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The NBA wants Lebron to travel more
« on: March 13, 2009, 11:51:48 AM »

Offline Celtic

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This is amazing, the NBA says they are looking at the way traveling is called, and thinking about revising it, and there appears to be a focus on Lebron James. When you hear this the first thing you think is, "Finally they are going to do something to stop him and other stars from blatantly breaking the rules." However, the NBA is looking at his traveling and thinking of ways to make it legal.

So basically instead of letting him and Wade break the RULES of the NBA over and over, they are just going to change them, so that there can be no debate. The worst thing of all of this is that you realize Lebron himself, doesn't know the rules of basketball, he has no idea that he travels.

I have played recently with a few kids who insisted that on a fast break you are allowed to take 3 steps, so thanks Lebron, not only are you ruining the NBA, but now you are ruining basketball all together, and the NBA is A OK with it.

http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf/2009/03/lebron_james_pleased_to_hear_n.html

Re: The NBA wants Lebron to travel more
« Reply #1 on: March 13, 2009, 12:16:37 PM »

Offline crownsy

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This is whu only my love of the celtics keeps me with the NBA.

In other sports, while obviously, i like the team i root for the most, i can enjoy a game between two teams playing at a high level.

rarley can i do this with the NBA, because it has become more circus and star pandering than actual sport.
“I will hurt you for this. A day will come when you think you’re safe and happy and your joy will turn to ashes in your mouth. And you will know the debt is paid.” – Tyrion

Re: The NBA wants Lebron to travel more
« Reply #2 on: March 13, 2009, 12:18:02 PM »

Offline markketch

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Henry Abbott sits down with Joe Borgia, Vice President of Referee Operations to discuss the issue. Among other things, they take a look at some of the infamous YouTube travels to analyze them. Regarding the crab dribble, Abbott writes:

"Watch the move, which is now famous, and you'll be convinced that, by the letter of the law, LeBron James certainly did travel. But it's closer than you might think. It all comes down to when James gathered the ball, because that's when the dribble stops.

Start and stop that video again and again. Try to find the exact moment when he stops dribbling by gathering the ball into his hands.

"He's gathering," says Borgia, "on the left foot." If James had gathered slightly later, though, with his left foot lifted off the floor, it would have been different. Then he'd have been a guy gathering on his right foot, and taking the two steps that players have long been getting from NBA referees. It's not allowed by the NBA rulebook, but it has long been allowed by NBA referees. "Another three feet, another half-step," says Borgia, "and it's legal."

Listen to LeBron James, though, and he's just sure that he only took two steps. Borgia agrees that James has likely done this move before without having it called. But in those other instance, Borgia suggests, James has gathered the ball slightly later, after that trailing leg was off the floor. Then he could take two steps to the hoop."



The actual move itself is closer to being legit than you think. It's all depedent upon timing, which is ridiculously hard to catch properly at real speed.

Re: The NBA wants Lebron to travel more
« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2009, 12:23:37 PM »

Offline crownsy

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Henry Abbott sits down with Joe Borgia, Vice President of Referee Operations to discuss the issue. Among other things, they take a look at some of the infamous YouTube travels to analyze them. Regarding the crab dribble, Abbott writes:

"Watch the move, which is now famous, and you'll be convinced that, by the letter of the law, LeBron James certainly did travel. But it's closer than you might think. It all comes down to when James gathered the ball, because that's when the dribble stops.

Start and stop that video again and again. Try to find the exact moment when he stops dribbling by gathering the ball into his hands.

"He's gathering," says Borgia, "on the left foot." If James had gathered slightly later, though, with his left foot lifted off the floor, it would have been different. Then he'd have been a guy gathering on his right foot, and taking the two steps that players have long been getting from NBA referees. It's not allowed by the NBA rulebook, but it has long been allowed by NBA referees. "Another three feet, another half-step," says Borgia, "and it's legal."

Listen to LeBron James, though, and he's just sure that he only took two steps. Borgia agrees that James has likely done this move before without having it called. But in those other instance, Borgia suggests, James has gathered the ball slightly later, after that trailing leg was off the floor. Then he could take two steps to the hoop."



The actual move itself is closer to being legit than you think. It's all depedent upon timing, which is ridiculously hard to catch properly at real speed.

i could care less. the point is they are about to change a basic rule of the game because lebron can't figure out that 2 steps is traveling. I realize that as you bolded the ref's don't call it on superstars. But this is typical stern BS. rather than have the game called correctly, he will change the rule to pander to stars who can't play technicaly sound basketball.

