since their pressing need is someone up front(which the draft can help them get). Chad ford is an idiot to make up this rumor.

A more likely trade occuring would be receiving James Posey, Rasual Butler(very good 3 point shooter), and hornets 21st pick for Ray Allen

The reason why the celtics would even think about such a trade is that there might be someone at 21 Danny might highly regard to get and will make a sudden impact(ie Bj Mullens if he drops, casspi)

The celtics issue right now is that they lack depth. Even with our team being near the same team that won last year we would still be missing important ingredients such as a pj brown, sam cassell, posey to help us battle teams like the lakers, orlando and cleveland.(no chance to sign such depth via free agency)

I think ray allen is gone and a trade to the hornets with the propsed players coming back might be the trick to get alot of decent depth while not weaknening the starting 5 tremendously 

Starting 5

Perk
Kg
PP
Butler
Rondo

Bench

Posey
Powe/Davis
House
Draft pick( pref Mullens, Casspi, Earl Clark)
Scal/T Allen
Walker/Giddens

vs

Starting 5

Perk
KG
PP
R. Allen
Rondo

Bench

Powe/Davis
House
Scal/T Allen
Walker/Giddens

Tell me which lineup do you think has a better chance to win it all?

 

Thats a pretty good call. Saves the Hornets some money and adds an allstar to their team. I like the idea as long as Danny thinks he can get a player at 21 .

Depth is overated. If you're downgrading the starting unit of the C's you need to be getting an elite prospect or at least a better starter than Rasaul Butler....

Plus if Danny didn't want Posey last year, why would he want him now that the best valued year of his contract was used up in New Orleans? Makes no sense for us, NO jumps at it.

[Evantime34]

As Walker Wiggle pointed out in hist post on the main page James Thomas and Haywood are all expiring contracts. If you add those to TA and Scals that is 20 million in expiring contracts. So we give up Ray, get Evans and then we use our 20 million in expiring to get some other top notch talents. If anyone has any idea of plausible players we could get with 20 mill in expiring contracts please let me know

[Fafnir]

As Walker Wiggle pointed out in hist post on the main page James Thomas and Haywood are all expiring contracts. If you add those to TA and Scals that is 20 million in expiring contracts. So we give up Ray, get Evans and then we use our 20 million in expiring to get some other top notch talents. If anyone has any idea of plausible players we could get with 20 mill in expiring contracts please let me know

That is a huge risk to take without already have a deal in place.

[Evantime34]

As Walker Wiggle pointed out in hist post on the main page James Thomas and Haywood are all expiring contracts. If you add those to TA and Scals that is 20 million in expiring contracts. So we give up Ray, get Evans and then we use our 20 million in expiring to get some other top notch talents. If anyone has any idea of plausible players we could get with 20 mill in expiring contracts please let me know

That is a huge risk to take without already have a deal in place.

Well I'm sure if they did pick up that many expiring contracts they would have a deal in place. We just need to figure out what it is

[Fafnir]

As Walker Wiggle pointed out in hist post on the main page James Thomas and Haywood are all expiring contracts. If you add those to TA and Scals that is 20 million in expiring contracts. So we give up Ray, get Evans and then we use our 20 million in expiring to get some other top notch talents. If anyone has any idea of plausible players we could get with 20 mill in expiring contracts please let me know

That is a huge risk to take without already have a deal in place.

Well I'm sure if they did pick up that many expiring contracts they would have a deal in place. We just need to figure out what it is

We have Ray Allen's expiring deal already, most of the permutations have already been gone over....

[Evantime34]

As Walker Wiggle pointed out in hist post on the main page James Thomas and Haywood are all expiring contracts. If you add those to TA and Scals that is 20 million in expiring contracts. So we give up Ray, get Evans and then we use our 20 million in expiring to get some other top notch talents. If anyone has any idea of plausible players we could get with 20 mill in expiring contracts please let me know

That is a huge risk to take without already have a deal in place.

Well I'm sure if they did pick up that many expiring contracts they would have a deal in place. We just need to figure out what it is

We have Ray Allen's expiring deal already, most of the permutations have already been gone over....

