Congressman compares NBA age limit to slavery

[EatSleepBreatheGreen]

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/05/sports/basketball/05stern.html?_r=3&ref=basketball


This sounds pretty ridiculous imho. Sounds like pathetic pandering as well. Not many baseball 18 yr olds are on major league teams, if any. They're in the minors. Business wise it makes sense for Stern to not want 18 yr olds in the NBA. They should call the NBA age limit rule the "Gerald Green Prevention Rule."  Then again he was like 21 when he finished HS. 

It does make sense for the nba, and the guys analogy is quite extreme, but the practice is still quite crooked.

 it is denial of employment for the express purpose of trying to force these players to play for free (in theory anyway) at the NCAA level, for all intents and purposes a minor league business partner of the NBA.

The player assume tons of injury risk and risk to their draft status to play for free at a basketball vocational school that they have no intention of finishing for educational purposes while the NCAA cashes in and the NBA gets another year to look at its future draft picks.

 that's why i have zero problem with them going overseas till they are 19.

So overseas is equivalent to minor league baseball in a way. From the NBA perspective it does a disservice to have 18 yr old NBA players on NBA rosters. Noone's forcing anyone to go to college.

Sure the NBA is. Europe is only open for top level guys. If you don't go to college as a mid round/ 2nd round guy prospect, who on earth do you think is going to draft you after a year not playing basketball while others who went to college are impressing scouts?



Look it makes great business sense to do this "scratch your back I'll scratch yours" thing with the NCAA for both sides, its why stern is trying to make it two years of college pre-NBA.

The NBA gets a year of easy scouting and hype for the player, The NCAA gets tons of profit from the same hype. IT's a no-brainer from a business standpoint.

It still doesn't change the fact its a screw job for the kids. What if you get hurt on your free tour of the country's NCAA arena's?

It would be like if you wanted to apply for a job, but first you had to work for free for a year, and at the end of said year, they MAY offer you the position or not. No one would stand for that in corporate America. IT's a shady business practice.

TP. I don't think I could have put it any better.

[nickagneta]

crownsy,

Your whole argument that the NCAA makes tons of money from Rose and Beasley and others going to the NCAA instead of the NBA is wrong. Last I checked, the NCAA made huge gobs of money even though LeBron and Al Jefferson and Dwight Howard didn't go to the NCAA. Also, if you think the Kansas State University, or Texas or Memphis made giant amounts more money because Rose, Durant or Beasley went there for one year you are extremely mistaken.

Most big colleges that recruit the top talent in the country and get them belong to large conferences. Those conferences pool their money and then disperse it. So just because Memphis went to the Finals, it doesn't mean they made all that much more money than say Tulsa or UAB. Most conferences equally distribute television revenues, give percentages of the gate to the opponents, and take all moneys earned post season and distribute it equally between the teams.

Also, the biggest colleges and universities are going to make gobs of money regardless of who plays there. Texas and Kansas State made tons of money when Durant and Beasley were there but they made giant amounts of mony the years before they got there as well. As does UCLA, USC, Dke, UNC, Oklahoma, and so on and so on.

So by forcing the 5 r 6 basketball savants that are good enough to go in guaranteed first round slots, and sending them to the top level colleges, and we know that is where they will go, isn't going to significantly effect the money situation for those colleges or the NCAA basketball. It is a giant money making machine that is not going to reap tons of benefits by keeping the best of the best 18 year olds for one year. Now if the policy was to keep 18 year olds 2 or 3 or 4 years, I could see where you have a point in this sense, but that isn't the policy and all the rant about money for the NCAA is a fallacy.

[Eja117]

I am assuming the NBA has an anti-trust exemption, like the MLB, and if they're going to discriminate then I assume the government can say something about that

The NBA doesn't have an antitrust exemption.  However, that has little to do with this case.  The players could sue, but based upon the Maurice Clarett case, they would be likely to lose.  An employer and a union can enter into an agreement to restrict employment of non-union members.