What about in 5-10 years where refs are letting 3 steps go? will we then change it again because ref's arent always calling guys for 4 steps?

Or, here's a better idea. Learn to play the game.
“I will hurt you for this. A day will come when you think you’re safe and happy and your joy will turn to ashes in your mouth. And you will know the debt is paid.” – Tyrion

Re: The NBA wants Lebron to travel more
« Reply #4 on: March 13, 2009, 12:27:59 PM »

Offline markketch

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You're allowed two steps...


The point is that the play is harder to call then you think, especially in game speed.  It's a BIG timing issue, and it's hard to actually determine when the dribble stops.

If you want to nitpick, Paul Pierce loves to shuffle his feet on turnarounds, but that's rarely called as well.

Re: The NBA wants Lebron to travel more
« Reply #5 on: March 13, 2009, 12:40:13 PM »

Offline crownsy

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You're allowed two steps...


The point is that the play is harder to call then you think, especially in game speed.  It's a BIG timing issue, and it's hard to actually determine when the dribble stops.

If you want to nitpick, Paul Pierce loves to shuffle his feet on turnarounds, but that's rarely called as well.

again, not the point i was making in any way, shape, or form. Why does the rule need to be changed when everyone knows that guys travel all the time and it isn't called?

the problem isn't that it needs to be changed to make it so it's easier to walk farther than they already do. The issue is the NBA ref's are so terrable they can't do thier jobs.

But it's never the absolute joke of the officals part, thus stern protects and tries to put out this false sense that NBA officating is great. It isn't, and this is another case where rather than do something about it, he's going to change a bsic rule.

Its tough for umpires to call strikes at the knees. should we change the rule to ankles to waist so that its easier to make the call?

in stern's world he would say yes. in mine, i would say hold them to higher standereds.
“I will hurt you for this. A day will come when you think you’re safe and happy and your joy will turn to ashes in your mouth. And you will know the debt is paid.” – Tyrion

Re: The NBA wants Lebron to travel more
« Reply #6 on: March 13, 2009, 12:56:52 PM »

Offline Bankshot

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Henry Abbott sits down with Joe Borgia, Vice President of Referee Operations to discuss the issue. Among other things, they take a look at some of the infamous YouTube travels to analyze them. Regarding the crab dribble, Abbott writes:

"Watch the move, which is now famous, and you'll be convinced that, by the letter of the law, LeBron James certainly did travel. But it's closer than you might think. It all comes down to when James gathered the ball, because that's when the dribble stops.

Start and stop that video again and again. Try to find the exact moment when he stops dribbling by gathering the ball into his hands.

"He's gathering," says Borgia, "on the left foot." If James had gathered slightly later, though, with his left foot lifted off the floor, it would have been different. Then he'd have been a guy gathering on his right foot, and taking the two steps that players have long been getting from NBA referees. It's not allowed by the NBA rulebook, but it has long been allowed by NBA referees. "Another three feet, another half-step," says Borgia, "and it's legal."

Listen to LeBron James, though, and he's just sure that he only took two steps. Borgia agrees that James has likely done this move before without having it called. But in those other instance, Borgia suggests, James has gathered the ball slightly later, after that trailing leg was off the floor. Then he could take two steps to the hoop."



The actual move itself is closer to being legit than you think. It's all depedent upon timing, which is ridiculously hard to catch properly at real speed.

i could care less. the point is they are about to change a basic rule of the game because lebron can't figure out that 2 steps is traveling. I realize that as you bolded the ref's don't call it on superstars. But this is typical stern BS. rather than have the game called correctly, he will change the rule to pander to stars who can't play technicaly sound basketball.

What about in 5-10 years where refs are letting 3 steps go? will we then change it again because ref's arent always calling guys for 4 steps?

Or, here's a better idea. Learn to play the game.

Agreed.  This is ridiculous.  Note to Lebron:  Learn the rules of the game! >:(
"If somebody would have told you when he was playing with the Knicks that Nate Robinson was going to change a big time game and he was going to do it mostly because of his defense, somebody would have got slapped."  Mark Jackson

Re: The NBA wants Lebron to travel more
« Reply #7 on: March 13, 2009, 12:57:20 PM »

Offline Celtic

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The hop step is a travel, no amount of excuses will change my mind on that. When you jump up and land without ever letting go of the ball, it's a travel, for some reason people forgot it was, but it is.