Good Point

[Fafnir]

As Walker Wiggle pointed out in hist post on the main page James Thomas and Haywood are all expiring contracts. If you add those to TA and Scals that is 20 million in expiring contracts. So we give up Ray, get Evans and then we use our 20 million in expiring to get some other top notch talents. If anyone has any idea of plausible players we could get with 20 mill in expiring contracts please let me know

That is a huge risk to take without already have a deal in place.

Well I'm sure if they did pick up that many expiring contracts they would have a deal in place. We just need to figure out what it is

We have Ray Allen's expiring deal already, most of the permutations have already been gone over....

Good Point

I suppose there would be a few more you could throw around just because our "20 million" would be more broken up. But I doubt there is much out there that hasn't been discussed in one form or another.

It is going to be a very long off season.

[johnnyrondo]

As Walker Wiggle pointed out in hist post on the main page James Thomas and Haywood are all expiring contracts. If you add those to TA and Scals that is 20 million in expiring contracts. So we give up Ray, get Evans and then we use our 20 million in expiring to get some other top notch talents. If anyone has any idea of plausible players we could get with 20 mill in expiring contracts please let me know

Tmac?

[rondohondo]

As Walker Wiggle pointed out in hist post on the main page James Thomas and Haywood are all expiring contracts. If you add those to TA and Scals that is 20 million in expiring contracts. So we give up Ray, get Evans and then we use our 20 million in expiring to get some other top notch talents. If anyone has any idea of plausible players we could get with 20 mill in expiring contracts please let me know

Tmac?

They would want more than just expiring contracts for TMAC. I know he is always injured, but if he ever gets healthy again, he is still young enough to be a really good player.

I think more along the lines of a Mike Miller or Raja Bell, Jason Terry could be gotten for expiring contracts and Giddens or Walker + BBD (S +T 4YR 20 MIL).

[Tr1boy]

"Depth is overated. If you're downgrading the starting unit of the C's you need to be getting an elite prospect or at least a better starter than Rasaul Butler....

Plus if Danny didn't want Posey last year, why would he want him now that the best valued year of his contract was used up in New Orleans? Makes no sense for us, NO jumps at it."

Danny knows he made a big mistake when he didn't sign posey and i'm sure posey regrets not taking a little less to have another proper chance to win it all. Also we will be getting posey with a 3 year deal now compared to the 4 he initially signed. He is experienced enough to complement out starters and still young enough for be a good influence for our future lineup.

Depth is not overrated. Out of all the considered elite team maybe outside of cleveland we had the weakest bench with unbalanced depth.

Lastly Rasual butler imo is a very good player, that has height at 6'7, can shoot the three consistantly, athletic and plays defense. He is not ray allen no doubt but is starting material imo on a good team(just like raja bell was with phoenix)

[johnnyrondo]

As Walker Wiggle pointed out in hist post on the main page James Thomas and Haywood are all expiring contracts. If you add those to TA and Scals that is 20 million in expiring contracts. So we give up Ray, get Evans and then we use our 20 million in expiring to get some other top notch talents. If anyone has any idea of plausible players we could get with 20 mill in expiring contracts please let me know

Tmac?

They would want more than just expiring contracts for TMAC. I know he is always injured, but if he ever gets healthy again, he is still young enough to be a really good player.

I think more along the lines of a Mike Miller or Raja Bell, Jason Terry could be gotten for expiring contracts and Giddens or Walker + BBD (S +T 4YR 20 MIL).

Congrats fellow Rondo on your second star. Here's a TP

[nickagneta]

As Walker Wiggle pointed out in hist post on the main page James Thomas and Haywood are all expiring contracts. If you add those to TA and Scals that is 20 million in expiring contracts. So we give up Ray, get Evans and then we use our 20 million in expiring to get some other top notch talents. If anyone has any idea of plausible players we could get with 20 mill in expiring contracts please let me know

You would have to work a three way trade immediately since once you trade for a player you need to keep them on your team for at least 90 days or until some time in Dec, whichever comes later.

I think...

[Fafnir]

"Depth is overated. If you're downgrading the starting unit of the C's you need to be getting an elite prospect or at least a better starter than Rasaul Butler....