I was under the impression that age discrimination was illegal, although maybe it's only against the old.

[Eja117]

Thinking outside the box, what if NCAA teams were allowed to offer two paid internship scholarships each? Maybe you could require these internships be for 2 years. This would also improve the competitive balance in the NCAA, stop the one and done situations, and compensate players for the revenues they bring to their colleges.

Another idea: What if players could be drafted out of HS and guaranteed a stipend from the NBA team which drafted them after two yrs in college?

Wouldn't be amateur sports. You can't legitimately pay college athletes.

I don't see why it's illigitmate to pay people what they're worth, especially while the coaches and university presidents make money off them.

[indeedproceed]

Thinking outside the box, what if NCAA teams were allowed to offer two paid internship scholarships each? Maybe you could require these internships be for 2 years. This would also improve the competitive balance in the NCAA, stop the one and done situations, and compensate players for the revenues they bring to their colleges.

Another idea: What if players could be drafted out of HS and guaranteed a stipend from the NBA team which drafted them after two yrs in college?

Wouldn't be amateur sports. You can't legitimately pay college athletes.

I don't see why it's illigitmate to pay people what they're worth, especially while the coaches and university presidents make money off them.

Not the point, I agree with you that a lot of people are making a lot of money on an unfair system. The point is, college sports are amateur sports. You cannot pay college athletes.

I guess I could give all these arguments about how the biggest schools would benefit the most, but lets face, that happens anyways.

But what do you do if a guy gets injured? You can't revoke scholarships, but would you still have to pay them if they didn't show up? Every person who wants to make a little coin would be rushing to fill one of those internship spots. (That would lead to greater parity, and that's maybe supporting your idea)

I guess (lamely, but not poingant) it just comes down to a purity of the game thing. There is something beautiful about the college game, its not the one and done thing, its something..more innocent. Probably an innocent that is assumed but not present but an innocent nontheless. Paying college athletes to me would be like legalizing PED's in professional sports. We all want to believe that these guys are just like us, better at the sport, but like us. IF they all did steroids with our knowledge, or if a school openly paid a player for coming there...its not like they're like us, its like they're something..different.

Maybe it doesn't make the most sense, but I think Im getting close.

[dark_lord]

i think the nba should not restrict anyone from playing because of their age, if a team is willing to acquire them. as long as they are of legal age, it shouldnt matter. in the real world, not every kid who graduates high school goes to college.

[Brickowski]

The NBA's age requirement isn't slavery.  The problem is that players must endure the NCAA slave system until they are 19, where players who earn millions for the schools are paid nothing for their work while they pretend to be students.

I see more and more 18 year-olds going to Europe, as Brandon Jennings did this year.

[Brendan]

Age discrimination is legal - ask airline pilots, cops, and firemen with mandatory retirement age. And since seniority and age are highly correlated, most union contracts favor the older members "more senior."

[Eja117]

Thinking outside the box, what if NCAA teams were allowed to offer two paid internship scholarships each? Maybe you could require these internships be for 2 years. This would also improve the competitive balance in the NCAA, stop the one and done situations, and compensate players for the revenues they bring to their colleges.

Another idea: What if players could be drafted out of HS and guaranteed a stipend from the NBA team which drafted them after two yrs in college?

Wouldn't be amateur sports. You can't legitimately pay college athletes.

I don't see why it's illigitmate to pay people what they're worth, especially while the coaches and university presidents make money off them.

Not the point, I agree with you that a lot of people are making a lot of money on an unfair system. The point is, college sports are amateur sports. You cannot pay college athletes.

I guess I could give all these arguments about how the biggest schools would benefit the most, but lets face, that happens anyways.