Re: The NBA wants Lebron to travel more
« Reply #8 on: March 13, 2009, 01:17:42 PM »

Offline davemonsterband

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LOVE it, they should allow baby half step/hop step and stick to it strictly, figure it out somehow, if they're not going to call it anyway change the rule, so long as they regulate it as finitely as possible without exception regardless of a certain superstar's stature. I'd rather change it than have to whine about the rule in place not being adhered to. I wish people would stop whining about Lebron already, the dude's doing what all true greats do, he's changing the game. Shaq did it. Mike did it. Wilt did it. Derek Harper did it (haha). His turn.
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Re: The NBA wants Lebron to travel more
« Reply #9 on: March 13, 2009, 01:23:07 PM »

Offline QuinielaBox

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I know this has been talked about in one other thread. I posted a youtube demo video on travelling and they showed Lebron doing a textbook example of it. It seems like they are legalizing Lebron to not take any dribbles from inside the three point line while he takes off for the rack. That is not right. 
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Re: The NBA wants Lebron to travel more
« Reply #10 on: March 13, 2009, 01:23:43 PM »

Offline Cman

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Well, I for one hope that they also change the rules to allow for a little fighting.  The refs should allow two punches to be thrown before breaking up any fight.  That way, the NBA can grow in popularity by stealing away NHL and MMA fans.  Who wouldn't want to watch players running up and down the floor cradling the ball to their chest the whole time before leaping, dunking, landing, and then throwing a punch for good measure?
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Re: The NBA wants Lebron to travel more
« Reply #11 on: March 13, 2009, 01:43:01 PM »

Offline Fox40Kid

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"I don't think the rule has evolved since the time of Bob Cousy. But we're also going to probably share it with the NCAA and maybe FIBA, because it would be nice if we could all come up with a similar rule. A similar rule would be great for the players, the coaches, and the officials."

There is already a similar rule used by NCAA and FIBA that is great for players, coaches and officails, it's called a travel.

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Re: The NBA wants Lebron to travel more
« Reply #12 on: March 13, 2009, 01:53:14 PM »

Offline crownsy

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"I don't think the rule has evolved since the time of Bob Cousy. But we're also going to probably share it with the NCAA and maybe FIBA, because it would be nice if we could all come up with a similar rule. A similar rule would be great for the players, the coaches, and the officials."

There is already a similar rule used by NCAA and FIBA that is great for players, coaches and officails, it's called a travel.



lol, TP.

can you see that phone call to a FIBA/NCAA director?

"yea, uh hi, listen we talked it over, and we decided it would be better if we changed it so that traveling was more like, say 3 steps...Its to hard on our officals to be asked to do thier jobs, plus alot of our more marketable stars travel all the time, and were tried of people pointing it out. So you mind changing your rule that works to ours?"

*click*
« Last Edit: March 13, 2009, 02:01:05 PM by crownsy »
“I will hurt you for this. A day will come when you think you’re safe and happy and your joy will turn to ashes in your mouth. And you will know the debt is paid.” – Tyrion

Re: The NBA wants Lebron to travel more
« Reply #13 on: March 13, 2009, 02:51:03 PM »

Offline housecall

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It looks like his teammates are following in his footsteps of traveling.In the Suns game Pavlovic traveled to the basket without a call being made,even the announcers had to laughed at it.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2009, 02:56:24 PM by housecall »

Re: The NBA wants Lebron to travel more
« Reply #14 on: March 13, 2009, 03:11:36 PM »

Offline cordobes

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I don't know if it's fair to single out LeBron James. He surely "benefits" from the situation, but it's not things where different to Dr. J or Michael Jordan, just like they aren't different to Wade or Kobe.

The problem with the travel call at this level is that, whichever the rule and the interpretation may be, it's a very difficult to detect with sureness a travel violation and call it. I think most of these efforts to clarify the issue will prove to be futile. The game is so fast that referees have to base their calls on instinct; the problem with this is that some players are so fluid and quick with their movements that they are able to get away with violations; others will look awkward executing the exact same movement and be called for it. Having a 4th ref exclusively calling travel violations maybe the only way of minimizing these mistakes, but I'm not sure how much the situation would improve.