Plus if Danny didn't want Posey last year, why would he want him now that the best valued year of his contract was used up in New Orleans? Makes no sense for us, NO jumps at it."

Danny knows he made a big mistake when he didn't sign posey and i'm sure posey regrets not taking a little less to have another proper chance to win it all. Also we will be getting posey with a 3 year deal now compared to the 4 he initially signed. He is experienced enough to complement out starters and still young enough for be a good influence for our future lineup.

Depth is not overrated. Out of all the considered elite team maybe outside of cleveland we had the weakest bench with unbalanced depth.

Lastly Rasual butler imo is a very good player, that has height at 6'7, can shoot the three consistantly, athletic and plays defense. He is not ray allen no doubt but is starting material imo on a good team(just like raja bell was with phoenix)

Depth is over rated. You need 1 backup wing, 1 backup big, and 1 backup guard for the most part in the playoffs. You need a variety of skill sets for various situations but your best players produce the majority of the wins.

Rasual Butler is a 3 point shooter and that is it. Roughly half of his shot attempts were from 3. He shoots a good percentage on those and a bad percentage on everything else. He only shot 43% from the field overall. He only shoots 78% from the line.

He is a very limited player. To trade the versatility of Ray Allen for two role players and a pick is crazy.

Also you are looking at Posey's contract completely wrong from a logical stand point. To trade for him now would be similar as giving him the four year deal and then him missing the whole season for some reason.

You still have the 3rd and 4th years which Danny didn't want to give, but you lost the best valued year's worth of production. So it is worse than signing him during last year's off season.

Trading Ray Allen should be done to get younger and/or bring in more talent overall to the team. Your proposed trade downgrades the starting unit severely to add a rookie and James Posey. We can and should get more out of Ray, by either having him play the year out or trading him for a better package.

[wiley]

"Depth is overated. If you're downgrading the starting unit of the C's you need to be getting an elite prospect or at least a better starter than Rasaul Butler....

Plus if Danny didn't want Posey last year, why would he want him now that the best valued year of his contract was used up in New Orleans? Makes no sense for us, NO jumps at it."

Danny knows he made a big mistake when he didn't sign posey and i'm sure posey regrets not taking a little less to have another proper chance to win it all. Also we will be getting posey with a 3 year deal now compared to the 4 he initially signed. He is experienced enough to complement out starters and still young enough for be a good influence for our future lineup.

Depth is not overrated. Out of all the considered elite team maybe outside of cleveland we had the weakest bench with unbalanced depth.

Lastly Rasual butler imo is a very good player, that has height at 6'7, can shoot the three consistantly, athletic and plays defense. He is not ray allen no doubt but is starting material imo on a good team(just like raja bell was with phoenix)

I like this post.  I know nothing about Butler but the size, defense and 3-point shooting you mention are musts, especially the defense.  I'm assuming he can backup Paul too with Posey at the 4 occasionally.  I have no problem with Big Baby coming back, but I'd prefer a slew of 3-4 type players and more tall studs in the big rotation.  A wing rotation with Butler, Pierce, Posey and Walker would allow the Celtics to use the full MLE on a big as good as Pachulia, for example.

And I agree with you that depth is not overrated.  It may seem overrated in the postseason when the rotation is shortened, but especially on our team (aging stars), depth is what will allow us to stay injury free and fatigue free, so that come playoff time Pierce can play his 42 minutes at an M.V.P. level.

The combo of House, Posey and Butler helps replace Allen's 3-point shooting, and a less-tired Pierce can go back to 3-point bombing as well.  It scares me that Ray's 3-point shooting was atrocious except in the final moments of games.  It's true he rescued our butts a couple of times, but poor shooting early in games unfortunately helped create some of those tight finishes.  I'd rather smash the other team with defense and a less streaky approach to 3-point shooting.  Yes, his scoring prowess will be missed along with the attention teams must pay him, but with the minutes they play him plus his age he can no longer make them pay for playing him tight by getting into the paint or to the rim, at least not with enough frequency.

On the other hand, I'd a want a better pick than 21.  If I knew more about Butler I might not feel that way, so I wouldn't mind a Butler thread before saying yes or no to this one.