But what do you do if a guy gets injured? You can't revoke scholarships, but would you still have to pay them if they didn't show up? Every person who wants to make a little coin would be rushing to fill one of those internship spots. (That would lead to greater parity, and that's maybe supporting your idea)

I guess (lamely, but not poingant) it just comes down to a purity of the game thing. There is something beautiful about the college game, its not the one and done thing, its something..more innocent. Probably an innocent that is assumed but not present but an innocent nontheless. Paying college athletes to me would be like legalizing PED's in professional sports. We all want to believe that these guys are just like us, better at the sport, but like us. IF they all did steroids with our knowledge, or if a school openly paid a player for coming there...its not like they're like us, its like they're something..different.

Maybe it doesn't make the most sense, but I think Im getting close.

I just don't see any innocence in a multi-billion dollar system.

Shareef Abdur Rahim wrote a good essay on why he did the one and done thing and when they asked Andre Iguodala of he was 50/50 student athlete he said it was like 80/20 athlete/student

Even in high school there's a lot of bull with the AAU stuff

And I think it's funny you say that cause I have no problem with legalizing peds either

[indeedproceed]

Thinking outside the box, what if NCAA teams were allowed to offer two paid internship scholarships each? Maybe you could require these internships be for 2 years. This would also improve the competitive balance in the NCAA, stop the one and done situations, and compensate players for the revenues they bring to their colleges.

Another idea: What if players could be drafted out of HS and guaranteed a stipend from the NBA team which drafted them after two yrs in college?

Wouldn't be amateur sports. You can't legitimately pay college athletes.

I don't see why it's illigitmate to pay people what they're worth, especially while the coaches and university presidents make money off them.

Not the point, I agree with you that a lot of people are making a lot of money on an unfair system. The point is, college sports are amateur sports. You cannot pay college athletes.

I guess I could give all these arguments about how the biggest schools would benefit the most, but lets face, that happens anyways.

But what do you do if a guy gets injured? You can't revoke scholarships, but would you still have to pay them if they didn't show up? Every person who wants to make a little coin would be rushing to fill one of those internship spots. (That would lead to greater parity, and that's maybe supporting your idea)

I guess (lamely, but not poingant) it just comes down to a purity of the game thing. There is something beautiful about the college game, its not the one and done thing, its something..more innocent. Probably an innocent that is assumed but not present but an innocent nontheless. Paying college athletes to me would be like legalizing PED's in professional sports. We all want to believe that these guys are just like us, better at the sport, but like us. IF they all did steroids with our knowledge, or if a school openly paid a player for coming there...its not like they're like us, its like they're something..different.

Maybe it doesn't make the most sense, but I think Im getting close.

I just don't see any innocence in a multi-billion dollar system.

Shareef Abdur Rahim wrote a good essay on why he did the one and done thing and when they asked Andre Iguodala of he was 50/50 student athlete he said it was like 80/20 athlete/student

Even in high school there's a lot of bull with the AAU stuff

And I think it's funny you say that cause I have no problem with legalizing peds either

Funnier thing, when I typed it I thought "He probably wouldn't mind if they were legal either. It'd make the sports more entertaining"

[Brickowski]

A few more PEDs and LeBron will be starring in Hellboy III.

[Hoyo de Monterrey]

Thinking outside the box, what if NCAA teams were allowed to offer two paid internship scholarships each? Maybe you could require these internships be for 2 years. This would also improve the competitive balance in the NCAA, stop the one and done situations, and compensate players for the revenues they bring to their colleges.

Another idea: What if players could be drafted out of HS and guaranteed a stipend from the NBA team which drafted them after two yrs in college?

Wouldn't be amateur sports. You can't legitimately pay college athletes.

I don't see why it's illigitmate to pay people what they're worth, especially while the coaches and university presidents make money off them.

Not the point, I agree with you that a lot of people are making a lot of money on an unfair system. The point is, college sports are amateur sports. You cannot pay college athletes.

I guess I could give all these arguments about how the biggest schools would benefit the most, but lets face, that happens anyways.

But what do you do if a guy gets injured? You can't revoke scholarships, but would you still have to pay them if they didn't show up? Every person who wants to make a little coin would be rushing to fill one of those internship spots. (That would lead to greater parity, and that's maybe supporting your idea)

I guess (lamely, but not poingant) it just comes down to a purity of the game thing. There is something beautiful about the college game, its not the one and done thing, its something..more innocent. Probably an innocent that is assumed but not present but an innocent nontheless. Paying college athletes to me would be like legalizing PED's in professional sports. We all want to believe that these guys are just like us, better at the sport, but like us. IF they all did steroids with our knowledge, or if a school openly paid a player for coming there...its not like they're like us, its like they're something..different.

Maybe it doesn't make the most sense, but I think Im getting close.

I just don't see any innocence in a multi-billion dollar system.

Shareef Abdur Rahim wrote a good essay on why he did the one and done thing and when they asked Andre Iguodala of he was 50/50 student athlete he said it was like 80/20 athlete/student

Even in high school there's a lot of bull with the AAU stuff

And I think it's funny you say that cause I have no problem with legalizing peds either

Great point... Myron Rolle, football star from FSU who just got a Rhodes scholarship, was in a radio interview I heard and he said his defensive backs coach or defensive coordinator (I forget which) said to him one day he wished Rolle spent more time on football and not as much on his studies. At the time Rolle was a first one in last one out kind of player anyway, and this coach was giving him crap for studying! Big college players in the two marquee college sports (men's basketball and football) are not student-athletes. They are college athletes.

[Eja117]

Thinking outside the box, what if NCAA teams were allowed to offer two paid internship scholarships each? Maybe you could require these internships be for 2 years. This would also improve the competitive balance in the NCAA, stop the one and done situations, and compensate players for the revenues they bring to their colleges.

Another idea: What if players could be drafted out of HS and guaranteed a stipend from the NBA team which drafted them after two yrs in college?

Wouldn't be amateur sports. You can't legitimately pay college athletes.

I don't see why it's illigitmate to pay people what they're worth, especially while the coaches and university presidents make money off them.

Not the point, I agree with you that a lot of people are making a lot of money on an unfair system. The point is, college sports are amateur sports. You cannot pay college athletes.

I guess I could give all these arguments about how the biggest schools would benefit the most, but lets face, that happens anyways.

But what do you do if a guy gets injured? You can't revoke scholarships, but would you still have to pay them if they didn't show up? Every person who wants to make a little coin would be rushing to fill one of those internship spots. (That would lead to greater parity, and that's maybe supporting your idea)

I guess (lamely, but not poingant) it just comes down to a purity of the game thing. There is something beautiful about the college game, its not the one and done thing, its something..more innocent. Probably an innocent that is assumed but not present but an innocent nontheless. Paying college athletes to me would be like legalizing PED's in professional sports. We all want to believe that these guys are just like us, better at the sport, but like us. IF they all did steroids with our knowledge, or if a school openly paid a player for coming there...its not like they're like us, its like they're something..different.

Maybe it doesn't make the most sense, but I think Im getting close.

I just don't see any innocence in a multi-billion dollar system.

Shareef Abdur Rahim wrote a good essay on why he did the one and done thing and when they asked Andre Iguodala of he was 50/50 student athlete he said it was like 80/20 athlete/student

Even in high school there's a lot of bull with the AAU stuff

And I think it's funny you say that cause I have no problem with legalizing peds either

Funnier thing, when I typed it I thought "He probably wouldn't mind if they were legal either. It'd make the sports more entertaining"

Not for the entertainment factor. Also I'd like them illegal in the Olympics, but that whole thing has also degenerated.

[crownsy]

sorry to bump an old topic, but i found this interesting.

http://bwp-law.com/the-nba-age-limit-and-the-employment-discrimination-laws

basically its a lawyer arguing that the age limit is a invalid hiring restriction due to it being a form of age discrimination.

Interested to see what our resident lawyer thinks, do you think there's any merit to this gentleman's argument roy?